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Capitalism = Racism (A Brief Exploration)

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posted on Sep, 17 2009 @ 09:31 AM
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reply to post by fapython
 


I really do appreciate you input and your belief that racism is only a tool for liberals to undermine the 'free' country we live in. If hate and racism were gone, why would we have this?





Lynx and Lamb are the 14 year old twin rockers behind the band “Prussian Blue”. Behind their sweet smiles and good looks lies white supremacy and hatred for all races that are not pure. They spread their message with lyrics like “When the man who plows the fields is driven from his lands. When the carpenter must give away what he’s built with his own hands. When a mother’s only children belong to her no more. And black masked men with guns come bashing down the doors. Where freedom exists for only those with darker skin. Where lies and propaganda will never let you win. Where symbols of your heritage are held with such contempt, and benefits of country ‘cept tax are you exempt . Aryan man awake, How much more will you take, Turn that fear to hate, Aryan man awake.” The band’s name “Prussian Blue” was chosen because they are Prussian German, they have blue eyes, and the “lack of Prussian Blue coloring (Zyklon B residue) in the so-called gas chambers in the concentration camps might make people question some of the inaccuracies of the “Holocaust” myth”. They are gaining popularity globally and that’s a scary thought.

The girls were homeschooled by their mother, April Gaede, an activist and writer for the white nationalist organization National Vanguard. The twins' grandfather wears a swastika belt buckle, uses the Nazi symbol on his truck, and registered it as a cattle brand. They have recently been criticized for stipulating that goods they donated to Hurricane Katrina victims should go only to white people. (prussianbluestore)


...or this:

Russia - Skinheads Firebomb Synagogue

Any thinking that racism is a one-sided problem is just a little bit misguided. I appreciate your input though.




posted on Sep, 17 2009 @ 09:41 AM
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Originally posted by undo
"money is the root of all evil" phrase, needs to be fleshed out all the way. money is not the root of all evil, it's a survival mechanism. the root of all evil is the craving for power. in some cases, this translates to the accumulation of power by whatever means necessary. as the moral foundation slips, the "by whatever means necessary" concept becomes more pronounced and less humane.


Money is not the 'root of all evil.' the LOVE of money is. When money is used as a tool, that's great. I think it SHOULD be that way. When money is hoarded and lusted after, it can become an issue. When acquiring more money becomes more important than another human life, then we get into the situation we have today. We end up with less than ONE PERCENT of the population controlling more than NINETY PERCENT of the world's wealth.



posted on Sep, 17 2009 @ 09:46 AM
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Originally posted by KSPigpen


Money is not the 'root of all evil.' the LOVE of money is. When money is used as a tool, that's great. I think it SHOULD be that way. When money is hoarded and lusted after, it can become an issue. When acquiring more money becomes more important than another human life, then we get into the situation we have today. We end up with less than ONE PERCENT of the population controlling more than NINETY PERCENT of the world's wealth.



And free market capitalism has nothing to do with that. The entore world is not under the Umbrella of the free market for one. And the FED, World Bank, and IMF, are not free market institutions. They are government enforced monopolies. Put there to "end poverty". The system you are espousing already exists, it kills millions of people every year.

[edit on 17-9-2009 by aravoth]



posted on Sep, 17 2009 @ 11:40 AM
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reply to post by KSPigpen
 


Do you eve understand what slavery was? It had NOTHING TO DO with race. It was social status. The bottom was a slave/indentured servant, who had a freedom price, generally, though it was hard to obtain. Then came the unskilled laborers, serfs, etc, on up to landowners and nobility. Why were there so many black slaves? Because Africans had a lot of "brothers" to sell. Anyone who owed a debt that they could not pay, or were captured in war or convicted of certain crimes, could become a slave. Of course, then there were those like the irish, who were tricked into slavery, sort of, when they were desperate for a means to flee to the new world.

In relation to capitalism...well, slavery doesn't relate to capitalism, really. It has nothing to do with the market type, its a type of labor pool. That's sort of like saying it rains because there are rivers. Evaporation from ground water leads to rain, but it may not and does not need to be from a river; a river is merely a possible source of ground water.

The only connection economy has to racism in this country is this, and you and many other are going to howl at this truth, Im sure, because it goes against the hero worship Im sure you were taught:

In the civil war, because Lincoln wanted to severely reduce the power of the states and give it to the federal government, the South resisted. Emancipation eventually because a tool of economic warfare for Lincoln; the economy of the North was in banking and money, in large part, while the economy of the South was in farming and labor, meaning that most of the wealth of the south had been invested in the cheapest labor available at the time, ie, buying slaves from Africans who were happy to sell, and then maintaining them on plantations. So, to rob the South of all of its wealth, (and the reason why the south is still significantly poorer than the north, the reason why, btw, there are so many and such large ghettos in the south,) Lincoln made the emancipation proclamation, bankrupting the entire economy of the South and ending their ability to fight for maintaining the balance of power that our founding fathers had intended.

Because so many landowners were robbed of the freedom wages of their slaves, they heavily resented the freed slaves and felt as though they were all thieves, and should rightly still be slaves. For those who are still racist in the South, it stems from a long memory of generations of wealth stolen in moments, as well as resentment passed down through generations. If blacks are entitled to continue resenting white people for slavery, (despite there being, of course, numerous BLACK slave owners,) then don't you expect white people to remember being robbed? I think both sides need to grow up and move on, but perhaps now you have some inkling of the subject?



posted on Sep, 17 2009 @ 11:43 AM
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reply to post by KSPigpen
 


And btw...a child forced into prostitution has nothing to do with capitalism. I don't even begin to see how you think those are related. Children are exploited for sex in pretty much every country, and every economy. That has to do with horrible people, not economy.

Oh, and btw...exploitation of people...you do realize that communism and socialism are, essentially, forced exploitation of every successful individual in the ENTIRE NATION?? Talk about hypocrisy.



posted on Sep, 17 2009 @ 11:47 AM
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First things first

Using Dictionary.com lets have a review the meaning of brief.


brief

–adjective
1. lasting or taking a short time; of short duration: a brief walk; a brief stay in the country.
2. using few words; concise; succinct: a brief report on weather conditions.
3. abrupt or curt.
4. scanty: a brief bathing suit.


Ha ha, that was a joke.


Seriously, I understand the connection you are trying to make, but I see a huge flaw in your logic. Capitalism is indiscriminate and therefore can't be considered racial. It does not select a particular race to take advantage of generally. It is an economic philosophy and not an ideology like racism.

I believe racism comes from the subconscious mind as a survival instinct at birth then, depending on the individual, is either overcome with intelligence or it is fostered into a hateful viewpoint by several factors.

I could go on, and kudos for taking the time to make a great contribution, but my point is that I don't believe the two are related. I would say that capitalism does separate a population by class, but not by race. If a particular race is being discriminated against, it is because of individuals and not capitalism.



posted on Sep, 17 2009 @ 11:50 AM
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reply to post by KSPigpen
 


About Prussian Blue...never heard of them, but none of those lyrics were racist. They were all true, sadly, at least in some portions of this country. Sounds more like a rally to try to get some people to stand up for their own heritage and culture instead of sacrificing it all for the culture of others. Granted, I think the choice of using Hitler smileys and the whole Aryan thing is a bit shady, but sometimes such things are a tool for shock. To get people to actually pay attention. Some musicians, like say, Marilyn Manson, use all sorts of shock factors, including racial slurs towards pretty much all races, to try to make a point about the stupidity of the entire race game in the first place.

Let me put it this way: Exactly how many black rap um.."artists," if I can use that term loosely, are there, that go on about black culture and hating on white people? That's like a third of the basis for all rap. Perhaps these children felt a need to fight fire with fire.



posted on Sep, 17 2009 @ 12:02 PM
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Originally posted by saturnine_sweet
reply to post by KSPigpen
 

Because so many landowners were robbed of the freedom wages of their slaves, they heavily resented the freed slaves and felt as though they were all thieves, and should rightly still be slaves.


Are you sure you really read what you wrote? "Rightly" still be slaves?

Let's say you have a child. I abduct her and then the police are able to free her. Nobody in their right mind would state that I should be "rightly" angry to have missed out on my ransom.



posted on Sep, 17 2009 @ 12:09 PM
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reply to post by saturnine_sweet
 



Originally posted by KSPigpen
Where freedom exists for only those with darker skin.


What part of the lyric is not racist? You totally lost me there, again ...



[edit on 17-9-2009 by Nichiren]



posted on Sep, 17 2009 @ 12:23 PM
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reply to post by KSPigpen
 


Well, in a Utopian society that's how it would work, but the value placed on work for different locations around the world cannot be the same. You cannot pay Jamal in india 10.75 for doing the same work here because there would be no profit in it, so why do it, for the betterment of man? Won't happen ever.

Profit, even if it means paying 5 cents less is still 5 cents earned in profit. Why would any company make any products if they made no profit from those products?



posted on Sep, 17 2009 @ 01:52 PM
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reply to post by saturnine_sweet
 


Your motivation is refreshing. For starters, I don't pretend to know anything about anything.

I'm not standing strongly on the assertion that slavery was, or IS race-related. It is clearly stated in the Op that slaver was and is common across all racial lines.

The argument is that slavery fed capitalism and racism was fed from slavery. Really pretty simple. No, it's not the ONLY cause of racism. A good post on Tribalism was contributed earlier. It's very compelling.



In relation to capitalism...well, slavery doesn't relate to capitalism, really. It has nothing to do with the market type, its a type of labor pool.


So....when I have a group of slaves and they work for me for free, does that no increase my profit? How is something that increases you profit no related to capitalism? Slaves allow you to accumulate wealth, they are also considered assets themselves. Please stop looking down your nose long enough to look up the word capitalism and then come back and EXPLAIN to us all how owning slaves is in now way related to capitalism.



Im sure, because it goes against the hero worship Im sure you were taught:


Look, I would really love to have a civil discussion with you, but you're going to have to pull your weight. For one, you will have to stop assuming you know what I've been 'taught.'

I think you have incorrectly assumed that perhaps I fawn over Lincoln and his so called 'emancipation.' I worship no heroes. I worship no man. I also detest generalizations and stereotypes. I am, myself guilty of them, but please try to be objective and bring pertinent discussion, rather than personal attacks to the table. This has absolutely nothing to do with my 'feelings' for any president or political party.



Because so many landowners were robbed of the freedom wages of their slaves, they heavily resented the freed slaves and felt as though they were all thieves, and should rightly still be slaves.


Now this completely blows me away. The landowners were ROBBED of what they should have been PAID to free a slave? So that pissed them off? Hmm...I suppose if I had banked on slaves working for me and then somebody said they could leave, I would be pissed too. 'freedom wages?' does that not sound patently wrong to you? A sum of money that should be paid to your master so that you can have your freedom?



For those who are still racist in the South, it stems from a long memory of generations of wealth stolen in moments, as well as resentment passed down through generations.


Hmm....so what you're saying is that racism in the South has something to do with with wealth, by way of these 'freedom wages', being stolen. Someone stole these landowners CAPITAL and so now they are still mad? Hmm...and what is your argument against the premise of capitalism creating racism?


And btw...a child forced into prostitution has nothing to do with capitalism. I don't even begin to see how you think those are related. Children are exploited for sex in pretty much every country, and every economy. That has to do with horrible people, not economy.


When someone is FORCED into slavery, ANY type of slaver, so that someone else can PROFIT from that, yeah, I'm afraid it has everything to do with capitalism, or at least the illusion of capitalism that we are fed.



Oh, and btw...exploitation of people...you do realize that communism and socialism are, essentially, forced exploitation of every successful individual in the ENTIRE NATION?? Talk about hypocrisy.


NOWHERE, in the Op, or subsequent replies have I advocated ANY system, except perhaps the system of Abundance, mentioned by badmedia. Are you calling me a hypocrite, or would you just like to 'talk' about hypocrisy? Because we might need another thread for that.



About Prussian Blue...never heard of them, but none of those lyrics were racist.



"We want our people to stay white … we don't want to just be, you know, a big muddle. We just want to preserve our race," says Lynx Gaede.


www.progressiveu.org...

(little Hitler smiley faces on their shirts are cute, huh? )


I suppose I may hev been confusing racism with nationalism? Hmm...


The twins live with their mother in Bakersfield, California, one of the most conservative major cities in the state. But they are already looking for even whiter pastures. Their mother recently sold her house in Bakersfield, and is searching for a nice all-white community somewhere in the Pacific Northwest.


The artists are really irrelevant. And yes, there are black artists advocating hate ass well. None of it is very productive. It's apparently fairly popular and makes them lots of money, but I don't see how it could help anything.

Again, for the fourth time, it's not really just about black and white. We see THAT part because we live in America, right now.

Some racists, I'm sure think that the blacks should still be slaves, so that the landowners can get the 'freedom wages' they are entitled to. I'm sure as well, that some black people are mad because some white people think they should still be slaves.

I'm still not really seeing your argument. You've pretty much just helped me with mine. I appreciate it though.

Thanks for your contribution.



posted on Sep, 17 2009 @ 01:54 PM
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Originally posted by Stinkhorn1
reply to post by KSPigpen
 


Well, in a Utopian society that's how it would work, but the value placed on work for different locations around the world cannot be the same. You cannot pay Jamal in india 10.75 for doing the same work here because there would be no profit in it, so why do it, for the betterment of man? Won't happen ever.

Profit, even if it means paying 5 cents less is still 5 cents earned in profit. Why would any company make any products if they made no profit from those products?




I think you've summed up the problem quite nicely. Are you for hire?


It all comes down to profit.



posted on Sep, 17 2009 @ 02:05 PM
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Originally posted by Hal9000
First things first

Using Dictionary.com lets have a review the meaning of brief.


brief

–adjective
1. lasting or taking a short time; of short duration: a brief walk; a brief stay in the country.
2. using few words; concise; succinct: a brief report on weather conditions.
3. abrupt or curt.
4. scanty: a brief bathing suit.


Ha ha, that was a joke.


Seriously, I understand the connection you are trying to make, but I see a huge flaw in your logic. Capitalism is indiscriminate and therefore can't be considered racial. It does not select a particular race to take advantage of generally. It is an economic philosophy and not an ideology like racism.

I believe racism comes from the subconscious mind as a survival instinct at birth then, depending on the individual, is either overcome with intelligence or it is fostered into a hateful viewpoint by several factors.

I could go on, and kudos for taking the time to make a great contribution, but my point is that I don't believe the two are related. I would say that capitalism does separate a population by class, but not by race. If a particular race is being discriminated against, it is because of individuals and not capitalism.


Wow. I am so thankful for your civility. It would seem that people CAN make a point without throwing labels and insults around.
A breath of fresh air today.


I believe as well, that the NEED to associate with one's own 'kind' is ingraned genetically on an animal level with humans. The issue I'm taking is the artificial interruption of that practice by the acquiring and use of humnas from anothher ethnicity to do work and raise profit.

As justification for this behavior, the black man was dehumanized, made out to be dumber, but stronger, good for hard work, but not much else.

When a monetary system encourages the subjugation of an ethnicity and then legislation overrides that monetary system, you're left with slave 'owners' who got 'robbed' and ex slaves that have resentment towards their former 'owners.' Humans are the cream of the crop when it comes to fostering resentments and maintaining feuds for hundreds of years.

We don't forget. We teach our children our hatred as well. Some of us, anyway.

You argument about the individual being responsible, is absolutely correct, in my opinion, but the individuals 'overcoming' of that bias and hatred has to be made AFTER having been exposed to that hatred for some time. Some people will not go through the trouble of approaching the issue with an open mind or heart, and so we are left with what we have now.

Racism that TRULY exists. Some of it vengeful, violent and incessant, and a good deal of, again, just in my opinion, traceable back to when one man could OWN another.



posted on Sep, 17 2009 @ 03:22 PM
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I realized right after I posted I shouldnt have, talking about horrible atrosities in the past. I jump to conclusions strung out and tired and always look for parallels. Read through quick some pretty strange pictures. Imagine if you will someone being used for 20 years in LA, and cause of the script what we need him for we plan an near death attack and give very tiny breast implants to her then cant live any sort of normal life till you get better, oh wait someone has a problem with you again , life of heavy tranquilizers you dont need wander around aimlessly while everyone laughs at you. Waste more time ask them to stop and it just means new and creative ways to come after you, ask again they try to kill you deny medical rights and abuse you where you go then you can come home and watch TV. Then think to yourself what about MY life when do I get back to that, are we done YET.



posted on Sep, 17 2009 @ 08:49 PM
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reply to post by Nichiren
 


I meant to say these dispossessed former slave owners feel that the former slaves should still be slaves. Got a little blurry on the specifics of whose viewpoint I was illustrating. But um...slaves were not abducted. Seriously...read some history.



posted on Sep, 17 2009 @ 08:52 PM
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reply to post by Nichiren
 

Um...what world do you live in? A white person can't do anything to cross a colored person, or its a hate crime. One place Ive lived in the past few years, businesses openly advertised for minority employees only. Ever go into a largely minority area? Ive lived in several, and its a daily dose of hate from minorities, but they are only "feeling oppressed." Being a white male is nearly a crime, these days. Or even a half-white male, unless you happen to be half-black or half-hispanic. So yeah...stating the truth is not racism, just because you don't like the truth.



posted on Sep, 17 2009 @ 09:18 PM
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reply to post by KSPigpen
 


First off, I am beginning to suspect you're just trolling, more than anything. But to reply to some of your comments....If I pay for someone to work for me, and then someone else comes along and takes away the labor I paid for, yes, that is wrong. Do I agree with slavery? No. But it was the accepted practice of the day, and in the process of abolition, there should have been compensation to the owners. What they did was not illegal at the time, therefore they were unjustly ruined. Preeeetty simple concept. Completely unrelated to race, really. Race was just a handy identifier, because the primary source of slaves was black africans selling black africans.

For some strange reason you seem to equate capitalism with the existence of money and monetary gain. Rivers and rain, all over again. I would suggest some mathematics for you, on this. Just because A and B both can be added to another integer to equal C, it does not mean that they are equal.

A system of abundance is just a utopian offshoot of Communism, one that completely ignores any aspect of reality. So yes, essentially, if you are against capitalism, or, more specifically, you appear to be against any sort of wages or reward for human accomplishment, and against any sort of monetary system, then yes, you essentially espouse the ideals that are the philosophical groundwork of communism. Playing nonsensical word games about it only makes you look like a troll. Or a politician.

Why is it racist to want to preserve your heritage, your people? I don't care what color someone is, for myself, (because I am of mixed heritage,) but I can see why someone would want to maintain their cultural heritage and identity. Seems pretty logical. Its called independence. You know, wanting to hold to one's personal ideals and identity, rather than being part of an insane, identity-less hive-mind society. Not really about race, race is just a visible aspect of it. Got any more quotes? Not even saying they aren't racist, as I said, I am not familiar with them, just pointing out that nothing that you are criticizing as racist is anything racist, and is commonly accepted by anyone non-white.

Oh, and the mom looking for a more white community? Are you remotely aware of the crime and social degradation that runs rampant in most minority areas? I live in one, so I know first hand. I lived in mostly white communities my whole life, until the past year, and saw little crime. Now I live in a minority community, and there is a crime on the block almost every night. And no, I don't even live in the projects. These people aren't poor. They just are part of a culture that has no respect for others. Which, btw, is why most people avoid minority communities. Not because of their color, but because of the culture that tends to follow large groups of minorities around. If they want acceptance, they need to act civilized and have respect for others. I have a lot of minority friends, and guess what? They feel the same way, and move to "white" communities as soon as they can afford to. Its not tied to race, its tied to culture, but the culture tends to be a part of race. Make sense now?

I helped you with your argument? By showing how foolish and removed from reality you are? Slavery was all over the world, but had nothing to do with racism. Racism, worldwide...there is a lot less than you think. Cultural tensions, yes, LOTS of those. But let's see....wasn't it Serbia where a bunch of white people recently slaughtered....a bunch of white people? Because of CULTURE. And trying to force people to embrace another's culture, instead of letting us all live our own lives and find harmony in the places where they need to intersect, only breeds hatred and cultural tension.

Again...I think perhaps you might just be trolling. Because you aren't really arguing anything. You made a nonsensical statement, backed it up with unconnected points, then spout off more disjointed debate that ignores anything you find inconvenient. And top it all off by patting yourself on the back. My, thats neo-american style pseudo-intellectualism at its best. Congrats, you might have a future in politics or education.



posted on Sep, 17 2009 @ 10:23 PM
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reply to post by saturnine_sweet
 



Do I agree with slavery? No. But it was the accepted practice of the day, and in the process of abolition, there should have been compensation to the owners.


I still don't understand how a human can think that it is, or was ever OK to OWN another human being. Nothing personal, as I know you probably didn't own any. The concept is just atrocious, whether it was legal not. To argue that slave owners should have been compensated when their slaves were freed is also a belief that I can't make any sense of. To each his own, or her own, I suppose.



For some strange reason you seem to equate capitalism with the existence of money and monetary gain. Rivers and rain, all over again. I would suggest some mathematics for you, on this.


I'm not the one constantly telling you that you should get an education. Whether it's math, or history, or whatever else. If you want to have a discussion without the personal attacks that will be fine. I enjoy that.

I would recommend a dictionary, and a brief reading of the definition of capitalism. You might be busy, so I'll get that one for you.


cap⋅i⋅tal⋅ism  [kap-i-tl-iz-uhm] Show IPA
–noun
an economic system in which investment in and ownership of the means of production, distribution, and exchange of wealth is made and maintained chiefly by private individuals or corporations, esp. as contrasted to cooperatively or state-owned means of wealth.


It's the definition. Not a lot of wiggle room in there, it's pretty cut and dry. Slaves were assets, owned by private individuals for the production of other assets. I'm not making this stuff up or playing 'nonsensical word games' as you suggest. There is a definition and slavery fits right in.



A system of abundance is just a utopian offshoot of Communism, one that completely ignores any aspect of reality. So yes, essentially, if you are against capitalism, or, more specifically, you appear to be against any sort of wages or reward for human accomplishment, and against any sort of monetary system, then yes, you essentially espouse the ideals that are the philosophical groundwork of communism. Playing nonsensical word games about it only makes you look like a troll. Or a politician.


One more time for the record. I don't espouse any type of economic system. There is a relation between capitalism and slavery. Do I like capitalism, sure I do. I like to get paid for my job. Would I be angry if someone came and 'took' it from me for ten dollars less an hour, sure I would be. Why? because I like money. I like buying food and driving my car. I milk capitalism as much as the next guy and I really don't think there is a better alternative. There is fairy tale make believe stuff, but nothing we know of right now that can fix the system. I do firmly believe the system is broken, but that's not really the issue here.



Why is it racist to want to preserve your heritage, your people? I don't care what color someone is, for myself, (because I am of mixed heritage,) but I can see why someone would want to maintain their cultural heritage and identity.


I don't think that it is wrong to want to preserve your heritage, unless the 'preservation' of your heritage means discrimination or crime committed against someone else. I'm of mixed heritage as well. We're hard pressed to find anyone in America that is not. again, kudos for wanting to preserve your heritage, unless that means wanting to rid the world of other, inferior races to preserve your own.



as I said, I am not familiar with them, just pointing out that nothing that you are criticizing as racist is anything racist, and is commonly accepted by anyone non-white.


That is an awful large authoritarian hat you're putting on there. How can you speak for what 'anyone non-white' accepts? We're heading off on a tangent with this leg of the conversation anyway. There ARE racists alive today. They would like to kill black people, or white people, or anyone who has different color skin or heritage. Even that precious heritage YOU have, that you want so much to preserve is offensive to someone. I really don't think you would need any more 'quotes' to be able to accept the existence of raced-based bias (racism) as fact.



These people aren't poor. They just are part of a culture that has no respect for others. Which, btw, is why most people avoid minority communities. Not because of their color, but because of the culture that tends to follow large groups of minorities around. If they want acceptance, they need to act civilized and have respect for others. I have a lot of minority friends, and guess what? They feel the same way, and move to "white" communities as soon as they can afford to. Its not tied to race, its tied to culture, but the culture tends to be a part of race. Make sense now?


It makes plenty of sense to me. I hear you loud and clear. It's not their 'race' that you can't stand, it's the 'culture' that 'follows them around.' I hear you though. 'Them people' ought to just be good white folks and move to a white neighborhood so they can learn how to behave themselves. You're making yourself very clear.



I helped you with your argument? By showing how foolish and removed from reality you are?


Look, I know you've been a round the block a couple times, and I'm trying real hard to understand what you're saying and have reasonable discussion with you. I value your input and your perspective, but try to stay focused on the issue and not the person, ok? You helped with my argument by pointing out that:



For those who are still racist in the South, it stems from a long memory of generations of wealth stolen in moments, as well as resentment passed down through generations.


YOUR words. And to expand on that, IF black people in the south were never slaves, what would the southern racists be mad about then? If they had never lost their wealth, through emancipation, what would their complaint and generation-spanning resentments be about then? It's about money, wealth, assets, capital. Call me what you want to on a personal level, I am immune, but you still have not proven that no connection exists between capitalism and racism, as you have provided a wonderful example to illustrate that point. If slavery had never existed in the south, the southern racists, wouldn't have anything to be mad about.



Again...I think perhaps you might just be trolling. Because you aren't really arguing anything. You made a nonsensical statement, backed it up with unconnected points, then spout off more disjointed debate that ignores anything you find inconvenient. And top it all off by patting yourself on the back. My, thats neo-american style pseudo-intellectualism at its best. Congrats, you might have a future in politics or education.


I disagree with your interpretation of the discussion we are having. I think I have been firm and unwavering in my convictions and my attempt to justify my assertions. I have provided examples that I don't feel are disjointed and I don't really know how much evidence of racism one would need, but yeah.
I am all ABOUT the inconvenience. I am very, very willing to examine what I 'think' I know and seek out differing opinions that have the potential to correct my beliefs. If I wasn't interested in that examination, you and your half dozen personal attacks so far would have been ignored by now. My ignore list is empty and will always be that way for that reason. If I ignore you, I might miss that little spark of something that could change my beliefs forever. It's not a chance I'm willing to take. But I am also not going to roll over and assume that anyone is God incarnate unless he can provide me some proof.

I have a hard time understanding the defensiveness and personally attacking nature of your posts, as I have tried my best to remain civil and focused with you. It might just take me a little longer to understand or accept something, but it doesn't in any way mean that I discount your opinion, or your contribution.

I reread the posts and am having a difficult time finding the alleged 'back patting.' Maybe you can quote that for me or something. If I came across as arrogant, or ignorant, or abrasive, or abusive, please point out where so that I may strive to keep that from happening again.



you might have a future in politics


And that's just hitting below the belt. Thanks for your input again.



posted on Sep, 17 2009 @ 10:26 PM
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reply to post by saturnine_sweet
 


I totally agree that we don't live in the same world LOL. The world you live in is a scary place where black, brown, yellow, green and pink people are out to get you. And you know what, they've already succeeded because your posts are based on fear. Boo!



posted on Sep, 17 2009 @ 10:39 PM
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reply to post by KSPigpen
 


I really admire your ability to level with an ethically challenged individual. Don't have the nerves for that.



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