Israel 'will attack Iran this year'

reply to post by Agit8dChop


Well of course.

Egypt could've just opened a hole in its frontier and emptied the entire Gaza Strip, geography tells us that they have that kind of space to set up a refugee camp. And it would ease tensions in the region. Jordan could empty the West Bank, make those territories buffers. Saudi Arabia has some empty swathes of scrub land and more than enough funds to keep refugees in one place. Yet they do nothing. Because they hate Israel and are more than willing to use the plight of one people as their poker chip.

Putting aside for a moment the arguments, both classical and modern, of the conflicts between Jewish and Arab culture, why should any of us believe what TPTB say about Iran's military strength or first strike capability? I simply can't get four simple words from creeping into my mind:

Weapons of Mass Destruction

They lied to us then. Why in the world should we believe them now?

Originally posted by Agit8dChop

Perhaps you should become a little more educated.

A war between Israel and Iran, is actually a war for America.

Hardships? Your able to type and debate, youve obviously never experienced anything like the Palestinians.

Dont pretend to be a precious muff'n.

Sure 'nuff, my education ain't Ivy League as yours apparently is. It was on the ground amongst the "heathen", as yours apparently isn't.

How much Arabic do you speak? Which dialect? You ever sit down to a meal of goat and rice, right there with 'em? Have you got a taste for hummus that just won't quit? Ever debate politics and ethics WITH A PALESTINIAN? From whence does YOUR education in matters middle eastern spring?

The Palestinians are NOT the neanderthals you portray them as. Neither are they the innocent victims you insinuate.

I humbly suggest you educate yourself first, THEN come back and question my education and "hardships" history.

A war between Israel and Iran is a war between Israel and Iran - unless China and Russia would care to force the US into it, which I doubt they would.

That would be bad for all involved.

Originally posted by Dnevnoi
reply to post by Agit8dChop

 

Well of course.

Egypt could've just opened a hole in its frontier and emptied the entire Gaza Strip, geography tells us that they have that kind of space to set up a refugee camp. And it would ease tensions in the region. Jordan could empty the West Bank, make those territories buffers. Saudi Arabia has some empty swathes of scrub land and more than enough funds to keep refugees in one place. Yet they do nothing. Because they hate Israel and are more than willing to use the plight of one people as their poker chip.

Ahh now wouldn't that just be peachy of the Arabs to do just that? Hell, by doing that they could single handedly ethnically cleanse Israel of the Palestinians. That way the Zionists could save all of their bullets for the Iranians and shirk their oh so bad Public Relations in the region for past misdeeds..

Sorry brother. Israel created their crap sandwich and now they gotta eat it. Too bad so sad for the likes of somebody who thinks the way you do.

But something tells me that those Middle Eastern countries are smarter than you're giving them credit for and will continue to throw egg in the faces of those who got themselves into this very embarrassing situation to begin with. Something also tells me that the Palestinians wouldn't agree to be shoved off of the land that they have lived on for hundreds upon hundreds of years just because it would make life more convenient for the Zionists.

As to Israel attacking Iran is concerned, those of you who count out Russia coming to their aid militarily are probably going to be in for a nightmare surprise when they do.

The USA won't be coming in with the Calvary to kick ass either. They will be doing damage control at best. It amazes me how ignorant most Americans are right now to the international loathing of them that Bush caused. He destroyed over 200 years of diplomacy in just 2 years of office, not to mention the other 6 that followed.

I'm an American myself and sure as hell wouldn't want to be caught up in that Hornet's nest known as Iran. The Iranians are very skillful proxy war fighters as they've proven with Hamas and Hezbollah. Israel will have stepped into the abyss if they attack them. Their best option is to shut up and learn how to get along with their neighbors for once, and stop building those damned illegal settlements. But I know that's not likely happen.

Originally posted by 3DPrisoner
As to Israel attacking Iran is concerned, those of you who count out Russia coming to their aid militarily are probably going to be in for a nightmare surprise when they do.

There is a precedent. Egypt asked the Soviet Union to launch a nuclear strike on Israel, of course they never followed through because Israel was (and still is) an ally of the Americans. Russia won't do anything, they may put troops in Iran or send aid, they won't attack Israel directly because of the United States connection.

The USA won't be coming in with the Calvary to kick ass either. They will be doing damage control at best. It amazes me how ignorant most Americans are right now to the international loathing of them that Bush caused. He destroyed over 200 years of diplomacy in just 2 years of office, not to mention the other 6 that followed.

The Americans won't deploy, but they will be that deterrent to Russia from getting involved. American diplomacy was on the outs in the Middle East since the 1970s, its not all Bush's fault for people to denounce US foreign policy.

I'm an American myself and sure as hell wouldn't want to be caught up in that Hornet's nest known as Iran. The Iranians are very skillful proxy war fighters as they've proven with Hamas and Hezbollah. Israel will have stepped into the abyss if they attack them. Their best option is to shut up and learn how to get along with their neighbors for once, and stop building those damned illegal settlements. But I know that's not likely happen.

That's the difference between Israel and Iran. Israel would do the job themselves. Iran would rely on cowards hiding among civilians. Israelis are very willing to get along with the peoples that border them. Unfortunately, with all the rhetoric and attacks, getting along with hostilities is simply not an option. Do unto others, what you want them to do to you. Shoot things at Israel and antagonize them, they'll do it back.

reply to post by rogerstigers


I'm all for them fighting, but with the gloves off.

I'm all for them stating the identical things that their enemies spouted over the decades, and especially each time they were building up for another attack on Israel.

I'd love to hear Israel say, "we'll soak the ground with their blood and destroy them from the face of the earth."

And then DO IT.

Spoiled?

You start to get a little paranoid after a few centuries of persecution, and really paranoid after establishing your country, it's been one badass after another threatening to wipe you off the map.

So we agree.

But the next time Israel is going through their enemies like crap through a goose, let's not let the UN and Russia call them off.

Let them go and solve this problem.

And now that Iran wants a piece, let them have all they can handle.

reply to post by mpriebe81


You are so wrong.

Israel has perpetrated more crimes against Arabs than Arabs have perpetrated against Israel?

You're not even close.

And as far as Gaza?

Everybody hates the Gazans. Gazans hate Gazans, Arabs hate Gazans, and Israelis hate Gazans.

Gazans are like the clap.

It gets worse as time goes on.

reply to post by sanchoearlyjones

See, sancho, there you go with more of that "elite Pawn" crap. It's always a mysterious elitist, Israeli controlled MSM, or Zionist ghost group that can never quite be nailed down as to who these mysterious groups are, and how they are so ominous, we can't even tell for sure who they are.

Hell, there's more evidence of Bigfoot.

You made a erroneous claim. In the 1948-49 invasion of Israel by Lebanon, Syria, Jordan, Iraq, and Egypt, Israel was using Czech light equipment and whatever they could scrounge - and they sure as hell didn't get any materials from the US - and they sure didn't "stir the turdpot" and call for the US to pull them out.

You were incorrect on that.

In 1956, the US had not a damn thing to do with it, and Eisenhower was working hard to keep this from going down. The Israeli weapons were STENS and 20,000 rifles most of which came from the Czechs, and nothing from the US.

So your postulation at this point is still completely incorrect.

In 1967, the Israeli Air Force consisted of French Fougas, Mysteres, and Mirages. Their small infantry weapon of choice was the in-house designed and built UZI, and what armor they had was French, British, and some older American Shermans from WWII. No American presence, equipment, or advisors.

Your postulation is still incorrect historically.

In 1973, the US did send supplies by air to cover what they lost during the first few days of the war, but in no time, it wasn't Israel yelling for help - as you earlier postulated - it was Egypt and Syria doing all the screaming and yelling.

The US and Soviet Union almost got into a shooting war since these Soviet clients were getting their asses kicked so badly - yet again - using Soviet Equipment, Soviet Tactics, and were trained by Soviet Advisors.

It was a damn embarrassment.

But again, no US help, no Israel running to big brother or screaming for help.

Just the opposite.

Some early inventory assistance, but no more than we sent Britain when some of their ships swung wide on the way to the Falklands and met some of our ships off Charleston - to pick up some missiles and other little nik-naks.

Nothing was ever said about it. That's what friends are for.

So your postulation that Israel stirs the turdbowl and then gets US help and cover is utter BS. History indicates you don't have a clue on this particular matter, got it completely backwards, and so maybe you should let it go.

One other glaring falsification you stated - I hate Arabs? I have friends who are Lebanese, Syrian, Jordanian, and Iranian.

I specifically said that everyone hated the Gazans, and while Israel gets crap for shutting down it's border with Gaza, it's conveniently forgotten that Egypt shares a border with Gaza, and shut it down too. Even when Israel offered to return Gaza to Israel after the 1973 rumble, Egypt didn't want these troublemakers either.

Break out a book on occasion, and then read the specifics of another poster's statements before you experience a diahrrea of the mouth.

You claim that my interpretation of the Farsi statement is incorrect - well my friend Mansour was one of the late Shah's handpicked young men caught in school over here when the Revolution went down, and he knew he would be killed if he returned.

Since he's Iranian, and speaks perfect Farsi, I trust his interpretation, his ability to pick up on the nuances and inflections of the language a whole hell of a lot better than your ridiculous claim of "Israeli-controlled MSM."

For your fourth mistake, I don't recall replying to Warrenb. And for the record, yes, when statements are made that violate the facts, the historical facts - then I must assume that it takes a true retard to believe in some fabricated crap from some other nebulous source.

Sort of like you did.

I read your posts.

You're better than that.





[edit on 18-9-2009 by dooper]

reply to post by dooper


My God! WOW! I hope you like warm places my friend. I have a feeling you're going to spend and eternity in one. I hope you don't fall off of that high horse you rode in on. Make sure your saddles tied on tight. Wouldn't want you to fall and crack that oversized head of yours.

People like you make me sick

Imho all hell breaks loose when US economy crashes- then its gloves off .
We see in russias statements that they will stand and wait till US gets in to help Israel , then russia and china will go in against that coalition . It will be conventional warfare unless US goes bankrupt and some crazy bastage starts thorowing ICBM's

reply to post by DEEZNUTZ

Over what?

What's the weed up urass over?

Don't like history?

reply to post by dooper


I'm hoping they wait 'til after football season too. I want to see if Weis and Claussen will get it together and knock down USC. I predicted ND to lose two this year... but I really didn't think Michigan to be one of the losses.

Oh and ... I wish they would just get it over with and do something. Shut up or put up... survival of the fittest. All this rhetoric and positioning and lies just gets on my nerves.

I think the anti-Israel crowd is becoming more delusional than the "always support Israel" crowd used to be. This is not a Black and White issue. Most of you people cannot admit that within you there is a very strong sense of anti-Israel sentiment. Even if you believe Israel deserves this criticism, you would need to be blind to not realise that most countries surrounding her have been hostile since her inception and will be until her potential destruction. A lot of this hostility has to do with the establishment of a Jewish state in what are deemed Arab lands.

On the other side of the coin, people who are pushing for Israel to attack Iran are GRAVELY underestimating the consequences that would result. Do you really think other countries in the ME would simply stand back and congratulate the Israelis? Do you think the USA would agree to take all the heat that would come with supporting this attack? This could very well lead to a third world war.

Also remember what other posters have stated: Israel HAS numerous nuclear weapons already in her arsenal. Iran does not even have one nuclear weapon yet. Iran has a much cleaner history sheet than Israel and should be allowed to enrich uranium. Unless Israel is willing to destroy every single one of their nukes, it is hypocritical in the extreme to prevent Iran from utilising this technology. Iran has the right to defend herself from outside enemies just as Israel has the right to do the same.

Originally posted by reassor
Imho all hell breaks loose when US economy crashes- then its gloves off .
We see in russias statements that they will stand and wait till US gets in to help Israel , then russia and china will go in against that coalition . It will be conventional warfare unless US goes bankrupt and some crazy bastage starts thorowing ICBM's

So where's the problem there? US sits it out, as usual, Russia and China fidget, but have no excuse to get into the mix either, Israel makes a couple of holes at Iranian nuclear facilities and goes home.

A good time is had by all. I don't see the problem there.

Originally posted by Dark Ghost

On the other side of the coin, people who are pushing for Israel to attack Iran are GRAVELY underestimating the consequences that would result. Do you really think other countries in the ME would simply stand back and congratulate the Israelis?

Nope. Never said they'd congratulate Israel. I said they'd sit it out, and not be too eager to jump into the fray. I stand by that. Iran hasn't got as big of a fan base among arab countries as folks seem to think. That pesky Sunni-Shia rift thing. Even the Saudis are still miffed at the Iranians for that little spectacle at Mecca a few years ago. I don't know if Iranians are still barred from Mecca, though. They were for a while. Afghans don't like them, Pakistanis don't like them, Iraqis don't like them (except for the Shia elements), the list goes on. Actually, there's a bit more history there than the Sunni-Shia thing. There's the Arab-Persian rivalry too. A lot more stuff than meets the press.

Also remember what other posters have stated: Israel HAS numerous nuclear weapons already in her arsenal. Iran does not even have one nuclear weapon yet. Iran has a much cleaner history sheet than Israel and should be allowed to enrich uranium. Unless Israel is willing to destroy every single one of their nukes, it is hypocritical in the extreme to prevent Iran from utilising this technology. Iran has the right to defend herself from outside enemies just as Israel has the right to do the same.

Iran has publicly stated what their nuclear weapons would be used for. Now, whether they would follow through on the rhetoric or not is another matter. If they were threatening MY house, I don't suppose I'd be very keen on waiting to see if they really meant it or not, though.

On the other hand, I've yet to hear the Israelis threaten to nuke Iran, or anyone else, into oblivion with theirs.

Can you sort of see the difference there?

reply to post by warrenb


Hope your right, but I thought the last invasion of Gaza was the final straw.

Originally posted by dooper
reply to post by mpriebe81

 

Israel has perpetrated more crimes against Arabs than Arabs have perpetrated against Israel?

You're not even close.

Actually I never said that, you're putting words into my mouth on that one.
And if you refer to an earlier post, I clearly stated that blood has been shed by all nations at one point or another.
I'm not on a "side", as I think that the whole thing is a load of crap. I just think that it's a bunch of GARBAGE that so many people here want to "glass" Iran, as many of you are citing MSM and Gov't sources for reasons why Iran is so "evil". To trust the propaganda machine is ludicrous, especially when it has become so evident that they will say and do just about anything to further whatever agenda they have.
I am not anti-Israel or anti-semite. The only "anti" category that I think I could fall under is anti-hate. The ability to hate another for their beliefs, based on whichever fairytale one believes in, is such an antiquated and barbaric concept. Unfortunately it's hard to see any growth going on for our species as a whole in the future.

As for your take on Gazans, well that's real cute buddy. I sincerely hope that you are reincarnated as someone living under occupation in your next life, and maybe your leg gets blown off, maybe your farmland gets taken away, maybe some of your family is blown to smithereens due to someone's theocratic ideology of choice.

Originally posted by warrenb

Israel 'will attack Iran this year' if West does not cripple Tehran with sanctions

Israel will attack Iran's nuclear facilities before the end of the year if the West has not launched an attempt to destroy the regime with crippling sanctions, a former senior defence official has claimed.

"The Israeli government is the only entity that is responsible for the existence of the Jewish people," he said. "Iran has been explicit in its hostility to Israel time and again. They would use these weapons.
"We believe that Iran has the capacity and the delivery capability for nuclear weapons. They can proceed to production. We have got two months to act - before the end of 2009."

www.telegraph.co.uk...

Every 6 months for the last 10 years they've been saying Iran has the bomb or is building the bomb or will have the bomb, lets bomb them first.

Go ahead Israel, you do that. See how the world shuns you and does not come to your rescue when Iran's allies retaliate.

Sign your own death wish.

Israel has over 200 nukes to protect itself. Why can't Iran have any to protect itself as well? Double standards. Oh I forgot, they are gods chosen people and therefore can do as they please. Give me a f'in break.



[edit on 17-9-2009 by warrenb]

HAHAHAHA

I just love these threads of hate. Only problem is NOTHING will change what's about to happen to Iran. Sure you'll get a bunch of keyboard warriors who'll spew forth their hate of Israel.
But at the end of the day the Israeli Govt will do what it deems necessary.

"when Iran's allies retaliate" LOL you've got to be joking. About the only retaliation we're likely to see will be some half baked protests by peace loving hippies. (Granted, maybe some suicide bombings in different places) but Iran's allies? yeah right ...

Israel will get Iran. There's no doubt about that. At the end of the day Iran could be left in peace if only it would stop its nuclear ambitions. Its not an unprovoked attack. They've been warned, warned and warned some more. But no, they want to play with the big boys. Well guess what, the big boys are going to start playing shortly, and Iran will see how the big boys play - rough.

The saddest thing is the innocent. The everyday mums, dads and kids, who've got nothing to do with politics, governments and war, who'll be the ones to die for someone elses agenda.
Of coarse Iran could have a large say in that outcome, if only it would stop its nuclear ambitions.

Originally posted by Burginthorn
Israel will get Iran. There's no doubt about that. At the end of the day Iran could be left in peace if only it would stop its nuclear ambitions. Its not an unprovoked attack. They've been warned, warned and warned some more. But no, they want to play with the big boys. Well guess what, the big boys are going to start playing shortly, and Iran will see how the big boys play - rough.

Very well put. Iran has been given every opportunity NOT to be attacked, and has refused those invitations. As with all of us, they get what they beg for.

The saddest thing is the innocent. The everyday mums, dads and kids, who've got nothing to do with politics, governments and war, who'll be the ones to die for someone elses agenda.
Of coarse Iran could have a large say in that outcome, if only it would stop its nuclear ambitions.

I don't think there will be all that much collateral damage, unless Iran is foolish enough to puff it's chest out again and counterattack. Israel has a history of being fairly surgical with these sorts of strikes, leaving smoking holes where there used to be buildings, and no where else. They can't afford to lay waste masses of civilians, since they're already on pretty shaky ground in popular opinion (if ATS is any indicator of that), and there's nothing to be gained by it.

Iran can't really retaliate with ground forces, because of geographical considerations, and air attacks would be one-way missions, suicide missions. Those would end when Iran ran out of airplanes. Iranian overflights of intervening countries would also be problematic for them.

That leaves missile attacks and attack by proxies, like Hizb Allah. The proxy attacks have already been going on for decades, so that's no great deterrent. Missile attacks would be annoying, as Saddam's Scud attacks were, but that would accomplish nothing but to provoke further Israeli air strikes. Counter productive.

In short, there is no viable response Iran can initiate, short of jumping up and down, and screaming a lot. So far, that hasn't been very effective in guiding Israeli action away from their targets.

The only way there would be much in the way of collateral damage is if Iran goes completely off the rails and elects to commit national suicide. No long drawn out ground war is possible, since neither side has the capacity to deliver large masses of troops to the territory of the other. No long common border, as was the case in the Iranian-Iraqi war.

I expect it would be short, sweet, and to the point. Probably wouldn't even wake many civilians up, until they saw the morning news. The Iranian government would likely end up losing what little prestige it had among the Iranian people when they realize the government brought this on them with all the chest-thumping.

Remember, not long ago Iran was on the verge of large scale revolt. It brews beneath the surface yet.

Originally posted by nenothtu
Iran has publicly stated what their nuclear weapons would be used for. Now, whether they would follow through on the rhetoric or not is another matter. If they were threatening MY house, I don't suppose I'd be very keen on waiting to see if they really meant it or not, though.

On the other hand, I've yet to hear the Israelis threaten to nuke Iran, or anyone else, into oblivion with theirs.

Can you sort of see the difference there?

The difference is that you are basing your argument off a quote that is factually inaccurate. That quote that people keep referring to "wipe Israel off the map" was never actually said. People have created threads proving that it was a mistranslation and the actual translation suggests he was talking about the fall of Zionism coming soon.

Can you provide some credible sources where Iran officials have called for the destruction of Israel? I am not talking about terrorist organisations such as Hamas and Hezbollah - these groups have actual charters calling for its destruction. The problem is including the whole country of Iran and its citizens and classifying them all as terrorists that need to be bombed to oblivion. This is madness.

Do you not see the hypocrisy in HAVING nuclear weapons, NOT signing up to the non-proliferation treaty, then attacking another nation that does NOT have nuclear weapons and HAS signed the treaty?

Look at Iran's history. Look at Israel's history.

[edit on 18/9/2009 by Dark Ghost]