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Seven Crimes That Will Get You a Smaller Fine Than File Sharing

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posted on Aug, 24 2009 @ 01:10 AM

Originally posted by Karlhungis
reply to post by redseal

It isn't about the right to steal. It is about a penalty that fits the crime. You shouldn't face a 10 years in federal prison for jay walking, just like you shouldn't face a million dollar fine for downloading a song. I don't have a problem with punishing file sharers, just make it reasonable and the current system is so far from reasonable that it is absolutely ridiculous.

Thank you K,

you are a thinker and a patriotic!

Society and life is about striking a balance...

posted on Aug, 24 2009 @ 01:26 AM

Originally posted by fbipeeperjr file sharing, you have a huge number of people willing to do it, and very little ability to control it, so at best, all they can do is bankrupt a couple people to try and scare the rest.

So basically theyre F**ked, and theres nothing they can do about it. Especially in light of the fact that everyone who's ever participated in illegal file sharing is pretty much aware of the above, and are thefore not in the least bit scared. As long as you keep your collective heads low sharing a few files here and there and let the big-time file sharers do what they do best at their own risk nothing can be done about it. When it actually comes to punishment of these crimes they tend to go for those who make the most noise online, in the form of files uploaded or downloaded. youll find that those who download as often as they would buy a CD or DVD create what i see as the collective murmour. wheras those who keep their computers running 24/7 with hundreds or even thousands of uploaded files being shared all the time are the ones who shout "***K YOU!" most clearly into the face of the cyber police.

but even if they create a huge media circus about this and arrest a few individuals, handing out extremely harsh sentances, there will be those who were previously part of the collective murmour who stand up in defense of those who served them so well for so many years and who take the places of those arrested, and even louder than before belt out a defiant metaphorical "###k you" message.

posted on Aug, 24 2009 @ 02:25 AM
reply to post by Karlhungis

Today's fines are a grossly inappropriate way to hand out punishments because they do not take into account the savings and salary of the person being punished. And worse, the government actually gets financial benefit from violent crimes, giving them incentive to actually encourage crime.

posted on Aug, 24 2009 @ 03:39 AM

Originally posted by mental modulator

and so music will suffer the fate it is suffering... Pink Floyd could not have produced the work they did if they had to maintain a full time job just to support bills and food.
In a field that is hard enough as it is to gig, travel, individual practice, group practice and write... anyhow taking another eight hours out of the day and being anchored to a boss's schedule, so the art will suffer at large...

We will have an auto tune world and the ART will suffer as time dictates.

FIGHT the man by fooking the foot soldiers!

Ah, but pink floyd started playing in dance halls didn't they? So what if they would have had to get more income from there than from records? Maybe they would have never left britain for a concert, and nobody farther away than say germany or spain would have travelled to one of their performances. What would you poor americans have done? right. Listen to local bands, while the germans have the privilege to travel to britain, and spend their marks for food and accomodation in the UK.

So: perform instead of record helps local artists (who now have a higher chance of actually making some money out of their hobby) and tourism. The only people who don't profit from it is the publishers, because nobody needs them anymore.

Now of course if performing isn't added value for your product (say, a movie for example) we have a problem.

A tiny reallive example: A few weeks ago i bought a 6 DVD set. Only through a cooincidence i realized on the same day that No.5 of the DVDs was missing and No.4 was in there twice. Nevertheless i had to fish the receipt out of the trash, go back to the store, and quarrel with the Shop assistant because "We don't take back digital media. You could have copied it or smthin"
So what exactly is the added value of burning, packaging, and putting it on shelfs far away from my place?

posted on Aug, 24 2009 @ 08:51 AM
Is this some kind of a joke?

talk about poor research.

where are these fines applicable? in the US? the UK? which state? if the us?
What an obviously fabricated attempt at getting attention.

shame on the OP for lack of analysis and shoddy presentation of pretend "facts".

posted on Aug, 24 2009 @ 09:38 AM
reply to post by mental modulator

Time to go on tour then. Make some money. Everyone knows that is where the money is at.

In the next post, you cry because you do not have time, money, patience, or whatever to go on tour.

Then you must make your choice. Do you want music to be your life or your hobby?

There is a reason why most musician's start out dirt poor, and only make big $$ in the latter part of their career's.

Edit: And before you spaz . . . yes, I am in a band. Yes, we do tour in the summer only. Yes, we make money, and no, we do not waste it on full studio cd's.

[edit on 8/24/2009 by Lemon.Fresh]

posted on Aug, 24 2009 @ 11:35 AM
One of the best threads I've seen so far.

One of my dreams is to own one of the biggest record labels in history.

This thread helps me understand what needs to be done, and I will bookmark it for future reference.

S & F!

posted on Aug, 24 2009 @ 01:19 PM
Why doesn't a band like Metalica market their music on the internet, and sell directly to the customers?

What percentage does Metalica get off of every record they sell? If they get 10 percent from the record company, then throwing together a web site and selling directly would allow them to sell their music for slightly more that the 10% they currently get, and they can make the same amount of money.

Remember Led Zepplin started their own record label, because they could make far more money that way. Zepplin had terrible news publicity for years. It was very clear that the music industry was very pissed off about them doing this.

It all about control folks.

posted on Aug, 24 2009 @ 07:26 PM
It just shows the hypocrisy of the human mind. We just place a different value on everything according to need. We are only too happy to pay out vast sums of money for the latest, bestest one of a kind new car, or house, no file-sharing there,(you can't download/steal these items..yet) Go down to the supermarket and expect to see a two for the price of one on offer, at the same time we gloat over how easy it is to share a piece of music over the internet, it's stealing no matter which way, just like the pen you nicked from work,(hey the pen probably costs more than a download from legal sites) unless it's offered for free. I'm a musician too and love music, but you'll get F..all free from me, unless I offer it,(just ask me nicely)

[edit on 24-8-2009 by smurfy]

posted on Aug, 24 2009 @ 08:27 PM
I play the bass in a band myself. Well i used to, after i found out they all wanted to be rich, famous, and signed on a huge label. Not how i wanna make my money as a musician. I think most musicians applauding the RIAA are envious of the paycheck of sports stars (which is beoynd redicolous)

Real musicians should earn their pay by playing live, CD sale should be secondary, cheap and with an availabilty to listen to all tracks online in high bitrate for free. Optimally, remove the middle man (RIAA), and produce your own cd's - it's not that hard.

posted on Aug, 24 2009 @ 08:48 PM

Originally posted by JayinAR
reply to post by Darthorious

Great post.
Yeah, from the artist's perspective, file sharing is great! Unless you are already established (Metallica).
Metallica doesn't need people to share their files to sell their stuff. Everyone already knows them.

But for the vast majority of artists, this is a good thing. It is the execs. that lose. And for precisely the reason you stated. Simply because they refuse to keep track with the technology.

One other thing though, there was a time when people DID buy just singles.
That changed in the 60's though.

The funny thing is that even thought it wasnt so high tech, bands like metallica definitely benefitted to some degree from piracy. I know at my high school, a friend of mine heard about the band while visiting in LA so after coming back, we found a tiny ad in the back of a metal magazine and all pitched in and bought 'Kill 'em all'. Was really cool red vinyl (wish I ended up with it.) That record was made into so many tapes, you wouldn't believe it. It also made a ton of metallica fans that went on to buy a TON of future releases and go to many concerts.

Just sayin...

posted on Aug, 24 2009 @ 10:34 PM
reply to post by Karlhungis

Interesting, but I believe that the penalties are different for some of those things based on where you live, your intent, circumstances among other things.

posted on Aug, 25 2009 @ 12:26 AM
For those who support Record labels or call this stealing:

It's damn High time the idolatry of celebrity ended!

last I checked the ERA of the "ROCK STAR" and being ABLE to Make MILLIONS and MILLIONS like some Demi God destined to OD on Blow anyway lasted from 1950 until NOW

That's 60 Years

And it's over okay?

They need to GET OVER IT, GET OVER THEMSELVES and stop being retarded and destroying peoples lives...

You know what, Most people live nice lives on 100 G or a little more a year

MOST people live on half that or less

Why the hell it's MANDATORY that a few albums makes you worth 150 Million bucks defies comprehension.

Alright... sure celebrity be a multi millionare

What does that take a single year of touring at modern mega venues?

See this whole concept that being a good singer was worth legendary amounts of money started about the same time, people starting doing WAAAY TOOOO MUCH DOPE

Okay, once you make a couple MILLION, if your not an idiot your rich for the rest of your life, investments, property etc, etc...

So, screw giant corporations selling hard copies

A: some will always BUY hard copy and they won't fail to feed their families WELL

B: There's enough money Playing for any big Band to make Millions in due time on that alone

C: It's all stupid anyway because via radio... 30 bands get to make RIDICULOUS MONEY and 100,000 others can't make squat... and over INTERNET lol... that 100,000 get to make a living TOO and the pop stars still make Millions...

D: Distributors are CRIMINALS because you should Burn your own CD for 1.00 and maybe buy the album for 1.50 online in which case you wouldn't need to Pirate, but they sell for 9.99 or 14.99 make you burn Gas, make you pay for the shipping and jack you a couple bucks on the cost of the CD too...

In short buying CD's is financially STUPID

E: METALLICA is worth collectively 400 MILLION DOLLARS

Paul Mccartney is worth 1 BILLION



And you know what they have in common? Metallica and Paul Mccartney?

They haven't either done a thing worth it's weight in dog POOP since they lost their feeling and emotion within a few years of being rich anyway...

I am an Artist/designer whatever...

I DO believe ... I shouldn't be ripped off, I do believe I deserve to make lots of money...

But no, you don't fine Kids 2 Million bucks if they print a poster of mine and hang it on the wall if they are poor...

You autograph it for them anyway... and Thank God you get to make music or art or whatever for a living and say "oh well" if you make 2 Million not 4 Million that year...

and you also... be thankful for the Internet and a bit o competition and realize your making new fans and allot of people just LIKE you get to also, do what they LOVE for a living, you don't make yourself into some kind of God in your own eyes and shoot the TV like Elvis when someone passes you because of it either.

In a nutshell...these people are creeps

The laws are as corrupt and biased as they come


The one of the worst offenses of the "elite" against the poor is being perpetuated in the name of MUSIC and ART

REAL TALENT... plays on the street and doesn't CARE about Platinum

posted on Aug, 25 2009 @ 02:55 AM
reply to post by Karlhungis
You are right and you know why the laws are such?

Because our government is not run for the people and by the people.

America is run for the large corporations and by the large corporations.

Read my location under my avatar. I did not chose that wording lightly.

[edit on 25-8-2009 by ofhumandescent]

posted on Aug, 25 2009 @ 04:05 AM
reply to post by smurfy

If production costs for cars dropped to 5c would you still want to pay several 1000 dollars for one?
That's the thing: 20 years ago to produce a record you had to invest quite heavily. (I am old enough to recall the first home use CD burners for around 1000 dollars) Before that, to make a vinyl you basically need a factory.
Not anymore.
It's capitalism 101 actually: If your services add no value and are not required you will have a hard time finding customers. As i said before: look what happened to the blacksmiths! Used to have one or even several in every town... damn you Ford and Benz!!!

posted on Aug, 25 2009 @ 09:03 AM
reply to post by Moodle

The problem is that the musicians really have little say in it. The record and production companies are who really cares. I think the two points should go more like this:

a. Musicians prosper more from utilizing file sharing than from fighting it.

b. Digital information IS free. Music, videos or software. Not because these things should be free, but because attempting to control them is near impossible without violating free speech and re-designing the internet.

It isn't a matter of morals or ethics, it's a matter of practicality. It's too hard to control, therefore it should be used.

posted on Aug, 25 2009 @ 11:32 AM
reply to post by Moodle

Next point: Beer should be free.

posted on Aug, 25 2009 @ 11:39 AM
Hmm now perhaps pop 'artists' could take a lesson from Tool and write, master, and PERFORM their own music then Id care about their 7 figure salary.
Tool has few fans but every fan LOVES them and has their cds and their concerts sell out hmm... last one near here sold out in 28 minutes. Freaking ridiculous. But hey you put actual EFFORT into art and people will appreciate it

posted on Aug, 25 2009 @ 01:41 PM
reply to post by Moodle

well if im paying 10-15 dollars a cd and i buy 5000 songs worth of cds in this broke down economy. that means i have no music to listen to.

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