Here's the commercial that ABC, NBC won't air.

Everyone is caught up in the argument but the real truth of this issue isn't healthcare, it's money and vested interests. To allow millions of Americans to go without healthcare is shameful.

While the British National Health Service isn't perfect, at least everyone is treated, rich or poor.

Perhaps it's better to spend the money on patient care, than lining the pockets of insurance companies and health providers?.....

Health spending as a share of GDP.
US 16% UK 8.4%

Public spending on healthcare (% of total spending on healthcare)
US 45% UK 82%

Health spending per head
US $7,290 UK $2,992

Practising physicians (per 1,000 people)
US 2.4 UK 2.5

Nurses (per 1,000 people)
US 10.6 UK 10.0

Acute care hospital beds (per 1,000 people)
US 2.7 UK 2.6

Life expectancy:
US 78 UK 80

Infant mortality (per 1,000 live births)
US 6.7 UK 4.8

reply to post by Gordi The Drummer


Thank you and everyone else who actually LIVE in these countries that provide public healthcare for giving us your honest opinion of the circumstances.

I get irritated also when people just go off the word of someone who is giving their experience with their system and is most obviously only providing the testimony for an obviously biased source (i.e. Fox news, Glenn Beck, etc).

These people are few and far between yet their stories get regurgitated over and over in the media so much that people who can't think for themselves start to think each recitation of one persons story is an entirely separate instance and think the situation is wide spread.

Is the public system perfect, no. Can there be errors, yes. But we currently have more frequent and sometimes worse situation with the one we have now.

We can't expect it to be perfect. You'd rather keep horrible over better but not perfect?

We need more and more Canadians, Swedes, Danish, and British (UK) people to tell us the truth.

I've NEVER heard anything bad about the system these countries have until we thought about adopting the same. Now all of a sudden they are horrible systems and the people hate it.

I think you are spot on when you say to ask any person in these countries if they would trade what they have now for our system. They'd probably DIE laughing.

We are so far down on the list of countries with good healthcare it's embarrassing. And all the countries that already have the public system are above us.

What does that tell you?

reply to post by DARKJEDIG
You hint the nail on the head. I agree 100% with you.

Micheal Moores movie (Sicko) tells you just the way it is. So wake up America. www.michaelmoore.com/sicko/health-care-proposal

Originally posted by suicydking

Here is a map which shows the nations that have implemented universal health care. Draw your own conclusions.
www.blogcdn.com...

For those who are not looking at the map.

Let's not forget, Iraq and Afghanistan, they get universal health care and WE pay for it. Gotta love the hypocrisy of taking care of other countries but leaving our own to die.

Harm None
Peace

reply to post by VitriolAndAngst


Use the search feature...

It's been discussed.

The doctor in that video does ask the Trillion dollar question?
How can Obama's plan cover 50 million new patients without any new doctors?

If Obama opens up the flood gates, all our healthcare professionals will be swamped.
Wait time will be even more horrendous just to be seen.
If this thing passes, I predict Obama will begin promoting Veterinarians to Physicians just to try to lighten the load, which means our pets will get neglected.

I believe there should be some type of reform, but good God Barrack, why not spend some of that stimulus and bailout money to send some folks to medical school first?

Originally posted by Alxandro
The doctor in that video does ask the Trillion dollar question?
How can Obama's plan cover 50 million new patients without any new doctors?

If Obama opens up the flood gates, all our healthcare professionals will be swamped.
Wait time will be even more horrendous just to be seen.
If this thing passes, I predict Obama will begin promoting Veterinarians to Physicians just to try to lighten the load, which means our pets will get neglected.

I believe there should be some type of reform, but good God Barrack, why not spend some of that stimulus and bailout money to send some folks to medical school first?

Are you serious?

This is America. We roll up our sleeves and do what we can. We don't toss people out to die because they can't afford to pay hundreds of dollars a month for health care.

Health care should be included in the basic list of human needs that are provided for, so that we can go forth and pursue life, liberty and happiness without having to acquire wealth first.

Will you be the first to tell an uninsured child that that can't seek treatment for an infection because you don't want to wait in a lobby for an hour?

Your statement shows the worst traits of humanity. To deny someone medical treatment for the sake of your convenience is absolutely deplorable.

edit:
Quite a bit of stimulus is going to college grants.

[edit on 28-8-2009 by suicydking]

reply to post by Alxandro


You predict vets will take the place of doctors and why? Based on what? Oh dear. And 50 million new patients, which means by your logic 50 million Americans are not currently getting the healthcare they need or deserve. But that's ok I guess. As long as you can buy a gun and avoid the swine flu vaccination everything will be ok. Thats if you don't get put in those FEMA camps first. I hope that underground bunker is logic proof. It seems so...

I was at a party last Christmas, at a M.D.'s house. He had an amazing collection of ERTE bronze statues, about 25ish I would guess. His house was about the length of a football field and he had a garage that was filled with beautiful cars - several Lamborghinis, Ferraris, Mercedes, and collectibles such as a 1974 Karmann Ghia ranked number 6 in the world.

He earned his money because he was able to tell people that were dying of heart disease that if they didn't pay his fee, they would most likely die. A gifted surgeon but nevertheless only to those who could afford it...

Something tells me the American Medical Mafia just doesn't want to give up control over who can afford to live, it would hurt their car and art collections.

reply to post by DieterDengler
I have to ask what the aforementioned MD treatment is?
I know for a fact in the case of a bypass or similar here in the UK,(listen to the negative reference to Britain in the video re; medical care..not heart disease in particular) it is dealt with swiftly and competently and is very successful. The patient can also have a choice of where to go for the operation, if there is an available timescale for the treatment.There is no charge for the treatment to the individual. There is also an arrangement with Eire to extend the same treatment to UK citizens, if that is their preference, and is non-emergency included.So is what you say about your Doc is that, no matter how brilliant or out-of this-world he is, you will have to pay him?





[edit on 28-8-2009 by smurfy]

reply to post by smurfy


Thank God that your citizens have that line to stand in, there is no such line that exists in the United States.

Originally posted by wylersix
Micheal Moores movie (Sicko) tells you just the way it is. So wake up America. www.michaelmoore.com/sicko/health-care-proposal

I'm watching 'Sicko' right now. As a Brit with access to free (okay I pay for it in my taxes) healthcare, it scares the living whatsit out of me. Having to choose which finger to sew back on because you can't afford both? And this is the richest country on the planet! Every American should hang their heads in absolute shame. If I chopped off two fingers, the NHS would treat me for free (again I pay for it in my taxes but it costs less than health insurance!).

Still watching 'Sicko' - okay it's a M Moore film but even if 10% is spot-on, it scares just as much as a whatsit out of me as the paragraph above.

reply to post by DieterDengler
I don't quite understand about standing in line, at least in reference to my last post.
In edit, now I look again there probably is not a line, unless you measure it in Bucks, but who would know?


[edit on 28-8-2009 by smurfy]

reply to post by mithrawept


Right on! I starred you and that's exactly the truth. Elite cars and ERTE collections only come from restricting the service so much that the ones who can pay will pay a fortune. And if you can't pay in America, the caring M.D.s would step on your dying body to tee off at the golf course that day, without a care in the world other than how they could turn it into a joke at the club house.

Originally posted by DieterDengler
reply to post by mithrawept

 

Right on! I starred you and that's exactly the truth. Elite cars and ERTE collections only come from restricting the service so much that the ones who can pay will pay a fortune. And if you can't pay in America, the caring M.D.s would step on your dying body to tee off at the golf course that day, without a care in the world other than how they could turn it into a joke at the club house.

Star for DD. Meanwhile, Americans are selling everything they spent a lifetime building to pay for healthcare.

I am still watching 'Sicko' - now the film has moved on to the money politicians received from the healthcare companies to protect their interests.

I understand now why Mr Moore called it 'Sicko' because there is something really sick about it.

Interesting how this has devolved into an argument about who is right or wrong? Talk about a Straw Man!

Is not the real issue that the Networks are controlled by one Party and are denying free speech whether you agree with it or not?

Since when do networks have the right to control speech and why do some of you think it is OK to do that?

Being for controlled speech is not a badge of honor but one of shame. Any network that does not air ALL sides is part of the problem. If you don't believe that, you don't believe in free speech. Clearly these networks do not.

reply to post by mikerussellus




No the Liberal crowd very rarely use any intelligence when they think. They mostly use their emotions hense We are stuck with a idiot that is going to hyper inflate the currency and they keep begging for more....


We have had a doctor shortage for a very long time which is one of the major reasons prices are through the roof. I believe the ratio of surgeons to patients is 1 per 900 which is the reason why You pay through the roof. The government started rationing the number of doctors years ago and it was called managed care. Now if they take the money incentive for people to be doctors then watch the numbers plummet to say 1 per 1200. I wonder how You are going to get an operation then? I guess You will have to wait oh damn.....


There is a reason doctors come to this country to practice but then again some people don't think about that.

Originally posted by jkm1864
reply to post by mikerussellus

 

No the Liberal crowd very rarely use any intelligence when they think. They mostly use their emotions hense We are stuck with a idiot that is going to hyper inflate the currency and they keep begging for more....


We have had a doctor shortage for a very long time which is one of the major reasons prices are through the roof. I believe the ratio of surgeons to patients is 1 per 900 which is the reason why You pay through the roof. The government started rationing the number of doctors years ago and it was called managed care. Now if they take the money incentive for people to be doctors then watch the numbers plummet to say 1 per 1200. I wonder how You are going to get an operation then? I guess You will have to wait oh damn.....


There is a reason doctors come to this country to practice but then again some people don't think about that.

Yes there is a reason M.D.s come to the United States - because the United States allows them to suck the blood of the infirmed like leaches or vampires.

Real doctors have a PhD after their name.


[edit on 28-8-2009 by DieterDengler]

reply to post by jkm1864
I believe the figure in the UK is average something not much less than two doctors per 1000 patients, although I'm not sure whether that also includes GP's,(general practitioners) together with specialists. France, Germany and Italy have a higher ratio of medical care, again i'm not sure how the splitup is. There are most likely internet links that would get down to that nitty gritty.