What is your Gripe about Obama?, page 2

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reply posted on 18-9-2009 @ 01:02 PM by daddyroo45

First and foremost my main gripe is the mans arrogance. How he readily dismisses opposing opinion,and belittles those that oppose his plans.

reply posted on 18-9-2009 @ 01:03 PM by R-evolve

Off the point a little but is abortion a really big issue in the states. I can't see how abortion is a decision that has anything to do with the state.

reply posted on 18-9-2009 @ 01:08 PM by jmotley

Originally posted by asmall89
My gripe with Obama is he's just continuing down the same road of Bush just in a different way. He is increasing spending just as much as his predecessor. We're not getting out of our wars. Nothing has really changed, because none of them will look at the real problems of our country. People elected him thinking he'll be like Clinton and I think they're going to be very disappointed, just like how my father voted for Bush Jr. thinking he'll be like Bush Sr. Big disappointment. What I want is a Libertarian type person that will hold to their word, no bailouts & little spending, little foreign intervention, low taxes, more state power. Inflation is only inches away, the dollar has fallen quite a bit this last week, Euro=1.4720 or somewhere around that.

One of the first things that Obama did is to set a deadline for troop withdraw from Iraq. That is something that Bush Jr refused to do. Yes he is adding on to our natioal deficit but it is primarily finishing what bush started. The bailout were unpopular but remember bush started them not obama. His budget was 90% done by the time he got into office so I cant hold the wastfull spending in that budget to him that was all bush. and yes the people who voted for Obama thinking he would be like Clinton will be disappointed he is not Clinton. Please wait to reserve judgement till we see what he does with his first budget, if his medical care bill does add money to the deficit.

reply posted on 18-9-2009 @ 01:16 PM by jmotley

Originally posted by aravoth
reply to post by jmotley

Like I said before...

Maybe it has something to do with 23 trillion dollars in guaranteed loans to criminal bankers....

Or the 95 Afghan children his air-strikes have lit on fire....

Or the continuing job losses.....

Or the expanded wars

What do people have against Obama? The exact same things they had against Bush....

Just sayin...

Bush started the bailout. I will say that I did not agree with them but they were a necceray evil. If allowed to fail those companies would have completley destroyed America's economy far worse then it did. (you can thank deregulateing wallstreet for that)

Hate to say it but there are casuilties in any war. This is a war that bush started in more ways then one.

Job loss, well we are in a ressision. that also started under bush. Obama is just a man he cant snap his fingers the day he is sworn in and say the ressision is over. It takes time.

What expanded wars. He has closed the war in Iraq. Has set a pull out date. We are now in Afganistan where we should have been from day one looking for that ____________ Osama Bin Ladin (you fill in the blank) We had no business in Iraq

reply posted on 18-9-2009 @ 01:18 PM by jmotley

reply to post by Lasheic

Thank you thats all I ask for Give the man a chance to prove his self

reply posted on 18-9-2009 @ 01:20 PM by SailorinAZ

My biggest problem with him, is how he has spent so much money. I think companies should have been left to fail and other new companies would have popped up in their place.

I think that the money could have been spent in so many other better ways that actually would have created temporary and permanent jobs.

For example. (In a nutshell) To much fresh water is being dumped in to the Gulf of Mexico from the Mississippi. This is creating a salinity issue in the gulf.

I would have proposed we build a pipeline from the Mississippi River to the desert southwest and power the pumps by solar and wind. I also would have proposed we hire veterans first when possible to complete the construction.

This would have created soooooooo many jobs. Even after the great pipeline was completed, people would still need to be employed to maintain it.

As another benefit to the environment, we could have brought much needed water to the southwest.

If the Romans built those super aqueducts 2000 years ago, we surely could have built a pipeline today.

All this would have costs only a fraction of the bailout/stimulus money.

There are plenty of other building projects that could have been implemented.

Anyway, in summary. my biggest problems with Obama are his fiscal policies.

reply posted on 18-9-2009 @ 01:27 PM by jmotley

reply to post by daddyroo45

I have not seen him belittle the people that do not support his plans but I have seen his supporters do it.

reply posted on 18-9-2009 @ 01:28 PM by jmotley

reply to post by R-evolve

I cant see how abortion has anything to do with the government at all

reply posted on 18-9-2009 @ 01:34 PM by jmotley

Originally posted by SailorinAZ
My biggest problem with him, is how he has spent so much money. I think companies should have been left to fail and other new companies would have popped up in their place.

I think that the money could have been spent in so many other better ways that actually would have created temporary and permanent jobs.

For example. (In a nutshell) To much fresh water is being dumped in to the Gulf of Mexico from the Mississippi. This is creating a salinity issue in the gulf.

I would have proposed we build a pipeline from the Mississippi River to the desert southwest and power the pumps by solar and wind. I also would have proposed we hire veterans first when possible to complete the construction.

This would have created soooooooo many jobs. Even after the great pipeline was completed, people would still need to be employed to maintain it.

As another benefit to the environment, we could have brought much needed water to the southwest.

If the Romans built those super aqueducts 2000 years ago, we surely could have built a pipeline today.

All this would have costs only a fraction of the bailout/stimulus money.

There are plenty of other building projects that could have been implemented.

Anyway, in summary. my biggest problems with Obama are his fiscal policies.

Yes when a company fails I say let it die a new one will sprout from the ashes BUT when several componies die at the same time or in rapid succession then the bailouts were needed. These companies if allowed to collapse at once would have destroyed our great country and the global economy as a whole. Could it have been handled better, HELL YES.!!!!!!!!

reply posted on 18-9-2009 @ 01:52 PM by aravoth

reply to post by jmotley

Ok first off. Bush had his own bailout. Obama created 2 brand new bailouts that he himself signed. They were not continuations of old policy, they were brand new.

Secondly, Wall Street was not "deregulated". It was the FED that set the interest rates so low. It was the government that created Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac. That was government interference with market forces. And the invisible hand of the market bitch slapped the US for doing that. Just like it always does.

Yes Bush started the war, and Obama has spread it to Pakistan. I guess you're just fine with it. You probably protested the war under Bush, but think it's just fine under Obama.

As far as Iraq is concerned, it wasn't even a few weeks ago that a bomb blew up and killed 95 people over there, some of them US servicemen. The war in Iraq is over for everyone except the soldiers still over there I guess.

Despite what you heard on the "News", You cannot borrow your way out of debt. Massive amounts of debt that can not be paid back is the reason we are in a recession, do you honestly think you can fix that by going further into debt? I don't care who started it. Obama and Bush are the exact same person.

The both Support corporate welfare, they enjoying hitting children with smart-bombs. They both have spent us into oblivion. Both support the Patriot act. The list goes on...

If you support Obama now, I am curious to know why you didn't support Bush back then? He did everything Obama is doing now.

One more thing. If those companies where allowed to go under Nothing would have Happened. Smaller companies would have cannibalized the profitable portions of the companies that went under, and we'd probably have positive job growth by now. Instead Obama Nationalized the Auto industry because it "can't be allowed to fail", and then 3 months later it failed anyway. Just like everyone that said it was a retarded idea in the first place said it would.

I don't believe you have a single solitary clue with regard to what it is you are talking about.

Obama and Bush, your favorite Presidents of all time..........

[edit on 18-9-2009 by aravoth]

reply posted on 18-9-2009 @ 02:07 PM by WalterRatlos

Originally posted by jmotley
I personally like Obama. While I may not agree with all his policies I do believe he is steering this country in the right direction. I believe that we do need more government control. Look at the mess we are in now This happened because we deregulated wallstreet.

I like him too.

Disclaimer: He's not my "commander in chief" and I don't live in the USA. That said I think he does a reasonably decent job. I am quite a bit disappointed however, because he promised a lot of things and has backed off on some of those promises. And government control needs to be balanced: too much and you drift towards a totalitarian regime; too little and you risk drifting to chaos and anarchy.

Originally posted by jmotley
So all I want to know is what your problem is with our current commander and cheif. I will not answer what I can. I want to know if you believe what others have said. ie death panels. Pleaase no name calling here I would like this to be a civil discussion.

Well, death panels is a nice catch phrase and that's all there is to it. The fact that I only heard about death panels here on ATS should give you a hint. If death panels were even a remote possibility I would have heard here on the local news. Trust the mass media in my country would jump on a story like this.

reply posted on 21-9-2009 @ 05:27 AM by gravykraken

the man is a fraud. in more ways than one. as is any tool that would place themselves in a position to be a puppet.

change? how about reformation?

hope? how about some truth?

reply posted on 21-9-2009 @ 08:56 AM by crimvelvet

reply to post by jmotley

Thank you thats all I ask for Give the man a chance to prove his self

While you and others are busy defending him, Obama and his Democratic Congress are handing control of our entire Food Supply over to the Ag Cartel. I swear as soon as the word "Democrat" is spoken the Political Activists switch off their brains. More damage has been done to US farmers and US food under the "tender loving care" of the Democrats recently because you all assume they are not in the pocket of the Corporate Cartels. When are you going to wake up? After your kids starve to death?

Like other farmers, I had hopes for Obama until he proved he is in the pocket of the Banking/Corporate Cartels. He appointed Vilsack, a Monsanto shill, instead of someone like Mike Pollan as head of the department of Ag. He appointed Monsanto's lawyer,Mike Taylor, as food czar. Right out of the starting gate Rosa Delauro D-CT introduces a bill "To OUTLAW Organic Farming and Backyard Gardeners'

As John Hammell of IAHF.com said "Obama Targets Food Safety: Will Obama and Michelle Please WAKE UP???

Please read History, HACCP and the Food Safety Con Job It explains WHO is driving our domestic policies and it is not the voting public.

The real cause of the food safety problem

Instituting HACCP to the raw meat and poultry industries served to de-regulate it for the big players and hyper-regulate it for the smaller players. Large corporations with financial reserves and persuasive legal staff privatized the food safety function. With inspectors confined to “critical control points,” plants were free to increase the speed of their disassembly lines, a profitable practice that unfortunately encourages a lot more feces, pus and other not insignificant unmentionables to ride down the line and out the door, stamped with a purple seal of approval.....

The real reason why HACCP replaced "the safest food system in the world" The food industry has once again allowed activists and headline-hungry journalists to turn the safest food system in human history into a house of horrors

So, just when the country is awaking to the need to relocalize its food sources, we find that many meat processors who would serve this growing market have been forced out of business by vague, onerous and costly regulations imposed under the guise of food safety.

Do we want the same thing to happen to our produce growers? Do we want to hyper-regulate those farmers whose practices do not contribute to the food poisoning problems endemic to industrially produced food products and de-regulate those whose practices poison us? No? But that's what we're being set up for with the Food Safety Enhancement Act of 2009.....

While the fake HACCP program made it easier for the large players to gross more and cover up contamination with chemical sprays and irradiation, small players found it substantially more expensive and difficult to conduct business..... Food & Water Watch had examined the effects of HACCP on small meat slaughter and processing operations and found that the complexities of one-size-fits-all federal regulations was a key reason for business closings.

It's also noted in “Where's the Local Beef?” that “when USDA adopted [HACCP], all federally and state-inspected plants, regardless of their size, were required to, as well. Now these plants have to justify their plans with scientific studies and tests. They also have to set up extensive self-monitoring and recordkeeping systems. Because smaller plans often make a greater number of more complex products (such as sausages), they require multiple HACCP plans that also are more extensive.”[28] Possibly because they have no leverage when they inspect large processors, agency inspectors “exert more oversight and enforcement action at the smaller grinders and explicitly makes them responsible for changing food safety practices at the largest plants, which are suppliers of raw material for the small plants. {In other words the small butcher gets fined for the contamination originating at the Ag cartel slaughter house Link}

One meat inspectors surveyed stated that “we've had more recalls since HACCP was implemented than I can ever remember. This should tell everyone that the inspection in the plants is not what is used to be, and I think HACCP is to blame.”[24]

Another meat inspector complained that “[HACCP] replaced FSIS' long-standing program of meat and poultry inspection. Under the pre-HACCP system, the production of meat and poultry products was monitored at every stage by Government employees rather than in-plant production managers. The HACCP program reversed this arrangement by allowing a plant to monitor the safety of meat and poultry products.”
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