Jack the Ripper : The Art of Conspiracy

reply to post by Rising Against


Will take a look at it. Fascinating thread.....

Very in depth.

Originally posted by AugustusMasonicus

Originally posted by Jackdaw
In both Latin and German carolina means FREE MAN.

In Latin 'free man' (freedman) would literally be translated as 'libertus' you could also get away with 'liberus homo', 'solvo vir' or 'solvo homo'.

I, Jackdaw, beg to differ with you.
Maybe you should look up the meaning of girls names?

Originally posted by Rising Against
reply to post by sonnny1

 

It's odd you would post that documentary you know, I actually dedicated a thread to Kelly here: Mr James Kelly.. A Serious Jack the Ripper Candidate?

I really do think he's by far the most likely candidate for the Ripper you know, It all just seems to fit. I discussed why at length in the above thread, I hope the OP here doesn't mind me posting it too.

edit on 13-5-2012 by Rising Against because: (no reason given)

During a domestic incident Kelly picked up a kitchen knife.. . . . or was it his pocket knife? He slit his wife throat. Then he disappeared on the run. Last seen, if it was him, boarding a boat for the USA.
He was not the Ripper.

reply to post by Jackdaw

During a domestic incident Kelly picked up a kitchen knife. He slit his wife throat. Then he disappeared on the run. Last seen, if it was him, boarding a boat for the USA.
He was not the Ripper.

You're a tad too dismissive here to say the least.

Kelly has a fantastic motive for his attacks on women. He was well known to have hated them, and not just women but prostitutes in particular, these being the victims in the original ripper case. He also had a history of rather severe mental health issues and also, which is key here, severe violence against women, even murdering his own wife in an argument as you pointed out and murdering her in just the most brutal way too.

He was then sent to Broadmoor Prison thus his life was ruined by the women he once loved and murdered - He then later escaped pretty much just in time for the murders which took place in the Whitechapel area of London, and let's also not forget that he was very, very familiar with this particular, small area of London as this was where he previously, and yep, you guessed it, he met with prostitutes. It was also this meeting with prostitutes where he picked up a venereal disease which caused him to later argue with his wife and then murder her, thus there's a pretty clear link right back to them for a motive here.

What else, well he went over to America a short while later and of course once he did that the murders stopped occurring over in London and in fact similar ripper-type cases instead started occurring in America, these even becoming very public and at the time It was feared that the London Ripper had traveled overseas - Which Kelly had indeed done. Coincidence? Possibly but not likely.

In short that's why I feel you're being a bit rather unfair with how you so easily dismissed Kelly. With all due respect but I dare say you're not even attempting to look for the truth here, instead just have us belief your already made up beliefs in regards to the killer. This theory really has a lot going for it and Kelly is a very plausible candidate.

Originally posted by Jackdaw
I, Jackdaw, beg to differ with you.

You can beg to differ all you want it does not make it correct. The word 'libertus' means 'freeman' (freedman). There was a legal process surrounding manumission and the word 'libertus' is the central part of the act.

Maybe you should look up the meaning of girls names?

Sure. It means 'beautiful woman' in Latin.

I do not dismiss Kelly as you say.
Much like I do not Tumblety who may well have been in prison on the night of a Ripper murder? The doc had been arrested for a lewd act with a boy.
Much like I do not Maybrick and his diary and pocket watch? Both items are of dubious origin.
Both suspects have been put to the fore by those who protect the realm.
And a secret locked away in the tower . . . . . . and never to be told :-D

Originally posted by AugustusMasonicus

Originally posted by Jackdaw
I, Jackdaw, beg to differ with you.

You can beg to differ all you want it does not make it correct. The word 'libertus' means 'freeman' (freedman). There was a legal process surrounding manumission and the word 'libertus' is the central part of the act.

Maybe you should look up the meaning of girls names?

Sure. It means 'beautiful woman' in Latin.

Not interested in Libertus.
So now . . . . please tell the forum what the true meaning of the name CAROLINA means?
Then I may move onto the writing on the Goulston street wall . . . . and why the police washed it off?
Maybe the word JEWS. . . . however it was spelt? . . . .had Masonic links?

Originally posted by Jackdaw
Not interested in Libertus.

Then you are obviously not interested in the Latin word for 'freeman'.

So now . . . . please tell the forum what the true meaning of the name CAROLINA means?

I already did, it is posted above.

Originally posted by AugustusMasonicus

Originally posted by Jackdaw
Not interested in Libertus.

Then you are obviously not interested in the Latin word for 'freeman'.

So now . . . . please tell the forum what the true meaning of the name CAROLINA means?

I already did, it is posted above.

No probs.
I feel certain that the viewers are able to look up the name Carolina and what it means as a proposed baby name.
It would have been nice for you to say it all the same?

I send the pic come portrait soonest :-D

Originally posted by Jackdaw
I feel certain that the viewers are able to look up the name Carolina and what it means as a proposed baby name.
It would have been nice for you to say it all the same?

Are you having some reading comprehension issues? I posted that it meant 'beautiful woman' in Latin when you asked me to look it up and you requoted it yourself in the next reply.

Originally posted by AugustusMasonicus

Originally posted by Jackdaw
I feel certain that the viewers are able to look up the name Carolina and what it means as a proposed baby name.
It would have been nice for you to say it all the same?

Are you having some reading comprehension issues? I posted that it meant 'beautiful woman' in Latin when you asked me to look it up and you requoted it yourself in the next reply.

I do not think I asked you to look it up in Latin?
Please quote when I did?
Thanks.

Originally posted by Jackdaw
I do not think I asked you to look it up in Latin?
Please quote when I did?
Thanks.

If were are discussing the meanings of words in Latin and you ask me to look something up what language do you think I am going to check? Swahili?

Since you seem to have a tremendous grasp of language maybe you can link to where 'Carolina' (a girls name) means 'free man'.

Originally posted by AugustusMasonicus

Originally posted by Jackdaw
I do not think I asked you to look it up in Latin?
Please quote when I did?
Thanks.

If were are discussing the meanings of words in Latin and you ask me to look something up what language do you think I am going to check? Swahili?

Since you seem to have a tremendous grasp of language maybe you can link to where 'Carolina' (a girls name) means 'free man'.

Being considered erudite . . . and multi lingual . . . I do actually have a grasp of several languages.
i.e. your opening line on this post was incorrect grammatically.
It should have read IF WE ARE. . . .not IF WERE?
I feel certain that you do not need me to find you a web link re a baby name?. . . or its meaning?

Originally posted by Jackdaw
I feel certain you do not need me to find a web link re a baby name?

If you have one that says it means 'free man' in Latin, then yes. If not you need to amend your initial statement.

Originally posted by AugustusMasonicus

Originally posted by Jackdaw
I feel certain you do not need me to find a web link re a baby name?

If you have one that says it means 'free man' in Latin, then yes. If not you need to amend your initial statement.

Try :-
babynamesworld.parentsconnect.com
or
thinkbabynames.com

reply to post by Jackdaw


Really,he broke it down for you.

Second,how about getting back to your theory,and providing more evidence to back it up ?

If pictures are going to be the evidence,then I am sure you can find more,that are more defined,less of an eye strain.

Please continue..............

Originally posted by Jackdaw
Try :-
babynamesworld.parentsconnect.com
or
thinkbabynames.com

Neither one of those addresses contains supporting evidence of your statement that Carolina means 'free man' in Latin.

From your first link:

Feminine form of the Latin Carolus, from the name Charles.
It is now the Italian, Spanish and Portuguese cognate of the name.

The states of North and South Carolina in the USA were named after King Charles I of England.

From the second:

Carolina c(a)-roli-

na,

car(o)-

lina as a girl's name is a variant of Carol (Old German) and Caroline (Old German), and the meaning of Carolina is "free man".

Nothing about it meaning 'free man' in Latin which would be 'Libertus'.

Originally posted by AugustusMasonicus

Originally posted by Jackdaw
Try :-
babynamesworld.parentsconnect.com
or
thinkbabynames.com

Neither one of those addresses contains supporting evidence of your statement that Carolina means 'free man' in Latin.

You sir are either blind. . . .or a liar.
Personally I don't care either way.
You seem to take such a stance?
And you haven't even seen the portrait yet?
Or Jackdaw's interpretation of it :-D

Originally posted by Jackdaw
I would like to set a challenge to any so called "Ripperologist" out there who doubts that Patricia Cornwell was correct in her opinion that Walter Richard Sickert was in fact Jack the Ripper.

Beyond that, Cornwell says that Sickert painted several prostitutes in a way that resembled the photographs of the dead Ripper victims, but those photos were taken at the morgue, not the crime scene, and were published in books to which Sickert had access. He also painted these scenes two decades after the murders, and the women depicted are not necessarily dead. Yet what about "dried blood" on a Ripper letter turning out to be artist's medium? That still does not tie it to Sickert. Taking a stab with psychology, Cornwell believes the macabre paintings he did of menacing men sitting with murdered prostitutes is a reflection of his own crimes from two decades before, sublimated for a while to avoid attention. Cornwell leaves no room for the motive of simply being interested in bringing attention to his art by depicting sensational subject matter.

Cornwell admits that conclusive physical evidence is lacking at this time, but insists that the many links she has made between Sickert's life and the Ripper crimes just cannot be denied. He was a master of disguise, his initials match those on some of the Ripper letters, he had quirky handwriting (like Jack) and as a boy he had sketched naked and bound women. These are among the reasons why, she says, she has closed the case. But in fact, she has merely begged the question: She appears to have assumed Sickert is Jack and to have made the "right" facts align nicely with that thesis, thereby "proving" it. But she hasn't really proved anything. The records are incomplete, the remains are gone, the crime scenes have long since been contaminated, and evidence is missing or wiped away. Thanks to Cornwell, Sickert can be restored among the usual suspects, but she offers no scientific basis for tapping him as the infamous Red Jack.

Can Art Reveal a Killer?

Cornwell admits that conclusive physical evidence is lacking at this time......................and closing the case is ludicrous.....

Originally posted by Jackdaw
You sir are either blind. . . .or a liar.

Then post a translation that contradicts the ones I listed above. You can also use this translator which will give you the meanings in Latin of both 'libertus' (free man) and 'Carolina' (Carolus (Charles of the Franks)).

Personally I don't care either way.

The fact that you are responding proves otherwise.

You seem to take such a stance?
And you haven't even seen the portrait yet?
Or Jackdaw's interpretation of it :-D

Your painting and third person opinion of it do not interest me. I only pointed out yor erroneous statement about Latin.