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'We hate the United States': Secessionists rally in Texas

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posted on Sep, 1 2009 @ 07:39 AM
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Originally posted by midnightbrigade
Anyone who knows my posts knows that I have said it since I've been a member of ATS. If Texas, Oklahoma, and Kansas all seceded, the U.S.

Sshhhhhh! Don't say a word. As we say in TX, "no te digas."

Man, that's our secret! We don't need the gringos afueras when we have EVEYTHING abajo.

Lay low. Wait your turn. It's coming soon.

JW




posted on Sep, 1 2009 @ 07:49 AM
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Originally posted by whaaa

As a native Texan, I feel that I can safely address this issue.
Has anyone actually thought about what would happen if Texas seceded? No military bases! No federal jobs! No federal money. Limited travel to rest of the states. Communication breakdown. If Texas were to secede, should the rest of the country place restrictions on Texans like we do Mexicans?

Knee jerk reactions and emotional solutions need to be carefully considered. Rev. Kilgore sounds like a fool.




Kilgore might be a fool when talking about executing people based on sexual orientation, but secession sounds like an idea whose time has come.

If Texas left the union, you can bet that other states would follow suit. I suspect the 'travel problem" would be a non-existent issue. People would most likely travel between the newly freed states and the old slave states with nothing more than a drivers license.

Those US military bases in Texas would become Texas military bases. The Texas National Guard would be recalled and would actually be used to protect Texas. Really novel idea huh?

You're decrying the loss of federal money and federal jobs? Federal money is *our* money and it's currently worthless. It's cotton paper and ink. A potent symbol of our slavery to international banksters. Might make good toilet paper. Texas could put out their own currency based on gold or silver. Banking problem solved.

Our federal government does not represent me in any form, fashion or way. They haven't for a very, very long time.



posted on Sep, 1 2009 @ 07:55 AM
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reply to post by brimstone735
 


You're right and wrong. Awfully smug too.

You are correct. Texas doesn't legally have the right to secede, not because yankees were nice enough to ALLOW us back in, but because Texas has been bought and paid for by the USA.

As for being a dog-with-tail-twixt-legs, Texas was so rebellious following the civil war that several federal raids and military stand-offs were held before they were re-annexed. In Fact, the last battle of the civil war was held in Texas at the Battle of Palmito Ranch, 1865.

Is this a good thing? NO. Slavery is bad.

But don't get 'high and mighty' because you might be from a state that abolished slavery 2 years before Texas did.

Great Britain and all of her colonies were guilty of conducting slavery and slave trade. The blame doesn't lie on Texas.

EDIT: It is not Treason.

[edit on 1-9-2009 by SelfDestruct]



posted on Sep, 1 2009 @ 07:59 AM
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If Texas leaves the union proper, other states will join them in a new subnation.

If Texas left the union, there WOULD be war. The US will not let that happen without a fight.

And Mexico would hate to pass up the opportunity as well.

Other states would have to jump in within days after Texas left.

Unless there were mass protests in the streets all across the country, I don't think Texas would pull that trigger.

But I do think it's something we should kick around just to give DC something to think about.

But what we really need is 100,000 people standing on a freeway during rush hour. The sooner, the better.



posted on Sep, 1 2009 @ 08:01 AM
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reply to post by praxis
 

Do you mean that "The Republic of Texas" would be different from the rest of the US?

Won't Texans lose out on the equation?

They get to share in the National Debt.
They get the benefit of "National Health Care."
They can shore up the bankrupt states of California and New York.
They can enjoy the benefits of "cap and trade," "Obamacare," and TARP.

Oh, you don't NEED those? OK. Goodbye.

jw

[edit on 1-9-2009 by jdub297]



posted on Sep, 1 2009 @ 08:02 AM
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As a native Texan, it would be cool to wake up one morning knowing that Texas was a free nation. On the reality side, we would struggle coughing up the funds to keep the nation sustainable. Plus not to mention during the succession process we would be up against the US military.

“To secede from the Union and set up another government would cause war. If you go to war with the United States, you will never conquer her, as she has the money and the men. If she does not whip you by guns, powder, and steel, she will starve you to” - Sam Houston

My thoughts regarding the Reverend. I wish this nut would shut the bleep up! There is a reason why there should be separation of church and state. So pompous religious a-holes can't influence government. Case in point

"Larry Kilgore, a Christian activist that the Texas Observer says has advocated execution for homosexuals"
Enough said. Yet another reason why this jerk should never be allowed to run for Governor in 2010. Gimme Chuck Norris instead!



posted on Sep, 1 2009 @ 08:20 AM
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Why is this about the reverend (no caps, cuz he's a fraud)? There are crazy people from other states too.

We didn't elect an Austrian roid freak that can't even speak his native language.

I bet Californians are wishing they could have a do-over.



posted on Sep, 1 2009 @ 08:22 AM
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Let us assume for the moment that John Titor had some predictive ability, time traveler or otherwise. Let us assume someone else wrote the text below, how would you rate his ability?

quote
John Titor - Civil unrest

Titor also predicted that there would be civil unrest during or shortly following the U.S. Presidential election of 2004 that would gradually escalate into civil war in 2005. Titor wrote:
There is a civil war in the United States that starts in 2005. That conflict flares up and down for 10 years. Real disruptions in world events begin with the destabilization of the West as a result of degrading U.S. foreign policy and consistency. This becomes apparent around 2004 as civil unrest develops near the next presidential election. The civil war in the United States will start in 2004. I would describe it as having a Waco type event every month that steadily gets worse. The conflict will consume everyone in the U.S. by 2012 and end in 2015 with a very short WWIII. The President or "leader" in 2005 I believe tried desperately to be the next Lincoln and hold the country together but many of their policies drove a larger wedge into the Bill of Rights.
end quote



posted on Sep, 1 2009 @ 08:23 AM
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Originally posted by prof-rabbit
Let us assume for the moment that John Titor had some predictive ability, time traveler or otherwise. Let us assume someone else wrote the text below, how would you rate his ability?

quote
John Titor - Civil unrest

Titor also predicted that there would be civil unrest during or shortly following the U.S. Presidential election of 2004 that would gradually escalate into civil war in 2005. Titor wrote:
There is a civil war in the United States that starts in 2005. That conflict flares up and down for 10 years. Real disruptions in world events begin with the destabilization of the West as a result of degrading U.S. foreign policy and consistency. This becomes apparent around 2004 as civil unrest develops near the next presidential election. The civil war in the United States will start in 2004. I would describe it as having a Waco type event every month that steadily gets worse. The conflict will consume everyone in the U.S. by 2012 and end in 2015 with a very short WWIII. The President or "leader" in 2005 I believe tried desperately to be the next Lincoln and hold the country together but many of their policies drove a larger wedge into the Bill of Rights.
end quote



Way off topic....



posted on Sep, 1 2009 @ 08:43 AM
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well first off texas is a 'donor state' meaning for every federal tax dollar they send to washington they get about $0.85 back. i will miss that contribution to the well being of the country.

still the $0.15 is not going to be enough for texas to take over the 'paying' responsibility for all the things it is going to need once it sluffs off the usa. as someone pointed out, texas is going to have a really hard time dealing with mexico and in this matter they are really between a rock and a hard place. on the one hand you have the drug war, which is escalating on our boarders. texas will be alone in dealing with this. i know they have chuck norris down there but even his all powerful karate jeans (i use to see advertisements for them as a kid) and all the 'armed folk' are going to have a hard time with out military backing. second, i could see texas just building a huge fence and then they would get to live 'a day without mexicans' in real life. it is one thing to bitch about them it is quite another thing to realize how much they do in the usa, i mean why do you think the corporations have been bringing them over for decades?

it is pretty comical to me, i mean, is there really popular support for this? or is it the fringe dragging the majority into something they don't want. which if that is the case isn't their actions in regards to this issue a bit similar to their complaints against government? you know the 'minority' of us citizens wielding too much power over the rest of us and doing things in our name we don't like? i'd say let them go but i think we would be doing a disservice to most texans.

as someone else pointed out, this really seems like the movement of spoiled brats. where the hell was the recession movement during the bush era? i am pretty sure there wasn't one. spying on americans was okay then, so was the patriot act, the war in iraq was pretty cool too, so was all the no bid contracts to cheney's friends.

oh but now that obama is in office the government is corrupt and evil and 'they must leave'.


reminds me of something i was told over and over during the bush years, don't like it? maybe you should leave! (that meant find a new country to live in). perhaps the secessionist movement, which appears to be the minority, should consider the same thing? somalia has been government free for almost a decade, perhaps that would be the perfect location for you all to relocate to. heck i'd even donate money to a fund designed to help get you all there, and you all thought i didn't care.

[edit on 1-9-2009 by Animal]



posted on Sep, 1 2009 @ 09:19 AM
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reply to post by Genfinity
 


The solution is not session....it is engagement(get off the couch and get involved)the numbers of folks who are opposed to the policies of our existing government and the ones before this one should VOTE !! and demand accountability from elected officials and stop this nonsensical party line voting...THEY ARE ALL THE SAME....Rep.or Dem....Theme for election day starting Nov 2009....WHOEVER IS IN...IS OUT...if this methodology is followed we have been rid of career politicians and their special interest groups...The magic is in six years we would have taken back our free country and the constitution that makes us all free...



posted on Sep, 1 2009 @ 09:24 AM
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So this - A possible solution to bring health care to all in need - is what will push people over the edge?

Nice one guys, way to show up late at the wrong house....



posted on Sep, 1 2009 @ 09:49 AM
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Originally posted by Miraj
reply to post by havok
 


I think the US might just let them do it. Forcing them to survive on their own will probably teach them a lesson rather than forcing them to come back.

If they can do it and survive? Great.

If they can't then they come back on their knees begging to be back in.

Seems like a win win.



Many don't realize that Texas has the third largest economy in the world of country subdivisions behind California and Japan. The Gross state product is comprable to that of Canada and India.
It isn't due to federal government subsidy. It is despite the fact that the US government pulls more money out of Texas in federal taxes than they put back in.

Texas' port of Houston is second in the US in overall tonnage, highest in foriegn tonnage and tenth in the world. They have over 35 percent of the fuel refining capacity in the country, 80 percent of other petroleum based products, a large proportion of GOM oil reserves, over one third of the wind power in the US, the second largest state in land mass, the highest exporting state and is second highest state in gross product. Texas is larger than France and almost twice the size of Germany or Japan. Contrary to popular belief ,Texas has less than 10% desert. Most of the landmass is prarie, plains and pine forest. Texas has enough arable land to provide for the present population dozens of times over. Texas could revive much of the farming that the politics in DC have squashed and reduce much of the overpricing in food products locally as well as selling food internationally.

As far as federal support goes, if Texas seceded from the Union then the surplus that Texas wouldn't be paying to the states would more than cover the return from DC which isn't near as much as you might believe.

The nay-sayers that say Texas will need protection from Mexico forget that the DC has intentionally thwarted attempts by the border states to do ANYTHING about illegal immigration and the drug wars on the border. Texas could shut down the border and the path of least resistance would be the direction that the drugs and people would go. The thugs in DC would simply ensure that the rest of the border states were encumbered by the trafficking while Texas would be free to properly protect it's southern border for a change.

Texas taxes wouldn't be subsidizing the multi trillion dollar world police and wouldn't be spending the next three decades trying to pay off their share of the 25 or so trillion in insane Obama-cash spending.

As far as needing defense from other countries, it wouldn't be strictly necessary. Given the present political situation in the world, many countries, including the percieved enemies of the US, would be eager to have diplomatic and trade relations with Texas because of the fact that Texas sits in the center of the continental US with access by deep water ports.

Texas, as an independent country would have its' own currency that was not devalued by the fact that half of the available currency was owned by foriegn nations. It would be more competitive with developing countries and would have a superior exchange rate against the US dollar.

The basic facts are that Texas has more than enough economic, geographic and human assets to be a strong independent nation with plenty of wealth to spare.

The strong reaction of many to assert that Texas can't survive on its own seems petty. There are a lot of well run and successful countries out there with much less to work with than Texas. Many other states could also survive on their own and if the states actually started standing up for themselves then their citizens might not get screwed over by DC constantly.

I think a few seceding states might wake up the powers that be and unite the rest of the states to take care of their citizens and protect them from our so called government.

People should realize that the politicians, lobbyists and big money executives are reliant on the states and the taxpayers for their power.

They are parasites living off of the 300 million plus citizens of this country. It's not the other way around. If the citizens and states took that power back then we'd all be better off.







[edit on 103030p://f25Tuesday by badgerprints]



posted on Sep, 1 2009 @ 10:01 AM
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I'm in Georgia and I'm all for secession because our federal government has too much power. The 13 colonies seceded from the British and the south suceded from the north (not just because of slavery) and it's just as possible today. I commend Perry for what he said. I'm voting for Ray McBerry here in Georgia for governor. He's a states rights activist. In the words of country music group "Little Texas", 'God blessed Texas with His own hands.'



posted on Sep, 1 2009 @ 10:03 AM
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Originally posted by theodorej

The solution is not session....it is engagement(get off the couch and get involved)





You cannot pick up a turd by it clean end. AKA -- You can't salvage any classic Americana when the stars-n-bars have been replaced by the philosophy of the swastika. It really is that simple.

The government is working hard right now to increase the fear level for reasons known only to themselves. What we *can* see is the overall high level of government crimes, deception and non-nonsensical proclamations.

The US will not even exist in it's present form in a few years.



posted on Sep, 1 2009 @ 11:40 AM
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reply to post by Animal
 
The hands of Texas are tied when it comes to dealing with drug trafficking and illegal immigration. The federal governement has fallen asleep at the border.



posted on Sep, 1 2009 @ 12:18 PM
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reply to post by eradown
 


I agree. From who I have talked to, if the feds would let TX take care of it, they would.



posted on Sep, 1 2009 @ 03:06 PM
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reply to post by brimstone735
 

You'll notice that ban on secession was AFTER the Civil War, and WHILE the Southern States were occupied.

We didn't buy into that crap.

The original agreement, the only one that counts, is that the States voluntarily joined the Union, and they can By-God un-join.

No Lincoln now. No occupation.

Now we're more "civilized." More "understanding."

I guarantee you, the very first state to do so, many other states would follow.

Oddly, close to, but not identical to the original Confederacy.

And for anyone who thinks that the Southern States rejoined the Union in the prescribed manner, and are not in fact "occupied territories," you need to break out the Constitution and Federal laws right after the Civil War and get it straight.

We NEVER rejoined the Union.



posted on Sep, 1 2009 @ 04:44 PM
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Originally posted by infinite
I recall the words of the Texas governor who commented that secession might be possible - even though he would not be the vox populi.


Ha I like your name


Anyway what's there to gain for Texas? Financial security? I doubt it.



posted on Sep, 1 2009 @ 06:11 PM
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reply to post by nighinfinite
 


How about freedom. Texas was never even properly inducted into the Union when it was included as a state in the 19th century. Technically, they're not even part of the United States. They are still, technically, the People's Republic of Texas.



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