Polls show atheists on the rise in America

Originally posted by thisguyrighthere
Why do atheists have meetings?

I mean, if they've all come to the conclusion that there is no god what is there to discuss? Do atheists have struggles with their 'faith' that call for group support to bring them back to the fold? Do they embark on evangelical recruiting missions and need to plan attacks and strategy?

I dont get it. What do they do?

Some people go to church and just ignore the preachy preachy and psalm songs, they go for community, and friends.

Can atheists not have friends Will you be my friend

reply to post by makinho21


And so you hope to rectify that by becoming exactly the same thing, and instead insert atheist beliefs into things?

Just goes to show that atheism is actually a religion. This thread just highlights the main reasons I eventually stopped being an atheist.

Originally posted by Water-tastes-good
As a Christian, to me this is just another sign for the end times.

There was a poll somewhere here on the internet about religious affiliations and such and it mentions that there are 2 Billion Christians in the world today. 1.5 Billion Muslims, then 1 Billion atheists. Of course, all other religious statistics are present there as well. I think it they did the survey between 2004-2007. Not too sure though.

[edit on 27-8-2009 by Water-tastes-good]

You know humans have been predicting end times for the last couple thousand years right? Nothing new, moving oonnn...

Originally posted by TLomon

In South Florida, they recently picketed a prayer meeting in a public safety building paid for with tax dollars.

This part jumped out at me. This should have been picketed. However, I also feel an Atheist group meeting at the same location should also be picketed.

Atheism is just as much a religion as Christianity is. They aren't just people who don't believe in God, but people who actively try to educate people that there is no God.

They should have the same rights (and restrictions) as any other religious group. The problem is, in the above cited example, the whole seperation of Church and State has gone to the wayside.

I agree with you but us atheist believe in seperation of church and state. As the founding fathers wanted.

Originally posted by jvm222

Originally posted by TLomon

In South Florida, they recently picketed a prayer meeting in a public safety building paid for with tax dollars.

This part jumped out at me. This should have been picketed. However, I also feel an Atheist group meeting at the same location should also be picketed.

Atheism is just as much a religion as Christianity is. They aren't just people who don't believe in God, but people who actively try to educate people that there is no God.

They should have the same rights (and restrictions) as any other religious group. The problem is, in the above cited example, the whole seperation of Church and State has gone to the wayside.

Religion - Noun - Definition number 2: a specific fundamental set of beliefs and practices generally agreed upon by a number of persons or sects:

woohoo, clearly defines atheism as a religion

False atheism is a LACK of a believe in a God. To say to believe in atheism it cancels itself out (or something like that) it doesn't make sense.

[edit on 28-8-2009 by FantasmaTaans]

Originally posted by TheAgentNineteen

Originally posted by miriam0566

Originally posted by whaaa
I am not an atheist. I do believe in a higher power but I certainly don't appreciate anyone knocking on my door at 8am with a copy of the "Watchtower" in their hands.

For Christians to stem the tide of creeping atheism, perhaps they should practice what they preach.

what does JW's preaching door to door have to do with christian's turning america into a theocracy?

In case you missed the memo, this Nation was founded upon Christian principles. A Theocracy we are not, but Christian we are.

False, you can find numerous quotes from the founding fathers actually talking down on christian beliefs. This country was based on secular beliefs that would benefit white, male, property owners.

reply to post by whaaa


Maybe this is an American thing - to gather in social groups to 'discuss' and 'coalesce' on religious beliefs...?

I'm an atheist, as are many of my friends here. Typically in the UK, people don't go around flaunting their religion, nor are they as vocal as the Americans when it comes to their beliefs; I guess it's the British way

But none of my 'atheist' friends have get togethers and chat about being an atheist. In fact, that entire sentence sounds weird. 'Atheist friends'. I don't have 'atheist friends'. I have friends who happen to be atheist and some who happen to be of a religious faith (aww, bless!). We don't group together based on religious belief and discuss atheism.

That would be...very very weird...

Now, the only 'place of worship' we do gather and group together is something we call "the pub" - a very sacred institution...

[edit on 28-8-2009 by noonebutme]

Originally posted by N3krostatic
reply to post by thisguyrighthere

 

I think one of the reasons they have meetings is for moral support and such. A lot of atheists have converted to such after being in a religion and seeing its flaws and fallacies. Religion is damn good at indoctrinating people and only the strongest escape such and manage to live normally without religion and without questioning if what they did was right. I don't believe in religion but wouldn't say I am atheist. I am described as leaving things unknown until real evidence can prove such. I lean towards agnosticism.

After long indoctrination moral support is needed for many leaving a religion. Not only that but friends think alike and many people look to create groups for strength and unity. Makes sense to me anyway.

We don't need religion anymore. We don't have to have it to be spiritual. It is a long lived lie that penetrates the weak and wanting and I am ready for it to be gone with, any day now.

Edit: I guess I can't spell atheist. lol

[edit on 27-8-2009 by N3krostatic]


[edit on 27-8-2009 by N3krostatic]

Well, it's impossible to be "agnostic," but you can be a "agnostic theist" (not sure if there's a god or not, but thinks most likely there is) or a "agnostic atheist" (not sure if there's a god or not, but thinks most likely there's not)

Originally posted by FantasmaTaans
False atheism is a LACK of a believe in a God. To say to believe in atheism is a double negative, it doesn't make sense.

Do you believe religious people are wrong? I know most atheists do. Why? Because you have a belief.

The entire atheists don't have a belief and it's just a lack of belief is just a cop out. That's all it is. And it says quite a good bit that you can't even own up to your beliefs.

But it is in fact a belief that god does not exist. In most cases, it's like a catch all net for someone who rejects a certain religion. An immediate response to what people say about god, a rejection of that. I've seen it a number of times in this thread alone, it's easy to spot because their beliefs are based on the same people they think is wrong. They will point out the wrong things about religion as proof god is not real.

So it is a belief, and what people base their arguments off of in both cases, both atheist and a religion are the same exact texts. Which is foolish. In both cases, they are accepting the same source as being an authority on god. It's either this, or it isn't. You are just the other side of the same coin.

It's just plain foolish to say atheism isn't a belief.

Both sides are close minded in my opinion. They are not acting out of understanding, they are acting out of belief. Belief is just a way of closing a door, and clearly that door is closed for the atheist.

You either understand and know or you don't IMO. And there is nothing wrong with just not knowing(agnostic). It's honest and open minded - which is required to ever come into understanding(gnostic).

2 sides of the same lie.

Considering I took Nyquil not too long ago because I have a headache forgive me if my answer's a little slow. (plus I edited my post not sure if it cancels out or double negative, but it's along those lines)

It's not a cop out. Theism is to believe in a god(s). A is a prefix for (to not) or (lack of) it's even in the word itself: Lack in a belief of a god.
It's a cop out to even argue "if you're an atheist do you believe the world is wrong?" arguement, because even if you are religious you believe that other religions are wrong too. Yes, I personally think all people who believe in a higher being are a bit deluded, but people who are religiously zealous are in fact heavily indoctrinated, but I'm not going to go protest them for it, debate it sure, if they bring it up. I personally don't give a ****. I'm just saying I won't back down from a debate. I will respect your belief if it doesn't infringe on mine, doesn't mean I can't critique it though the same way religious people can critique me and my beliefs go ahead. I'm a humanist, and personally from what I've read I think that religion was ironically necessary for our evolution into a "civil" society. Now though as our understanding of the universe grows and our society grows into a technological one, we no longer need it, yet it remains same way our tailbones still exist.

I already replied to the agnostic thing, so I will not repeat myself, and not to use a cliche atheist quote but it's very true and relevant,
"I contend to you that we are all atheist, same way you are atheist to Greed and Nordic etc. gods, except I believe in one less god than you."

(Something along the lines of that, I added a bit.)
Yup.

Amazing and ask most atheist, "Would you be willing to change your views on a God if he was proven true?" Most, will answer yes. I would. Sometimes I wish there was, life would be sooo much easier, but I can't. I tried when I was younger, and in fact was a little bit scared to consider myself atheist. I just can't. I tried being a good catholic, and when that failed I considered other religions, but I found them all so fairy tale-ish for the lack of a better term.
Not without proof, scientific empirical evidence, and mathematic proof. Then when I see that, yes. Otherwise I won't look at science with a predetermined outcome already in mind like some theist do. Most atheist do.

So close minded no, open minded very.

This is to all you iPud's (invicible Pink Unicorn Denialists)
You are all members of a horrible religion.

The disgusting thing is that YOUR fellow iPuD's have commited all the horrible mass murders in history. Hitler, Stalin, The spanish inquisition, The crusades, The Jihads etc.. all invicible Pink unicorn Denialists.



Listen... Cant, or wont you understand that a LACK of belief in god is not a religion. That would make lack of belief in the invicible pink unicorn a religion too, which it surtainly IS NOT. Everyone would be one then.

Can you please stop refusing to deny ignorance, by claiming atheism and iPuDare religions, IS fotball and work religions also then??

To say atheism and iPud are religions is DISHONEST and basicly spreading DISINFO.

[edit on 28/8/2009 by Daniem]

Originally posted by FantasmaTaans
It's not a cop out. Theism is to believe in a god(s). A is a prefix for (to not) or (lack of) it's even in the word itself: Lack in a belief of a god.
It's a cop out to even argue "if you're an atheist do you believe the world is wrong?" arguement, because even if you are religious you believe that other religions are wrong too. Yes, I personally think all people who believe in a higher being are a bit deluded, but people who are religiously zealous are in fact heavily indoctrinated, but I'm not going to go protest them for it, debate it sure, if they bring it up. I personally don't give a ****. I'm just saying I won't back down from a debate. I will respect your belief if it doesn't infringe on mine, doesn't mean I can't critique it though the same way religious people can critique me and my beliefs go ahead. I'm a humanist, and personally from what I've read I think that religion was ironically necessary for our evolution into a "civil" society. Now though as our understanding of the universe grows and our society grows into a technological one, we no longer need it, yet it remains same way our tailbones still exist.

I already replied to the agnostic thing, so I will not repeat myself, and not to use a cliche atheist quote but it's very true and relevant,
"I contend to you that we are all atheist, same way you are atheist to Greed and Nordic etc. gods, except I believe in one less god than you."

The simple fact of the matter is you can't help but have a belief about god outside actually knowing god. The idea has been given to you, and you will thus have a belief on it. Even if it is a belief that god is not real.

But it seems to me that most atheists are just rebelling against religion in general due to the things it has done in the past, and based on what some people have done in the name of religion. I did the same thing myself. I am not "indoctrinated", I use to be an atheist until I realized the flaws in it.

I don't belong to any religion either, but I do understand the bible. And you know what the funny thing about it is? All the things you will say is wrong about religion and stuff, the bible will say it too. You will tell me you have to go with understanding and logic, and yet the bible says that too. All these people you see going around talking about kill gay people or whatever - the bible calls those people out for what they are - wrong. If you read the story of Jesus, you will see that he was actually against those kinds of people.

And god is not some fairy in the sky. It is nothing at all like those Nordic gods. You don't even understand what you put down at all. Do you think Genesis is literal? That they are talking about actual snakes and apples? Do you think it is saying everything happened in "7 days"?

I hear that quote all the time btw. I know the arguments, I use to be an atheist myself. You just don't understand what it's really talking about. It's not talking about what all those preachers are talking about and so on.

You wanna see god? Go look in the mirror.

I think atheism nowadays is misunderstood and many people who don't

have any type of religion are labeled atheist or otherwise. Just because

people promote science doesn't mean they're atheist. I think people

should be dropping their connections to religions anyway since their

underlying agenda is usually power, greed, and murder. Just my opinion

Lets go on a crusade shall we!!!

It doesn't surprise me that atheism is on the rise in America, especially given the fact that our President is a closet atheist who only uses religion when it's politically convenient.

I would think that the bad economy would be a major cause for this supposed increase. When someone loses their job and begins to lose control of their lives and the ability to support themselves, they start to question if God even exists.

Personally, I believe in God and am a Christian (although far from a perfect one). I genuinely feel sorry for atheists but I do not hold it against them as it is their choice to believe or disbelieve anything they wish. And I would certainly never try to force my beliefs on them or anyone else. Never have and never will.

A lot of people seem to drag out the old "Atheism is a religion" line, but really, it isn't, as they just don't have the trappings of religion. No churches, no supreme being (unless you count the people who are a little too fanboyish for Dawkins or others), and so on.

Some Atheists do go a bit over board when they say "There is no God", as that's just as bald an assertion as "There is a God".

Even Dawkins doesn't succumb to that though, even he says "There probably isn't a God"

I think the idea of having meetings is OK. As mentioned, a lot of rather casual Christians go to church more as a social event, and once you denounce religion, you do miss out on that feeling of community that comes from meeting together with like-minded people.

Originally posted by jvm222

Originally posted by TLomon

In South Florida, they recently picketed a prayer meeting in a public safety building paid for with tax dollars.

This part jumped out at me. This should have been picketed. However, I also feel an Atheist group meeting at the same location should also be picketed.

Atheism is just as much a religion as Christianity is. They aren't just people who don't believe in God, but people who actively try to educate people that there is no God.

They should have the same rights (and restrictions) as any other religious group. The problem is, in the above cited example, the whole seperation of Church and State has gone to the wayside.

Religion - Noun - Definition number 2: a specific fundamental set of beliefs and practices generally agreed upon by a number of persons or sects:

woohoo, clearly defines atheism as a religion

You are confused here I think

Do you know what Atheism actually is? It is not a belief system, nor is it fundamental. An Atheist does not distinguish a church from any other building, such as a library or a house. It is just another pile of bricks. An Atheist wouldn't see a priest as having a job any different to a bus driver or doctor or aerobics instructor, and so wouldn't argue with them. Somebody needs them to do what they do, but that is nothing more special than anything else.

An Atheist does not go around saying 'you are wrong to have a belief'. Your faith is nothing to them, and faith in what religious people call the 'Divine' to an Atheist is like saying 2+2 = 8. It makes no sense, and therefore it is not something to investigate further or entertain as an idea at all.

Someone having faith is entirely unoffensive to an Atheist, because it means absolutely nothing. Some people who claim to be Atheist will attack religion but they are also confused about what it actually means to be one - such as people who meet up together. If they were Atheists they wouldn't have much to say because doing so would mean they hadn't rejected any form of organised belief. They should probably call themselves agnostic or 'undecided', but not Atheist.

An Atheist who meets another Atheist does not say 'Hey you're an Atheist too? Wow lets talk about that.' There would be nothing to talk about. Religion would never come up in conversation unless instigated from an outside party, because it means and contributes nothing to an Atheist.

Richard Dawkins did a bus campaign in London that had posters saying 'There's probably no God. Now stop worrying and enjoy your life.' That's just the same as the Alpha Course posters trying to push their agenda. He does not speak for Atheists - because he acknowledges that people should believe something. He's the 'Tom Cruise' of whatever you would call people who attack Christians - but that is not Atheism.

An Atheist rejects (not attacks) anything dogmatic, because anything else would be dogmatic. They reject (not attack) the collective belief in one thing, because anything else would be some sort of acceptance. Atheists do not 'believe' there is no God, because the word God itself is the same as any other, like butter, car or zebra. There is no special significance!

Bear in mind also. This is more of a language issue also, anyone who has studied philosophy will especially understand this. Atheists only have a name because it is easier that saying 'someone who rejects organised belief systems and who sees no significant or special meaning in anything deemed religious.' Do not confuse a label with a belief or dogma. It is there for practical purposes only, and any Atheist would say the same.

Hope that clears it up for you, and anyone who thinks saying they are an Atheist is an excuse to attack religion.

reply to post by whaaa

“I’ve had some threats to blow up my truck,” said Loukinen, who is also state director of the national group American Atheists. But, he added, “We’d rather spread information than complain about stuff. We want to dispel myths about atheists, myths about science.”

Taking a page from the playbook of the gay-rights movement, some atheists say “coming out” will drive up membership all by itself, as other atheists realize they are not alone.

“There are many people in misery, emotionally torn apart by their doubts. I’ve been there,” said Ronelle Delmont, a book reviewer and former belly-dancer at the Davie meet-up. Delmont started studying science and atheism 15 years ago. Carl Sagan became her hero.

“I found courage by finding other people,” she said. “I’m now unashamed to say I’m an atheist.”

forgive the large quote - but this part is what really interested me

I wonder if I can explain why...adequately

I grew up without religion - without preaching of any kind

just information - and access to information - with the freedom to ask questions

I was always encouraged to think for myself - come to my own conclusions - my beliefs were my beliefs - untouchable

one of the greatest gifts my parents could have ever given me - though I imagine some will disagree

I grew up without religion - but I was surrounded by it on all sides

and it has a very loud and demanding voice - sometimes it comes at you with more than just a voice

how can it be surprising to anyone - or even appear to be threatening - to see like minded individuals gather together?

I am agnostic for a reason - still thinking, still wondering - doesn't get any simpler than that

but I so understand this one simple thing - it's definitely a numbers game - and most of the numbers are still on one side - and they still get to call all the shots

reply to post by badmedia

But it seems to me that most atheists are just rebelling against religion in general due to the things it has done in the past, and based on what some people have done in the name of religion. I did the same thing myself. I am not "indoctrinated", I use to be an atheist until I realized the flaws in it.

I have to disagree with that - and I'm not even an atheist

that's just superimposing one belief on top of the belief of someone else and not really trying to understand a particular point of view

as an agnostic - I have enough questions swirling around in my head to keep all possibilities open - but it doesn't prevent me from understanding what it is other people see, feel and believe

it's not really that hard

it's not about rebellion

it's not about indoctrination

reply to post by Spiramirabilis


I don't disagree, it's not always that. I didn't mean for it to sound as if it is always that. But it happens enough that I'd have to say it is more than 50%. I see it way more often than I don't.

I think agnostic and gnostic are the only 2 honest positions.