reply to post by xmaddness
I had to comment on part of your post. What kind of time frame is required for "on the job training?"
If he wasn't ready then he shouldn't have been president. I keep hearing Obama supporters stating that he needs time. Time for what? More bad
decisions? Time for him to learn his job?
If I hired a plumber to fix my sink, and he ends up hitting my tv with a hammer in order to exact repairs, then I am going to fire him.
Why should he be given more time?
Obamaland : Cotton Candy, Gumdrops, and Rainbow Dreams, This is the Land of Collusion, page 3
privacy
reply posted on 13-9-2009 @ 11:13 AM by jimmyx
Originally posted by mikerussellus
reply to post by jimmyx
We'll get you over to the dark side soon enough.
Luke, Luke. . . Reagan is your faaaather. . . .
Seriously, when you get down to it, and avoid the rhetoric, most Americans probably are center. You get the loud republicans, the loud democrats, and a general apathy for society in general, and we end up with America looking like it is now.
the dark side?.... now your conjuring up images of cheney in my mind. and i know we are better people than that. how would you like to be his next door neighbor...you would have to put an armored jacket on your dog, just in case he took a leak on cheneys front lawn. or maybe he has bamboo spiked pits along his sidewalk...you know...just to discourage the kids from riding their big wheel in front of his house.
[edit on 13-9-2009 by jimmyx]
reply posted on 13-9-2009 @ 11:17 AM by redhead57
reply to post by SpartanKingLeonidas
I had to star that post, that is my issue. This freaking stinking war of lies! One thing though I did notice. Think back to the day after the election maybe two, when he had his first FULL national security briefing. That day the man came out of that meeting looking 10 years older than when he went in. I would love to know what he heard that totally changed his entire premise on the war in Iraq!
I had to star that post, that is my issue. This freaking stinking war of lies! One thing though I did notice. Think back to the day after the election maybe two, when he had his first FULL national security briefing. That day the man came out of that meeting looking 10 years older than when he went in. I would love to know what he heard that totally changed his entire premise on the war in Iraq!
reply posted on 13-9-2009 @ 11:21 AM by Hx3_1963
reply to post by redhead57
Hmmm...
Then it just isn't me...
...Seems his hair has taken on a slight tinge of gray since his campaign days...
Hmmm...
Then it just isn't me...
...Seems his hair has taken on a slight tinge of gray since his campaign days...
reply posted on 13-9-2009 @ 11:22 AM by jimmyx
Originally posted by mikerussellus
reply to post by xmaddness
I had to comment on part of your post. What kind of time frame is required for "on the job training?"
If he wasn't ready then he shouldn't have been president. I keep hearing Obama supporters stating that he needs time. Time for what? More bad decisions? Time for him to learn his job?
If I hired a plumber to fix my sink, and he ends up hitting my tv with a hammer in order to exact repairs, then I am going to fire him.
Why should he be given more time?
uuhhmm...maybe because obama is not a plumber trying to fix your sink.
i have to assume being president of the united states is alot more complicated then using a hammer on your water pipes.
reply posted on 13-9-2009 @ 11:25 AM by xmaddness
reply to post by mikerussellus
I believe he needs more time because change takes time. It isn't so much that the actual change takes time, but its the people allowing the change that takes time.
Allow me to try and explain.
People don't like change. Period. Even when change is absolutely necessary, people still don't like it, and will fight it, even if the change is in their best interest. A good example is as follows:
In New Orleans, before Hurricane Katrina went through, people were told that they absolutely had to evacuate their homes. People were told, that if they do not leave, they may not survive. Even with such a dire warning, there were people that did not leave. Why? Because they couldn't deal with change. "I've lived here my whole life, and I'm not leaving for anyone." Even when their own life is at stake, the thought of change for many is something they simply cannot deal with. These people paid for their dissidence of change with their lives.
Change, and the acceptance of change, takes time. Humans in general are a panicky bunch when something changes.
This is why Obama needs more time. He needs to allow the changes that he has been pointing out to settle in the minds of the people. Once this has settled in, then change can truly occur.
-xmad
I believe he needs more time because change takes time. It isn't so much that the actual change takes time, but its the people allowing the change that takes time.
Allow me to try and explain.
People don't like change. Period. Even when change is absolutely necessary, people still don't like it, and will fight it, even if the change is in their best interest. A good example is as follows:
In New Orleans, before Hurricane Katrina went through, people were told that they absolutely had to evacuate their homes. People were told, that if they do not leave, they may not survive. Even with such a dire warning, there were people that did not leave. Why? Because they couldn't deal with change. "I've lived here my whole life, and I'm not leaving for anyone." Even when their own life is at stake, the thought of change for many is something they simply cannot deal with. These people paid for their dissidence of change with their lives.
Change, and the acceptance of change, takes time. Humans in general are a panicky bunch when something changes.
This is why Obama needs more time. He needs to allow the changes that he has been pointing out to settle in the minds of the people. Once this has settled in, then change can truly occur.
-xmad
reply posted on 13-9-2009 @ 11:27 AM by jimmyx
Originally posted by redhead57
reply to post by SpartanKingLeonidas
I had to star that post, that is my issue. This freaking stinking war of lies! One thing though I did notice. Think back to the day after the election maybe two, when he had his first FULL national security briefing. That day the man came out of that meeting looking 10 years older than when he went in. I would love to know what he heard that totally changed his entire premise on the war in Iraq!
yup...i noticed that too...obama looked like he had one of those "HOLY SH*T, WHAT DID I GET MYSELF INTO" moments. maybe he was told exactly how he was going to run things by some very powerful people.
i must take off my tin hat now.
[edit on 13-9-2009 by jimmyx]
reply posted on 13-9-2009 @ 11:36 AM by mikerussellus
reply to post by xmaddness
Change does take time.
But what kind of change is he talking about?
Healthcare? Needs reform. So, we initiate tort reform, and we open up insurance to interstate commerce. Simple. No time required. The ban on interstate commerce for health insurance is a construct of the Senate anyways. Easy to change.
Economy? We're in the tank. Yeah, yeah, Bush got us there. But that's like saying Bush started a fire and tried to put it out with a bucket of gasoline. Obama is just using a bigger bucket. Instead, dump cash into the sytem by letting America heal it's own problems. Lower taxes, lower interest rates, lower barriers that DC put in place for small businesses. Time? Very little.
GITMO? Close it. Today. Why wait? He's the frigging president and he can't close one jail? Need time? Hmmff!
War. Same thing. Pull out if that's what you want. Why this artificial need for time?
Again, I go back to what I said in the begining. It's all about what KIND of change he wants to do. And yes, that kind of change needs more "time".
Time to dismantle the constitution, time to erode our rights, time to place controls that will strip our freedom.
We're the ones running out of "time."
Change does take time.
But what kind of change is he talking about?
Healthcare? Needs reform. So, we initiate tort reform, and we open up insurance to interstate commerce. Simple. No time required. The ban on interstate commerce for health insurance is a construct of the Senate anyways. Easy to change.
Economy? We're in the tank. Yeah, yeah, Bush got us there. But that's like saying Bush started a fire and tried to put it out with a bucket of gasoline. Obama is just using a bigger bucket. Instead, dump cash into the sytem by letting America heal it's own problems. Lower taxes, lower interest rates, lower barriers that DC put in place for small businesses. Time? Very little.
GITMO? Close it. Today. Why wait? He's the frigging president and he can't close one jail? Need time? Hmmff!
War. Same thing. Pull out if that's what you want. Why this artificial need for time?
Again, I go back to what I said in the begining. It's all about what KIND of change he wants to do. And yes, that kind of change needs more "time".
Time to dismantle the constitution, time to erode our rights, time to place controls that will strip our freedom.
We're the ones running out of "time."
reply posted on 13-9-2009 @ 11:37 AM by Hx3_1963
Members of Congress / Barack Obama / Votes
projects.washingtonpost.com...
BTW: Just look at all the carp bills they try to shove down our throats!!!
Talk about job security!!!
And then this....votes no on a tax deduction on outside workplace insurance...Hmmm...what side of his mouth is he talking out of these days?
This speaks volumes IMHO...look through his voting record...past the not voting remarks
3/14/08
Vote 82: S CON RES 70: DeMint Amdt. No. 4339; To provide for a deficit-neutral reserve fund for providing an above the line Federal income tax deduction for individuals purchasing health insurance outside the workplace.
No
3/13/08
Vote 66: S CON RES 70: Allard Amdt. No. 4232; To pay down the Federal debt and eliminate government waste by reducing spending 5 percent on programs rated (as mandated under the Government Performance and Results Act (Public Law 103-62)) ineffective by the Office of Management and Budget Program Assessment Rating Tool.
No
3/13/08
Vote 65: S CON RES 70: DeMint Amdt. No. 4328; To provide for a deficit-neutral reserve fund for Social Security reform.
No
3/13/08
Vote 61: On the Motion: Motion to Waive C.B.A. Cornyn Amdt. No. 4242; To protect the family budget by providing for a budget point of order against legislation that increases income taxes on taxpayers, including hard-working middle-income families, entrepreneurs, and college students.
No
3/13/08
Vote 50: S CON RES 70: Kyl Amdt. No. 4191; To protect small businesses, family ranches and farms from the Death Tax by providing a $5 million exemption, a low rate for smaller estates and a maximum rate no higher than 35%.
No
3/13/08
Vote 43: S CON RES 70: Graham Amdt. No. 4170 as Modified; To protect families, family farms and small businesses by extending the income tax rate structure, raising the death tax exemption to $5 million and reducing the maximum death tax rate to no more than 35%; to keep education affordable by extending the college tuition deduction; and to protect senior citizens from higher taxes on their retirement income, maintain U.S. financial market competitiveness, and promote economic growth by extending the lower tax rates on dividends and capital gains.
No
[edit on 9/13/2009 by Hx3_1963]
projects.washingtonpost.com...
BTW: Just look at all the carp bills they try to shove down our throats!!!
Talk about job security!!!
And then this....votes no on a tax deduction on outside workplace insurance...Hmmm...what side of his mouth is he talking out of these days?
This speaks volumes IMHO...look through his voting record...past the not voting remarks
3/14/08
Vote 82: S CON RES 70: DeMint Amdt. No. 4339; To provide for a deficit-neutral reserve fund for providing an above the line Federal income tax deduction for individuals purchasing health insurance outside the workplace.
No
3/13/08
Vote 66: S CON RES 70: Allard Amdt. No. 4232; To pay down the Federal debt and eliminate government waste by reducing spending 5 percent on programs rated (as mandated under the Government Performance and Results Act (Public Law 103-62)) ineffective by the Office of Management and Budget Program Assessment Rating Tool.
No
3/13/08
Vote 65: S CON RES 70: DeMint Amdt. No. 4328; To provide for a deficit-neutral reserve fund for Social Security reform.
No
3/13/08
Vote 61: On the Motion: Motion to Waive C.B.A. Cornyn Amdt. No. 4242; To protect the family budget by providing for a budget point of order against legislation that increases income taxes on taxpayers, including hard-working middle-income families, entrepreneurs, and college students.
No
3/13/08
Vote 50: S CON RES 70: Kyl Amdt. No. 4191; To protect small businesses, family ranches and farms from the Death Tax by providing a $5 million exemption, a low rate for smaller estates and a maximum rate no higher than 35%.
No
3/13/08
Vote 43: S CON RES 70: Graham Amdt. No. 4170 as Modified; To protect families, family farms and small businesses by extending the income tax rate structure, raising the death tax exemption to $5 million and reducing the maximum death tax rate to no more than 35%; to keep education affordable by extending the college tuition deduction; and to protect senior citizens from higher taxes on their retirement income, maintain U.S. financial market competitiveness, and promote economic growth by extending the lower tax rates on dividends and capital gains.
No
[edit on 9/13/2009 by Hx3_1963]
reply posted on 13-9-2009 @ 11:54 AM by NightSkyeB4Dawn
reply to post by Hx3_1963
I think this video just about says it all.
I like that it points out that we live in a world that is being scripted and that our goal should be a world worth living in not a world worth dying for.
There is a big difference.
I think this video just about says it all.
I like that it points out that we live in a world that is being scripted and that our goal should be a world worth living in not a world worth dying for.
There is a big difference.
reply posted on 13-9-2009 @ 11:59 AM by NightSkyeB4Dawn
reply to post by mikerussellus
Our biggest obstacle to change will come from the fact that the average voting citizen has been conditioned to vote against his or her best interest.
Our politicians are sitting on Capitol Hill and fight everyday to keep themselves firmly entrenched in their positions.
You can bet they will never devise a bill that will limit their power and they will never vote against their best interest.
Our biggest obstacle to change will come from the fact that the average voting citizen has been conditioned to vote against his or her best interest.
Our politicians are sitting on Capitol Hill and fight everyday to keep themselves firmly entrenched in their positions.
You can bet they will never devise a bill that will limit their power and they will never vote against their best interest.
reply posted on 13-9-2009 @ 12:32 PM by SpartanKingLeonidas
reply to post by xmaddness
You have every right to defend Obama, if that's what you choose to do, I will not stop you.
I have never tried to keep someone from believing their particular views.
Just be intelligent and think for yourself, but to me, Obama is all talk, and no walk.
Yes, some of my comments are bold, but I am a bold person, I do not sugar-coat crap.
No sugar-coating, and no polishing turd's here, like it or lump it, that's me.
As for the lengthy sentence, it was lengthy because of the content, and needed no periods.
I got A's for Grammar, Spelling, and English Composition, because of my well thought out essays.
Only nine months?
Wars have been known to happen in less than nine months, think of the Six Day War.
I am not expecting the man to produce miracles, and I certainly know he is not going to walk on water, but enough of the speeches and tire spinning, do your job Mr. Obama.
I hope you know enough from reading this or other threads, I am not a Republican, nor am I Democrat.
I am a registered Independent, so this is not me griping, bitching, and whining because my choice did not win, because to me when the election process happens we all lose, because the lesser of two evils is still evil, is it not?
This is a false dichotomy, two choices is no choice at all, if you ask me.
Oh yeah, and those people not liking Obama's choices were offline, each and every one.
I fully expected this thread to be a toss up between positive and negative reactions.
[edit on 13-9-2009 by SpartanKingLeonidas]
You have every right to defend Obama, if that's what you choose to do, I will not stop you.
I have never tried to keep someone from believing their particular views.
Just be intelligent and think for yourself, but to me, Obama is all talk, and no walk.
Yes, some of my comments are bold, but I am a bold person, I do not sugar-coat crap.
No sugar-coating, and no polishing turd's here, like it or lump it, that's me.
As for the lengthy sentence, it was lengthy because of the content, and needed no periods.
I got A's for Grammar, Spelling, and English Composition, because of my well thought out essays.
Only nine months?
Wars have been known to happen in less than nine months, think of the Six Day War.
I am not expecting the man to produce miracles, and I certainly know he is not going to walk on water, but enough of the speeches and tire spinning, do your job Mr. Obama.
I hope you know enough from reading this or other threads, I am not a Republican, nor am I Democrat.
I am a registered Independent, so this is not me griping, bitching, and whining because my choice did not win, because to me when the election process happens we all lose, because the lesser of two evils is still evil, is it not?
This is a false dichotomy, two choices is no choice at all, if you ask me.
Oh yeah, and those people not liking Obama's choices were offline, each and every one.
I fully expected this thread to be a toss up between positive and negative reactions.
[edit on 13-9-2009 by SpartanKingLeonidas]
reply posted on 13-9-2009 @ 12:56 PM by xmaddness
Originally posted by mikerussellus
reply to post by xmaddness
Healthcare? Needs reform. So, we initiate tort reform, and we open up insurance to interstate commerce. Simple. No time required. The ban on interstate commerce for health insurance is a construct of the Senate anyways. Easy to change.
I completely agree that tort reform is a necessary part of any health reform bill that should be passed. As I stated, I am in favor of -some type of- reform, of which I would like to see tort reform included within. However, I do not think that tort reform alone is the all encompassing fix for the system.
Economy? We're in the tank. Yeah, yeah, Bush got us there. But that's like saying Bush started a fire and tried to put it out with a bucket of gasoline. Obama is just using a bigger bucket. Instead, dump cash into the sytem by letting America heal it's own problems. Lower taxes, lower interest rates, lower barriers that DC put in place for small businesses. Time? Very little.
No argument here. I agree that the "dump cash" into the market idea is a "hey lets throw money at the problem" approach, which -may- work, but it is sloppy at best. However as was stated, it was the previous administration who put it into motion, and once in motion, if it were to be suddenly stopped, it would guarantee that the money already placed into the system would be a total loss and would fix nothing. The only possible approach to gain at least some positive outcome from the approach was to follow it through.
GITMO? Close it. Today. Why wait? He's the frigging president and he can't close one jail? Need time? Hmmff!
GITMO is/was and always will be a black mark on this nation, at least in my opinion. There really is no quick solution to this problem. It is going to bite us in the ass no matter what we do. So we may as well take some time to weigh our options and see what approach will be the least painful.
War. Same thing. Pull out if that's what you want. Why this artificial need for time?
You and I both know that this is simply not that easy.
Again, I go back to what I said in the begining. It's all about what KIND of change he wants to do. And yes, that kind of change needs more "time".
To this I agree.
Time to dismantle the constitution, time to erode our rights, time to place controls that will strip our freedom.
To this, only time will tell.
reply posted on 13-9-2009 @ 01:00 PM by xmaddness
Originally posted by SpartanKingLeonidas
reply to post by xmaddness
This is a false dichotomy, two choices is no choice at all, if you ask me.
I can completely agree with this. Once again we are left with a choice of choosing the lesser of two evils.
However, I will support the lesser of two evils until I have sufficient proof to do otherwise.
-xmad
reply posted on 13-9-2009 @ 01:03 PM by NightSkyeB4Dawn
reply to post by GorehoundLarry
It is because as I posted on another thread; America is sick.
America is so full of hate that is splitting at the seams.
The ability to hold a civil conservation is rapidly disappearing.
People are attending community meetings with guns strapped to there hips.
The idea that you have the right to say and believe whatever you want is okay as long as it is the same thing that I believe and it is the same thing that I am saying or off with you head is running rapid in America.
People either don’t want to see the truth about what is actually happening around them or they can’t accept the truth. Many are like a frog in water coming to a boil. They feel the water getting hotter but continue to think that it is not that bad and by the time they realize that it is time to get out of the pot it is too late and they are cooked.
It is because as I posted on another thread; America is sick.
America is so full of hate that is splitting at the seams.
The ability to hold a civil conservation is rapidly disappearing.
People are attending community meetings with guns strapped to there hips.
The idea that you have the right to say and believe whatever you want is okay as long as it is the same thing that I believe and it is the same thing that I am saying or off with you head is running rapid in America.
People either don’t want to see the truth about what is actually happening around them or they can’t accept the truth. Many are like a frog in water coming to a boil. They feel the water getting hotter but continue to think that it is not that bad and by the time they realize that it is time to get out of the pot it is too late and they are cooked.
reply posted on 13-9-2009 @ 01:04 PM by SpartanKingLeonidas
reply to post by xmaddness
The lesser of two evils, is no choice, if you ask me, it's a forced option.
When people force you to pick one over another, or to only have two choices, you are being lead to make certain set and predetermined choices, not making free will decisions.
I had a friend who asked if I would lead or follow, I told her I would do the third option.
She was a bit taken aback at that.
My option, the third option, is to do whatever the Hell I feel is necessary, and not to be forced into picking is high on my priorities list.
I am a natural born leader, read, learned, and lived the Art of War.
I have successfully turned it into the Art of Peace for me and I always see Divide and Conquer in action, I saw it with Bush, I see it now with Obama, and I do not like what I see.
The lesser of two evils, is no choice, if you ask me, it's a forced option.
When people force you to pick one over another, or to only have two choices, you are being lead to make certain set and predetermined choices, not making free will decisions.
I had a friend who asked if I would lead or follow, I told her I would do the third option.
She was a bit taken aback at that.
My option, the third option, is to do whatever the Hell I feel is necessary, and not to be forced into picking is high on my priorities list.
I am a natural born leader, read, learned, and lived the Art of War.
I have successfully turned it into the Art of Peace for me and I always see Divide and Conquer in action, I saw it with Bush, I see it now with Obama, and I do not like what I see.
reply posted on 13-9-2009 @ 01:06 PM by Hx3_1963
It ALL has to do with this "supposed piece of fiction"...
Sound familiar???
Not bad for a fictional Manifesto eh?
[edit on 9/13/2009 by Hx3_1963]
The Bankers' Manifesto of 1892
circleof13.blogspot.com...
BANKERS MANIFESTO
We (the bankers) must proceed with caution and guard every move made, for the lower order of people are already showing signs of restless commotion. Prudence will therefore show a policy of apparently yielding to the popular will until our plans are so far consummated that we can declare our designs without fear of any organized resistance.
Organizations in the United States should be carefully watched by our trusted men, and we must take immediate steps to control these organizations in our interest or disrupt them.
At the coming Omaha (Obama???) convention to be held July 4, 1892, our men must attend and direct its movement or else there will be set on foot such antagonism to our designs as may require force to overcome.
This at the present time would be premature. We are not yet ready for such a crisis. Capital must protect itself in every possible manner through combination (conspiracy) and legislation.
The courts must be called to our aid, debts must be collected, bonds and mortgages foreclosed as rapidly as possible.
When, through the process of law, the common people have lost their homes,
they will be more tractable and easily governed through the influence of the strong arm
of the government applied to a central power of imperial wealth under the control of the leading financiers.
People without homes will not quarrel with their leaders. History repeats itself in regular cycles. This truth is well known among our principal men who are engaged in forming an imperialism of the world. While they are doing this, the people must be kept in a state of political antagonism.
The question of tariff reform must be urged through the organization known as the Democratic Party, and the question of protection with the reciprocity must be forced to view through the Republican Party.
By thus dividing voters, we can get them to expend their energies in fighting over questions of no importance to us, except as teachers to the common herd. Thus, by discrete actions, we can secure all that has been so generously planned and successfully accomplished.
Sound familiar???
Not bad for a fictional Manifesto eh?
[edit on 9/13/2009 by Hx3_1963]
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