Short thread- How I faced off against JWs and basically won....

Reply to post by moocowman

No, it's not to supposed to raise a tear. It is to show that even if he could do all those things, he chose to go without.

It's to show that even without all the pleasures of the world that life itself is fulfilling. It's to show that the joys of this life aren't mundane things such as plasma tvs and buttloads of cash. The joys come from living a life that is connected with the Father. In Him all things are joyous.

Jesus is to be used as an example. Even though he had close to nothing he still gave and helped. He still loved.

How many people these days, if their house and vehicles were destroyed, could think of someone besides themself? Probably not many.




Posted Via ATS Mobile: m.abovetopsecret.com

reply to post by Agree2Disagree

The reason these prayers go seemingly unanswered IMHO is... 1. Lack of true faith 2. Lack of knowledge of prayer(i.e. The Lord's prayer, praying to Jesus or whomever besides the Father...) 3. Lack of relationship with the Father 4. Greedy intentions

Ok let's assume for a minute that prayer works then I would have to agree with all bar number 4 bar greedy intentions.

Your a smart guy I guess you've got a rough idea or where I'm coming from, so I'll leave you to figure out why I choose to disagree on that point.

reply to post by Agree2Disagree

1. Life is what YOU make it, because we as humans have FREEWILL. This is also one reason why there is suffering. In a system of freewill we can do what we CHOOSE. Therefore there must be choices and opposites. If there is love, there is hate. If there is pleasure, there is pain.

*Groan* I'll say it (yet) again. NOT IN MY CASE. NOT IN MY CASE. (this is a recording) NOT IN MY CASE. NOT IN MY CASE. I have far too many times of making quite large, life altering decisions.... to have either nothing happen, or the exact and total opposite, contrary to any natural law walk up and slug me in the jaw. I wont go into lurid details- but at least a couple times, I should have been married (post ex g/f- who I tried so hard to marry, it amazed me and everyone who knew me)... I 'worked' very, very strongly to assure things would.... go thataway. I put in 25 YEARS dragging my way to a job that I knew I could do (and probably still could) with my eyes closed! It's something I could do easily, I could do amazingly well, and I could pull off with such a danged finesse, the company would have been morons to lay me off- and everything- things that should never have happened- have kept me from moving to where I could acquire that job. Heaven and earth MOVED to assure I couldn't get it. Things happened I had no plans for (and probably neither could anyone else). I was so close to having this job, I could smell it! I was so close, I had bought my interview clothes and had all references, phone numbers, and every last scrap of everything needed! I could taste it. I could see myself going thru the paperwork for taking orientation. I could see myself driving to work. I was planning my F*honking* lunches!

So- Who wants to try to dump ye olde 'free will' carde in my frigging lap again? Anyone? Because

I KNOW BETTER!!!!

Life is what *I* make of it, huh.... BULL*snip*. Parsnips, too! That is such a load of crock. That is such a frigging lie, anyone who even thinks it should be rapped in the mouth, just because of the pure ignorance of the statement itself.

Here's the simple, easy version, k? This is how my life SHOULD have been:

I should be married to the woman I love, And I should be working at the job I enjoy (By now, promoted to a supervisory position)- 1-2 kids, a small house, a lawn to mow occasionally, and occasionally, I get to do art, a scale model, and have taught my kids in their chosen talents.

NOT the life that has been dumped in my lap like steaming hot horse hockey, because *I* did. Not. ask/ work for/ try for it. Do. I. Make. Myself. Waterford Crystal. Clear?

reply to post by wylekat


Addendum: Ya know, after some thought, you people who come up with this stuff are the epitome of Adam Savage's quip on Mythbusters:

"I reject your reality, and substitute my own" And boy, o brother, Do you ever....

reply to post by wylekat


if it's going that incredibly bad, and against all odds, to the point of being outrageous, is it possible this may indicate that something supernatural may in fact, be transpiring, but, as you put it, the polar opposite of what you've asked for? i find that rather spooky. perhaps the test here is not just for you but for those you come into contact with, who are suppose to be learning something from the experience as well. that is very curious.

i know when i came out of the coma caused by the encephalitis, it was my sister who woke me up from the coma (hubby told her if she came and talked to me, that god had told him that i would hear her voice and wake up, and that's exactly what happened). in retrospect, the entire event may have been almost entirely for her benefit, as she deals with thousands of women every year, and she can take that experience and the knowledge she gained from it, and use it to help others. perhaps there's a family member that has a lesson to learn from your experience? i know that's a long shot, but couldn't hurt to explore it.

Originally posted by undo
we have literally no idea what this guy is going through, whacking him over the head with scripture when he clearly already knows the scripture, is going to do what, precisely?

im not whacking him over the head with a scripture. nor am i blaming him for anything.

hes blaming the wrong person.

its like he's struggling with an invisible enemy but he's throwing his punches to the air. its frustrating to him and it obviously made some scars.

but the bible tells him who his enemies are. it tells him how to cope with life's problems and it tells him whats going to happen in the future.

its called hope. hope helps us deal with many things. it helps me get up in the morning. it helps me to smile. it helps me be uplifting to others instead of being a burden. thats important considering that i rely on many.

without hope, life is pointless. god knows this and thats why he gives us a hope.

what is 80 years of pain compared to an eternity of happiness? its the prick of a needle, thats what it is.

why else would god send 2 christians to his door to tell him exactly that?

reply to post by miriam0566


ah but the secret message here is, he was already a christian...albeit a suffering christian, still a christian, unless i misunderstood? i acknowledge that the scripture can be uplifting, but not when it's being used to blame someone who is suffering for their suffering. believe you me, if you've suffered alot, you already are seriously aware of the dynamics of faith and the consequences of action.

Originally posted by wylekat
So- what's the point of praying? If it's all NO, unless you meet the stringent, narrow guidelines, and prayers to save someone's life, or to be married to someone (and have it turn into a 20 year backfire with NO respite) are completely ignored- WHY BOTHER?

its not all no. its yes, just later.

i have HIV. god is not going to cure me now. likely i will die. but...

god promises me i will live. in the future. i wont be sick. ill be happy.

isnt that answering my prayers?

I cant say I was in a life or death situation- but my mental and emotional health has been beaten down my entire LIFE-

your mental and emotional health will be helped if you focus on something bigger than yourself. even mental health professionals will attest to that.

if you focused on learning who god really is (not what your church tells you) and focused on helping others, you wont have time to worry about your pain.

jesus commanded us to preach. that is a very intense and time consuming work. let god worry about your problems and let him fix them (later if need be)

if you are honest hearted, god will bless you

reply to post by miriam0566

i have HIV.

Come quickly Lord Jesus! I say let's get this show on the road! Suffering needs to end! I like the whole glorified body dealio.

God sent them to my door so I could show them how inherently flawed their religion is, methinks. I already said- anything they had, I had a counterargument, based on what I had seen, felt, and experienced. I have a pretty good library of how 'Christianity (and obviously, by default, how Jehovahs Witnesses work)' seems to work. I am pretty well versed in abuse- and I simply am not going to be lied to by anyone in a tie holding a holy book. I caught them in so many 'religious' lies- what they were taught to say, not what they themselves thought- and called them on it, They got worn down after 15 minutes. My fave from the whole thing was "God will fix EVERYTHING on Earth". I looked the guy straight in the eye, and said "so, I'll be able to get the dream job I want, and be married to the woman I love"- And I hear "well, except that". EVERYTHING, huh.... I have been fed too many of these empty, baseless promises wholeheartedly. Now, when I hear 'Everything", "anything", or "all" It had better mean Everything, Anything, and All, or it's a lie and a complete waste of time. I am convinced 100% that anything that comes out of a Christians' mouth is a lie, a mistruth, or a statement of ignorance, just from the lies, mistruths and ignorant statements I have been fed, when I jolly well know what I have been thru, and while not the mechanics of how stuff went belly up, suffice to say I watched it go belly up, and none of the reasons why made any logical sense. I feel exactly like Wile E. Coyote- ANYTHING he did to catch the roadrunner failed spectacularly (well, it was a cartoon)- And anything I try to do to better my life- exact. Same. Results. It's to the point I actually can relate to the poor coyote! There was once a 2 month period I seriously considered changing my name to Wile. E. Coyote.

When I get told stuff that simply doesn't match up to what I've seen, I get pretty darned suspicious.

[edit on 10-9-2009 by wylekat]

reply to post by wylekat


i don't think i'm lying to you. i mean, i suppose i could be subconsciously, but i'ma doubtin' it. you already know my stance on the bible. it's nigh on impossible to take a philosophical and faith driven book and apply it like a concrete science text, to life's intermittent high strangeness. i'm still curious as well, as to why your example nearly screams supernatural realm but yet is the one place you've concluded can't be the source of the strangeness.

Originally posted by wylekat
When I get told stuff that simply doesn't match up to what I've seen, I get pretty darned suspicious.

You sure you aren't being "gangstalked"????

You might want to do a scan of your house, phone, car, etc...

Did you write or say something that put you on a "special" govt. list?

reply to post by miriam0566

jesus commanded us to preach.

See- the massive problem with that statement is preaching it RIGHT- and I don't think 2 people in the entire stretch of the entire religion knows what the hell they are talking about. I'm going to paraphrase liberally, but Jesus said we could do amazing, incredible things thru him and the holy spirit- and all, ALL I have seen is rhetoric, and side show carnival type 'miracles'- most of which are done by those- for lack of a better term, as close to blasphemous as I am betting you can get tv and over the top rich preaching types. There should be people who can cure anything, raise the dead, and, I'll say it, turn water into wine, feed 10,000 people on $5 of groceries...

And there aint nada. All we get are people who do somersaults, speak gibberish and try to pass it off as speaking in tongues, and little else. Or my fave "God told me to tell you..." and what God told this person was complete and utter smelly garbage. Been there, heard that. Scraped garbage off myself for months. I can also tell you what's a billion times worse- when you think you may have actually experienced a miracle, and Christians poo poo it, and tell you you're a lunatic for thinking (insert whatever it may be here) was a miracle!

Feel free to call me one of the bunch that 'expect miracles'. I DO expect them, especially after I have had nothing but smoke pumped up my rear for years, and have seen nothing but lame, pale stunts, and never a true miracle.

I'll be blunt, and I don't do this to hurt your feelings- but by all rights, there should BE a true believer (or believers) who SHOULD be able to cure your HIV. Here's the logic in a Nutshell: If Jesus could do it, and says Christians who follow him can do it, then someone SHOULD be able to do it- not offer you weak words and little else.

To be perfectly honest- If you aren't already married- a sign of a true believer is someone who CAN fall in love with you, and honestly, not worry about their own skin all that much- and treat you just like there's not a thing wrong with you. Not these PC twits strutting around going 'icky icky poo' either behind your back, or right to your face... Or those ones who tell you 'this is because God is punishing/ testing you.' I'll point something out: Those are the same ones who I am sure offer the weak words and little else- or a good % of them do...

[edit on 10-9-2009 by wylekat]

undo: i was miraculously woken up from a coma.

wyle: no christians ever have true miracles. and they tell me that my miracles aren't true, anyway, so bleh!

undo:



you sure you haven't considered the possibility that this against all odds stuff is a supernatural attack?



[edit on 10-9-2009 by undo]

reply to post by wylekat

I am with you here wylekat. I have had a similar experience of life. Every single thing that I ever truly wanted, believed would happen with all of my heart, let go of any presupposed way of it happening etc..
THE EXACT OPPOSITE has in fact happened often with extreme nastiness attached, and with no reason. And no, I did not ask for it. I did nothing to deserve it. I was not thinking negatively but believing it would happen.
Every single time about every single major thing it has been the opposite of what was asked for, for my entire life. I have no idea what this means, if it is a test. But it stinks. And it just seems like life is random luck, random chance, random events. What it doesn't explain though is why the most evil, most undeserving, unspiritual, selfish and greedy seem to get everything they want.
I do not understand any of it....and it is just very tiring.
But the phrases that make me apoplectic are 'life is what you make it'...'we have freewill'...'we have choices'. A choice implies that there are various reasonable options that one chooses between and then takes responsibility for. It does not imply that you have two options - accept the perpetual pain, disappointment and knocks or go under.

reply to post by KOGDOG


Since I was born??? I'd say to get real- but to be honest.... I've had enough weird crap to wonder. I don't think it's a 'tracking device' per se... But something's been well fishy in how I get handled- my quest with Burger King being a prime example: I tried to apply for a job. No applications, they said. I managed an application. The person who's been behind the counter knows me only BY SIGHT. He then kept making up these weird excuses (the manager who looks at the apps is on vacation, the manager has to work in another city for a week). Oddly enough, the 'help wanted' sign came down during this manager's vacation... I called the other place this joker was working at the right times, and he/ she was pretty much 'not there'.

I've had things denied me, I've had people seem to take an almost evil, remorseless glee in trying to run me off the road, I've had people literally walk up when I am doing business in line at a store and plop things on the counter in front of me (and I am not slow, I do my store business just as fast as anyone else), I've had women look at me like I was a chainsaw wielding maniac, I've had people... well, for lack of a better term- stare at me like I was a naked alien walking down the street pulling a 3 foot booger out of my nose. Last night- I found a burned patch in the yard. 3-4 inches in diameter, with what looks like melted plastic (and smelled like it, too) in the burned spot. Why? There's no reason, I don't know anyone here, and I want to keep to myself. I have had people look me in the eye- and the only way I can describe what happens next, they look away like I was going to yank their souls out or something drastic. I see fear in more faces when I see someone staring at me...

And it isn't everyone, just a certain amount of people. Like maybe one out of 10- 20 will stare at me and act like this. For the longest time, I put it down as people who had a mental condition. There's nothing outstanding about me- I am bent a bit because my back's going bye bye, and I try to walk straight (I used to have good posture. Now.... *sigh*)

On the other hand, There's been people who have LITERALLY trusted me with items so valuable, I could have run off and been comfortable for some time. I have had people who have trusted me with personal secrets that if I wanted to, I could have been well seated in blackmail for life. Secrets are still safe, all valuables were returned when the person requested them.

And the women.... I have literally frightened more than one woman, just by being pleasant. One's become the subject of a running joke- mostly because SHE was the one doing the running (from me). I'd say hello, be nice, and she was GONE- like an Olympic sprinter. Now, I just turn my back and pretend she doesnt exist. What really throws me is I told more than one person what was going on, and this sorry *blankety blank* female denies it ever happened. I had one go into a full blown panic attack when I went for take out once. All I wanted was food. FOOD! I walk into the take out place, didn't know this yahoo from Adam (or in this case, Eve), and she , screams, and then DIVES THRU THE KITCHEN DOORS- leaving me standing there, mouth open, still pointing at what I wanted on the menu, leaving her co worker to stare and mumble out an excuse. Meanwhile, these 2 beady eyes are staring at me from the kitchen.... I never went back there.

I've been to the doctor for many things, and not a one has come back and told me I am an ET, or an inter dimensional entity, Or a demon, or an angel, or....

Just a plain ol' vanilla human. So... What gives....

reply to post by oneclickaway


Exactly. I did a little experiment in random chance a while back. I bought 2 weeks worth of Cash 5 lotto tickets. I used the same numbers for all 14 rounds. I won- $1. I didn't even break even. I even did a search of the specific #s online in the past results- I couldn't even find 2 that matched even remotely. This told me the odds were getting muddied- but I didn't have a clue how... Still don't.

Fast forward to one week later: I was talking to someone who's uncle has 'connections' in the lotto racket who wins BIG, and quite regularly. I smelled a big, nasty rat, but I STILL cannot explain the way the numbers were done like they were.

It stinks when someone's always got their hand in the till- and the random chances of anything good are dropped to 0.

reply to post by undo

you sure you haven't considered the possibility that this against all odds stuff is a supernatural attack?

I'll be honest- I am confused. Not at your statement, but with everything's that HAS happened. I haven't a clue if this has been an attack to KEEP me from a normal, at least mediocrely happy life, Or if I was yanked down this path to keep me protected- because like I said, I cant get 2 straight answers from 10 Christians even if I shot them full of truth serum.

As for supernatural... I was told Satan only has whatever power God and us give him. Satan, in this case, *looks* like he's been given well more power than he's been 'allowed'. I say this and I am 100% sure- NONE of what I went thru was supposed to have taken place. None of it. It's like the entire universe and God lost the plot where I'm concerned. God/ the universe/ Satan(?!) act like I am actually married to my ex g/f. Keep in mind one thing- Sex or lustful thoughts NEVER entered my mind concerning her. If my thoughts were any more pure concerning her, my brain woulda exploded. The day I found out she was married, (and every time I tell this, I feel like *I* lost the plot) I 'heard'... experienced? Not sure how to describe what happened.... I heard the most incredible, inhuman, indescribable SCREAM come out of me- NOT my mouth- out of ME- My mouth was closed... It was an unbelievable, loud, clear as a bell sound. I heard it, but the person i was talking to, I don't think they did. To this day, I am not able to figure out what it was. My soul? My heart? My mind? God? Satan? The sound of the universe where I was concerned dying? My existence in a certain way? It did sound like something was being butchered... And when I tell about this, NO ONE can tell me what it could have been for sure- but the *look* on their faces.... I cant tell if it's fear of being presented with something unearthly and off the page, or the fact they think I am insane and delusional, or what. No one is sure who screamed, or why. No one has any idea what happened to me, if I had some sort of attack, I was attacked, or what.

The rest of it... the not being able to keep a relationship, and the undeniable, unignorable, blasted and accursed fact she's a part of my life whether I want her to be or not- speaks volumes- I just wish I knew which set of freaking books! I'd almost kill for a solid, clear, real and true answer- and I'll even accept 'Yer Nutz' if it can be proven beyond a shadow of a doubt. I swear, it's like a litmus test for Christians- I mention this whole mess, and it's like watching ants scramble away from a magnifying glass on a sunny day! You get fear, confusion, and people thinking you need pills. LOTS of pills. And yes, I tried LOTS of pills. Know what? It didn't help. Therapy, didn't help. This stuff burns thru the drug fog like a red hot knife thru melted butter.

So, now you know the complete and sordid tale. Supernatural don't even begin to cut it. This is on the realm of the super- supernatural. It's like Superman taking on Steve Urkel while he's still in the womb. Beyond freaking overkill.


And yes, obviously, it's ruined my life beyond repair.

[edit on 10-9-2009 by wylekat]

Originally posted by wylekat
reply to post by KOGDOG

 

Since I was born??? I'd say to get real- but to be honest.... I've had enough weird crap to wonder. I don't think it's a 'tracking device' per se... (WRONG!)But something's been well fishy in how I get handled- my quest with Burger King being a prime example: I tried to apply for a job. No applications, they said. I managed an application. The person who's been behind the counter knows me only BY SIGHT. He then kept making up these weird excuses (the manager who looks at the apps is on vacation, the manager has to work in another city for a week). Oddly enough, the 'help wanted' sign came down during this manager's vacation... I called the other place this joker was working at the right times, and he/ she was pretty much 'not there'. (YES! EXACTLY HOW GANGSTALKING GOES)

I've had things denied me, I've had people seem to take an almost evil, remorseless glee in trying to run me off the road, I've had people literally walk up when I am doing business in line at a store and plop things on the counter in front of me (and I am not slow, I do my store business just as fast as anyone else), I've had women look at me like I was a chainsaw wielding maniac, I've had people... well, for lack of a better term- stare at me like I was a naked alien walking down the street pulling a 3 foot booger out of my nose. Last night- I found a burned patch in the yard. 3-4 inches in diameter, with what looks like melted plastic (and smelled like it, too) in the burned spot. Why? There's no reason, I don't know anyone here, and I want to keep to myself. I have had people look me in the eye- and the only way I can describe what happens next, they look away like I was going to yank their souls out or something drastic. I see fear in more faces when I see someone staring at me... (THEY ARE ON TO YOU)

And it isn't everyone, just a certain amount of people. Like maybe one out of 10- 20 will stare at me and act like this. For the longest time, I put it down as people who had a mental condition. There's nothing outstanding about me- I am bent a bit because my back's going bye bye, and I try to walk straight (I used to have good posture. Now.... *sigh*) (CLASSIC GANGSTALKING)

On the other hand, There's been people who have LITERALLY trusted me with items so valuable, I could have run off and been comfortable for some time. I have had people who have trusted me with personal secrets that if I wanted to, I could have been well seated in blackmail for life. Secrets are still safe, all valuables were returned when the person requested them. (THE COS WOULD HAVE DONE THE OPPOSITE.... YOU SURE YOU ARE'NT FROM BIRTH A COG IN THE KOG???)

And the women.... I have literally frightened more than one woman, just by being pleasant. One's become the subject of a running joke- mostly because SHE was the one doing the running (from me). I'd say hello, be nice, and she was GONE- like an Olympic sprinter. Now, I just turn my back and pretend she doesnt exist. What really throws me is I told more than one person what was going on, and this sorry *blankety blank* female denies it ever happened. I had one go into a full blown panic attack when I went for take out once. All I wanted was food. FOOD! I walk into the take out place, didn't know this yahoo from Adam (or in this case, Eve), and she , screams, and then DIVES THRU THE KITCHEN DOORS- leaving me standing there, mouth open, still pointing at what I wanted on the menu, leaving her co worker to stare and mumble out an excuse. Meanwhile, these 2 beady eyes are staring at me from the kitchen.... I never went back there. (DUDE... WAKE UP!)

I've been to the doctor for many things, and not a one has come back and told me I am an ET, or an inter dimensional entity, Or a demon, or an angel, or.... (DR.'S WON'T HELP YOU)

Just a plain ol' vanilla human. So... What gives.... (WAKE UP!)

OK... I understand... now.

You are being "gangstalked".

You are not paying attention to the "ultra weirdness" embedded within the OT/NT.

Things are not what they seem to be.

The people who react to you in hostile or strange ways... would you ever act that way toward another "human being"???

This is ATS... I think I wrote that in an earlier post. :-) Weirdness is acceptable... even appreciated here.

Your house is bugged... as is your phone... car... etc.

This is the "End Times". Yahshua says that the last three and half years of the Tribulation will be the worst tribulation and time of trouble that the world has ever seen. He said that had these days not been shortened that no flesh would be saved.

The reason...
Weird science has given these "watchers" the ability to finally be like "god". They can track and watch Yahweh's children from birth.

You are being "gangstalked".

You need to determine who and what you are.

The way to do this is to know thyself... are you like "them"?

Would and could you ever do what the "children of Satan/COS" do?

Are you a "liar, tempter, and murderer"??

If not... wake up. You need protection. NOW!

reply to post by KOGDOG

Your house is bugged... as is your phone... car... etc.

So... how does one find these devices... and bugging the car? All they'd get would be engine noise- the thing sounds like an airplane. Not to mention- 99% of the time, I am alone in the car. Altho... this does explain a couple recent attempts to disable my car- someone took the air out of my tire. Too bad I still got in and drove off, only noting it pulled a bit to the right. Before that, some kid walked RIGHT up to my car, and was going to do something to it. With me standing right there. if he had touched my car... I'd have touched him. In a bad, pugilistic way....

Weird science has given these "watchers" the ability to finally be like "god". They can track and watch Yahweh's children from birth. You are being "gangstalked".

WHY ME??? I have nothing of any value to anyone! Even my brain's gone rotten! I have talent, yes- but why suppress it?! If this is all true- what kind of lunatics are they?!

The way to do this is to know thyself... are you like "them"? Would and could you ever do what the "children of Satan/COS" do? Are you a "liar, tempter, and murderer"??

No... but recently, murder HAS crossed my mind- The last desperate act of someone so fed up, mangling any one of the people responsible would actually cheer me up... When I can be pushed like that... Me, someone who wouldn't kill his own chickens unless he's going to die of starvation, and even then....

If not... wake up. You need protection. NOW!

I thought GOD was my protection. Did he lose the plot, or did I?