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The Kecksburg UFO Crash: December 9th, 1965

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posted on Sep, 9 2009 @ 09:55 AM
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Originally posted by JimOberg
My impression was that there were lots of sightings to base the fireball trajectory reconstruction on -- not just one photo. Aren't there links to the scientific papers on that?

As to thickening/thinning trails, that doesn't impress me. The object was moving into thicker layers of atmosphere undergoing increasing stress and heat, so any assumption that its smoke trail would STAY THE SAME is pretty non-credible, to me.

Thanks for the kind words, folks.


Yes there is a lot of evidence besides the photo. And yes the smoke trail could even get thicker! But there's no reason to assume it would always be constant.

The kind words are well deserved Jim. Your posts always provide valuable insights to me and I appreciate them!

Jim, I noticed the debunker.com link in your post isn't working but if you put a space after the html and before the period, i think it will. It's reading the period as part of the link and that throws it off. That looks like an interesting site, I see he links to your articles there as well! Thanks again.




posted on Sep, 9 2009 @ 12:13 PM
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The thing that makes me wonder about what crashed is what the reported military witness said he was told about "you have just seen something that'll be common knowledge in 20 years." Anyone have any ideas on that?



posted on Sep, 9 2009 @ 12:27 PM
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reply to post by jkrog08
 


I too found that comment interesting.

I can only speculate that maybe he knew it was some kind of classified object, or maybe it really was Kosmos in spite of the information we have that it's not. After all, if it were Kosmos and we grabbed it in violation of international agreements, we couldn't really admit it could we? I don't think we are beyond spreading disinfo to hide something like that. And did anyone ever identify the actual impact site of Kosmos and retrieve any wreckage from it?

So I'm guessing he thought it would eventually become declassified or lose its secrecy if it was something of ours that was classified, or that in 20 years it might not be a big deal to admit it's actually Kosmos. But he could have meant something different. Or maybe there was no crash debris at all as Jim Oberg suggests.



posted on Sep, 9 2009 @ 02:43 PM
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reply to post by jkrog08
 


The really fascinating part about this case was the now renamed Project Moon Dust team was activated to retrieve the craft (as researched by Major Kevin Randle). I believe it was an alien probe that landed and now lies in some storage area of a base.

Thank you for the great report, jkrog08.



posted on Sep, 9 2009 @ 03:02 PM
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reply to post by kidflash2008
 


You know that was always what I thought, either a ET probe or a 'escape pod' from a larger craft. Although I have no evidence to prove those theories, those are my own personal theories if indeed the object was ET in origin.



posted on Sep, 9 2009 @ 03:18 PM
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reply to post by jkrog08
 


I have long thought this was not ET, but a USSR Venus probe. Proof? No. But the circumstance of the fact the Russian's launched a probe to Venus that never made it, would have had unuusual writing, indicate to me was likely the situation. I have heard we did track something come down, but since I was five at the time, I was not yet working.

It has been reported on programs on the History Ch. for example that the trajectory of the probe was east-central or north eastern Canada. Who knows, but I trust my instincts. Why would this have been such a big deal? Less the fact we were concerned about the Soviet's knowing WE knew. Russian HUMINT was and is superb. But the fact a warhead-size object dropped into the woods, near population centers of the northeastern U.S, and us not being able to prevent it "dropping in", may have something to do with it. You can add to the fact LBJ was such a control freak...



posted on Sep, 9 2009 @ 03:40 PM
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S&F!
amazing research jkrog08!

In my opinion for the government to cover that up it has to be something huge..like ET's



posted on Sep, 9 2009 @ 03:45 PM
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I just want to say THANK YOU TO EVERYONE, you guys are TOO nice. Thank you, I am glad everyone is finding this report useful.


EDIT: Also, sorry for some of the typos, lol my Word spell check is not working and the one I used likes to combine words for some reason.. I think I corrected them all now everyone.


[edit on 9/9/2009 by jkrog08]



posted on Sep, 9 2009 @ 04:04 PM
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The son of the Farmer and property owner who witnessed the object and the ramifications of what happened to his father and family is now living in LaGrande Oregon.

If there is a professional investigator who is interested in getting more details you might want to contact him. I was told by a hunting buddy who works for the railroad that he was not a happy camper after the government and the town where they originally lived in began to cover up and make false statements and acusations of the event.

His name is Lee Manor and my be willing to open up and discuss it with the right people who would know how to approach him and this subject.



posted on Sep, 9 2009 @ 04:10 PM
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reply to post by jkrog08
 


It was one of two things:
Russian Satellite
or
Alien Spacecraft

Why can it be ONLY these two things?
Well, a researcher had the wonderful idea of researching this at the Presidential library of Lydon B. Johnson - what he found was none other than explosive!
The very next morning after the Kecksburg incident (really just hours after) the President was on vacation at his ranch for some relaxation. But what is soooo amazing was who came to see him at his ranch the next day:
Joint Cheifs
Secretary of Defense Mcnamara
President Johnson
Nasa Administrator James E. Webb
and none other than the Governor of Pennsylvania!

Now, why else would the governor and NASA admin be at the Presidents ranch the very next day after kecksburgh?
For two reasons - it was either a russian satellite where I do believe in the possibility b/c of the trajectory was close enough!
or,
a UFO!

The source of this schedule was from the History Channel: UFO FIles - Kecksburgh



posted on Sep, 9 2009 @ 04:20 PM
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Excellent work. F'd & the S.

Right now, after reading the OP and not being all that familiar with the event, I'd lean more towards some sort of extraterrestrial vehicle. It's one of the few cases that can actually be concluded to be a UFO in definition terms. But, discerning what the UFO actually was is another story.

However, there may be some credence to the nuclear warhead scenerio. Like I stated above, I haven't done any research other than what was presented here on ATS and the linked sites, but to my knowledge the only countries mentioned were the U.S. and Russia as possible candidates for the warhead. However, a scenerio that would explain the strange "writing" of "hieroglyphics" is if Israel were testing a warhead like such. Israel had research the atomic bomb since the mid-50's and silently weaponized atomic energy around 1967. I have no clue as to the ICBM capabilities though. That's a whole other story, I'm sure.

Anyway, just brainstorming.



posted on Sep, 9 2009 @ 04:59 PM
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What a well made post!


I was just reading about this case this morning in the book Need To Know, and planned to check up on the case here today. What perfect timing.



posted on Sep, 9 2009 @ 04:59 PM
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Another story that will always be he-said-she-said. A point I'm not seeing addressed...If you believe the witnesses as I do then it (whatever it was) fell from space and didn't obliterate and incinerate into fine pieces. It's exterior had almost no damage at all. So much for the theory of anything manmade, including what we build for space. Meteor, anything soviet, domestic black project, etc., etc.....why that level of secrecy then and why any secrecy at all forty-four years later?

To me, the simplest explanation is usually the correct one, but it just doesn't add up.



posted on Sep, 9 2009 @ 05:33 PM
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reply to post by herbii
 


Your conclusions are very logical, but if I may ask you to view this under the auspicious of the politics of not 2009, but 1965. Violation of air space, space probes in any way shape, or form were a very very big deal in '65. I am not at all surprised the heavy hitters of the government would quickly hold court.

Also, at the LBJ lib. if you listen to the released audio tapes of his Presidency to date, the psychology of the man is complex, vindictive, and very frightend.



posted on Sep, 9 2009 @ 06:13 PM
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Great post jkrog, S+F!!! This is one of the most interesting and well documented threads I have read in a while here on ATS. Kudos to you! Definitely got my attention, and I will add any relevant information that I am able to find on the web that is relevant to this thread.

One of the things that comes to mind is the Bob Lazar story. Now I don't know your standpoint on this, but I do know several people on ATS have mixed opinions about Lazar's story. It would be interesting to see if there is any correlation between the supposed craft that were housed at S-4 that he described and the Kecksburg object.



posted on Sep, 9 2009 @ 09:15 PM
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Originally posted by rygi23
Another story that will always be he-said-she-said. A point I'm not seeing addressed...If you believe the witnesses as I do then it (whatever it was) fell from space and didn't obliterate and incinerate into fine pieces. It's exterior had almost no damage at all. So much for the theory of anything manmade, including what we build for space.


Apparently you didn't read Jim Oberg's post on page 1:


Originally posted by JimOberg
In early December, 1965, a Soviet spacecraft of very high interest was about to fall out of orbit. It was the entry capsule of a Venus probe, whose engine had failed during launch, trapping it in low Earth orbit. That spacecraft would contain the very latest Soviet hardware for heat shielding, hi-G structural strength, guidance, navigation instrumentation, and computer/communications systems, since the same factories that
built space probes also were involved in building military missile and warhead systems.


See that about the very latest Soviet hardware for heat shielding? If it's a probe designed to withstand Venus, that's a very severe environment so I imagine it would be very, very tough and capable of surviving re-entry to the earth.

So that's a possibility and some witnesses claimed the object even had the same acorn shape as that probe. Are you still sure it couldn't be man-made?



posted on Sep, 10 2009 @ 08:09 AM
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There are a few things that I thought odd to say the least for instance:

The land owners said that men from the Government were in there home and used there phones to make calls and I wonder why no one checked the phone records or what there phone bill would have stated the following month to see where those calls were made to.

One person said he was hiding near a Army vehicle that was blocking an area off he said, he snuck up as close as he could to observe then he heard this ungodly monsterous scream that came from the area the object was in that scared him so bad he left the area as fast and as quiet as he could and never went back.

I have no doubt Northcom was tracking this object and had teams ready when they knew where landfall was and I think when NASA showed up with that large white crate they knew what they were going for and putting the scream and the crate together I would think there was some kind of Creature or Being they were after. I know many life forms can not breathe our air there is to much oxygen in it (this is our protection) so unless they have there protection they aren't going to survive long in our atmosphere.

It's a shame that not only was the town divided by this but so were families.



posted on Sep, 10 2009 @ 08:15 AM
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Can i just say what a excellent post,

but i have a questions..

1. why do the government keep coving up what we now know, with the usual junk, it this or its a meteor.

the aliens will be too scared to come here as our government will cut them up and run test on there there living things aswell( i think) leave them be.

the government suck




[edit on 10-9-2009 by dee-kay]



posted on Sep, 10 2009 @ 09:49 AM
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Great post -- nice comprehensive work.

Agreed on the question posted above, why not disclose now? If it was, say, the Venus probe, both sides know it, so what's the downside?

Best answer I can think of is 'why disclose?', even it was terrestrial. Who really cares? A very small segment of the population (people like us), so there isn't really any strong demand to do anything about it. Doesn't seem like the lawsuit has much power.

Believing in the notion of visitation from extraterrestrial craft requires the ability to live with mystery -- something most people are uneasy at best with.

I don't ever expect disclosure, and whenever I think about it, I'm reminded of Eisenhower's comment about peace -- someday the American people will want it so bad they'll storm the White House and take it. He was speaking figuratively of course, but the point was that real change on anything has to come from the bottom up. Won't be top down.



posted on Sep, 10 2009 @ 10:19 AM
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reply to post by jkrog08
 


Wow, wow and wow. S&F.

Thanks a lot jkrog08!!I had planned to have a night off from ATS, now I've got to spend another fascinating evening in front of my laptop, followed by another night of poor sleep as I assimilate the info you have provided.



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