Pentagon 5 Frame Anomaly Solved?, maybe.

A longer video worth to analyze...without date and time

[edit on 3-9-2009 by JFletcher]

Originally posted by VitriolAndAngst
As I've said before, more than hundreds of people see a magician saw a lady in half at a magic show.

Wow, what a horrible analogy. Matter of fact, if there was an award for "Most Horrible Analogy" in this forum, I would vote for you getting first place.

A magician controls his illusions by forcing and maintaining the perspective of his audience. This is impossible to do in an urban environment with the general population as there are people at all directions and angles, even including the inside of the Pentagon.

Even if you were watching this event "straight on" you would have noticed the plane pulling up to clear the Pentagon, or clearly never being low enough to impact if this "flyover" nonsense were true. No one who witnessed this event even from that angle reports anything other than the plane hitting the building. Period.

Boger alone destroys any and all theories of a "magic trick" since he was one the complete opposite viewing angle from most other witnesses (watching it come to him), and still reports watching it crash into the building. Sorry, his perspective could not be fooled by this "Hollywood flash bang" nonsense.

Yet, CIT uses him as a witness! Hilarious. Ask yourself why, if you really believe in a magic trick, then how is that possible?

The only magic trick being pulled is this silly theory concocted by CIT, and it's fooling many people on this forum who blindly believe in a conspiracy so bad they'll go along with anything, even if it doesn't make any logical sense.

Think long and hard about that.

Originally posted by Classified Info

Originally posted by VitriolAndAngst

As I've said before, more than hundreds of people see a magician saw a lady in half at a magic show.

True, but everybody know that it is fake, no human being can survive being cut in half. Smoke and mirrors. I truly hope that you are not going to imply that the two airliners that slammed into the WTC's was smoke and mirrors. Real people suffered and did indeed die.

But then again maybe you hold to the no plane theory, if you do, seek psychiatric help, immediately.

Face it! Hundreds of people witnessed the event.

Seems straight forward to me.

This is only more proof that you are in dire need of medical attention.

By the way; Now that Obama is in charge do you feel the war has somehow become a just war? Is it no longer a war for oil? What happened to the Police State?

it amazes me how silent the Radical Left has become about our "unjust" war overseas.

Your hypocrisy has been noted.

[edit on 9/3/2009 by Classified Info]

Dude, until 2001, nobody believed that a Kerosene (jet fuel) could cause a steel structure to collapse. A few experts in suits and suddenly, the physics changes such that a building pancake collapses AND pulls down the core that it's supposed to be breaking off from to fall in the first place.

It would be easier for me to believe you could stitch a lady who was cut in two back together.

The first sign you are entering into a logical trap is the phrase; "everybody knows." Everybody collectively, is led by the nose and crowds are dangerous and stupid. Only an individual can show intelligence. Now, small, teams can come up with good problem solving as long as the task is specific and there is feedback to prevent "group think."

But the Media takes advantage of group think. A pinch of ridicule, a few suites who chuckle, a few silly fools who are easily exposed. Fire a few experts and reporters who don't stay in the lines and send the message. Deride the nay-sayers as traitors (which, when the questions came -- was very common). I'm sure a few people could write a book about "how to manipulate crowds, and get away with murder."

I can meditate, but I can't be hypnotized as much as I've tried. I can try really hard to have "faith" but it does nothing to change me, nor can I get the "feeling of the divine" and that special high. I don't believe in many things that I can't explain and most of my beliefs are based on suppositions that can be proven and disproved. I'm always willing to adopt a new idea given better evidence. Having said that, more and more I trust that I have a sense of TRUTH.

The first time I saw the buildings collapse, my very first thought was; Bush and the Mossad. I strayed from that idea for a long while. Tried the "al Qaeda" thing, which is hard to even know if it exists outside of the CIA and it's ops. But I history and evidence seems to keep returning to that first theory.

Personally, I can't enjoy magic tricks all that much, because I usually figured them out -- of course, that makes Penn and Teller more fun because they give you the secrets and one-up the trick.

So I'm not the person, who is addicted to conspiracy theories. It's just the mounting evidence, and that the sources that try and tell me "trust us, we are experts" is constantly lying. How many times does the Government have to lie to you for you to say; "Maybe I should just assume that they aren't telling the truth until it's proven otherwise." Funny how the same people who don't trust government to run health care, trust people who deal death and lie for a living (Military and CIA).



Face it! Hundreds of people witnessed the event.

No. Hundreds of people were around -- they didn't all witness it. Witnessing something, is actively watching it happen. Just seeing a plane streak over your head and then an explosion is being in the audience during the magic act -- you aren't prepared to SEE the trick. There were a lot more conflicting stories just after the event. And they were silenced, or changed their stories. Don't tell me I don't remember hearing what I heard, or that you can make that one statement out of context.

There is no huge list of witnesses, there are perhaps a couple dozen in the chorus with the government theory and there are just as many people who describe a different flight path and talk about another, white plane, that followed above.

Originally posted by Soloist

Originally posted by VitriolAndAngst
As I've said before, more than hundreds of people see a magician saw a lady in half at a magic show.

Wow, what a horrible analogy. Matter of fact, if there was an award for "Most Horrible Analogy" in this forum, I would vote for you getting first place.

A magician controls his illusions by forcing and maintaining the perspective of his audience....


... Yet, CIT uses him as a witness! Hilarious. Ask yourself why, if you really believe in a magic trick, then how is that possible?

The only magic trick being pulled is this silly theory concocted by CIT, and it's fooling many people on this forum who blindly believe in a conspiracy so bad they'll go along with anything, even if it doesn't make any logical sense.

Think long and hard about that.

>> I haven't watched the video. I'm not very interested in following the Pentagon story until they release video tapes to actually have something to make an informed comment.

So I base nothing on the CIT -- and I don't stand by a plane fly-over theory. -- there isn't enough evidence.

There is ZERO evidence for me, that I would go to court with. The clean-up of the alleged plane strike, was under cover and the crime scene tainted.

With a 5 second accident, eye-witnesses have a horrible track record. I'm sure anyone in the courts could tell you that. Hundreds of people can be convinced they saw something and be wrong.

>> It is sufficient to me to say; "The WTC was destroyed by a controlled implosion. We have to look at those with the motive, means, and methods to pull it off. Larry Silverstein had obvious fore-knowledge and would be a prime suspect in any normal insurance fraud case. The Bush family, had evidence destroyed in building 7 that would have resulted in a multi-billion dollar fraud charge. Dick Cheney, the head of security for the FAA, the head of NORAD, and quite a few others associated with the PNAC group, exhibited strange actions, behaviors, and roles on that day that make them suspects, and at least, people who destroyed evidence.

I don't need to prove these jerk-offs guilty -- THEY need to prove themselves innocent.

Dick Cheney has a long track record of war profiteering and making money by helping rich people offshore their bank accounts. He's just one of many, with an illustrious history that would make them candidates for any Mob employee.

Many of these people are war criminals, supported torture, and death squads that go against our Constitution.

Tell me when people in the Bush administration told the truth, or did something that was altruistic.

The onus is on me to figure out what happened at the Pentagon? The reason there are so many conspiracy theories is because there is so much obstruction of justice.

"Everybody knows that a single assassin killed JFK at Deeley Plaza." Well, everybody doesn't seem to know that the Government concluded that it was a conspiracy. How did the single shooter steal JFK's brain? There was a coverup, and that's why there were so many theories -- because the truth was never told.


Why don't I believe the 9/11 Government myth? Tell me when these people told the truth and I might have an answer.

reply to post by JFletcher


In this video -- now I do notice the "contrail" that "Donny 4 million" was talking about.

It doesn't look like dust stirred up and it isn't from an airplane unless it was trailing smoke.

Seems like more evidence for the "not a plane" theory. Planes make contrails because the compressed moist air is pushed out and expanding into less dense cold air -- which isn't present at most ground-level altitudes as Donny points out.

I don't have any way to verify the other details Donny claims, but his point about contrails seems very consistent with reality to me. Would their likely be a fire on the plane to make this trail of smoke? Looks like propellant to me.

The craft looks small and stubby winged -- between a lear jet and a DC 9 in size -- just going by the size of the car in the foreground and perspective -- simple geometry to watch the fading perspective lines -- I've done no scientific measurement but I deal in art, 3D and video all the time. I've got a pretty trained eye. And to me, it doesn't look like a large commercial aircraft.

It also fairly looks like something with rocket propulsion.

Stop for a second and don't look at it for what you are told you are seeing.

Originally posted by Classified Info
...

Seems straight forward to me.

This is only more proof that you are in dire need of medical attention.

By the way; Now that Obama is in charge do you feel the war has somehow become a just war? Is it no longer a war for oil? What happened to the Police State?

it amazes me how silent the Radical Left has become about our "unjust" war overseas.

Your hypocrisy has been noted.

[edit on 9/3/2009 by Classified Info]

>> Where to begin?

>> I'm not sure about a No-Plane theory. There is no evidence to prove that either way. The video released, however, seems to NOT indicate a large commercial airplane, and the vapor trail looks like a propellant -- according to my arm-chair untrained eye.

>> Thanks for the Straw man argument about what liberals think about Obama and the war. Have you actually talked to a Liberal? I guess since the Media is Liberal, it must be telling you what we think, right? All the Liberals I know are pissed at Obama for not going after war crimes and getting us out of Iraq and Afghanistan as fast as possible -- which would be three tanks of gas and the speed of a convoy.

Your hypocrisy has been noted.
Oh, I guess I own it now, huh? See if you can squeeze me in the Book of Hypocrites after all the "American Security" crowd that let Reagan offshore all the jobs and borrow to boost his economy with tax breaks for the wealthy. The "freed" Afghanistan from the commies, and forgot to

When you got people sniffing shoes, while you sell your weapons manufacturing to Dubai -- you really don't have a security policy -- we have a PRETENSE and FLEECE the public policy in effect.

it amazes me how silent the Radical Left has become about our "unjust" war overseas.
>> Radical Left? Is that anyone NOT in favor of torture and tax breaks for Donald Trump now? How many people are running as Communists and how many actual Liberals have been promoting the idea of a farming commune (we like to keep that on the down-low, we collectivists).

Nobody on the left is promoting that Government run business or that business run government. WE want the people to run the Government, and protect us from abuse and help us all provide for the common good. Obviously, if you think that is the Radical Left than the Constitution must be the communist manifesto. We are silent, because BUSINESS owns the air waves. We are holding our breathe because the economy can fail --- which will mean withdrawing from Iraq and Afghanistan won't be an option -- we won't be able to afford it.

Originally posted by Classified Info
What is amazing is that nutjobs like you continue to ignore the hundreds of witnesses that saw the passenger airliner crash into the pentagon.

Lets have some names and who cross examined them.
You do know that trash mouth meatwads are a dime a dozen.
Cutie pies are amazed by that when they discuss 911 with total negativity.
Fifty out of the hundreds cross examined that you mention will do!
thanks classipied

Originally posted by Donny 4 million

Originally posted by Classified Info
What is amazing is that nutjobs like you continue to ignore the hundreds of witnesses that saw the passenger airliner crash into the pentagon.

Lets have some names and who cross examined them.

You 9/11 Deniers never do a stitch of work. How could you possibly NOT know all of this. Have you been asleep for 8 years?

You do know that trash mouth meatwads are a dime a dozen.

You need to apologize to all of us for that foul statement. Or should I let those eyewitnesses know what you think of them?

Originally posted by jthomas

Originally posted by Donny 4 million

Originally posted by Classified Info
What is amazing is that nutjobs like you continue to ignore the hundreds of witnesses that saw the passenger airliner crash into the pentagon.

Lets have some names and who cross examined them.

You 9/11 Deniers never do a stitch of work. How could you possibly NOT know all of this. Have you been asleep for 8 years?

You do know that trash mouth meatwads are a dime a dozen.

You need to apologize to all of us for that foul statement. Or should I let those eyewitnesses know what you think of them?

Who? What? You are sayin the shoe fits?
So you have the fifty out of a hundred names that have been cross examined ?
Is this a ploy to get your bbuddy classipied off the hook?
Why don't you back up your witness crap with 2 names that have been cross examined in a court of law. If you cannot do that you cannot even use the word witness here on ATS to spooge the members.

By Kevin L. Leahy, Esq.7

This article addresses an alternative reaction,
that is, to challenge the reliability of the testimony
proffered. The occasional “Could
you be mistaken?” aside, most eyewitness
cross-examinations are mired in credibility
squabbles that try to hold the witness to a
series of true or false propositions. The
examiner banks on witness contradictions.
With such focused attention on credibility, it
is no surprise that the reliability of the testimony
often escapes heightened scrutiny.JAb

reply to post by Donny 4 million


Donny, Donny, Donny, we have 503 First Responders reporting explosions, eye witness accounts mean nothing (obviously).... Oh Wait.

Did I mention only if they regard the OS.

See the way it works?, to them it is absolute gospel, to us however... expect..

`Where`s your proof?`.

/facepalm.

Originally posted by VitriolAndAngst
And to me, it doesn't look like a large commercial aircraft.

It also fairly looks like something with rocket propulsion.

Stop for a second and don't look at it for what you are told you are seeing.

It does not look like a commercial airliner, also my opinion.

But, what I wanted to point out with this vid is the relevance of the missing 'frames" of the OP. Hope it worked.

I just wanted to add going from flying a cesna to flying a 757, I would think is like going from riding your pedal bike around town, to riding a speed bike in a race with no experience. so being able to control the plane all the way into impact of the building is hilarious to me, not to mention all the eyewitness reports the showed it was flying alot slower then official reports.

Originally posted by phiktion
I just wanted to add going from flying a cesna to flying a 757, I would think is like going from riding your pedal bike around town, to riding a speed bike in a race with no experience. so being able to control the plane all the way into impact of the building is hilarious to me, not to mention all the eyewitness reports the showed it was flying alot slower then official reports.

Don`t forget Nintendo Gameboy flight simulators and the Arabic `How to pilot 757/767/737`s for dummies (Martyrdom limited edited version). .

Originally posted by Seventh

Originally posted by phiktion
I just wanted to add going from flying a cesna to flying a 757, I would think is like going from riding your pedal bike around town, to riding a speed bike in a race with no experience. so being able to control the plane all the way into impact of the building is hilarious to me, not to mention all the eyewitness reports the showed it was flying alot slower then official reports.

Don`t forget Nintendo Gameboy flight simulators and the Arabic `How to pilot 757/767/737`s for dummies (Martyrdom limited edited version).

.

Don't forget, you still haven't refuted the massive evidence that AA77, a Boeing 757, hit the Pentagon.

Since there is a long weekend and the gov. shills are probably soaking there fingers in a piece of humble pie. I would like to thank all that have been working so hard bringing the unknown 911 information to light.
It's a hard fight when the cards are stacked against the facts in these tragedies. Alas I see a solid increase in those fighters.
Enjoy the weekend and watch your back.

reply to post by jthomas


Just about to do that got around 560 brand new photos and over a 1000 pages of written calculations to sort through, in the mean time go look at my latest thread, you guys have been avoiding my WTC2 explosion threads like the plague.

Brace yourself the ride has begun.

Originally posted by jthomas
Don't forget, you still haven't refuted the massive evidence that AA77, a Boeing 757, hit the Pentagon.

What is their to refute?

No photos that look like a plane crash.

No videos of the plane crash.

Contradicting eye witness accounts...

Originally posted by Jezus

No videos of the plane crash.

Hmm....

There's a blurry video of something hitting the Pentagon:

*MORE IMAGES LIKE THESE FOUND IN MY OLD POLICE PHOTO ENHANCEMENT SOFTWARE THREAD*

SMOKETRAIL:


NOTE: That odd frame rate deal in my image set is how Sony Vegas presented it. I'm trying to remember, but it was something like 4 frames would have incremental changes, and then about 10 of no changes. I left out the scrap. Some images I didnt bother adding it.

PLANE?:




[edit on 6-9-2009 by IgnoranceIsntBlisss]

[edit on 6-9-2009 by IgnoranceIsntBlisss]

reply to post by IgnoranceIsntBlisss


I think the part you just explained is around 1.5 seconds of that whatever it is, sitting there doing nothing, rumour has it at that stage Hani Hanjour had to go to the toilet so he parked it up, in the very 1st release of that video the Pentagon got so bored of waiting it blew itself up whilst that whatever was still in the same place

Originally posted by jthomas

Originally posted by Seventh

Originally posted by phiktion
I just wanted to add going from flying a cesna to flying a 757, I would think is like going from riding your pedal bike around town, to riding a speed bike in a race with no experience. so being able to control the plane all the way into impact of the building is hilarious to me, not to mention all the eyewitness reports the showed it was flying alot slower then official reports.

Don`t forget Nintendo Gameboy flight simulators and the Arabic `How to pilot 757/767/737`s for dummies (Martyrdom limited edited version).

.

Don't forget, you still haven't refuted the massive evidence that AA77, a Boeing 757, hit the Pentagon.

Have you posted one testimony of evidence that has been cross examined in a court of law? I ain't seen none!
I saw a guy, I thought was you ,run accross the hyway with toilet paper on his heel though.
Or is that just an example of hear say?

[edit on 8-9-2009 by Donny 4 million]