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Do ‘Death panels’ already exist?

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posted on Aug, 25 2009 @ 10:24 PM
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Hi all, I didn't want to get myself involved in any part of this 'death panel' business, however I did noticed the question about 'existing death panels' hasn't been raised much if at all here on ATS, so just wanted to find out if anybody here can shed some light.

Here's some of recent published articles I found concerning 'pre existing' and 'existing death panels'.


In 1962, with help from a $100,000 foundation grant, Seattle's King County Medical Society opened an artificial kidney clinic at Swedish Hospital and established two committees that, together, would decide who received treatment. The first was a panel of kidney specialists that examined potential patients. Anyone older than 45 was excluded; so were teenagers and children; people with hypertension, vascular complications or diabetes; and those who were judged to be emotionally unprepared for the demanding regimen. Patients who passed this first vetting moved on to another panel, which decided their fate. It soon gained a nickname -- the "God committee." Born of an effort to be fair, the anonymous committee included a pastor, a lawyer, a union leader, a homemaker, two doctors and a businessman and based its selection on applicants' "social worth" Of the first 17 patients it saw, 10 were selected for dialysis. The remaining seven died.

Source


When insurance companies deny coverage to critically ill patients because of what they deem "pre-existing conditions," they sentence those people to misery and often death. And that has nothing to do with proposed health care reform. This travesty exists now.


The following comment was the first one submitted for the above article. It might be worth a read if what he is saying is true.


As an end of life care physician, let me urge everyone to use the right terminology. We already have palliative care teams. What is wrong with reviewing those who have chronic life limiting conditions and offering them palliative care instead of aggressive care? Often people opt for extending their days of living instead of their quality of days remaining due to ignorance about a "death panel," or hospice team. Yes, we save the system money by not ordering more tests and unnecessary treatments. We also improve quality of life with out prolonging life. Death panels already exist in healthcare and I am proud to be a part of a palliative care team that focuses on quality and not quantity of life. Do you really want to spend millions of dollars prolonging the life of someone with advanced metastatic terminal malignant cancer in the intensive care unit? Is that an effective use of healthcare dollars? If the healthcare system has one dollar left to spend, would you spend it ordering an MRI on a terminal cancer patient? Or on a new born baby? Currently, most of healthcare dollars are being wasted in the last days of life. Are we effectively using our current Medicaid/Medicare health dollars? Has anyone looked at the hospice palliative care movement in America and how much money we are already saving the healthcare system? Is that so wrong? Death panels do exist and they are a necessary part of healthcare.

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The next article just seems to be mostly somebody's personal opinion and almost looks more of a blog than a news article, I found many like this saying they believe the insurance company's are the 'real deciders'.

Is there any truth to it?


The “death panel” smear goes something like this: President Obama and his comrades in Congress are hell-bent on instituting mandatory end-of-life counselling sessions for American seniors as part of their socialist takeover of the health insurance industry. They will choose who gets to live and who will die.


Death panels are real. They do exist. Your own insurance provider could be in on it. And it’s time the media said so.

Source

What about the 50 - 60 million without cover? are they already on some kind of death panel?


So what's the story then do they already exist or is this put out to fool us?





[edit on 26-8-2009 by deadoralive]




posted on Aug, 25 2009 @ 11:24 PM
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Well I would prefer talking about healthcare, I have written the word "Death Panel"
20 times already and I am starting to feel like a puppet for some reason???


This bickering in fact does nothing for OUR interests, our lives or our society.
I do think the point of a flag is to represent a group of PEOPLE most of all.

Seems the ultimate goal of opposition is to keep the status quo... MY GOAL is
to regulate CONSUMER PROTECTIONS, not necessarily create a single payer
system.

So many people question socialisms, death panels, nazi plots, but they do not question

A $50 DOLLAR ASPIRIN

So I ask myself: Self... why would TPTB want to change such a great set up?

and truly I have no answer. So my next thought is:

Self? do people like paying $50 for a common pain killer worth only pennies?

SO I really have to wonder has this world gone mad... I mean couldn't both sides
agree to this?

The messed up part is that many on ATS, after all the posturing has been displayed
open up. You can't punish business's, etc... And there it is...

$50 Aspirin is to me paying a ridiculous tribute that everyone accepts and few ever question.

WHY?

Cause we are a lost case and backwards?

don't know?



posted on Aug, 26 2009 @ 01:26 PM
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They must exist in the private insurance business or else why
would this 'grass roots' question arise.
People don't like dying by government choice but its OK by private insurers.
Kind of odd.



posted on Aug, 29 2009 @ 11:49 AM
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reply to post by mental modulator
 


mental modulator,

There isn't a link between overpriced OTC medications and public healthcare. The only link that could occur is if everyone's doctors started prescribing Aspirin for everything under the sun and more. Got athlete's foot? Aspirin. Got cancer? Take two Aspirin and call me tomorrow. Got a bullet in your chest? A little Aspirin before bed will fix that right up. That is the only situation in which the price of a common drug will rise. When supply gets too low or demand gets too high.

Public healthcare, nationwide insurance, and even death panels don't have an impact on the cost of pharmaceuticals. The only effect insurance and public healthcare has on them is whether or not your prescription is covered by Medicare. Death panels would only affect death, not medications.

We have Aspirin in Canada too you know, it doesn't move up and down like peak oil. It just stays at one price depending on what store you go to. In fact, with each sale it periodically fluctuates in price. We have a by in large public healthcare system yet we can either by Aspirin for regular price or generic ASA for cheap. If your ridiculous theory becomes true, don't worry about it, someone will have created a market for black market ASA by purchasing bulk cases from Costco.




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