Forest a Desert, Cool the World (Turn the Sahara Green)

I think it was around 12,000 years ago the earth wobbled and the Sahara Turned Green.

For more than a century, a few scientists have occasionally daydreamed of transforming much of the Sahara desert green, with a lush inland sea or vast tracts of farmland. Now researchers say they have actually found a way to make such a scheme work with forests across the desert

The article goes on to say that :-

The scheme could also work for the arid Australian outback

I'm not particularly keen on his idea to use aqueducts to send desalinated water to the desert. Surly it would be better to plant salt tolerant plants and trees.

Science Now

But could it save the planet

If I am not mistaken, isn't the Saharan region starting to green slightly already? It's not a huge change, but the advance of the desert is slowed if not stopped. Overgrazing will be the main problem.

Let nature takes it's course, it's always a bad idea to think mankind can control the climate. We will cause more problems with our great "ideas" than Nature will deal us.

National Geographic News July 31, 2009

Desertification, drought, and despair—that's what global warming has in store for much of Africa. Or so we hear.

Emerging evidence is painting a very different scenario, one in which rising temperatures could benefit millions of Africans in the driest parts of the continent. greening desert picture Study Says Scientists are now seeing signals that the Sahara desert and surrounding regions are greening due to increasing rainfall. If sustained, these rains could revitalize drought-ravaged regions, reclaiming them for farming communities.

news.nationalgeographic.com...

Actually, greening the desert has been done on a small scale. This is a goal of permaculture -- and it works. The problem is that it doesn't get a lot of publicity because there is not money in this approach for big agri-business or other big corporations.

Here is a short video on the Dead Sea Greening Experiment


[edit on 16-9-2009 by metamagic]

reply to post by majestictwo


Good post!

I'll have to say that with all the trees being cut down in the Amazon and our Oxygen supply running out that this would be a great thing to do... there's plenty of land in these deserts... it would also then become a habitable place to live and as long as your not digging up more green roots to produce habitable places to live i'm all for it... more room, more space, more energy, more oxygen...

As it says in the artical... this could also produce more rainwater for desolate lands which need it...

S+F from me

[edit on 16-9-2009 by TruthxIsxInxThexMist]

If you turned the Sahara green, you could feed Africa too. Normally I'm against "greening" deserts, as most of the world's deserts are complex ecosystems to themselves, but the Sahara is very close to a complete wasteland.

If you follow Interstate 10 east from Los Angeles toward Arizona you will see efforts to green the desert, also. Rows of trees that are drought resistant are like soldiers holding the line against sands and surface heating. With enough money behind it, you can do anything. The Sahara is extremely large, and to make a significant dent will take generations of effort, and some future restrictions on grazing.

Apparently, overgrazing by sheep/goats is what likely stripped the surface materials to begin with.

Originally posted by TruthxIsxInxThexMist
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I'll have to say that with all the trees being cut down in the Amazon and our Oxygen supply running out that this would be a great thing to do.

Whoa, whoa whoa, there. Back up a little bit. Our oxygen supply running out? Please provide proof.

Originally posted by TruthxIsxInxThexMist

As it says in the artical... this could also produce more rainwater for desolate lands which need it...

S+F from me

[edit on 16-9-2009 by TruthxIsxInxThexMist]

Yeah and it also says:

Planting these forests might have side effects. The increased moisture could trigger plagues of locusts in Africa, just as the odd wet year does now. It could also dampen existing soils, stopping iron-rich dust from blowing off the Sahara and into the Atlantic Ocean, where it nourishes sea life, the study points out.

There's bound to be unintended consequences to such an action.

Let nature decide the fate of the Sahara, as another poster stated. The Saharan region has gone through multiple changes in regards to climate.

The more we meddle with natural cycles, the more we mess them up. Our track record as a species is not good in this regard.

Actually the Sahara has been growing for the last several thousand years. It wasn't always this big. However, the process of "desertification" has been more rapidly encroaching south upon the Sahel after the drought which occurred in Africa from 1968 to 1973. Since the Sahel continues to be drought-prone, which in turn increases the rate of desertification.

The Sahara desert is estimated to be growing at a rate of 0.6 km every year.

In Ancient Egyptian History even the Pyramids and the Sphinx would be swallowed by the Sahara desert every 1000 years or so, although the Sahara is currently the driest it has ever been in over 13,000 years, and it is only continuing to get drier.

I think reversing the process of desertification of the Sahara is a noble goal. With our modern technology we couldn't get rid of the Sahara entirely, and one wouldn't want to, but turning large parts of it green, and returning moisture to the area would reverse it's growth and dramatically reduce it's size back to it's more natural state as it was over 13,000 years ago.

Sure this might be a great idea on the surface however you also have to look at the impacts of such activities on existing weather patterns. At least one Hurricane in this years season met its demise thanks to layer of Saharan dust and sand that was essentially sucker punching storms that move through it. Greening it could very well bring about more violent storms by reducing the size of the band and permitting more storms to cross the North Atlantic untouched and far stronger than they would be if the band was its normal size.

reply to post by pavil

Let nature decide the fate of the Sahara, as another poster stated. The Saharan region has gone through multiple changes in regards to climate.

But read again the original article there is a suggestion that they do the same to Australia. I bring this up as a point because I live in this neck or the woods. If its trees you need planted then there are vast plains outback that would be easier to grow trees on. To start with its not sand and it rains no and then and there is already plenty of bush growing. So surly its not just about the Sahara. There has to be plenty of places around the world to get them tree growing.

why don't we just leave the deserts and re-green all the clear-cut forests around the world. Deserts are what they are for a reason. Chile for example has a desert that in some areas hasn't seen rainfall for over 20 million years.

i don't see the point of using massive resources to fertilise deserts when there are plenty of fertile, or once fertile land that we have ravaged. But wait, there are now cities built on these regions, this poses a problem doesn't it. people live in cities and there has to be somewhere for the guilty liberals to hide.

reply to post by funny_pom


funny_pom - Very good point

why don't we just leave the deserts and re-green all the clear-cut forests around the world. Deserts are what they are for a reason

Infact why don't we stop cutting them down - that could help

reply to post by pavil


Ok, i see your point and i can only say that living in the City with all these buildings, cars, fumes and dust has surely saturated some of our breathable Oxygen!

You know just as well as me that we need as much greenery on this planet as possible especially with the rise in the World Population!!

It's a shame we didn't have the means to do this many years ago as it may have stopped a swarm of people swamping the UK

Originally posted by pavil

Originally posted by TruthxIsxInxThexMist

As it says in the artical... this could also produce more rainwater for desolate lands which need it...

S+F from me

[edit on 16-9-2009 by TruthxIsxInxThexMist]

Yeah and it also says:

Planting these forests might have side effects. The increased moisture could trigger plagues of locusts in Africa, just as the odd wet year does now. It could also dampen existing soils, stopping iron-rich dust from blowing off the Sahara and into the Atlantic Ocean, where it nourishes sea life, the study points out.

Yes i did see that when i read the article but it only says Might & Could not definately will

I will also add though that maybe they should start on desolate lands in parts of Africa i.e Ethiopia where people are still starving to death before starting in areas where there is no life!

Originally posted by fraterormus

I think reversing the process of desertification of the Sahara is a noble goal. With our modern technology we couldn't get rid of the Sahara entirely, and one wouldn't want to, but turning large parts of it green, and returning moisture to the area would reverse it's growth and dramatically reduce it's size back to it's more natural state as it was over 13,000 years ago.

So how would mankind artificially manipulating things bring the Saharan region back to a more "natural" state. I don't have faith in Man being able to do that without F'ing up things even more. Unless you can desalinate a huge amount of ocean water on a consistent basis and pump it there for Centuries, the Sarhara is what it is, a desert.

Originally posted by TruthxIsxInxThexMist
I will also add though that maybe they should start on desolate lands in parts of Africa i.e Ethiopia where people are still starving to death before starting in areas where there is no life!

Last time i checked there is plenty of life in the Sahara, perhaps not that much human life, but life nevertheless.



i must stress the fact that, to make a forest where there is none would mean that you would have to furtalise all the soils over the entire region. Water alone will not surfice, it will simply drain through the sands or evaporate. you would also need regular low pressure systems over the region in order to create enough rainfall to keep the area furtile. Africa has such a thing, since the equator effectively cuts through the centre of the continent.

Deserts are caused, minus the effects of geographic land forms such as mountain ranges, by the high pressure belts that occur north and south of the Equator, just past the tropics (the Saharan desert is located north of the tropic of cancer.). as a result of this, the air is constantly hot, and dry. not the best conditions for forests i think.