Aethism (oh yay)

Well... you're simply superior in every regard aren't you Freemason.

(Didn't Freud have something to say about people who behave like this?)

William *does a double take* you just attacked me like Winston

In any case if you must know, I'm not the only one superior, anyone in the west living north of Monterey bay is superior to any one living east of the mid west//texas place.

Sincerely,
no signature

Anyone who think's there superior to anyone else has a personality disorder therfore nullifying that superiority, thus making them nothing more than a simple minded troll without any education and life. So, ya live out with the hick's do ya? Come out to the east, we'll show you superiority.

Originally posted by FreeMason
You can't say there is no god, when you stand before some of the things I've stood before, one being a tree almost as high as the highest building in Reno. (Which is 270 feet, this tree was about 200 and beside it layed one of equal size, which had fallen due to fire, that must have made an amazing sound).

I live in Wisconsin! You can't get much farther awayfrom people. I live in a town that has 867 people, and I still don't believe there is a god.

The reasoning? Because I cannot think of any proof that there is one.

I have nature all around me.
Is it beutiful(sp?)? Yes.
Is it natural? Yes.
Created by a divine being? No.

You need to come up with a more valid argument that nature for proof of god.

Many scientists think that life was accidentally created by a chemical reaction in sea foam.(yes sea foam, now bear with me) From this emerged the first single celled organisms. And you can guess what happened from there.

Anybody else have an argument that they think is valid? One that applies to everybody.

One that science backs up, not faith or blind ignorance. Ok, so anyone non religous have any other explanation?

Also, Joe, I heard something about that, except lightning had something to do with it also.(creating ozone or something like that)

I have never heard of that. Not that it couldn't be true. Sounds like an interesting add-on. Electicity seems to be the key to most things.

Hey, just a question for you guys, while your thinking up a good argument for the divine, what's the difference between regular electricity and the electricity used in your body?(you know, to run nerves and muscles)

Originally posted by FreeMason
Well my question to Athiests still stand, have you ever left your city? Neighborhood even?

Yes, my spouse has traveled to Canada, to Costa Rica (and fell in love all over again with the volcanos) and to at least 20 of the 50 states.

I've never found an athiest yet that experienced and loved nature, they are all children in spirit, clinging to the support of mighty cities, and fearing no darkness, because where they live, the light always shines.

Don't get out much, do you?

There are quite a number of atheists and agnostics at any univiersity, and particularly in the mathematics and physics and astronomy and geology departments. You find them in biology and you find them in medicine and computer science. You're much less likely to find them in the soft sciences, however.

But I challenge every athiests, to come out to my house, and I'll take you into the desert, one moonless night...where darkness will envelope your body and you'll not see your feet, but all that you can see will be the mighty heavens above, that outshine any city in their timeless splendor.

My spouse, who had astronomy courses, loved to take me out in the country and show me the sky.

And yes, we've seen all that and more... the fires of Pele pouring down from the volcano at night like the breath of a hot dragon; eruptions on Mt. Arenal, a mere mile from our lodge, the peace of the rain forest, the serene beauty of West Texas landscape, the endless peace of the Llano Estacado.

My spouse loves them all, photographs them, and occasionally is an activist for them. And is still an athiest.

reply to post by FreeMason


What a load of crap. Atheism is NOT a religion. Why do people keep suggesting this??? And to even suppose than a person who does not a worship a 'god' is any less good than someone who doesn't is insanity.

So many religious people are SO judgemental!!! Why do you CARE what I choose to believe or not? The difference is that I had a choice. I did not grow up only knowing one way of life. My parents were not religious but they never stopped us from going to church if we wanted to. I was not interested as it seemed too self centered to me. As far as I'm concerned the bible is a story book like any other

You know, how many good things have you done lately? I am of no religion but I am a good person who cares for others, I don't spend half my time worrying about what happens when I die - I use the time I have NOW to care for people, for the environment. I have done volunteer work in Thailand, I sponsor various women in poor countries through Kiva to help get their small business's going, my dog is a 'hospital visit' dog and I have travelled the world to experience all that it can offer.

Religion as so based on the 'self' and getting 'yourself' into heaven. How about caring for what you have here and now and for our future. Instead of sitting around and praying, get out and make good things happen yourself!

Originally posted by FreeMason
Because they don't, you live in a skyscraper in New York, and then think a small snow storm is "amazing".

Damn what I'd give for things to be turned back 10 years when Reno got 4 feet every year normally, and the pass recieved 10feet.

Reno only gets 4 feet of snow? That's barely a winter...

Anyway -I'm an atheist. And of the last 10 weekends, I've spent 9 of them outdoors, doing something in a natural environment: photographing it, fishing in it, hiking, climbing, exploring. Can't stand cities.

From where I sit - rather sunburned - I'd say that it's you that needs to get out of the house, and meet a few actual atheists in person.

it is the belief that there is no supreme being (s)

Originally posted by FreeMason

I've never found an athiest yet that experienced and loved nature, they are all children in spirit, clinging to the support of mighty cities, and fearing no darkness, because where they live, the light always shines.

You have GOT to be kidding right??? This has to be one of the most mis-informed, uneducated statements I have EVER heard!!!

I am of no religion and yet I am a member or Greenpeace, World Wide Fund for Nature, I do tree planting, volunteer with the RSPCA and when it comes to caring for the environment I will actively protest and do the physical work. Like the poster above I have Kiva people that I sponsor in poor countries, I am there when family and friends need me and I volunteer to help those less fortunate in my community.

Worrying about whether I get to go somewhere after I die is too self centred for me. As far as I'm concerned my body will go back to the earth when i die and that is fine. What is so scary about death with nothing after? Just do good while you are here because you WANT to, because it's IN you - not because if you don't you will be punished.

And to end, I know literally hundred of people who work for the same volunteer environmental/nature groups that I do who are NOT religious, in fact it seems that most of the people who actually do the most and care the most are of no faith, who do it for the good of all . You need to get out and see what is really going on, do some good and realise that not being religious has no bearing on whether you are a good and worthy person.

What do you do for the environment and the world other than preach and try to make others who do not beleive what you do feel bad?

Originally posted by solo1
it is the belief that there is no supreme being (s)

Yes you got the definition right in the middle.
Atheism at large think about god to be nothing more then a conceptual totality of energy deprived of consciousness, love and free will. They philosophy remain centered on the belief that what ever happens is justified because it happens according to the laws of cause and effect generated by matter.
If you go deep in to this philosophy one can see the defect of this view point.
Kacou.

Sigh...don't generalise. You obviously didn't read MY post. I don't believe in ANYTHING. I just try to be a goo person and do good things for others and the planet. This requires no reward and neither should it.

Originally posted by kacou

Originally posted by solo1
it is the belief that there is no supreme being (s)

They philosophy remain centered on the belief that what ever happens is justified because it happens according to the laws of cause and effect generated by matter.

Do THEY now? Not me.

reply to post by swinggal


i am sorry for one line post.
if you don't adder to this philosophy then you are obviously not an atheist.

kacou.

Once again you generalise. Being an athiest is not a religion. Nothing practised. every single person is different!! I have many Christian friends who all believe different things and I dont say, 'well you can be a Christian then'.

Everyone is different. Talk about narrow-minded dude!

Here is a question for all of you to think about,when you die death comes to you
and everyone that dies will meet death .Now my question for you all is

What is death?


is it energy,
is it just a word,
is it the end.
is it a power?
is it something you believe in without ever seeing it?
is it absolute?
is it something that just happens to everyone?

What do you think?

No one is narrow mind here, we only try to define what is the core of been atheist.
To be atheist is to believe that is no place for God, spirituality, thoughts over matter, in the real world of hard matter. The only things left are your attitude to interact with the world around you.
Atheist goes behind good and evil and like any philosophy that tries to absolute its belief, it shows a narrow mind and cul-de-sac kind of view.
Kacou.

Originally posted by kacou
No one is narrow mind here, we only try to define what is the core of been atheist.
To be atheist is to believe that is no place for God, spirituality, thoughts over matter, in the real world of hard matter. The only things left are your attitude to interact with the world around you.
Atheist goes behind good and evil and like any philosophy that tries to absolute its belief, it shows a narrow mind and cul-de-sac kind of view.
Kacou.

It's not a philosophy or a belief!!!!! You ARE being narrow-minded by trying to define it as such. There is no core to being an athiest. Those who are religious have no concept of a life without religion so they don't understand that not 'believing' in anything is possible. I don't live in fear or worry and know what is right and wrong.

I just get really annoyed when people who are clearly religious try to tell me what an 'athiest' when they have no idea. Calling it a philosophy or belief shows me that you just don't get it.

I've always assumed that atheists believe that there is no God. By God, I mean an omniscient, omnipotent, omnipresent being superior to all other beings. By superior, I mean capable of total control of everything. Notice that does not imply actual control, just the capability. While this might by extension mean that they, atheists, do not believe in the afterlife or eternal life, I don't take that as a given. For instance, they might believe that their molecules disassemble in the ground, then through some amazing physical process reassemble into the next Napoleon or Charlemagne. I see no evidence for this but, the possibility exists I suppose.

My beef with atheists is that they're irrational. I define rationality to be the continuous selection of the 'best' alternative among many when making decisions which may or may not lead to actions. I define 'best' as that which optimizes my personal objective function under any particular goal seeking behavior. My objective function is effectively a product of my preferences and the things I can sense about my choices.

If we all agree that we die at least once - which is still true today unless Bill Gates or Warren Buffet have actually become rich enough to purchase eternal life - then what should we be doing here in the absence of anything after death?

Feeling good - that's what we should be doing. And we should be feeling good no matter what the post mortem implications like our spouse or kids hating us, the world vilifying us, etc. Who cares, they're only relevant to the extent that they help us in our goals while we're alive. So, why do atheists I know sit around at their boring, low paying, jobs whining about traffic and kids and other such nonsense? Why do they put those awards from work on their bookshelves to look at? Shouldn't they be as busy as they possibly can be grabbing the gusto? Come on, every second you think about this question is another second off of your clock. As an atheist, your most precious resource must be your time here and as it gets closer to the end, that resource should be dominating everything else. Well, then why do so few act like it? Why do old atheists grow more conservative with a diminished amount of time? Why not go rob a bank and live it up in that last 30 seconds?

Irrationality? Yes, because it doesn't meet my definition of rational. You aren't selecting your 'best' alternatives unless sitting at your boring, low paying, job and whining happens to be how you enjoy life. Nor do our civil laws that repress and hold down our fleeting ability to enjoy it all. So why participate in this nonsense and charade? Unless you atheists are all saying, "Sure, I'll obey the law." and then taking absolutely every opportunity to enjoy everything by skirting it before the end, I'd say you're irrational.

So, that's my beef with atheists. In some sense, they seem to be hypocrites also, holding others to a standard that they themselves would not bear. Because while they readily admit their disregard for God and some even espouse (but don't live) the lifestyle I'm suggesting they should live, none of them do more than egg others on to join them.

Well, I must say if were to join, I'd be sitting there asking, "What? Is this it? We just sit here and whine about traffic and the kids?" No anarchy? No petty theft when it can be accomplished?

Sheesh, what a bunch of puritans!