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The Desperation and Dangers of the Far-Right Extreme Evangelical Sub-Culture

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posted on Sep, 21 2009 @ 12:46 AM
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reply to post by Benevolent Heretic
 


I never thought I'd live to see the day when Frankey proffered such a clueless perspective.

Yes, there are rigid, narrow, blind sorts of folks on all ends of all values extremes. He should know that.

He should also know--as his father demonstrated so well--that the other side--the LEFT, LIBERAL, REGRESSIVE, SECULAR HUMANIST side is FAR, FAR, FAR, FAR MORE BLIND to REAL FACTS than is the Evangelical "right" side.

One almost wonders . . . did the real Franky get abducted and replaced with a robotized clone?

Stranger things seem to be happening routinely in this era.




posted on Sep, 21 2009 @ 01:37 AM
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reply to post by Benevolent Heretic
 



im really saddened by what conservatism has grown to mean anymore. same goes for liberalism too I suppose



posted on Sep, 21 2009 @ 07:42 AM
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Originally posted by sickofitall2012
I am begging everyone, please stop feeding the hate!!!!!!!!!!!!
A country divided cannot stand!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

WE THE PEOPLE need to stand up and unite together. A divided country is much easier to control, don't you see that? Both sides can preach all day, but changing peoples deep beliefs will never work, never has. Holy wars ring a bell?
Not only is there a far right, there is a far left. Both are a very small # of the population. I am very suspicious of anyone that deliberately sets forth to destroy the unity of Americans. I will no longer contribute to the hate, I will only keep asking people to stop before they divide us for good.


Thank you for saying it!!



posted on Sep, 21 2009 @ 08:00 AM
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Originally posted by mental modulator
Well looks like you have struck a vein BH, or more like the umbilical cord -


What I find most interesting about this little experiment of these two threads is that this one (about the Right Extreme Subculture) is 14 pages long, filled with assumptions, accusations, vitriol and attacks toward me, people taking deep offense at the topic of the thread and people sadly confirming the topic of the thread.

The sister thread (about the Left Extreme Subculture) is 5 pages long and is a fantastic and productive discussion about some of the extremes on the left and the similarities and differences between the right and left. All very civil and educational... no attacks, no offense taken...

I'm not sure what it means, but I find it very interesting. I think we all know that both of these extremes exist. It's just very interesting to me to see how ATS members handled bringing that fact out into the open.

And yeah, this thread has struck more than a few nerves along the way.



posted on Sep, 21 2009 @ 11:40 AM
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reply to post by A Fortiori
 


You are probably correct in the assumption the article and the video was not meant to appeal to the center conservatives.

After all it was msnbc...


But...and ther is a rather large posterior here...hearing those words from the horses mouth about the inner dealings and the real conspiracy that is at the heart of that anti american and anti christian (and I will quantify this statement below) movement should at the very least be a huge waking call to those extremists who cant see the forest through the neo con trees...

Because there is nothing moderate...nothing really conservative...nothing centeristic about some of these people and the things they do and say...The hypocrisy is almost unfathomable and very difficult for someone who can see it for what it is to swallow how well accepted the insane rhetoric some of these people spew on a daily basis...

Examples of this are everywhere in the republican party (not saying they are not there in the democrat party...now that Obama is POTUS there seems to be a much more unified non-jewish religious platform within the democratic party... especially with black people...who are seemingly headed down the same path the neo con republicans are) ...from the politico churchs who do their very best to mix their sermons with poiltical ideologies and preach to their people how and what to think about the issues of the day to the hannitys who talk america first but then go around spouting how dire it is for us to attack the percieved "evil doers." A very suspicious and peculiar stance for a self pro-claimed "conservative" and "Christian."

So if you wish to defend some of these hypocrites...thats on you my friend...there is room for defense of the GOP...that is the party that is supposed to represent the American people as a republic should...(not new age ideologies that have self serving agendas) but you cant defend it (the GOP) and these people...these extremists... at the same time...

It is of my opinion that the biggest realization that real conservatives have to come to is their party was hijacked even before 9/11 and has been at the center of fulfilling the agendas (began by democrats even since the civil war) for at least the last 8 years...sustaining and extending the globalization and wicked foreign policies established by the global elites who depend on these 2 major factors to maintain their status quo...

Until that happens you are going to see the destruction of conservative values and traditions that has been the glue that has held the republican party together for at least the last 200 years...And hearing how destructive and conscientious some of these scumbags have been about it can only be a good thing...even if the source is one as poor as msnbc... But hopefully it can wake some people up.



posted on Sep, 21 2009 @ 11:49 AM
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reply to post by Benevolent Heretic
 


I agree with your observations regarding the comparison between the two threads. I also agree that extremists exist at each end of the political spectrum and maybe even more on one side than the other.

The difference is a grey area due the subjective nature of each posters standard of judgement. In left wing extremist thread, examples of extremist offenders are judged against accepted societal norms of behavior. It could also be said that those offenders did not follow a set standard of moral code, rather one set by each individuals perspective. I base that on the non-religious beliefs and leanings held by the left.

Contrast that with this thread and the offenders are not only judged by a accepted societal norms of behavior, but also a moral code that is defined in numerous religious text. The condemnation is more entertaining because of a much stickier guideline and moral code of behavior, all the while caressing your ego.



posted on Sep, 21 2009 @ 03:00 PM
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Go far enough left and you start becoming far right and vice a versa...

people seem to forget or fail to understand how narrow the political spectrum in this country actually is...

in many countries our most extreme right winger's would be considered fairly liberal and our most extreme leftists would be considered moderate.

[edit on 21-9-2009 by grover]



posted on Sep, 23 2009 @ 04:25 PM
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Polarization....

Before anyone starts quiping about how republicans eat their own unless they cary the recently far right party line, they might do well to think about Joe Lieberman.

Spector, Inglis etc. Yes...right now the GOP is eating their own, driving the party further to the right.

The Democrats need their moderates to pass bills.

Regardless...this is not good for anyone. We should be celebrating our politicians who rise above partisanship, not running them out of office.

GOP Congressman Targeted By 'RINO' Hunters
www.npr.org...



Conservatives in South Carolina have singled out Rep. Bob Inglis as being a RINO, or a "Republican In Name Only," and they are vowing to purge him and others deemed not right-leaning enough from the party — even if it means alienating moderate Republicans.

By any measure, Republican Rep. Bob Inglis of South Carolina is a solid conservative. In the 1990s, he was a vehement opponent of President Clinton. Last year, he got an "A" from the National Rifle Association, and an 84 percent approval rating from the American Conservative Union. His votes to cut budgets, leave markets unregulated and restrict abortions put him among the most conservative of his party.

But things are different these days. In the past three years, the Republican Party has lost control of the House, the Senate and the White House. The result is a shrunken, somewhat disoriented GOP, one that is on a search for its soul. And Inglis' district in South Carolina is a kind of microcosm of this. It's where the congressman is already facing stiff opposition in the 2010 Republican primary, from four challengers who say he isn't conservative enough.




"Our challenge as Republicans is to win at offering solutions with a hopeful, optimistic voice, rather than shrinking the party down to a snarling few who don't present their ideas with optimism, but rather just play on the worst fears of a small group of people," he says.


[edit on 23-9-2009 by maybereal11]



posted on Sep, 23 2009 @ 04:36 PM
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reply to post by maybereal11
 


As I was reading your post, I kept thinking... What in the world has Inglis done to earn the ire of the party?


You make a great point in your post. They ALL need to rise above this "win at all costs" attitude. That is going to ruin the GOP. But maybe that's what we need to break out a third party. Right now, if a third party were to start campaigning for 2012 on a Constitution platform (Libertarian, maybe?) and get a charismatic candidate, I would be real concerned if I were a R or D...



posted on Sep, 23 2009 @ 05:12 PM
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Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
reply to post by maybereal11
 


As I was reading your post, I kept thinking... What in the world has Inglis done to earn the ire of the party?



The article sheds some light...Inglis asked Joe Wilson to apologize to his fellow Senators for the outburst.

That and as I qouted above...he feels the GOP should be focused on solutions for the country rather than blanket negative attacks and opposition to anything Obama...beyond those two items he is as conservative as they come, but within the present day GOP that was enough to garner the ire of the party leadership.

It infuriates me...and I am a democrat. I am also savy enough to know that the democratic party needs their moderates to hold a majority...so to say that the democratic party is more welcoming of dissenting voices within their party might not be entirely truthful..they need those votes.

But the GOP RINO hunts continue and good men are being told to fall in line or be driven from office.

Strategically the only outcome I can see is a smaller, louder, more extreme GOP with little hope of regaining power....and this makes me sad...and again, I am a democrat.

We need both yin and yang and wise decisions come from legitimate discourse. Absent a viable GOP the Dem party, without restraint, will eventually swell and burst...In a classic partisan mindset...they will confuse the GOPS failure with growing public endorsement of their far left...and eventually they will swing too far left and suffer the same fate the GOP is suffering.

here is hoping a good third party, like you suggested, is established to step into the void....or the GOP rebounds.

[edit on 23-9-2009 by maybereal11]



posted on Sep, 23 2009 @ 05:17 PM
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Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
reply to post by maybereal11
 

Right now, if a third party were to start campaigning for 2012 on a Constitution platform (Libertarian, maybe?) and get a charismatic candidate, I would be real concerned if I were a R or D...


I just re-read your post..

The funny thing is that if a strong third party candidate hit the scene...I think the bickering between the GOP and Dems would dissapate! They would be eager to demonstrate that they got something done prior to 2012 and both parties would at least be united in attacking the newcommer party



posted on Sep, 23 2009 @ 05:29 PM
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There are those who post here who believe that purging the GOP of what few liberal and moderate members that remain will return them to power but the odds are a hard right party will continue to alienate voters...

Their biggest bet for the return to power is Democratic incompetence...which sadly they are masters of.



posted on Sep, 23 2009 @ 05:37 PM
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reply to post by Benevolent Heretic
 


I cannot believe I've missed this thread until now. Thanks BH. The OP put into words what I've long stressed, and recently felt overwhelm by. It absolutely seems these People aren't concerned with hard cold steel facts, but are wrapped up in a cocoon of ignorant faith. I don't know how You combat that. I've read many a poster on ATS talking about how to save the USA, and most of the time they say it won't be purdy. The reason it won't be too purdy is because most wouldn't recognize the truth even should it be a rattle snake reaching out to bite.
I am finding myself having to agree with People that say it would take almost an occupation; make no mistake these People cocooned in blind faith have shaken the once great USA down to it's knees.

S&F



posted on Sep, 23 2009 @ 06:45 PM
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Originally posted by maybereal11
The article sheds some light...Inglis asked Joe Wilson to apologize to his fellow Senators for the outburst.


Oh, yeah. I read the article after I read your post, but I was shocked by the reason.



Strategically the only outcome I can see is a smaller, louder, more extreme GOP with little hope of regaining power....and this makes me sad...and again, I am a democrat.


It makes me sad, too. I'd like to see a strong, stable conservative balance to the Democrats that are in power. Bipartisanship is a fantasy under the current predicament, but it's exactly what the country needs. And I don't mean picking up 5 Republican votes on a bill...


Absent a viable GOP the Dem party, without restraint, will eventually swell and burst...In a classic partisan mindset...they will confuse the GOPS failure with growing public endorsement of their far left...and eventually they will swing too far left and suffer the same fate the GOP is suffering.


Wow. I'd like to get in on that bet. I think you are right on.


Originally posted by sanchoearlyjones
I cannot believe I've missed this thread until now. Thanks BH.


You're welcome.
I'm glad you like it.


Yeah, when I heard him make that comparison of fact to faith, I totally "got it". Being raised in a family whose faith was the center of our very existence, I understood how faith can and will outweigh the facts every time for some people.


I don't know how You combat that.


Like Schaeffer said, "You don't". I've learned a lot from this thread about the idea of trying to "fight it". You just walk on by. I mean, I still like to debate, but I have no hope of some people recognizing the facts when their faith in the lie is so strong.

I also learned a lot from the sister thread here.



[edit on 23-9-2009 by Benevolent Heretic]



posted on Sep, 23 2009 @ 10:08 PM
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Every time you mix religion and politics things turn to #!! Politicians abuse religion as a means to control people. If you constantly state religious points, and link them to your agenda, people will believe in your agenda because if they don't, they'd contradict the religious statements.

In countries like Saudi Arabia, it's exactly the same thing...politics and religion are intertwined.

Everyone has the right to believe whatever they want, AS LONG AS IT DOESN'T HURT OTHER PEOPLE. Sadly, politicians using religion as a means to support their agenda, and shoving it down the throats of people know that.

There was a reason the Western world has separated church and state...but there's too many people with blind faith. Birthers, ppl who believe dinosaurs roamed the earth alongside humans, that the earth was created 6k years ago, and so on should NOT be taken serious. We KNOW those things are not true, yet we let plenty of them make political decisions that affect all of us.

Would you hire a chimp to manage your funds? NO, of course not, because although a chimp might look cute, he's mentally not able to grasp the concept of investments.



posted on Sep, 24 2009 @ 06:34 AM
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There were sound historical reasons why the founding fathers saw fit to institutionalize the separation of church and state...it is called the reformation and all the awlful bloodshed that resulted from it from the 30 years war to the St. Bartholomew day's massacre when forces behind the French throne ordered the death of all the protestants in the kingdom...they (the founding fathers) unlike us, knew their history and were determined not to repeat it.



posted on Sep, 26 2009 @ 01:36 AM
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Originally posted by mental modulator


No, the concerns about Obama are fully crap - in fact your entire post is so crappy and unchristian I think you should think about getting into LAW.

The bible is a story filled with moral tales and fantasy - And when you base your entire world view on fantasy it seems to be easy to believe the fantastically ignorant things such as the two paragraphs above. IMSO


My concerns are crap? Take a look at your golden child. Maybe you forgot to do so prior to voting for him. You failed to notice his association with terrorists (Bill Ayers). While Obama claimed he hardly knew Ayers, it now seems that Ayers wrote his memoirs. I guess you failed to notice that Obama was funded by a Syrian national, and corrupt Chicago slum Lord. By the way did you notice who paid for Obama's schooling?

How'd you like Obamacare? You like the idea of reporting all your bank account numbers to the fed.s in case you buy too much insurance and need to be fined? How do you like health care rationing, mandatory vaccinations, death panels, government deciding your treatment options instead of your doctor? hospitals prevented from upgrading their facilities, health care rationing, paying for illegals, and the elimination of private insurance?

Did you like Obama's cronies saying that America is evil and we need to redistribute our wealth to third world countries?

You call me unchristian while insulting me and apparently enjoy the utter slander offered up by the Christ hating OP.

Finally you've never read any Biblical prophecy it seems. Otherwise you would have noticed that the Bible predicted Jesus arrival in precise detail hundreds of years before it happened and that the coming one world government, under islam, appears to also have been prophesied. Good luck explaining away all of that.



posted on Sep, 26 2009 @ 08:10 AM
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reply to post by SevenThunders
 


Thanks for providing a shining example of what this thread is about.

And the OP doesn't hate Christ.
Just FYI.



posted on Sep, 26 2009 @ 07:39 PM
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post removed because the user has no concept of manners

Click here for more information.



posted on Sep, 26 2009 @ 10:09 PM
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Originally posted by useless eaters
you have removed the option of this thread being merely an opinion.


Everything on ATS is opinion. I don't have the power to remove the option of this thread being opinion. You credit me with power I don't have.



You’re a closet liberal who is smart enough to know, liberals are supposed maintain the image of “tolerance” if they are to be creditable. So you try to make this thread appear as some sort of fair and balanced experiment. Then you covertly steer it in the direction you choose.


I am not a closet anything. I have always been quite open about my views, many of which are liberal and some of which are conservative. And, once again, I don't have the power to steer this thread. You give me entirely too much credit and power. I control only my own posts.



If the title of this thread alone is not a dead give away to your covert liberal intentions, the remainder of your comments are.


Covert? I thought it was pretty clear. I can't imagine why you think I'm hiding something. You seem quite suspicious... paranoid, even. I'm "out of the closet" so to speak. My political views have long been an open book.



This becomes all to obvious in your comparison of , Right sub-culture vs. left sub-culture, which is really no comparison at all when we see you trying to compare the left as innocent, compassionate, and non violet, and your 5 page statistic of the left demonstrating, “productive discussion”, while the bad guys, the so called right sub-culture, “is14 pages long, filled with assumptions, accusations, vitriol and attacks toward me, people taking deep offense at the topic of the thread and people sadly confirming the topic of the thread.”


Is that what it looks like to you? Your perception is very interesting. But that's all it is... Your perception and your opinion. I don't think you know me well enough to make all these conclusions, but you are entitled to you opinion, just as I am.




And, your choice of Frank (closet liberal nut job) Shaeffer as a creditable spokesman on anything to the right, is like Adolph Hitler being a creditable spokesman for democracy.


I made no claim that Mr. Schaeffer is a spokesman for the right. He's a "closet liberal" too, huh? Tell me, is everyone who disagrees with you a "closet liberal"?



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