I believe over 1,000 people were murdered due to the actions of a UK national newspaper

What if these headlines do the opposite, maybe people knives as a danger and they are aware of the consequences and are more against such acts?

Then one has to research the people who use them with the type of street slang and music they listen to on top of that. There was a big gun crime and killings amoungst Jamaican immigrants and their teenagers in London.
Why was that the case? Why has Jamiaca got such high crime rates and why does thier slang language and music contain so much recycled criminal acts that are seen as cool and the everyday normality when its not? There was never a problem like that before, life was simple in some areas of London but now it seems there baggage involving letting certain people's in. Of course there is bound to be successful people out of immigration but at the same time, honour killings is not the every day norm in British society, sometimes problems the way we see them is unrelated to what we simply write in the papers, sometimes its down to what they believe and every culture is different.

We should not feel so guilty because people write headlines in newspapers, sometimes cultures do their own conditioning and they can not even read the English language.

I have no doubt that you are onto something here. Not to say what they did was deliberate. But it's just the sublimminal message, being repeated over and over again which "plants the seed".

It's terribly irresponsible. Those using the metaphor consistently are very likely the ones, that even on a subconcious level, either wanted this to happen or maybe even feared it would happen.

It comes back to the idea that "thoughts are creative". Interesting stuff, and we might as well put on our seatbelts, because we will be seeing more of this type thing happening.

I'm glad you are on the "lookout" for it! Excellent. I'm going to be too.

Good thread.

Thanks ladyinwaiting.

To answer the post previous, every time "the knives are out" printed there has been a murder with a knife. Just these 3 months gone by, there had just been 2 murders, now there has been 4 murders in 2 days, after "the knives were got out". This cannot be allowed to continue, and I do not believe the newspaper can be allowed to continue to trade.

The biggest problem with the headlines like "Knives are out for Gordon Brown", is that to a small percentage of criminals, it is saying that kniving people is acceptable, it's OK to knife the Prime Minister - we're doing it (The Daily Mail), that's why it's the countenancing of knife crime.

Originally posted by TheDailyPlanet
Could anybody give me an estimate as to how many people have read this thread already ?

Not sure, mate. Are you worried that a few people may have gone out and murdered someone after reading this thread? After all, knives are mentioned an awful lot here

No, that is not a risk.

I told you how in the UK for 2.5 months, there was only 2 murders.

Then the Daily Mail printed a "Knives are out" headline, and there were 4 murders in 1 weekend.

This weekend just gone by, there were 4 murders with knives, none of which were reported to the readers of the Daily Mail,, after last week the Daily Mail literally printed a headline "KNIVES ARE OUT FOR ALESHA", as a double page spread like that in capitals. Until the point of the publication of that headline, there had been the lowest knife crime in the UK for years during the 2.5 months leading up to that headline - 2 murders. Then, the headline, and 4 murders in one weekend.

Here are other headlines the Daily Mail has used:-

'Knives are weapon of choice for violent criminals', new figures reveal

'Doctors have knives out for kitchen tools.' (The article explains that the tools referred to are kitchen knives).

'Knives are out for Orliath'

'After a week to forget, the knives are out'

'Why the BBC's knives are out for Osborne, Mandy is getting away with murder'

'Romeo and Juliet: Knives are out for a roving Romeo'

'Knives are out for marriage'

'The knives are out for Gordon after poll disaster in Glasgow'

'Usmanov's knives out for Gunners in Moscow talks'

'Now the knives are out for Mrs Obama'

'Knives out for Labour's 'golden couple'

'Knives are in youngsters' DNA,' minister warns [as it's revealed A&E treats 38 stab victims a day]

'The abyss facing us on knives'

'Knives out for Ancelotti...' (similar headline was used by the Daily Mirror on the same day)

'Knives out: Delia Smith attacks 'foul-mouthed' Gordon Ramsey'

'Tom Parker Bowles gets the knives out'

'Labour loses as knives out for Tory leader'

'Day of long knives as jobs cut'

'Knives are out for Charlie'

'Knives are out for Goldsmith...'

'Knives and forks out for Ming'

'Record numbers found carrying knives'

'Knives are out for Lord Levy as Blair rift grows'

'Now the Whitehall knives come out for the honest general'

'Night of frocks and knives' [TV Showbiz]

'KNIVES OUT FOR CAMILLA'

'Knife deaths at record 6 a week'

'Day of the long knives at City Hall at Boris axes 120 jobs'

'KNIVES ARE OUT FOR GORDON BROWN' (front page headline - it was the very first time that the Daily Mail used the knives are out metaphor in headlines, July 2001)

'Now they will stab him in the front'




















[edit on 29-9-2009 by TheDailyPlanet]

[edit on 29-9-2009 by TheDailyPlanet]

Further examples:-

Why no one (apart from Charles Clarke) is rushing to put the knife into Mr. Brown

Moses twists the knife

Cameron plans his own night of the long knives

News article body text:- 'This coming week marks the first anniversary of Brown's premiership - and the knives are being sharpened.'

News article body text:- 'The knives are being sharpened for the Health Secretary.'

News article body text:- 'In the wake of the credit crunch, however, the knives are out.'

City News headlines:- 'Knives are being sharpened', and 'Barclays Knives'

Sport article body texts:-

'As the knives were being aimed at Avram Grant with the body of his side still warm, John Terry made a secret vow to breath new life into Chelsea'

'The jeers of the crowd were assailing his ears and, in the background, he could hear the sound of knives being sharpened.'

[edit on 29-9-2009 by TheDailyPlanet]

Sorry to post again in this thread, I won't post again if people don't want me to.

In the UK, we achieved the greatest reduction (I believe for 8 years) in knife crime homicide for a 2.5 month period - nothing was mentioned in the media about the crime drop, after I asked them to stop printing knife metaphors like knives come out.

Then, the Daily Mail went back to printing the headline "KNIVES ARE OUT FOR ALESHA", and 4 people got murdered in a single weekend, and interest in this thread dies!

Perhaps my brain is wired up differently to a lot of people - I saw that these were effective murder incitements within a split second of the very first time it was used, on the front cover of the Daily Mail on July 2nd 2001.

[edit on 30-9-2009 by TheDailyPlanet]

Hi there - I appreciate no one else is posting, so I won't post again unless there is anyone left reading this thread, who is still interested, who posts back.

Just to let you know, that yesterday I phoned the police.

That's after seeing them 6 months ago, calling in, and telling them about the websites on the internet that include videos of people being raped, and back then was approximately the 100th most popular website in the world. The police officer explained that would likely not get involved, because she was unsure what offence had been committed, she said if it had been 'child porn' it would have been a different matter.

Six months later, and that website, is now the 84th most popular website in the world, and in the absence of any law enforcement, the treatment of the women being raped has expanded, and the ordeals being recorded have got worse.

I have made 10 phone calls to the police in the last 3 weeks, trying to get hold of a PC Jack Russell, explaining that the matters were very serious right from the first call. However, every time I phoned he was not available, and I was asked to leave a message and my phone number. Although there were at least 5 times I phoned when he was on shift, he did not phone me back.

Finally, yesterday I was put through to someone else.

I explained that I had uncovered a network of internet sites that included content of people being raped (really), and that nothing was being done to shut down this section the site, and that the site was now the 84th most popular website in the world.

I further explained that I had a list of websites which included content of people being murdered, and that nothing was being done to remove the video recordings.

I asked if this could be investigated, and the woman police officer with a very cold manner indeed, said "the police are very busy, I'm not sure that that will get investigated". She explained, naturally, that this matter would get transferred to another department, but there was absolutely no guarantee it would get investigated.

I said "If the Police do not investigate rape and murder, I'd be disgusted."

I then explained that I wished to speak to PC Jack Russell about the Daily Mail matter, for about 10 minutes, face to face, for his advice.

She said "The Police will not be investigating that."

I said "What if I had 100 letters from people saying that committed knife crime due to reading the knives are out, and to them, with a violent potential or psychotic illness; this was a trigger"

She said "The Police will still not investigate that".



[edit on 2-10-2009 by TheDailyPlanet]

Wow, I think I've scared you all off!

Anyway, thank you for all your comments and thoughts, I will be printing off the entire thread and it will be useful.

I have sent an email to Charles Garside of the Daily Mail today, the Assistant Editor, advising him that since the Mail printed "KNIVES ARE OUT FOR ALESHA" there were 6 murders in a week, prior to this, there were 2 murders in 2 and a half months. Furthermore, I have sent the Mail information of 5 cases where headlines have been cited as causing knife crimes. There are a further 5 cases where I am awaiting reply from the prisoner in respect of their commited knife crime, including 2 murders.

I spoke to one solicitor about incitement to murder legal action, however they were unable to help. Now I have found another solicitor, and he believes my point is easily provable, and the case will be won against the Daily Mail, for corporate incitement to murder.

It was good to speak to you all, and best wishes to you all for the future.

Naturally I hope to return to the forums, but the possible legal action against the Daily Mail is now taking up a lot of time, but I don't mind, because "knife culture" cannot be allowed to go on, and the investment of time is worthwhile.

There's plenty of other amazing threads on this forum, the majority of which I haven't yet had time to look at or contribute to, but I will definitely be back!

[edit on 2-10-2009 by TheDailyPlanet]

So we've identified that these statements occur, that they serve no positive purpose, and that as human beings we are susceptible to suggestion.

I would consider that a fab outcome, and commend you. Keep on demanding the truth, and if you piss them off? ... diddums

I'd just like to pip in on another subject along the same lines though, if I may?

That being another form of mind-control at their disposal - 'the totty factor'. I shall endeavour to explain.

The Blackeyed Peas most recent song in the UK was 'I gotta feeling', with the rather lovely Fergie practically in her underwear, tickling up snogging lesbians, alongside a repetitive "Go out and smash it!". It had me reet riled to be fair, because I wondered how they'd gotten to there from 'where is the love?'

However, that track has now for me been completely outshone by Cheryl Tweedy-Cole-Leek's "Fight for this love" in which she is dressed in military uniform doing a rather regal wave, has nails sticking outta both of her hips, and wears animal prints ahoy. All to the lulling ballad of "we gotta fight fight fight fight fight for this love, because heaven is worth fighting for".

It is my personal opinion that this particular song is meant to incite the military to rage, not least because of its military references. I know a young lad who trained for the army last year and he said that everywhere there are posters promoting violence and what have you. He wouldn't tell me what they said specifically, because he'd had to sign the official secrets act (if there were no secrets, society as we know it would collapse after all - yip-dee-do!). He didn't get accepted due to health reasons, but he said that when he came out all he wanted to do was beat people up. My first husband joined the army after we split up and when he came out he'd go round town kicking people in for fun.

This isn't a menial topic. It's our human instincts that are being manipulated here and it's absolutely disgusting.

Thank you for your time

Kerry-Ann
xXx

WTF is going on? (a copy of my post on Stop Knife crime now group, facebook):-

Today in the "Daily Telegraph":- "Telegraph.co.uk - London,England,UK
By Lucy Jones Last updated: October 14th, 2009 The knives are out for Jean Sarkozy, the 23-year-old son of the French president. ...

Today in the Mail & Guardian Online - Johannesburg,South Africa
"... live with the fact of journalists informing the populace; it's when readers respond with hard-hitting SMS messages that the political knives come out. ..."

Today in the Inner City Press - Bronx,NY,USA
"But some say the knives are out. Watch this site. By Matthew Russell Lee UNITED NATIONS, July 30 -- The biting incident at the UN, on which Inner City Press ..."

Today in the Guardian:-
"Sparkling, quaint indie in which Berkeley's John Ringhofer has his knives out for the likes of Damien Hirst"

And there's people that tell me that double-page spread headlines like the Mail did :-

"Who will wield the knife?" , and

"Now they will stab him in the front",

are completely fine?

I say - if you see a media outlet that has the effect of inciting murder - boycott them, in the interests of bankrupting them for what they have done. And do not commit knife crime.

I've been subscribed to this thread for a while now, and still haven't completely finished it, although I will keep it on my favorites list until I do.

I see you've taken a lot of heat and insults on this thread, but I GET it.
I really get it. I'm glad you are on to it, as in have put the pieces of the puzzle together.....although some still don't "get" it.

Do you have support in this undertaking from any other journalists or friends? Maybe a psychologist or two? I don't won't you to wind up looking like a nut job when you have a very valid observation, which could happen, as is evidenced here.

It's very distrubing what has transpired, and what the media is capable of. I'm not saying this is intentional, but rather, they have unwittingly contributed to these travesties.

Again, great thread. Thanks for contributing this. It's important.

Thanks Ladyinwaiting. I have been very surprised at the number of people who did not or do not agree with my research, and the truth is, the more opposition I get, the harder it will be for me to stop the newspapers printing phrases, as they did, like "the knives are being sharpened."

I appreciate your support, and hope I will be able to see support from others, because the quicker the knives incitements scandal has them shut down, the better.

I truly want to live in a world where there is no murder whatsoever. It is much easier to reach for this target, if the newspapers would not have the effect of promoting violence !

[edit on 18-10-2009 by TheDailyPlanet]

reply to post by TheDailyPlanet


If people could understand what is being unwittingly accomplished through this choice of wording, they might begin to understand how the media contributes to racial issues, wars, the economy, and other injustices.

Sometimes it goes beyond contributing.....it's downright creating issues.
This we know and have seen.

I am sorry I have discovered that there is a broken link in a previously posted link - the article that was published, printed and circulated in Inside Time, the prisoners' newspaper. Here is the complete article:-



Have knife metaphors

in the media

led to knife crime?



A media entrepreneur is researching what he believes is a possible cause or contributory factor in the commiting of "knife crime" in the UK, in an effort to find ways to stop these crimes from happening. Peter Dew, from Saffron Walden, Essex, believes that there may be a connection between headlines in newspapers using metaphorical language about knives and actual knife crime (involving real not metaphorical knives).

To show examples of what he means, Peter quotes examples from newspapers:- On January 8th 2006, the Daily Mail newspaper printed, on page 3, the headline "Now they will stab him in the front" (in an article about Charles Kennedy, the Liberal Democrat leader, being removed from office). On May 1st 2009, the same newspaper printed the headline "After a week to forget, the knives are out [for Gordon Brown]". In 2005, the Daily Mail newspaper also printed a double-page spread headline saying "Who will wield the knife?" (about Tony Blair). Peter's research in this area by his organisation goes right back to July 2001 - on the day that the “softly softly cannabis approach” was trialled in North Lambeth, London. Peter had himself visited the area, and saw in a newsagents that the Daily Mail had printed the front-page headline “Knives are out for Gordon Brown”.

To give an example from another newspaper, Peter quotes the Sun last year, on May 13th 2008, which printed the headline "MPs queue up to knife Brown". On the same day, a man was stabbed to death in Oxford Street London at 3.30pm. In May of this year, the Daily Mirror printed the sports page headline "Knives are out for Ancelloti".


Peter says "The problem I have with these headlines, is twofold:- having spoken to them, I am aware that many youngsters do not know that the expression 'knives are out' is metaphorical, in which case how can they tell that these headlines were not intended literally? Also, some people with mental health problems may take these headlines literally as a 'call' to get knives out - as they read the headlines and feel that they pertain to them and how they should behave and conduct themselves."

Peter would like to hear from anybody who has previously committed a violent or knife crime of any sort, who feels that they may have been influenced by such use of the English language particularly in these newspaper headlines, or where it may have been a contributory factor. If this is the case, he would be very pleased to hear from you and your information will be kept strictly confidential and anonymous. If a connection is proven, it will be easier for him to take action to stop newspapers from printing these expressions, which he believes embeds knife crime in the subconscious of the newspaper readers, leading in some cases to actual knife crime.


If any other forms of media have acted as catalysts for you, and led to violent crime, Peter would be happy to hear from you also.

You can write to Peter with your information at the following address:- Peter Dew, 7-9 Station Street, Saffron Walden, Essex, CB11 3HE. Mr. Dew will be very grateful for input received, wishes you all well, and will be very pleased to write back to all that get in touch with him.

[edit on 11-11-2009 by TheDailyPlanet]

reply to post by TheDailyPlanet


I just wanted you to know I have kept up with this thread, and I appreciate your recent post, as well as how astute you are to have put this together. Thank you for taking appropriate action through reports and complaints. I hope you are able to accomplish having others realize how significant something like this can be.

Good job, and thanks. The world could use more people like you.

Folks, I have just today posted an important video about this on YouTube.

Called "Knives are not out - put the knives away in the media"

You can see me at the computer, discussing it, and making the case.

I have never posted anything to YouTube before, hope some of you might like to see the man behind TheDailyPlanet lol! And spread the word about this abhorrent issue, hopefully the youtube videos and ones I do from henceforth will get a good number of hits, as people pass it on (tell others to view it too!)

Now working on a project to set up a national/international newspaper on the internet! (Approx 5 months away)



www.youtube.com...

[edit on 10-1-2010 by TheDailyPlanet]

The Knives of the Daily Mail newspaper.
An updated list.
(July 2001 - September 2009)

'Knives come out..' (Double Page spread)

'Knives come out again..' (Double Page spread)

'Blair buddy puts knife in Brown' (Double Page spread)

'Doctors have knives out for kitchen tools.' The article explains that the tools referred to are kitchen knives)

'Who will wield the knife?' (Double Page spread)

'Knives are out' (The headline in Peter Hitchen's column printed mid knife amnesty, arguing that the amnesty would be a complete failure). Youngsters tell me that "knives are out" means "get the knives out".

'Knives are out for Orliath'

'Knives are out for men' (Jan Moir column)

'After a week to forget, the knives are out'

'Why the BBC's knives are out for Osborne, Mandy is getting away with murder'

'Romeo and Juliet: Knives are out for a roving Romeo'

'Knives are out for marriage'

'The knives are out for Gordon after poll disaster in Glasgow'

'Usmanov's knives out for Gunners in Moscow talks'

'Now the knives are out for Mrs Obama'

'Knives out for Labour's 'golden couple'

'Knives are weapon of choice for violent criminals', new figures reveal (any surprise after all these headlines?)

'Knives are in youngsters' DNA,' minister warns [as it's revealed A&E treats 38 stab victims a day] (is it any surprise?)

'The abyss facing us on knives'

'A knife attack every 4 minutes'

'Knives out for Ancelotti...' (similar headline was used by the Daily Mirror on the same day)

'Knives out: Delia Smith attacks 'foul-mouthed' Gordon Ramsey'

'Tom Parker Bowles gets the knives out'

'Labour loses as knives out for Tory leader'

'Day of long knives as jobs cut'

'Knives are out for Charlie'

'Knives are out for Goldsmith...'

'Knives and forks out for Ming'

'Record numbers found carrying knives'

'Knives are out for Lord Levy as Blair rift grows'

'Now the Whitehall knives come out for the honest general'

'Night of frocks and knives' [TV Showbiz]

'KNIVES OUT FOR CAMILLA'

'Knife deaths at record 6 a week'

'Day of the long knives at City Hall as Boris axes 120 jobs'

'Now they will stab him in the front'

'THE SHADOW OF THE KNIFE' (Front Page headline)

'KNIVES OUT FOR GORDON RAMSEY' (Double page spread)

'KNIVES ARE OUT FOR ALESHA' (Double Page spread)

'KNIVES ARE OUT FOR GORDON BROWN' (Front Page headline - it was the very first time that the Daily Mail used the knives are out metaphor in headlines, July 2001)

'Why no one (apart from Charles Clarke) is rushing to put the knife into Mr. Brown'

'Moses twists the knife...'

'Cameron plans his own night of the long knives'...

News article body text:- 'This coming week marks the first anniversary of Brown's premiership - and the knives are being sharpened.'

News article body text:- 'The knives are being sharpened for the Health Secretary.'

News article body text:- 'In the wake of the credit crunch, however, the knives are out.'

City News headlines:- 'Knives are being sharpened', and 'Barclays Knives'

Sport article body texts:-

'The jeers of the crowd were assailing his ears and, in the background, he could hear the sound of knives being sharpened.'

"As the knives were being aimed at Avram Grant with the body of his side still warm, John Terry made a secret vow to breath new life into Chelsea", I quote the Daily Mail newspaper.

"This coming week marks the first anniversary of Brown's premiership - and the knives are being sharpened."

"The knives are being sharpened for the Health Secretary."

"In the wake of the credit crunch, however, the knives are out."

"Also nowadays if a high profile person gets it wrong the knives are out for them."

"So the knives are out for him big time. Alistair Darling and Ed Balls."

"The knives are out, the blood is flowing. Won't be long, now."

"The knives are out: The knife-thrower throws daggers at Oksana."

(some time back):- "However, Labour and the Liberal Democrats said it showed the "knives are out" for the Tory leader."

"In the kitchen, temperaments are frying, knives are out in every sense."

"I think you'd struggle at the moment - the knives are out, polished, sharpened, and I think we are a lesser country for it."

City News headlines:- 'Knives are being sharpened', and 'Barclays' Knives'

Sport article body texts:-

"The jeers of the crowd were assailing his ears and, in the background, he could hear the sound of knives being sharpened."

"As the knives were being aimed at Avram Grant with the body of his side still warm, John Terry made a secret vow to breath new life into Chelsea"

"And the knives are out. Blood-letting is imminent, we hear, when the Government calls in British Olympic Association heads next week to demand an ..."

"Suddenly, the knives come out and the dimly lit, tree-lined streets around the Olympic Stadium become the scene for a sinister game of dare, ..."

"Watch the knives come out for him when Man City go through a bad run of results. The expectation to win something will lead to impatience.."

"Martin has seen the writing on the wall now so he should watch his back and have another job lined up when the knives come out again."

"I am not the most patient guy in the world." Portsmouth chairman Milan Mandaric after giving under-fire boss Alain Perrin the vote of confidence. Sharpened knives anyone?"

(Please DO NOT commit knife crime)

I have made the matter public on Facebook "Stop Knife Crime" groups.


Testimony was sent to the Daily Mail in June 2006, that these headlines were catalysts for knife crimes (from an ex knife crime criminal), but despite over 10 letters since July 2001, Mr. Paul Dacre, the Chief Editor still did not listen. Generally every time a special delivery complaint was sent in 2001, the complaint was ignored - knife cacophemism headlines were used MORE, and more people were murdered.

DMGT plc was sent an official cease and desist letter on June 22nd 2009.

Knife crime plummeted to just 2 homicides in 2.5 months in the UK after a period where knife metaphors were ceased in the media (following phone calls by me), prior to the September double-page spread in the Daily Mail - they went to press with "KNIVES ARE OUT FOR ALESHA" (after our cease and desist letter which was completely ignored).

PLEASE DO see my YouTube video about this, it's my YouTube debut! :-

www.youtube.com...

I haven't been on the site for a while, best regards to all.