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Here's the commercial that ABC, NBC won't air.

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posted on Aug, 30 2009 @ 12:59 PM
In the end, this is just people willing to give up control vs. people that want to keep it.

Nationalized health care will invade our rights to what we put into our bodies. Yes, I believe that, as I'm not so naive as to think it would be my body anymore. If the gov't is paying to maintain my health, then it becomes THEIR body.

and with codex being passed - guess what? you won't be allowed those vitamins and nutrients - they'll be poisonous.

and don't worry about the prime rib, mike. it won't be much longer before our food is rationed. for our health and well-being, of course.

posted on Aug, 30 2009 @ 01:08 PM
reply to post by mikerussellus

You don't get it. Stop listening to the pundits. You are being frightened by a cleverly rendered tale.

You have already eaten the salad. You will either pay for it now or you will pay for it later but you will pay for it.

Just as you have always paid.

posted on Aug, 30 2009 @ 01:15 PM

Originally posted by mikerussellus
Here it is folks, not sure how to link this, but I'll do the best I can.

Are they THAT afraid of the truth?

[edit on 28-8-2009 by mikerussellus]

this is the organization that put out this clip:
it's organizational "staff" is listed as 1 person...a republican strategist.

yup, a real "truth" teller, no other members, employees, or contributors listed...funny how that "truth" is not told. why would they not be proud of their association with this organization?

posted on Aug, 30 2009 @ 01:21 PM
reply to post by orderedchaos

Thank you. Well put. It isn't about what to do with our own bodies, because they will all be owned by uncle sam.

That kind of control I can live without.

And they can take my prime rib, when they grab it from my cold dead hands. . . .

posted on Aug, 30 2009 @ 01:24 PM
reply to post by SpiritoftheNightSky

I don't listen to anyone.

Well, let me rephrase that, (
) I'm all about a practical application to this. Forget the rhetoric, forget the political parties, can we afford it?

And the answer is nope. We can't.

posted on Aug, 30 2009 @ 01:25 PM
reply to post by jimmyx

Don't slam the messenger, slam the message. If you can . . .

posted on Aug, 30 2009 @ 01:35 PM

Originally posted by mikerussellus
reply to post by jimmyx

Don't slam the messenger, slam the message. If you can . . .

i don't have to...maybe if you asked the people that support this to actually prove what they are saying is true and is going to happen. they are the ones that are saying all this if the law is passed, let them prove it.

if i said you are a red goat...would it be up to you to prove that your not? or would it be up to me to offer pictures and documentation to prove that you are?

posted on Aug, 30 2009 @ 01:41 PM

Originally posted by suicydking
reply to post by SpiritoftheNightSky

Thanks. I'll be gone for the day anyhow, but I'll come back tomorrow and see what's happening.

I enjoy debating with open minded people. i like to have my ideas challenged. It forces me and my ideas to evolve and grow.

There are some few fundamental things I just won't bend on, though. The idea that health care is a basic human need that should be provided for by any means necessary is one of them. If people want to debate the pros and cons of this health care reform bill, that's one thing. To say that some people don't deserve to get to see a doctor is quite another.

Well when you get back let me apologize. I encouraged you not to give up but I think I was wrong.

When people listen but don't hear, look and don't see maybe it is time to throw in the towel.

I have said all that I can say and have broken it down to the level of a three old so either they will get it or they won't but now like you; I am out of here.

posted on Aug, 30 2009 @ 01:48 PM

Originally posted by mikerussellus

Who then, gets to pay for all these free rights?

The evil, zombie, satanic rich?

Lets be realists here.

I wouldn't call them "zombie's or satanic." Evil is somewhat subjective.

I would offer that many of them could be called the "useless" rich.

I've said this before.

A guy who tells a guy to tell a guy to buy stuff from China is really pretty useless.

A guy who does not create, invent, develop, produce, procure, assist, etc etc - in any way shape or form - but who is extremely wealthy from "investing" is quite useless in the great scheme of things.

I could likely come up with a great number of examples. My last post developed the idea of the imbalance of "value" and an incorrect - or immoral - hierarchy.

[edit on 30-8-2009 by gtatix]

[edit on 30-8-2009 by gtatix]

[edit on 30-8-2009 by gtatix]

[edit on 30-8-2009 by gtatix]

posted on Aug, 30 2009 @ 01:51 PM
reply to post by SpiritoftheNightSky

maybe if all political posts were prohibited, this would be a better site. too much vitriol and nastiness has made these posts unreadable and pathetic.

posted on Aug, 30 2009 @ 02:09 PM
To those that say I'm wrong on the issue. Convince me. Instead of labeling me as a right-wing marcher who only listens to Rush, tell me how Obamacare will benefit all? I have posted numerous times how I am willing to listen to ANY alternative.
You don't like the system? What are your ideas?

Everyone is so set on their opinion that I have it wrong, america has it wrong. We have the most evil, worst heathcare system around. We kick people out of hospital beds while they are bleeding. . . yadda yadda yadda.

Convince me.

Argue your point.

posted on Aug, 30 2009 @ 02:10 PM
reply to post by jimmyx

Nice. How about adding something of substance then.

posted on Aug, 30 2009 @ 02:11 PM
reply to post by jimmyx

True, you don't have to slam the message, if you don't want to actively debate the subject. . . .?

posted on Aug, 30 2009 @ 02:13 PM
reply to post by gtatix

Why punish people because they made money? If they made it legally, then what is the big deal? I don't see how the rich came to be the bad guy in this healthcare debate, but it seems that in order for a liberal to argue, they need an enemy.

Whether it be a smoker, rich people, christians. . .

posted on Aug, 30 2009 @ 08:21 PM
reply to post by SpiritoftheNightSky

Where are all of these sick people now? Why are they suddenly going to get sick because they have health care?

If you think there are people out there that don't have health care and are sitting around just waiting to get better or die you are mistaken.

I don't think that there are that many people that don't know that they can be treated in and ER. You don't give Americans enough credit. If illegal aliens who can't even speak English know it and some use it the moment they cross the border or are off the boat, I think that Americans born and raised know it as well.

So basically you are saying that anyone, regardless of whether they can afford it or not, can already go to ER and receive healthcare.

If you think that anyone, whether they speak English or not, can get treated for whatever symptom, at any time of the day, 24-7, anywhere in these United States, then this tells me that the system ain't broken.

If this is the case then why should we spend Trillions for something we already have?

posted on Aug, 31 2009 @ 10:02 AM
OK, I'll try to answer all the good questions that were posted since I was here yesterday.

First, mikerusselus wants to know who I believe stated that some people deserve health care and some don't. I refer to his post where he says he would rather keep his piece of the pie that same size, rather than take a smaller piece and make sure that everyone at least gets some pie at all.

Second, mikerusselus asks how we are going to pay for our Utopian dreamland, or deal with the demands on infrastructure. First, I say that by calling it a dreamland, you are preconditioning people to think of universal health care as an impossible idea. Second, the facts regarding our number of doctors, nurses, beds, etc. per capita has already been posted.

Here is a brief paper discussing the efficiency of the public health care system in The Netherlands, showing how viable a system like that can be:

We can afford to have our defense budget total more that the combined sums of the next ten nations on the list. I'm sure it's possible to make healing people as much of a priority as killing people.

As a final thought regarding cost, I would like to mention, although I'm sure no one will believe it to be true, that Obama has vowed to cut lots of superfluous government programs to open up funding.

As for liberals hating the rich, this isn't true. Some people just believe that the 5% of Americans who hold 95% of the wealth are not benefiting the free market by hoarding wealth and speculating with other people's money. In order for capitalism to function correctly, capital needs to move. Not be hoarded. You don't need to help this 5% defend their empire by restating talking points from Lou Dobbs. Hoarding wealth and using it to leverage the market in order to hoard more wealth is not capitalism. It's not a free market if a tiny fraction of the participants are able to dictate how wealth is distributed. That's economic tyranny.

Finally, Alxandro's question. He wants to now why we need to change a system that already works. He defines they system as functional because the ER can't turn away people who don't have insurance.

Well, the hospitals have to foot the bill for this, which is a huge part of the problem. The cost to society is ultimately higher when it's done this way. Preventative medicine would not only result in a more productive workforce, but would allow hospitals to worry less about their budget when they aren't the ones paying out of pocket to treat 50 million uninsured people.

One last thing. Health care is not the same as a prime rib dinner. Health care means you can be a productive worker, and go forth in good health to earn a good living. A good prime rib dinner is not required to begin the pursuit of life liberty and happiness. It's what you earn in the process.

If people didn't need to choose a job based on the benefits and insurance that's offered, people would be free to choose jobs that they do well, or that they enjoy. This would increase productivity by an untold amount, and would surely benefit us as a nation.

posted on Aug, 31 2009 @ 06:49 PM
I see no need for the commercial. What i think Americans need is for someone to sit down and broadcast exactly what the plans are for the new healthcare system, and explain it in terms everyone can understand, then let the people decide if that is what works for them.

posted on Aug, 31 2009 @ 08:43 PM
reply to post by Freenrgy2

I went to see a specialist several years ago... Didn't have to pay a thing at that moment... I don't have to pay anytime I go to the doctor or get medicine. It comes out of my salary every month and that of everyone else here on the island. God bless our government health care here. It's not perfect, but I have enough relatives who would be dead by now if they were living in the U.S.. One of my grandmothers would be dead by now, because she wouldn't have been able to afford the health care in the U.S.. And the insurance I can imagine would cripple her, even with my dad and his siblings helping her financially.

Why you people don't want a system that is working well for practically the whole western world is beyond me..

posted on Aug, 31 2009 @ 09:01 PM
reply to post by suicydking

Actually I was not defining anything, I was merely posing a question to Spirit~NightSky who stated that the system will not and can not turn away patients.
This almost tells me the current system already works, so why spend Trillions?

You make some good and valid points but I think you need to define what you mean by "earn a good living".
Show me someone who earns a good living and I'll show you a slacker who is crying foul because they don't understand the value of hard work.

This ties in with the "preventative medicine" bit you bring up because not everyone eats a healthy diet.
Why should someone who has a burger, fries and a coke for breakfast, lunch and dinner be given access to free healthcare, compared to someone who eats healthy and always watches what they eat?
This does not make sense.

It almost reminds me of the woman that sued McDonalds because the burgers made her fat.

Don't get me wrong, people should have access to healthcare but there will always be those that choose to abuse the system. I personally don't like this thing because I think we should fix what we already have and also because Obama is just too damn eager to get this thing passed.

There's something to be said about this.
He's already received huge sums of money from Fannie and Freddy, so something tells me there even a bigger pot of gold at the end of the ObamaCare rainbow.
Clearly, he is not to be trusted because there is much more going on here.
If this thing passes you can bet all the hospitals will soon be asking for a bail out.

posted on Sep, 1 2009 @ 12:49 PM
Q:"Why should someone who has a burger, fries and a coke for breakfast, lunch and dinner be given access to free healthcare, compared to someone who eats healthy and always watches what they eat?
This does not make sense. "

A: Because they are human. A member of Your Own Species. They may not be the smartest, fittest or most responsible, but that does not mean, that they should not be entitled, to the same level of care as you or I.

Oh, and by the way - It's not free! It's paid for by every taxpayer. (Including the taxes on burgers, fries, cokes......)

Leaving people to suffer and die, from illness or disease, because they don't stick to a healthy diet? Yeah, that makes sense.
Or because they don't (or can't) earn enough money, to pay for healthcare or insurance? Yeah that makes sense too.
Hey, why not go the whole hog.... and take the next logical step.... you could rid society of these "burger and fries for breakfast" types once and for all, with a few hit squads... hot on the trail of RFID chips which record and report hi BMI levels!!

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