Mohammed is now the third most popular boy's name in England. So why this shabby effort to conceal

Originally posted by prototism
Im not muslim, and not even necessarily "pro-muslim", but the original post sounds like disgusting anti-muslim diatribe, similar to the anti-black campaign in this country's recent history.

You should be ashamed of yourself. Just because you use a lot of words, it doesnt mean you are any less of a bigot.

It's because of tabloid papers why people feel this way. I want people to engage their brains and think using reason, rather than with emotional responses. Sadly though there are still issues worth discussing that may not happen because of the majority overreacting and making it all taboo.

Don't forget, it's impossible to publicly criticise prophet mohammed in Islam, without receiving death threats. Islam is extreme, and a quick look in the Quran tells you that! I know not all muslims will take it literally, but some will naturally tend to. Even so, I've pointed out various Quran versus to Muslims, and they often deny it exists or haven't read the Quran. So, seemingly many young muslims follow a religion, or are indoctrinated into islam, without knowing what it's all about.

One particular prophet, whose name slips my mind, actually died from eating poisoned berries, yet was supposed to be an expert in healing and plants. I said to a group of muslims, that don't you find it ironic that his death resulted in a mistake, when you claim he was an expert in that area. Their reaction was somewhat extreme, more extreme than christians react even if I said to christians that jesus didn't exist, or god doesn't exist.

It seems to me that more muslims should accept that criticism is part of living in a democracy, and is part of free speech. I imagine if Richard Dawkins were to criticise muslims as much as he criticises christians, he would receive death threats, much in the same way the dutch cartoonist received death threats. That's not to say that christians or other religions wouldn't send death threats, it's that muslims tend to generally do it more frequently and more extremely!

Being an athiest I find it ridiculous when muslims discuss prophets from the quran like they were discussing somebody they met last week. I know people in other religions do the same, but in the UK, they tend to be less devout.

Another point is that the prophet mohammed was a child rapist according to islamic texts. In fact many islamic traditions still allow these disgusting practices, along with stoning of women who haven't even commited a crime, when the rapist claims she wanted him. To discuss that with most muslims would be the equivalent of burning a church to christians.


[edit on 13-9-2009 by john124]

It's the same old story.

If a nation wants to infiltrate another nation and fails to do so by waging war, they simply turn to the amazingly easy way of doing so via immigration.

Works every time.

Originally posted by spellbound
It's the same old story.

If a nation wants to infiltrate another nation and fails to do so by waging war, they simply turn to the amazingly easy way of doing so via immigration.

Works every time.

Worked for Castro. Now the muslims.

reply to post by JJay55


I would like to say here that I am not a racist, but I do recognize when a country is trying to take over another country through immigration.

And I do not trust whichever country is trying to take over another.

That is not a good thing.

Originally posted by spellbound
reply to post by JJay55

 

I would like to say here that I am not a racist, but I do recognize when a country is trying to take over another country through immigration.

And I do not trust whichever country is trying to take over another.

That is not a good thing.

Add a dozen terrorism attacks on population centers, say... at the end of Ramadan... and then the country infiltrated will fall easily all the way into the hands of Islam. Let's see what happens this weekend.

www.timesonline.co.uk...


From The Times

January 30, 2009

Muslim population 'rising 10 times faster than rest of society'
Richard Kerbaj Recommend? (18) Click here to view the table

The Muslim population in Britain has grown by more than 500,000 to 2.4 million in just four years, according to official research collated for The Times.

The population multiplied 10 times faster than the rest of society, the research by the Office for National Statistics reveals. In the same period the number of Christians in the country fell by more than 2 million.

Experts said that the increase was attributable to immigration, a higher birthrate and conversions to Islam during the period of 2004-2008, when the data was gathered. They said that it also suggested a growing willingness among believers to describe themselves as Muslims because the western reaction to war and terrorism had strengthened their sense of identity.

Muslim leaders have welcomed the growing population of their communities as academics highlighted the implications for British society, integration and government resources.

David Coleman, Professor of Demography at Oxford University, said: “The implications are very substantial. Some of the Muslim population, by no means all of them, are the least socially and economically integrated of any in the United Kingdom ... and the one most associated with political dissatisfaction. You can't assume that just because the numbers are increasing that all will increase, but it will be one of several reasonable suppositions that might arise.”

Professor Coleman said that Muslims would naturally reap collective benefits from the increase in population. “In the growth of any population ... [its] voice is regarded as being stronger in terms of formulating policy, not least because we live in a democracy where most people in most religious groups and most racial groups have votes. That necessarily means their opinions have to be taken and attention to be paid to them.”

There are more than 42.6 million Christians in Britain, according to the Office for National Statistics, whose figures were obtained through the quarterly Labour Force Survey of around 53,000 homes. But while the biggest Christian population is among over-70s bracket, for Muslims it is the under-4s.

Ceri Peach, Professor of Social Geography at Manchester University, said that the rapid growth of the Muslim population posed challenges for society. “The groups with the strongest belief in the family and cohesion are those such as the Pakistanis and Bangladeshis. They have got extremely strong family values but it goes together with the sort of honour society and other kinds of attributes which people object to,” he said. “So you are dealing with a pretty complex situation.”

Professor Peach said that the high number of Muslims under the age of 4 — 301,000 as of September last year — would benefit Britain's future labour market through taxes that would subsequently contribute to sustaining the country's ageing population. He added, though, that it would also put pressure on housing and create a growing demand for schools. “I think housing has traditionally been a difficulty because the country is simultaneously short of labour and short of housing. So if you get people to fill vacancies in your labour force you also need to find places for them to live,” he said.

Muhammad Abdul Bari, general secretary of the Muslim Council of Britain, predicted that the number of mosques in Britain would multiply from the present 1,600 in line with the rising Islamic population. He said the greater platform that Muslims would command in the future should not be perceived as a threat to the rest of society.

“We each have our own set of beliefs. This should really be a source of celebration rather than fear as long as we all clearly understand that we must abide by the laws of this country regardless of the faith we belong to,” he said.

The Cohesion Minister, Sadiq Khan, told The Times: “We in central Government and local authorities need to continue our work to ensure that our communities are as integrated and cohesive as possible.”

Growing numbers

The total number of Muslims in Great Britain:

2004: 1,870,000

2005: 2,017,000

2006: 2,142,000

2007: 2,327,000

2008: 2,422,000

Source: Labour Force Survey

Originally posted by maloy

Originally posted by JJay55

-The negative treatment of Japanese Americans during WWII, and associated concentration camps.



[edit on 12-9-2009 by maloy]

WRONG!!!! The US did not run CONCENTRATION camps. They were internment camps. Concentration camps is a term used for what the Nazis and the Japanese did (yes...the Japanese ran nazi-like camps...Look up Unit 731.)

reply to post by PenandSword


The US is no cleaner than any other nation.

They probably did their share of torture.

I am horrified by everyone who does these things, so I am horrified by all nations.

I can understand the anger against muslim. I think they are right to express it. Myself I live in an area with a good number of muslims and dressing short sometimes attracts unpleasant comments or looks.

I am not racist by any means, but I think it is difficult for a lot of muslims to integrate any society other than theirs. They are so entrenched in their religion and cultural beliefs that are very different from our own. God is greater than the state or its angry citizen after all!

Having said that, I have a muslims and arabic friends and honestly they are very good people. They have higher social values, helping people, being polite and good neighbours is important to them. For example if I need help in the middle of the night, I know I can call a muslim friend and he will always help with a smile. Most british or white europeans friends always seem to never have time for friends or even relatives.
And us whites are part of the problem, if we worried less about the material and valued family more, we would have more children and there wouldnt be as much 'minorities' there are presently.

[edit on 13-9-2009 by TheOracle]

I think people are making a mistake in assuming that birth rates for Muslims will indefinitely continue at the current rate.

People are people. It doesn't matter what your religion is in the end. Almost every group of immigrants to the west, once acclimated to the new world, eventually adapt to its customs and standards; and that mean fewer kids.

People learn that to achieve success for their children, with expensive higher education and all, its best to have smaller families. Pool your resources so the one child can have the best there is available.

Why would the Muslims be any different? Even if their religion teaches to have many, most won't in the end because in this society fewer kids is more practical.

Originally posted by TheOracle
Myself I live in an area with a good number of muslims and dressing short sometimes attracts unpleasant comments or looks.

Originally posted by TheOracle being polite and good neighbours is important to them.

By your own admission, they are not. Would an English person make unpleasant comments to you in the middle of the street? (Chavs excluded in the same way I'm excluding Muslims who'd want to behead you)

Originally posted by TheOracle And us whites are part of the problem, if we worried less about the material and valued family more, we would have more children and there wouldnt be as much 'minorities' there are presently.

We're part of the problem? In our own countries?

Let me ask you: would you move to Saudi Arabia? If not, why not?

Originally posted by spellbound
reply to post by JJay55

 

I would like to say here that I am not a racist, but I do recognize when a country is trying to take over another country through immigration.

And I do not trust whichever country is trying to take over another.

That is not a good thing.

So which country is trying to take over which?

Originally posted by PenandSword

Originally posted by maloy

Originally posted by JJay55

-The negative treatment of Japanese Americans during WWII, and associated concentration camps.



[edit on 12-9-2009 by maloy]

WRONG!!!! The US did not run CONCENTRATION camps. They were internment camps. Concentration camps is a term used for what the Nazis and the Japanese did (yes...the Japanese ran nazi-like camps...Look up Unit 731.)

Invented by the British btw. It shows what our nation is capable of and why we should be wary of this overtly racist element which is becoming vocal.

reply to post by phoenix103


Calm down. Concentration camps used by the British were not a holding place before shovelling them into gas chambers.

Originally posted by Sargon of Akkad


Let me ask you: would you move to Saudi Arabia? If not, why not?

It's illegal to be a Christian there. Reason enough.
The way they treat women is horrible. Reason too.


[edit on 13-9-2009 by JJay55]

Originally posted by JJay55

Originally posted by hardpounding
an incredible amount of utter codswollop being spoken on this thread by purely borderline xenophobes and islamophobes.

not even worth trying to debate with these crusaders and morons

Oh yeah, the old Islamophobe classification. Without even considering how accurate the danger is. That's typical.
I am not an Islamophobe and I am fully aware of the dangers of Islam. The fact that the UK will be 50% Islamic in a few years isn't a fear, it's a fact. The reprocussion from population density change is one of the factors of chaos and drastic measures that are critical to safety management.
But go ahead and name call, run away and ignore the facts.

Would you put your money where your mouth is? I bet you £5000 that the percentage of Muslims won't even be 25% in 5 years time.

You're talking crap with nothing to show for it, anyone can talk, put your money where your mouth is.

Originally posted by hardpounding

Originally posted by JJay55

Originally posted by hardpounding
an incredible amount of utter codswollop being spoken on this thread by purely borderline xenophobes and islamophobes.

not even worth trying to debate with these crusaders and morons

Oh yeah, the old Islamophobe classification. Without even considering how accurate the danger is. That's typical.
I am not an Islamophobe and I am fully aware of the dangers of Islam. The fact that the UK will be 50% Islamic in a few years isn't a fear, it's a fact. The reprocussion from population density change is one of the factors of chaos and drastic measures that are critical to safety management.
But go ahead and name call, run away and ignore the facts.

Would you put your money where your mouth is? I bet you £5000 that the percentage of Muslims won't even be 25% in 5 years time.

You're talking crap with nothing to show for it, anyone can talk, put your money where your mouth is.

You are probably right but only because there will probably be an act of Islamic terrorism in the next week that will make the place uninhabitable. So how about if all you non-muslim kiffars go collect your muslim buds and make them stop the planned attack. Where are all the peaceful muslims making an effort to stop the violent muslims?

Originally posted by 0010110011101
It makes me worried for my children's future when I read bollocks like this, you should be ashamed.

It makes me fear for MY children's future when I read rubbish like you just wrote. There's been no racism whatsoever and yet you couldn't wait to pull out the "R" word to stifle an opinion that you disagree with. Do you realise how much damage you're doing to free-speech by misusing the "R" word?

Originally posted by JJay55

Originally posted by Sargon of Akkad


Let me ask you: would you move to Saudi Arabia? If not, why not?

It's illegal to be a Christian there. Reason enough.
The way they treat women is horrible. Reason too.
[edit on 13-9-2009 by JJay55]

Precisely. You find the indigenous culture to be unpalatable to your way of life, correct?

Then you have to ask yourself, why did a group of people who find British culture unpalatable choose to move to the UK? There are going to be obvious culture conflicts with the indigenous people, why inflict that on them? What right do the Muslims have to come to a non-Muslim country and cause tension?

How is that fair on the people who haven't done anything to antagonise the Muslims?

And lets not get into "well, Iraq/Afghanistan" etc, because your average short-skirt-wearing white girl didn't have much say in those policies...

Originally posted by spellbound
It's the same old story.

If a nation wants to infiltrate another nation and fails to do so by waging war, they simply turn to the amazingly easy way of doing so via immigration.

Works every time.

The f-ing French! I knew the EU was evil!