Does the Central Limit Theorem prove a Creator/Deity?

reply to post by OldThinker


Obviously you are not going to argue the point nor are you going to argue with intelligence. Your skirting around the issue and until your willing to debate with at least three brain cells, kiss it.

reply to post by sirnex


You want to talk about control. Evolution is all about controlling the masses. It gives power to the government and takes it from the people.

That video welfard posted above, about transitional forms....read the quote in my post above....and they defined transitional forms, not me....it's evolutionists definition....and it has changed from Darwin's time.

They ended the video by saying humans are just another variety of apes...not me. Humans are humans....created unique and distinct from all other life.

Only an evolutionists would think animals are smarter than humans. Humans do a lot of crazy things to each other, and that is evidence that human nature is in a fallen state, and requires a union with the divine nature to bring back to life that spirit that we lost at the fall of Adam.

That is what repentance, redemption, salvation, the new heart and the new spirit given by the love, grace, and mercy of God is all about.

Our nature needs a transformation, and the Spirit of God does that for us when we begin to turn from our old ways to the new way provided through Christ.

reply to post by John Matrix

You want to talk about control. Evolution is all about controlling the masses. It gives power to the government and takes it from the people.

Where the hell are you getting that from? It's complete BS, and if you are a 'freethinker' as you claim to be, then you would know that.

That video welfard posted above, about transitional forms....read the quote in my post above....and they defined transitional forms, not me....it's evolutionists definition....and it has changed from Darwin's time.

Boohoo, the definition changed accordingly to newer discoveries of thing's that Darwin was not rightfully aware of during his time. Theories and terminologies will change or go out of disuse as new knowledge is discovered. Get over it and deal with the discoveries, knowledge and theory as it exists today.

They ended the video by saying humans are just another variety of apes...not me. Humans are humans....created unique and distinct from all other life.

Who cares if they said humans are apes. Big deal if they used that terminology, idk why they chose it as it's stupid and erroneous and allows people like you to argue against the theory with misunderstandings.

Only an evolutionists would think animals are smarter than humans. Humans do a lot of crazy things to each other, and that is evidence that human nature is in a fallen state, and requires a union with the divine nature to bring back to life that spirit that we lost at the fall of Adam.

Suffice it to say, I haven't met many people who actually think animals are smarter than humans. AFAIK, I'm the only one who does! Your not as intelligent as I thought I supposed.

Our nature needs a transformation, and the Spirit of God does that for us when we begin to turn from our old ways to the new way provided through Christ.

So you follow the god of the new testament and not the old testament?

reply to post by John Matrix

You want to talk about control. Evolution is all about controlling the masses. It gives power to the government and takes it from the people.

How does an understanding of human origins possibly make the masses controllable. You're talking a lot of smack in your smear campaign against evolutionary theory.

In terms of mass control, science doesn't compare to religion and it's histroy of taking power from the people.

That video welfard posted above, about transitional forms....read the quote in my post above....and they defined transitional forms, not me....it's evolutionists definition....and it has changed from Darwin's time.

Of course it's changed from Darwin's time, we've learnt more and our understanding has improved as the science became more complete.

The intermediate gradations in the human evolutionary line are now so fine that paleo anthropologists can't agree whether they are all different species or merely mildly modified varieties of the same one such that there are no more links needed for human evolution anymore.

Translation: Some scientists believe they are just variations within the same species, which is what creationists have said all along.

Shot right over your head didn't it. What has been found is a long smooth progression of species from one to the next all the way up to humans, so much so that it is difficult to draw the line between the species.

Palaeoanthropologists argue about what to do with the specimens found on the boarder from one species to the next - a problem that in itself makes creationism laughable.

Notice the last line...."such that there are no more links needed for human evolution anymore."

Translation: we found all the links and man is not evolving anymore.

No it means that our understanding of human evolution is virtually complete for human evolution to date. There is nothing in there to suggest that humans are not evolving any longer.

Do apes have Criminal Laws founded upon the 10 commandments?
Do apes send men to the moon and telescopes into outer-space?
Do apes build LCD and Plasma TV's?
Do apes build buildings, houses, cars, farm machinery?
Do apes grow crops, cure disease, set bones and put limbs in casts, do heart surgery, talk four or five languages fluently, go to school, make nuclear power plants, make computers?

Give me a break....what garbage!!

Yes actually, to all of those things. Humans are apes. Humans are to apes what BMW are to cars, you twit.

They ended the video by saying humans are just another variety of apes...not me. Humans are humans.

Which are a species of ape.

created unique and distinct from all other life.

Only an evolutionists would think animals are smarter than humans. Humans do a lot of crazy things to each other, and that is evidence that human nature is in a fallen state, and requires a union with the divine nature to bring back to life that spirit that we lost at the fall of Adam.

That is what repentance, redemption, salvation, the new heart and the new spirit given by the love, grace, and mercy of God is all about.

Our nature needs a transformation, and the Spirit of God does that for us when we begin to turn from our old ways to the new way provided through Christ.

Or so dictates your faith, but certainly not anything in science.

Humans are different. From the time humans suddenly popped up in the ancient past, out of seemingly nowhere, they had language, made tools, built dwellings, had knowledge of mathematics, appointed leaders, grew their own food, and where able to dominate all creatures.

None of that is true. Humans evolved in Africa - they didn't just pop up recently. Late pre-history humans were hunter-gatherers around world and did not grow food, had knowledge of mathematics, appoint leaders (outside of animalistic pecking orders), did not dominate all the creatures, they had very rudimentary language (not unique to humans) and made rudimentary dwellings as did their cousins, the Neanderthal.

[edit on 30-9-2009 by Welfhard]

Has everyone forgot about my Darwin's Lagacy thread....short memories around here eh?

Marx, and Hitler. Both believed in Darwinism. Both justified their mass killing sprees with doctrines like natural selection and survival of the fittest.
Both took over countries, and justified it as being the natural process of evolution.

If that doesn't demonstrate to you the type power the gov gets over the people then.....

Ya, oh ya! I posted a whole video series on it. Go back and look.

Gov controls the flow of money to the scientists, and what is taught in schools....gov. gains power....people loose power....people loose civil rights....people get abused by authorities and treated like animals.....people whine about it on ATS.

Open your eyes for crying out loud.

[edit on 30/9/09 by John Matrix]

Originally posted by John Matrix
.......controls the flow of money to the scientists, and what is taught in schools....gov. gains power....people loose power....people loose civil rights....people get abused by authorities and treated like animals.....people whine about it on ATS.
.....

Wow John, that is the "value stream" of frustration for so many...

OT knows you are on to something!

Thx

Originally posted by OldThinker.....can you please offer some insight on my question???? I'll be good, i promise...I am not trying to "get you" friend....


Why don't you both watch... www.youtube.com... especially at 2:50 to 3:30, humbly dare you?

Are you still there friend?

Thoughts?

Your answer to the question?

Thoughts on the vid?

OT

JM:

Evolution is all about controlling the masses.

Sorry John, have to disagree with you on this particular point. Social Darwinism (to which you are alluding) is not a natural tendency of evolution, it is a cherry-picking of Darwinian principles fashioned to promote a warped ideology used by some to justify prejudicial bias. It has nothing whatsoever to do with natural evolution.

There is no instance of a few cells controlling the masses of other cells in the body. The real non-intelligent controlling force is that occurring between molecules and the bonding process.

I can understand your reason for wanting to lump evolution to all the ills of mankind, but a little honesty - just unto yourself - will admit of your ill-defined acceptance that evolution is a controlling force. Evolution is not controlling, but a autonomous occurrence of interactions...the results and consequences of which evolution cannot pre-know...it is simply a incidental process.

reply to post by John Matrix


Darwin's initial thoughts do NOT apply in light of modern advances! Use your brain for once, try and find the common sense in that statement, it's quite obvious.

Hitler was Christian.

Here is how he justified his actions against the Jews.

"As a Christian I have no duty to allow myself to be cheated, but I have the duty to be a fighter for truth and justice."

Karl Marx was influenced works of sociology and economics.

Unless *YOU* want to rewrite history, LEARN IT!.

Originally posted by elysiumfire
JM:

Evolution is all about controlling the masses.

Sorry John, have to disagree with you on this particular point. Social Darwinism (to which you are alluding) is not a natural tendency of evolution, it is a cherry-picking of Darwinian principles fashioned to promote a warped ideology used by some to justify prejudicial bias. It has nothing whatsoever to do with natural evolution.

There is no instance of a few cells controlling the masses of other cells in the body. The real non-intelligent controlling force is that occurring between molecules and the bonding process.

I can understand your reason for wanting to lump evolution to all the ills of mankind, but a little honesty - just unto yourself - will admit of your ill-defined acceptance that evolution is a controlling force. Evolution is not controlling, but a autonomous occurrence of interactions...the results and consequences of which evolution cannot pre-know...it is simply a incidental process.

It is what it is my friend.
They justify their action and appease their consciousnesses with it's foundational teachings.

reply to post by John Matrix

It is what it is my friend.
They justify their action and appease their consciousnesses with it's foundational teachings.

You mean Abrahamic Religion? I think you must.

Originally posted by sirnex
reply to post by John Matrix

 

Darwin's initial thoughts do NOT apply in light of modern advances! Use your brain for once, try and find the common sense in that statement, it's quite obvious.

Hitler was Christian.

That statement is a complete and utter perversion of the truth. NO Christian would ever do what he did.

Just because someone calls them self a Christian, that does not make them one. You need to learn what makes a Christian a Christian.

The word says we are known by our actions. The actions of Hitler are not included in the array of characteristics which define a Christian.

reply to post by John Matrix

The word says we are known by our actions. The actions of Hitler are not included in the array of characteristics which define a Christian.

Then there are no Christians at all.

Originally posted by sirnex
reply to post by John Matrix

 

The word says we are known by our actions. The actions of Hitler are not included in the array of characteristics which define a Christian.

Then there are no Christians at all.

Well....we know you certainly would not know one even if you saw their acts of goodness.....you thought Hitler was a Chrsitian.

reply to post by John Matrix


As I said, there are no Christians, this is in despite of those whom claim to be Christians as no person today lives a true Christian life and no person in history has ever lived as Christ said they should live.

You are not a Christian, you never have been and so long as you abide by societies rules you will never be.

People who claim to be Christians are always making excuses for the atrocities of those who also claim to be Christians even when those very people are inspired by the word of God to commit those crimes.

So much conflict within yourselves.

Originally posted by sirnex
reply to post by John Matrix

 

As I said, there are no Christians, this is in despite of those whom claim to be Christians as no person today lives a true Christian life and no person in history has ever lived as Christ said they should live.

You are not a Christian, you never have been and so long as you abide by societies rules you will never be.

People who claim to be Christians are always making excuses for the atrocities of those who also claim to be Christians even when those very people are inspired by the word of God to commit those crimes.

So much conflict within yourselves.

Your error is that you think being a Christian requires you to live up to something.

A Christian has the Spirit within them. The Spirit empowers us to imitate Christ's character and when we do that we will be walking in the Spirit and we will not fulfill the desires of the old nature(covetousness, envy, pride, wrath).

What is the true Christian life that you think I should live up to?

Originally posted by John Matrix

Originally posted by sirnex
reply to post by John Matrix

 

As I said, there are no Christians, this is in despite of those whom claim to be Christians as no person today lives a true Christian life and no person in history has ever lived as Christ said they should live.

You are not a Christian, you never have been and so long as you abide by societies rules you will never be.

People who claim to be Christians are always making excuses for the atrocities of those who also claim to be Christians even when those very people are inspired by the word of God to commit those crimes.

So much conflict within yourselves.

Your error is that you think being a Christian requires you to live up to something.

A Christian has the Spirit within them. The Spirit empowers us to imitate Christ's character and when we do that we will be walking in the Spirit and we will not fulfill the desires of the old nature(covetousness, envy, pride, wrath).

What is the true Christian life that you think I should live up to?

Read your bible, there is no possible way that anyone in today's society is living to it's word. Including yourself. Therefore, there is no such thing as a Christian and Christianity died before it even had a chance to get off the ground as a religion. The goodness it preaches is great, no one follows it, no one ever has and no one will, including yourself.

You even go against one thing god had said. You despise knowledge as if it were the very evil of the earth. Yet, god asks you to test him, he asks you to learn. You decide to argue with ancient arguments that have long been put to rest. You know why? Because you haven't a chance in hell to argue against what we know today, that is why you avoid it and that is why when we bring it up you ignore it.

You have consistently shown the highest disregard for science and the word of your very god. You are the very definition of an enigma.

JM:

It is what it is my friend. They justify their action and appease their consciousnesses with it's foundational teachings.

No John...this is what you stated...

Evolution is all about controlling the masses.

...you stated it emphatically as one whole sentence...then later you state regarding Hitler...

Just because someone calls them self a Christian, that does not make them one.

...I take it then that just because someone calls themself an evolutionist, it does not make them one? When you follow the logic that you yourself espouse, it becomes quite apparent that...

It is what it is my friend.

...becomes something that you don't really agree with, and I wouldn't expect you to?

Nevetheless...

They justify their action and appease their consciousnesses with it's foundational teachings.

...I assume you are talking about the Bible wherein acts of persecution, oppression, indoctrination, and faith-inspired violence justifies and appeases the religious conscience? There is nothing 'spiritually loving' in such hypocritical contradiction.

I suppose the point I'm making is that if you are going to call a religion one of love, then such a religion must genuinely 'be' a religion of love, in practice and adherence. It should condemn publicly those that abuse it's loving principles and drag it into disrepute. Not one single person should be harmed in any way by any religious faith of any type, but we see a long long history of persecution and oppression and violence against those that disagree with the tenets of the various religions, and we still see it even today. If evolution really is all about controlling the masses, then we need not look too far from the evolution of religion to understand how great a device religion is in acheiving such control.

Originally posted by sirnex
...
People who claim to be Christians are always making excuses for the atrocities of those who also claim to be Christians even when those very people are inspired by the word of God to commit those crimes.

...

Matthew 7:15-20


15 "Watch out for false prophets. They come to you pretending to be sheep. But on the inside they are hungry wolves. 16 You can tell what they really are by what they do.
"Do people pick grapes from bushes? Do they pick figs from thorns? 17 In the same way, every good tree bears good fruit. But a bad tree bears bad fruit. 18 A good tree can't bear bad fruit. And a bad tree can't bear good fruit. 19 Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down. It is thrown into the fire. 20 You can tell each tree by its fruit.

Originally posted by sirnex
So much conflict within yourselves.

yep!

fo sho!

For what I am doing, I do not understand; for I am not practicing what I would like to do, but I am doing the very thing I hate. Romans 7:15

Your statement is a biblical truth you know?