The woman's comparison was historically without foundation. The Nazis never instituted a health care policy in which certain benefits might be
withheld from people suffering from particular illnesses. They instituted a campaign of extermination of people based on their disabilities, ethnic
origin, sexual orientation, political beliefs, and other factors. They rounded these people up and murdered them.
That's not the same as *potentially* refusing treatment for certain types of illness.
One thing the Nazis really did, though, was to use propaganda to lie. They frequently depicted the people they hated in unflattering ways, just as
this woman and her friends were displaying a picture of Obama looking like Hitler. That's a whole lot closer to what the Nazis were doing, than what
Obama was doing or proposing.
Comparing Obama (or his policies or efforts) to Nazis is nothing more than name-calling. It is nothing more than an insult, not a legitimate question
about the health care plan. It was an attack against the person. Frank's response was more than that woman deserved.
Barney Frank Floored By Nazi Insult at Town Hall. OMG, page 2
privacy
reply posted on 24-8-2009 @ 03:49 PM by mental modulator
Originally posted by ANTHONY33
reply to post by JohnnyCanuck
You really don't get it. The fact is the questions asked are very important but this guy did not have desirable answers to them so he conveniently played the '' I am a Jew so I can't be a bad person '' card on her. There was no attack on his race or religious beliefs but he chose to take the opportunity to make it so.
He is basically saying I am Jewish so you cant touch me. I am immune to criticism because I am a Jew. As if to say he could not possibly subscribe to NAZI style agendas.
It makes no difference what race or culture one comes from there is bad eggs everywhere and this one just happens to proclaim his Jewishness. Yeah right
[edit on 24-8-2009 by ANTHONY33]
That lady went way past the line with that idiocy... Seems you and bint did not take notice of the massive militarization and nationalism that bread the NAZI'S unbridled power. The reference is so detached from the referenced that it should be added to DSM - projected delusional disorder
I wouldn't have not been so kind, line backer or water logged tart alike.
reply posted on 24-8-2009 @ 03:53 PM by john124
Originally posted by ANTHONY33
reply to post by JohnnyCanuck
You really don't get it. The fact is the questions asked are very important but this guy did not have desirable answers to them so he conveniently played the '' I am a Jew so I can't be a bad person '' card on her. There was no attack on his race or religious beliefs but he chose to take the opportunity to make it so.
He is basically saying I am Jewish so you cant touch me. I am immune to criticism because I am a Jew. As if to say he could not possibly subscribe to NAZI style agendas.
It makes no difference what race or culture one comes from there is bad eggs everywhere and this one just happens to proclaim his Jewishness. Yeah right
[edit on 24-8-2009 by ANTHONY33]
How is government run healthcare nazi style agendas? What evidence is there of death panels? Putting aside what some people think of Jews etc, what else is he supposed to say to somebody who doesn't talk any sense whatsoever.
reply posted on 24-8-2009 @ 03:59 PM by ANTHONY33
reply to post by mental modulator
I have to agree that she went overboard with all the NAZI references but the questions she asked deserve attention.
I my self try to steer clear of these petty squabbles over how things were worded as there is a far bigger and more pressing matter at hand here don't you all agree? Like what have TPTB got in store for you all? No? or do you just want to squabble over analogies.
I'm done here so I will leave you guys to it, I got to get on with life and I'm hungry
It's been fun, thanks for the interactions.
I love you guys, all of you
[edit on 24-8-2009 by ANTHONY33]
I have to agree that she went overboard with all the NAZI references but the questions she asked deserve attention.
I my self try to steer clear of these petty squabbles over how things were worded as there is a far bigger and more pressing matter at hand here don't you all agree? Like what have TPTB got in store for you all? No? or do you just want to squabble over analogies.
I'm done here so I will leave you guys to it, I got to get on with life and I'm hungry
It's been fun, thanks for the interactions.
I love you guys, all of you
[edit on 24-8-2009 by ANTHONY33]
reply posted on 24-8-2009 @ 05:28 PM by NWRHINO
Barney's reaction was tex book CIA disinformation policy- Ridicule & negative association applied in classic Ad Hominem attack the messanger style.
The congressman could have simply asked her to explain why she though that Obamas policies were similar to the German government of the 1930s &
40s.
He could not afford to have anyone remind the public that Hitler and the NAZIs were elected in a democratic election as social reformers
From Wikipedia
Nazism, officially in German as National Socialism[1][2][3][4] (German: Nationalsozialismus), refers to the ideology and practices of the National Socialist German Workers’ Party or NSDAP under Adolf Hitler, and the policies adopted by the dictatorial government of Nazi Germany from 1933 to 1945.[5][6][7][8]
Nazism is often considered by scholars to be a form of fascism. While it incorporated elements from both left and right-wing politics, the Nazis formed most of their alliances on the right.[9] The Nazis were one of several historical groups that used the term National Socialism to describe themselves, and in the 1920s they became the largest such group. The Nazi Party presented its program in the 25 point National Socialist Program in 1920. Among the key elements of Nazism were anti-parliamentarism, Pan-Germanism, racism, collectivism,[10][11] eugenics, antisemitism, anti-communism, totalitarianism and opposition to economic liberalism and political liberalism.[11][12][13]
This is what the woman was speaking about when she compared the current health care reform to the policies of the NAZIs :
Dr. Ezekiel Emanual, Healthcare Policy advisor to president Obama.
"... Procedurally, it suggests the need for public forums to deliberate about which health services should be considered basic and should be socially guaranteed.
Substantively, it suggests services that promote the continuation of the polity-those that ensure healthy future genera- tions, ensure development of practical reasoning skills, and ensure full and active participation by citizens in public deliberations-are to be socially guaranteed as basic. ... Read More
Conversely, services provided to individuals who are irreversibly prevented from being or becoming participating citizens are not basic and should not be guaranteed. An obvious example is not guaranteeing health services to patients with dementia.A less obvious example Is is guaranteeing neuropsychological services to ensure children with learning disabilities can read and learn to reason."
He could not afford to have anyone remind the public that Hitler and the NAZIs were elected in a democratic election as social reformers
From Wikipedia
Nazism, officially in German as National Socialism[1][2][3][4] (German: Nationalsozialismus), refers to the ideology and practices of the National Socialist German Workers’ Party or NSDAP under Adolf Hitler, and the policies adopted by the dictatorial government of Nazi Germany from 1933 to 1945.[5][6][7][8]
Nazism is often considered by scholars to be a form of fascism. While it incorporated elements from both left and right-wing politics, the Nazis formed most of their alliances on the right.[9] The Nazis were one of several historical groups that used the term National Socialism to describe themselves, and in the 1920s they became the largest such group. The Nazi Party presented its program in the 25 point National Socialist Program in 1920. Among the key elements of Nazism were anti-parliamentarism, Pan-Germanism, racism, collectivism,[10][11] eugenics, antisemitism, anti-communism, totalitarianism and opposition to economic liberalism and political liberalism.[11][12][13]
This is what the woman was speaking about when she compared the current health care reform to the policies of the NAZIs :
Dr. Ezekiel Emanual, Healthcare Policy advisor to president Obama.
"... Procedurally, it suggests the need for public forums to deliberate about which health services should be considered basic and should be socially guaranteed.
Substantively, it suggests services that promote the continuation of the polity-those that ensure healthy future genera- tions, ensure development of practical reasoning skills, and ensure full and active participation by citizens in public deliberations-are to be socially guaranteed as basic. ... Read More
Conversely, services provided to individuals who are irreversibly prevented from being or becoming participating citizens are not basic and should not be guaranteed. An obvious example is not guaranteeing health services to patients with dementia.A less obvious example Is is guaranteeing neuropsychological services to ensure children with learning disabilities can read and learn to reason."
reply posted on 24-8-2009 @ 07:21 PM by JohnnyCanuck
Originally posted by NWRHINO
This is what the woman was speaking about when she compared the current health care reform to the policies of the NAZIs :
Dr. Ezekiel Emanual, Healthcare Policy advisor to president Obama.
"... Procedurally, it suggests the need for public forums to deliberate about which health services should be considered basic and should be socially guaranteed.
Substantively, it suggests services that promote the continuation of the polity-those that ensure healthy future genera- tions, ensure development of practical reasoning skills, and ensure full and active participation by citizens in public deliberations-are to be socially guaranteed as basic. ... Read More
Conversely, services provided to individuals who are irreversibly prevented from being or becoming participating citizens are not basic and should not be guaranteed. An obvious example is not guaranteeing health services to patients with dementia.A less obvious example Is is guaranteeing neuropsychological services to ensure children with learning disabilities can read and learn to reason."
Mmmm...something yoinked out of context from an academic paper some 13 years ago. Do you think she read it, or is she simply drinking the Koolaid? I submit:
Ezekiel Emanuel, Obama's 'Deadly Doctor,' Strikes Back
The attacks on Emanuel are a reminder that there is a narrow slice of Americans who not only don't trust government, but also have come to regard it as a dark conspirator in their lives....
This is where the criticism of Emanuel enters the picture, since he is just the sort of scientist who might be appointed to one of those panels. For decades, Emanuel has studied the ethics of medical care, especially in situations where a scarcity of resources requires hard decisions to be made. His work sometimes deals with the hardest possible decisions, like how to choose who gets a single kidney if there are three patients in need, or the reasons that doctors order tests with little medical value. Emanuel's reputation ranks him among the top members of his field. He is published often in the best journals; he has been given multiple awards for work to improve end-of-life care. news.yahoo.com...
reply posted on 25-8-2009 @ 07:08 AM by NWRHINO
Originally posted by JohnnyCanuck
[Mmmm...something yoinked out of context from an academic paper some 13 years ago. Do you think she read it, or is she simply drinking the Koolaid? I submit:
Ezekiel Emanuel, Obama's 'Deadly Doctor,' Strikes Back
The attacks on Emanuel are a reminder that there is a narrow slice of Americans who not only don't trust government, but also have come to regard it as a dark conspirator in their lives....
Kudos for using the word "yoinked" !
I agree that this woman could be a Kool Aid drinking automoton, programmed to carry forth an agenda.
However, I do not understand how an acedemic paper written by Dr Emanuel can be "taken out of context". These are his written words regardless of the date it was created, until he can refute his own written word, then it can logically be inferred he still is of this mind set
Dr Emanuels 1996 Hastings report - Where Civic Republicanism and Deliberative Democracy Meet
One of the great things about freedom is that you do not have to trust your government, which is made of failable people.
What is the point of having a constitution that protects a free peoples right to express themselves to their elected representatives, if the representatives will not address the people's expression of concern
He could have just said, No your wrong about this issue.
Frank instead denied this woman of her right to express herself by condeming her for even asking her question
Even if this woman is wrong or deluded she is entitled to her opinion
The 1st Amendement is not suspended because of an unpopular opinion or because a person mentions Nazis to a person of Barney Franks ethnic background
3-4 years later, after being strongly anti-Obama....I will be voting for him for a second term.
Posted 15 days ago with 65 member flags
Posted 15 days ago with 65 member flags
Fox News Drops The Ball On Its Focus Group - Ron Paul Supporters!
Posted 12 days ago with 43 member flags
Posted 12 days ago with 43 member flags
Obama Supporters...Remember This List When You Vote This Year.
Posted 11 days ago with 35 member flags
Posted 11 days ago with 35 member flags
Ron Paul Rally Today in Colorado Springs! (full video and pictures!)
Posted 10 days ago with 33 member flags
Posted 10 days ago with 33 member flags
3-4 years later, after being strongly pro-Ron Paul... I will be voting for Ron Paul for a 2nd time
Posted 14 days ago with 28 member flags
Posted 14 days ago with 28 member flags
Newest topics, updated in real-time:
The President & The Prophet: Obama’s Unusual Encounter with Eric Metaxas
Religion, Faith, And Theology, Posted 3 minutes ago
Religion, Faith, And Theology, Posted 3 minutes ago
Himalayan glaciers have lost no ice in the past 10 years, new study reveals.
Fragile Earth, Posted 22 minutes ago
Fragile Earth, Posted 22 minutes ago
Newest topics getting flags, in real-time:
Google accidentally released Maine election results early!
2012 US Elections, Posted 15 hours ago, 82 flags
2012 US Elections, Posted 15 hours ago, 82 flags
The CIA in Australia: America's Foreign Watergate
Political Conspiracies, Posted 13 hours ago, 17 flags
Political Conspiracies, Posted 13 hours ago, 17 flags
Iran to announce "very important" nuclear achievements
Middle East Issues, Posted 9 hours ago, 15 flags
Middle East Issues, Posted 9 hours ago, 15 flags
Newest topics getting replies, in real-time:
Google accidentally released Maine election results early!
2012 US Elections, Posted 15 hours ago, 102 replies
2012 US Elections, Posted 15 hours ago, 102 replies
Massive Obama Conspiracy to Kill the Second Amendment
US Political Madness, Posted 17 hours ago, 74 replies
US Political Madness, Posted 17 hours ago, 74 replies
Catholic Bishops: Obama's Solution 'Is Unacceptable'
Breaking Political News, Posted 11 hours ago, 55 replies
Breaking Political News, Posted 11 hours ago, 55 replies
First Strike Scenerio in conjunction with the Departure of The Body of Christ.
World War Three, Posted 16 hours ago, 43 replies
World War Three, Posted 16 hours ago, 43 replies
The Above Top Secret Web sites are a
wholly owned social content community of
The Above Network, LLC.
This content community relies on
user-generated content from our member contributors.
The opinions of our members are not those of site ownership
who maintains strict editorial agnosticism and simply provides
a collaborative venue for free expression.
ATS Server: www2.theabovenetwork.com
Header data: 0.003 seconds
Page processed in: 0.165 seconds
wholly owned social content community of
The Above Network, LLC.
This content community relies on
user-generated content from our member contributors.
The opinions of our members are not those of site ownership
who maintains strict editorial agnosticism and simply provides
a collaborative venue for free expression.
ATS Server: www2.theabovenetwork.com
Header data: 0.003 seconds
Page processed in: 0.165 seconds
