Thirteen Goals of a Witch

Originally posted by A Fortiori
reply to post by cautiouslypessimistic

 

Christian apologist? How is pointing out that humans have historically committed brutality and used various ideologies to justify it apologizing for a religion?

It is far too easy to write off our bad deeds, our ability within to become aggressive and evil on a religion, a book, a rock band, etc.

People kill people, guns don't kill people.
People kill people, not socialism.
People kill people, not Christianity.
People kill people, not nationalism.

People do bad things and justify it using whatever tool they have in front of them be it the Bible or violent video games.

Moreover, name a culture that didn't brutalize a weaker culture? You can't. Every nation in the world has it's closet filled to the brim with skeletons of minorities and fringe societies terminated for their gain.

People are abysmal creatures.

You are still, at this point, missing the point.

The OP spoke of the "heathanization" of "witches". I responded with facts. That people kill people all throughout history has nothing to do with it.

I never said christians were the only ones that have ever killed. But it is HISTORICAL FACT that christians were highly responsible for the heathinization and erradications of pagans, especially those that practiced witchcraft.

reply to post by cautiouslypessimistic


It was not directed at you specifically. Sorry if it came off that way. You were merely responding to others. It was the general direction that the thread was heading in that I was attempting to address.

[edit on 1-9-2009 by JaxonRoberts]

reply to post by Hazelnut


I'm sure that the order depends on the person. But I was curious whether it said it should be in a specific order or not.

Me? I think these things tend to come naturally and that lists like these need to be adjusted based on the individual.

reply to post by Hazelnut


Hi Hazelnut,

I'm liking the list. I don't have a religion as such, but I fall kinda into paganism... almost the list. I believe the creator, or creation is all around, and in us. We must take care of Ourselves, and Nature to lead, and live balanced lives.

Thanks for sharing,

S&F

Reply to post by cautiouslypessimistic

It's obvious you don't think you said anything false and that's the pity. But you used the broad brushed comment "Christians kill." which is a obviously false generalization. Rather like calling all white people slave owners like another pointed out.


Posted Via ATS Mobile: m.abovetopsecret.com

reply to post by Hazelnut


Is anyone else having trouble with number 5?

Achieving balance? I'm really having a hard time with that one these days. It seems the more I try to be balanced in all things, the less able I am to do it. Why is it so difficult to achieve a sense of emotional, physical, mental and spiritual balance?

reply to post by Hazelnut


Because of chaos theory. Things fall apart and become disordered. It happens.

Originally posted by randyvs
well,this is disappointing. i expected to see my name on the list.

seriuosly though, do you ever worry if there is a God, who may not want
you to be involved in things he forbids. things besides those you have listed, you know what i mean ? like if you put me on the list, then your list
would be of fourteen, instead of that unlucky thirteen. i joke,but you know what i mean right? do you ever have doughts? very curious.snf


[edit on 1-9-2009 by randyvs]

Where in any religious books does it say " don't be a wicca " ??????

o yea it doesn't


btw...i am not

Originally posted by Dr Love

Originally posted by caitlinfae
Why minus the witchcraft, Dr Love?

Why not?

While I try not to push my beliefs off on anyone else, I think I would be remiss if I didn't at least say in so many words "leave that stuff alone". It's nothing personal.

Peace

all that stuff minus religion then.....

Originally posted by Watcher-In-The-Shadows
Reply to post by cautiouslypessimistic

 

It's obvious you don't think you said anything false and that's the pity. But you used the broad brushed comment "Christians kill." which is a obviously false generalization. Rather like calling all white people slave owners like another pointed out.

 

Posted Via ATS Mobile: m.abovetopsecret.com

 

There is nothing false about it, if you don't try and take it out of context. Christians do kill. No, not all christians. I was simply refuting the statment that christians do not kill.

A nice little list, apparently created sometime in the past 10 years or so. I've been Wiccan (and a witch) since the late 1960's and haven't ever seen a set of statements like that before.

I wonder if it's one coven's credo, since the "god and goddess" is more aimed at neo-Celtic Wiccans than at the rest of us (gods and goddesses would be more apt, here, particularly among the reconstructionists)?

But it's very nice and thoughtfully done and certainly a nice set of principles to live by.

Many philosophies teach about how to achieve balance. Taoism is famous for it... of course, by the time you've struggled through all that Taoist literature (dust on the floor (this is a Taoist joke in case any taoists are reading this)) you have probably gotten over your involvement in your own self-drama and have a better outlook on things.

I should preach about self drama... lemme tell you, I did a whole hour of self-drama over something today and I'm feeling right ashamed of myself, too.

reply to post by Byrd


LOL, thanks for coming over to this thread. I recall reading something about letting go of attachments to reach enlightenment. Upon further review, I believe letting go of ALL attachments would make one fly into oblivion like a helium balloon without its ribbon. If one considers that prospect uplifting yet another considers it a fearful thing, is that balance? Or have I lost the plot?

reply to post by Byrd


I noticed that about the "God and Goddess" too, and I even thought it was ironic that they didn't identify a single Goddess in the other parts of the list. It makes me curious about the source. It sounds like something Silver Ravenwolf would be up to, not so much like Cunningham, but it's possible.

The best applicable metaphor I know is like watching TV in your mind. You let your worries and problems and obsessions glance on the screen, you acknowledge them, but you let them go to the next program. And eventually there won't be something left to watch and you can enjoy the peace.

[edit on 9/1/2009 by ravenshadow13]

reply to post by ravenshadow13


Here is a quote from the site I found with the list I copied into my journal.

The Thirteen Goals of the Witch appear in Scott Cunningham's incredibly popular book, "Wicca for the Solitary Practitioner," which is among the first books on "Eclectic" Wicca. The Thirteen Goals are not Traditional (meaning I'm pretty certain that Cunningham made them up), but they nonetheless help to underscore "universal" Wiccan ethics.

Originally posted by cautiouslypessimistic

Originally posted by Watcher-In-The-Shadows
Reply to post by cautiouslypessimistic

 

It's obvious you don't think you said anything false and that's the pity. But you used the broad brushed comment "Christians kill." which is a obviously false generalization. Rather like calling all white people slave owners like another pointed out.

 

Posted Via ATS Mobile: m.abovetopsecret.com

 

There is nothing false about it, if you don't try and take it out of context. Christians do kill. No, not all christians. I was simply refuting the statment that christians do not kill.

Christians do not kill. If you do then you are no longer in accordance with the precepts of your faith, ergo you are not a Christian. You may call yourself that, but it doesn't make you one.

If I was to go around saying I was emperor cos some watery tart threw a sword at me, well, it doesn't make me one.

That was my philosophical point. Jesus promoted pacifism. People who choose to ignore it, choose to ignore the call to service are "goats" and will be weeded out. He stated that if you do not follow his commandments then you do not know him.

I argue that those people were not Christians, they were just calling themselves that, and using name to justify their actions.

Now, before you begin to argue with me on this... if my boyfriend tells me he loves me, but he beats me, would you a) believe him and tell me that he loves me, or b) say he's lying and that he does not love me?

If I said I was a Democrat and then I did nothing but agree with Anne Coulter and Bill O'Reilly, if I wore Sean Hannity tshirts and voted for McCain would you tell people I was a Democrat?

Killing people goes against the: Some will tell you an eye for an eye, but I say to you to love your enemies, do good to those that harm you... it goes against the love your neighbor as you do yourself.

The people that chose to disregard this were not/are not Christians.

reply to post by A Fortiori


I guess it comes down to the church vs. the ideology. I am speaking in terms of the church, who were and are recognized as christians.

reply to post by Hazelnut


Ohh thanks. My boyfriend has that book. That's right, it's not traditional at all, but it's a nice spin on things. So, therefore, it's not geared toward Coven practice.

Originally posted by caitlinfae
reply to post by JaxonRoberts

 

I would also point out that while all Witches are Wiccan, not all Wiccans are Witches.

With the utmost respect to you, I have to totally disagree with this. Wicca is a modern form of a traditional path, and many traditional witches, myself included, would never refer to themselves as Wiccan. Spell casting and ritual work can reside in both practises, and are not exclusive to either.

While you two discuss that, I will only affirm that I consider myself a witch, and a pagan, not a wiccan. I won't be bound by any rede, my goals are my own, and I prefer to drive my own karma, which is a hybrid.

reply to post by cautiouslypessimistic


With an overstatement that paints all Christians as murderers? Right.

[edit on 1-9-2009 by Watcher-In-The-Shadows]

The Ten Goals of a Human Are:

1. Know myself

2. Know my craft

3. Learn

4. Apply knowledge with wisdom

5. Achieve balance

6. Keep my words in good order

7. Keep my thoughts in good order

8. Celebrate life

X 9. Attune with the cycles of Earth X

10. Breathe and eat correctly

11. Exercize the body

X 12. Meditate X

X 13. Honor the Goddess and God X