Practicioners of magick, state your point of view

A few things I would like to hear your personal opinion about (leave some of it out if it suits you):

* The source of the energy needed. Within you? Outside of you? Reason.
* Free use or certain school?
* Any preferred school? If so,why?
* Consequences of the practice of magick, yours or others.
* Your moral boundaries.
* The value of it.



Warm thoughts from Scorpiotropic

reply to post by Scorpiotropic


what is magick can you give a few points as Id always wondered. It is mentioned quite often on ATS what is it?

Originally posted by Scorpiotropic
A few things I would like to hear your personal opinion about (leave some of it out if it suits you):

* The source of the energy needed. Within you? Outside of you? Reason.
* Free use or certain school?
* Any preferred school? If so,why?
* Consequences of the practice of magick, yours or others.
* Your moral boundaries.
* The value of it.



Warm thoughts from Scorpiotropic

The source of the energy needed is from within you. It derives from your will and most importantly, your intent. Say for instance you want to do a ritual or work a spell in order to bring good fortune your way. Well, the ritual and the components used in the spell are all nice and good, but they are there purely for a focus of your will and intent.

What do you mean by free use or certain school? I follow a path of wizardry which I take a lot of the teachings of Wicca into account, but do not consider myself 'Wiccan'.

Again, not sure what you mean by 'school'.

The consequences? Well - most Wiccans operate on the idea of the three-fold law of return. The three-fold law of return states that what you put out will return to you three times over. Therefore, if you put out negative energy or do a "hex" or "curse," the same will be done to you but three times worse. In general the consequences of magick are whatever you intended the end result to be.

My moral boundaries? They are basically as follows: "'An it harm none, do as you will." That is drawn from the Wiccan Rede. So, essentially, I do what I do freely as long as I know I will not bring harm unto other humans. Another good point is the fact I will never work any magick to deprive someone of their free will. One of the most stereotypical types of spells you hear about are 'love spells' - the most sought after thing by pubescent teens who want to land a hot date with that cheerleader they see in school. Well - unfortunately, the use of a love spell in that situation would be completely wrong because it would cause the cheerleader to act in a manner not of her own choosing. I generally tell people to go get a good personality or to actually go talk to the object of their desire to see if things go anywhere. Never EVER take someone's free will away.

The value of what? Magick? What's the value of prayer?

To go ahead and follow these answers up, I'd like to put something out there before this gets inundated with the other religions who will most likely show up. As a wizard (witch or whatever you want to call me/us....) we do not "hate" Christians or Christianity - nor do we "hate" Islam, Judaism, etc. The only major quarrel we have with any established world religion is the idea that their way is the ONLY way, to the total exclusion of all other belief systems. I respect people for whatever they believe in and never attempt to convert them to the Craft or make fun of them for their beliefs.

Those are my views/answers.

Hope that helps.

Cheers!

reply to post by Venus014


Magick is the deliberate focusing of intent by a person in order to cause a change in their life or reality. It is most commonly seen used through the act of "spell-casting."

Originally posted by mf_luder
reply to post by Venus014

 

Magick is the deliberate focusing of intent by a person in order to cause a change in their life or reality. It is most commonly seen used through the act of "spell-casting."

Interesting. Could this not be done by anybody who was aware of inner energy, focus and intent? Also could this be done without even realizing you had the ability to do it, and then realize it when you noticed the thing you were concentrating on actaully happened? I guess the word you use is important..deliberate.

I dont think Im Wiccan or what ever it is, but I am VERY aware of how powerful thoughts are. They are basically energy and can manifest what ever you wish.


I think we all need to be more conscious of what "thought energy" we are intentionally sending out, and also develop an awarness of when we sense others thoughts sent out towards us.

Magic according to the Mysteries is the ability to act upon an Idea. The simplest activity such as thinking about standing up and having the ability to do so is Magical. The source is both within and without, above and below. Magic is performed by all of us with or without our awareness. As far as ethics and boundries, I believe Magic is the NATURAL process of Life and consciousness. Scorcery is the UNNATURAL withholding of information from others. In other words when you use someones Ignorance of a subject for your own personal gain.

before you delve into the teachings of the mysteries please read and understand Plato's Allegory of the Cave. Our world is in trouble because too many people have left the cave and not returned to enlighten the profane.

Originally posted by Scorpiotropic
A few things I would like to hear your personal opinion about (leave some of it out if it suits you):

* The source of the energy needed. Within you? Outside of you? Reason.
* Free use or certain school?
* Any preferred school? If so,why?
* Consequences of the practice of magick, yours or others.
* Your moral boundaries.
* The value of it.



Warm thoughts from Scorpiotropic

Hello Scorpiotropic!! From your Pieces tropic dude!!!

1- Within you... I belive that the source of my power is LOVE!
So it could also come from outside, but shared in a tantric form.
2- Free use, School IMO can manipulate energy to use it for their reasons or their agendas.. I prefer being self taught.. Yet you have to start somewhere.. So read as much as you can.. And make your own ideas from what you have learned.. No ONE person is totally right.. Including myself.
3. NO prefered school personally.. however I wouldnt mind teaching others myself.. But its a tricky road when you bring in others, and want to train them in your ways.. Can lead to personal manipulations. ect.
4. Consequences--- What goes around comes around.. Its much deeper but this is an easy way to cover something very deep.. Karma..
You only get what you put out to the universe..
5.Moral boundaries- Truth.. Love, and compassion.. Do not mislead, do not manipulate for material goods..
I have vowed never to make money from such things... Yet I have needs. Small needs that must be taken care of so I can help others..
I belive one should not line their pockets with Gold... But its okay to make a living at this, while being true to yourself and those you love...
6.The value.. That is a personal truth... For each person comes different Values..
For me the value would be that I can help and heal others..
The value of having good karma, and one thing you can not put value upon is LOVE!


I have been walking a spiritual path most of my life.. but it wasnt until a couple years ago that I really started to walk the path...
But at the same time.. I have bills to pay.. And things to do in this life as WE all do..
IM trying to find that line, where I can help those in need of help..
And still pay my bills, and have personal freedom to do what I want to do and be happy.. To take care of my girlfriend, and allow us personal freedom.

Yet when I did all of this for free all the time.. So many would come to me and personally drain me of my energy and my time..
I never mind helping people... But I learned.. That I was putting to many before myself.. And I found myself in need of help.
And thats when she showed up and taught me how to deal with such things.

I learned that I can lay hands, read the tarrot, and help people both mentally and spiritually without misleading them.. Or taking money that wasnt worth the time..

I would never feel right in my heart to become rich doing this.. Its not something I would ever want to make alot of money doing.. As in my heart I feel it would be for the wrong reasons..
But when I travle across the USA.. It costs money to do such things..

Those who are willing to understand the minor details have no problem with paying Herself and I for our teachings..

And its very enjoyable being able to teach others proper tantric love techniques, and other tantric magicks...

And we have both met many people who are willing to learn and willing to know of true love.. Or just want to Bask in the love we share...


Thus to me.. LOVE is magick.. and its not like casting Fireballs, or hexes on people...
Its all about sharing energy.. Sharing frequency... And learning how to vibrate on a healthy frequency level...

Love is by far the most powerful vibration.. And its very healthy too!!

Thats the bottom line to this. And Magick to me has been taken out of context so far in this world.. and people get the wrong idea..

Its not mystical nor illusions...
Its knowledge.. Its love.. its feelings..
And its knowing how to share these feelings with others so they feel better about themselfs.. And about the world they live in...

Theres much more.. But that about covers what I wanted to say..

Love and light!

reply to post by zysin5


Lovely post zysin .

Your right LOVE is magick , it is the highest frequency we can create and as long as we mean no harm all is good.


Much love and light to you.

* The source of the energy needed. Within you? Outside of you? Reason.
* Free use or certain school?
* Any preferred school? If so,why?
* Consequences of the practice of magick, yours or others.
* Your moral boundaries.
* The value of it.

----

1.Things have to consume to produce relationship. Both within and outside at all times, I believe that they are the same. All actions of all things at all times are individually like threads flowing through each other forming a tapestry of cooperative generativity, with each one of our actions and choices forming incomprehensibly unique and novel designs throughout the strata of fractalized electric knots within knots.

Our particles are as old as the universe, and I believe just as smaller living cells cooperate to energize our processes, we are simultaneously extremely large and small cells, commanding our own selves for the health of a greater organism.


2. Free style. Names and words and phrases and ideas and schools of thought were all born from the mind and I think it is very healthy and gratifying to cut a swathe through the thicket in your own direction.

3. Scrying and gong fu. Everything we do is a result of a scrye in the sense that we perceive in order to facilitate action. Both passive scrying (collecting and responding to information from seeing the sun rise) and active scrying (embedding forms of encoded thought into perceivable mediums, such as, books, television, propaganda, art and mechanical form).

Gong fu because intent mixed with inner eye visualization mixed with body movements and perception of magnetic currents can free your mind from oppressive yokes.

4. I guess more of the knowledge of good and evil? Broadening of the scope to points where "you" grow to large, the fear, euphoria, extreme charity, cultivation of negative apparatuses, hate, boredom, feelings of extreme significance, the steeling of the mind, dissolving of self, dissolving of memory! Creation of new realms and gates.

5. Moral is commanded by necessity usually for me, and I've got mine coming. I still am a really nice person for the most part, though I have plotted and schemed to see negativity come about.

6. It is all I am, all I am is, and I am this. I love the shapes and colors of this universe and am very thankful for my vessel and its processes!






[edit on 12-9-2009 by depth om]

Originally posted by Mr Green
reply to post by zysin5

 

Lovely post zysin .

Your right LOVE is magick , it is the highest frequency we can create and as long as we mean no harm all is good.


Much love and light to you.

Awe thanks Its always good to hear from a friend on here!! Much love and light to you aswell!! We have spoke in great depth about all of this, you are one of the better people to speak with this about.. We have learned much from eachother Mr. Green.

And anyone in need of some deeper advice, always feel free to U2 me on here. It might take some time to reply, but I will help with the knowledge I have. And am happy to give that kind of energy.. As knowledge will lead you to your own personal truths, and manifestations.

Also to add real quick.. Good post depth om..
Many of us here vibrate on the same frequency level, and do our best to be good people, and not mislead others into false manifestations.
As what we say vibrates very closely to the same tune.



[edit on 12-9-2009 by zysin5]

reply to post by Scorpiotropic

1) Within me. Really within all of us because it is powered by the power of belief is my honest opinion. Basically if you believe you can, you will. If you believe you can't. You won't.
2) Free use as it it's only confines is what you believe you can do. Well, and the current consensus as to the "rules of reality" somewhat.
3,4) Simular to the consequences of karma. You get back what you put in. You put out negativity and thusly you will receive back negativity in abundance. "Do what thou wilt and that shall be the whole of the law.".
5) Aid in your struggles. Committing yourself to learning yourself and thusly becoming a stronger person.

I'm a UNIVERSALISM practitioner. Here's why.
1: all religions seek to connect with a higher power than the will of man.

2: Everything living, fears death. Nothing seeks it out. Therefore, life is innately self serving, and wants to survive at any cost. ( martyrs not included)

3: The cycle of life is; conception, gestation, birth, growth, maturity, death.
All life operates thus; Eat or be eaten, fight or flight.
The rule of the one is, safety in numbers assures survival.

4: The power/energy that drives all life, is the cosmos. Nothing could exist beyond a nano second, once the cosmos ceased to exist. The existential cosmos is the womb of everything. We are fragile embodiments/receivers of the All Power. The voice of the All Power is the Cosmic Om. We all receive it, and can hear it, if you let yourself.

5: Chaos and destruction are normal cycles. These twins are a part of every cycle within the cosmos. Yet, out of chaos can be rhythm and harmony. The balance between them is the Yyng/Ylang= Ying/Yang, light/dark, life/death etc.

6: Man is but one part of the total. He isn't anymore special or important to the cosmic conscientiousness, than a dung beetle. He deludes himself he is, but, he isn't.

7: Acceptance of what you are/aren't, is understanding the exegeses and exigency of "Why Am I here?"

MAGICK is can be many different types of disciplines. TRUE MAJIK, or " they that have wise knowledge" , is also that of the Consortium Imperialist Nasturtium. They that have wise knowledge are considered dangerous, and a threat to Organized Religion, which is an aberration. The wise have been called the Illuminati, and the Maaj or Magi. Interestingly, it was the Maaj, who sought the child of prophecy. They knew of him, before he was born. The Magi from three different disciplines of the east, all had the same epiphany/vision. Therefore, they had to see for themselves, and make the decision...was this child the chrysalis of the divine one? The Christ Child!
Make of that what you will...

A majik practitioner is often learned ADEPT. All three wise men were ADEPTS. To be an ADEPT, one must have literally practiced successfully their particular skills or discipline before their peers. Usually their mentor,teacher, or sage under whom they given the gift. To receive the Gift of Knowledge, they had to show certain affinities to be able to be a "conduit of the inner light".

A real Wiccan or Wicca adept can manipulate the forces of nature. Those can, would never do it for money, or to show off. To do so, is to abuse your knowledge, and usually will come to no good.

"`an harm none, do as ye will " is a modern day edict to polish the imagery of the NEW AGE WICCANRY, as is being touted today. It is a Politically Correct pseudo umbrage. Take no stock in it.

The Tri-Fold law of "what you give out, comes back three times on you," is another P.C. umbrage. Of course, ' what goes around, comes around', has some validity.

Most of the self professing Wicca practitioners today, are just a bunch of wannabe buffoons. They are followers/publicity hucksters and ego seekers, not Maji's by any stretch of the imagination.

As practicing "Cosma Universalum Consortia " I see it this way. I AM A MAP!

My task is to learn how to read it. It is an ever changing map, that is also a trickster. It loves to mislead me. It is written in a weird language, and the imagery is full of symbolism and mysticism. My destiny, my journey, are written upon and within the hundreds of pages of my own "Iluminati" or enlightenment.

No one can tell me the directions, or lead the way for me. I have to figure it out by myself. If I succeed, I'll be an ADEPT!

It has taken me over 60 years to be able to turn to page three of my life. It isn't something you just pick up, and breeze through in a days light reading at the beach! I wish it were that simple.

Everyone's MAP is different. It will lead them on different pathways, but, the ultimate destiny is their Felicity.



[edit on 12-9-2009 by Confused and Dazed!]

Originally posted by zysin5

Many of us here vibrate on the same frequency level, and do our best to be good people, and not mislead others into false manifestations.
As what we say vibrates very closely to the same tune.

[edit on 12-9-2009 by zysin5]

Thank you Zysin, I hold you as one of my closest and more deeply connected friends on here and beyond.

There is nothing worse for this to be used to mislead others into the creation of false manifestations. I have now made it one of my inner missions to rise above all that and also to help when I see it being done to others.

Magick and love is there for a reason, to raise the frequency of others to feel the higher spiritual energies residing within the higher planes. It is not to lead others into false manifestations often leading to the lower frequencies of dependancy, lust, lower astrals and total manipulation.





[edit on 13-9-2009 by Mr Green]

* The source of the energy needed. Within you? Outside of you? Reason.
Inside or outside, depends on the intent of the ritual/spell/whatever. Basically anything can be used to fuel change, the will channels it, but the source of it can change depending on what you can or want to use.

* Free use or certain school?
I'm certainly freestyle sorcerer, usually I use a direct means to cause change. I borrow heavily from christian and jew religion and certain african traditions. That said I'm mostly ceremonial in theory, but in practice I use more witchcraft/sorcery. I don't follow any order method, though I tried entering one, didn't work.

* Any preferred school? If so,why?
Mostly QBL, angelic and yoruba traditions, some family trad also. The reason is simply because I resonate better with them.

* Consequences of the practice of magick, yours or others.
Magic has consequences as any other action, sadly there are entities that try and regulate what we can or not do, also judging for what they see fit.

* Your moral boundaries.
Normal moral boundaries, I don't think I'm that different from most

* The value of it.
Of what? Magic or moral? Magic for me is just a word used to describe effects caused by reasons other than those known by the general public, actually everything is magic, the art of causing change in accordance to the will. Moral is just a guideline to live our lives with or without magic.


cheers

reply to post by Mr Green


I think so. I think it is the same energy monks use to meditate for a month at a time, or raise and lower their body temperatures. It is in the very soothing power of Gregorian chant. In fact, chant is often used to conduct energy. Or sex magic, which is very powerful, that uses the energy created to make things happen.

[edit on 13-9-2009 by nixie_nox]

Originally posted by Scorpiotropic
* The source of the energy needed. Within you? Outside of you? Reason.

The most powerful Magick operates on levels of reality where ideas like Within and Without blend together and no long indicate definite, actual boundaries.

Originally posted by Scorpiotropic
* Free use or certain school?

Hmm... Certain schools will teach their Magi better techniques than others. Technique, tradition, and the energy and intelligences behind a Magi's Initiation goes far towards the power of a Magi. But the most powerful Magi don't need tools, props, rituals or anything else. Once you understand how your personal Magick works, its just the knack of getting it down.

Originally posted by Scorpiotropic
* Consequences of the practice of magick, yours or others.

Everything you Will to happen occurs to you first and last, like any action, like if you punched a Wall or jumped on a trampoline. There are always consequences to actions, with Magick your opening your mind to levels which push the boundaries of your own abilities, as well as the abilities of the human race. Ultimately your working with the infinite, thus the heavy emphasis on discipline, introspection, and personal evolution in the highest schools of Magick. Not only to retain your sanity and functionality as a human being, but to deter the Magi from abusing their power.

Originally posted by Scorpiotropic
* Your moral boundaries.

The powerful who don't seek evolution destroy themselves or are destroyed by the powerful who have. Many Magi in the community don't place a heavy emphasis on the need for real Initiation, nor the power behind such things. They don't believe in traditions or secret societies, and they become enthralled of their own egos and the power they think they have. In reality most of them are weak. The Adepts of the strongest traditions can destroy the Masters of the weakest.

Originally posted by Scorpiotropic
* The value of it.

Personal discovery and growth, understanding the reality your a part of, understanding your personal power and where it comes from. Understanding what energy super-system/archetype you are a part of, and what part you play on the cosmic level. Using the change Magick brings to bring that energy into play in the universe in the way only your capable of doing. This idea is often called True Will today, but there are many terms for it.

In LVX,

Seventhdoor

Originally posted by Scorpiotropic
A few things I would like to hear your personal opinion about (leave some of it out if it suits you):

* The source of the energy needed. Within you? Outside of you? Reason.
* Free use or certain school?
* Any preferred school? If so,why?
* Consequences of the practice of magick, yours or others.
* Your moral boundaries.
* The value of it.



Warm thoughts from Scorpiotropic

Basically, energy is all around us and can be used or, manipulated if you will, for magic.
However, I would say it starts inside, with the intention you have. It is then directed outward, bending or using the energy outside of you. It is like a stone being tossed in water, it kinda moves away.

I think freeschool is great, though everybody that starts working with magic, should know something about the basics, or perhaps more about the consequences magic can have.
I'm not sure what you mean with the consequences question.

As far as boundaries go: to me, magic has to be constructive. Using magic in order to deceit, hurt or use people is off limits, atleast for me.
As far as the value of it goes..... apart from the fact that magic can help you achieve your goals, it also has a very positive psychological effect, or at least can have. It makes you feel in charge, it makes you self assured, because you believe/know you can accomplish things yourself.

Originally posted by Seventhdoor

The most powerful Magick operates on levels of reality where ideas like Within and Without blend together and no long indicate definite, actual boundaries.

I totally agree. Its power is beyond what I see as duality. It is beyond male/female, dark/light, positive/negative it is beyond boundaries of normal reality and ideals. To access it one must let all duality fall away and accept everything as pure energy, it is then up to you on what level/ frequency you connect to.

reply to post by zysin5


Hello zysin 5 and thankyou for your contribution I hope you are not in "pieces" though, hehe.

I couldnt help notice your dilemma of material gain. Walking the spiritual path..good. As a piscean it is important to remember not to let Neptun run away with you, keep at least one toe on the ground. To balance and master the material world is nr.1. We need to be able to earn a living and learn how to use it. As you said yourself...no matter what you do, the bills will still be there. So...don't feel bad for having to make money. I know it can feel that way when listening to the "O Spiritual great ones", but honestly...they wouldnt still be here if it was no more material lessons to be learned If they want to try jumping over the first chapter in the book of life, fine....it will eventually catch up with them.

Your intentions are good, needless to say, but the road to hell is also filled with good intentions Helping people the alternative way have consequences, bad ones too. Make sure what you do is promoting independence and strength, not dependency, inability to act and feeding destructive behaviour. The fortune telling business is one good example. No matter how "spiritual" we get, there is also always enough time to do "decent" work for a living too. Very healthy I must say, much underestimated

Well, enough from me. Keep up your good work and all good to you and yours

Originally posted by Watcher-In-The-Shadows
reply to post by Scorpiotropic

 

1) Within me. Really within all of us because it is powered by the power of belief is my honest opinion. Basically if you believe you can, you will. If you believe you can't. You won't.

So...belief..where do all the thousands of people praying go wrong then? The fact that they ask unto a higher power than themselves to make it so?

Also, do you believe there is a task too big for the human will? Are we under some universal law that says "This far, but not further!"

[edit on 14-9-2009 by Scorpiotropic]