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White House - Lockerbie bomber welcome "disturbing"

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posted on Aug, 21 2009 @ 03:17 PM
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Originally posted by jimbo2167
Are you Bill O'Relly or Glen Beck?


For your information, I hate both.

But I must resign from this discussion as you show no evidence of common sense and reason.




posted on Aug, 21 2009 @ 03:17 PM
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Originally posted by Retseh

Originally posted by jimbo2167
Why the hell do you want an innocent man to die in jail when
it should be the real culprits who are brougfht to justice?



Tried and found innocent in the court of ATS?

Last time I checked he was found guilty in YOUR court system, and never reprieved.



You don't really care do you, as long as the good old U.S of A is
being seen to kick ass throughout the world people like you really
don't give a #.


And here you have the real reason for the release.



The real reason people like you don't give a # about anything
outside the U.S. Correct

Now tell me when are the Iranian people getting their revenge
for the barbaric slaughter by the U.S Navy on Iran Air Flight 655?

When does Libya get its revenge?
Afghanistan?
Iraq?



posted on Aug, 21 2009 @ 03:30 PM
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Jim Swire's daughter, Flora, died on the flight.

He founded the campaign to have al-Megrahi freed on compassionate grounds. He's a remarkable man indeed.

Justice for Megrahi Campaign

How can some here say "let al-Megrahi rot in jail" when many who lost relatives on that flight don't share your certainty ? How can you be so outraged when those who have suffered have campaigned for this man's release ?

It's not anti-American to look askance at all this faux outrage and contrived passion. Nor is it anti-American to hope for progress through forgiveness & reconciliation rather than revenge and bitterness.

I see some Americans now advocate a consumer boycott of Scottish goods & services. Can you imagine that ? Citizens of a nation which has blitzed its way around the world over the last generation, killing tens if not hundreds of thousands of civilians, now advocate boycotting an entire nation simply because its Justice Minister had the temerity to say "No" to requests made by United States officials.

It's absolutely unbelievable. The sheer nauseating hypocrisy of it all beggars belief.

Boycott Scotland



posted on Aug, 21 2009 @ 03:34 PM
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Originally posted by Retseh

Originally posted by john124
It seems the power hungry tentacles on the US govt. cannot let go of anything, with their excessive tantrums until they get what they want.



That's a pretty disgusting statement, even for a Brit.

You release someone who has murdered 270 people, mostly Americans, and you not only defend that decision, but sneeringly insult us in the process.

I hope those Americans reading this thread take note of your words, you're fairly representative of your countrymen.


Just a fairly accurate observation. You obviously don't understand the situation by your comments.



posted on Aug, 21 2009 @ 03:35 PM
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Originally posted by buddhasystem

Originally posted by jimbo2167
Are you Bill O'Relly or Glen Beck?


For your information, I hate both.

But I must resign from this discussion as you show no evidence of common sense and reason.



Editing this post as I won't spoil the thread like you have by petty insults.

Pretty ironic all the same that you hate Beck and O'Reilly while singing
from the same hymn sheet.

Where exactly did you get your information about Al Magrahi
because all your posts are screaming out for revenge and
you don't seem sure who the enemy is.
Sounds like a Fox News fan to me.

[edit on 21/8/09 by jimbo2167]



posted on Aug, 21 2009 @ 04:16 PM
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reply to post by john124
 


Everybody in our court system is pontentially innocent. Innocent until proven guilty (probably much like the systems in Europe).

You could say that of a rapist or a child molestor. But that doesn't make them innocent. But ultimately, I care more for the victims than I do the criminals. Assuming this man is guilty (As he has yet to prove innocence after being proven guilty) then he doesn't deserve compassion.

The dead can't be asked that question? That's my point exactly. He gets to live, and they got to die because he decided to bomb them. Screw compassion, he never provided it himself. Now, if he is proven innocent? I'll take back what I said and admit he was treated unfairly.



posted on Aug, 21 2009 @ 05:22 PM
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John124's comments seem fairly typical of the neo-Trotskyite masses I got used to in Scotland. Dubious allies indeed. Soon, the UK will be overrun with wild-eyed Mullahs from South Asia who can bond with them. PM Brown, while he had little say in this matter, is hopefully already asking the security service what the potential blowback will be. There will be blowback.



posted on Aug, 21 2009 @ 06:08 PM
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The amount of thinly veiled threats on this thread
by Yanks is a joke.

None talk of justice but only revenge, well lets talk revenge.

On the 3rd of July 1988, the U.S Navy saw fit to gun down
Iran Air Flight 655, murdering 290 innocent people, 66 were children.

The Iranians vowed revenge.

In August President Bush said "I'll never apologise on behalf of America,
I don't care about the facts".

In 1996 the U.S paid $61.8 Million in compensation for the Iranians killed.
The U.S Government to this day have never apologised for their actions.

Revenge, well there you have it.



posted on Aug, 21 2009 @ 06:10 PM
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Originally posted by jimbo2167
Now tell me when are the Iranian people getting their revenge
for the barbaric slaughter by the U.S Navy on Iran Air Flight 655?


Good point



Iran Air Flight 655

Iran Air Flight 655, also known as IR655, was a civilian airliner shot down by the United States Navy on Sunday 3 July 1988, over the Strait of Hormuz.

The aircraft, an Airbus A300B2 operated by Iran Air as IR655, was flying from Bandar Abbas, Iran, to Dubai, UAE, when it was destroyed by the U.S. Navy's guided missile cruiser USS Vincennes, killing all 290 passengers and crew aboard, including 66 children,[1] ranking it the seventh among the deadliest airliner fatalities.[2] It was the highest death toll of any aviation incident in the Indian Ocean and the highest death toll of any incident involving an Airbus A300 anywhere in the world. The Vincennes was traversing the Straits of Hormuz inside Iranian territorial waters and at the time of the attack, IR655 was within Iranian airspace.

According to the US government, the crew mistakenly identified the Iranian Airbus A300 as an attacking F-14 Tomcat fighter. The Iranian government maintained that the Vincennes knowingly shot down the civilian aircraft. The event generated a great deal of controversy and criticism of the US. Some analysts have blamed US military commanders and the captain of the Vincennes for reckless and aggressive behavior in a tense and dangerous environment.[3][4]

After completing their tour, the crew of the Vincennes was awarded Combat Action Ribbons for having actively participated in ground or surface combat, and the captain received the Legion of Merit. (The Combat Action Ribbon was also given to crews from other U.S. naval vessels who served in Persian Gulf Operations from 1987–88.)[5]

In 1996, the United States and Iran reached "an agreement in full and final settlement of all disputes, differences, claims, counterclaims" relating to the incident at the International Court of Justice.[6] As part of the settlement, the United States agreed to pay US$61.8 million in compensation for the Iranians killed. The United States did not admit responsibility or apologize to the Iranian government.


Medals awarded for service in combat in shooting down a civilian airliner...now that is the definition of "disturbing"

[edit on 21-8-2009 by Taikonaut]



posted on Aug, 21 2009 @ 06:35 PM
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Just heard through a friend of Al Magrahi's lawyer there will be
no public inquiry or appeal and the case is and always will be closed
and the details of the appeal are being buried for 30 years under
the terms of his release.

[edit on 21/8/09 by jimbo2167]



posted on Aug, 21 2009 @ 07:09 PM
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Originally posted by EastCoastElitist
John124's comments seem fairly typical of the neo-Trotskyite masses I got used to in Scotland. Dubious allies indeed. Soon, the UK will be overrun with wild-eyed Mullahs from South Asia who can bond with them. PM Brown, while he had little say in this matter, is hopefully already asking the security service what the potential blowback will be. There will be blowback.


Do you feel the need to categorise people so generally into whatever stupid terms you use.... maybe you also think every muslim is a terrorist, or that all of the 1000 crowd of Libyans are evil islamics when they are probably just curious people who saw him in the news - especially the younger people.

What blowback could there be?? Libyan's seeing an opportunity for better western relations?? Is that so bad?? Unless the US try and impose sanctions on Libya.

It's funny how on ats I've been called the following: israeli spy, other western spies, neo-con pro-war supporter, and now some more bull# generalisations.

I think from this we learn that people on ats like to make generalisations about others in order to make the world fit their narrow pre-conceived views. Life isn't that simple, and just like I support the US govt. on some issues, on others I disagree. Therefore we can't also generalise all of the Libyans as welcoming him home as a terrorist hero. They may even feel he's innocent, and welcome better relations with the west should the US govt. not throw any more hissy fits.

Isn't al-Megrahi and his family allowed to look happy that he has returned home?

The comments here left by American's are stiffled by their own anger at wanting revenge which is just a transposition from their own mass-media which refuses to tackle this story objectively, and instead appeals emotionally to American's because all they hear about are one-sided views and relatives of the victims.

[edit on 21-8-2009 by john124]



posted on Aug, 21 2009 @ 07:20 PM
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Originally posted by Taikonaut

Originally posted by jimbo2167
Now tell me when are the Iranian people getting their revenge
for the barbaric slaughter by the U.S Navy on Iran Air Flight 655?


Good point



Iran Air Flight 655

Iran Air Flight 655, also known as IR655, was a civilian airliner shot down by the United States Navy on Sunday 3 July 1988, over the Strait of Hormuz.

The aircraft, an Airbus A300B2 operated by Iran Air as IR655, was flying from Bandar Abbas, Iran, to Dubai, UAE, when it was destroyed by the U.S. Navy's guided missile cruiser USS Vincennes, killing all 290 passengers and crew aboard, including 66 children,[1] ranking it the seventh among the deadliest airliner fatalities.[2] It was the highest death toll of any aviation incident in the Indian Ocean and the highest death toll of any incident involving an Airbus A300 anywhere in the world. The Vincennes was traversing the Straits of Hormuz inside Iranian territorial waters and at the time of the attack, IR655 was within Iranian airspace.

According to the US government, the crew mistakenly identified the Iranian Airbus A300 as an attacking F-14 Tomcat fighter. The Iranian government maintained that the Vincennes knowingly shot down the civilian aircraft. The event generated a great deal of controversy and criticism of the US. Some analysts have blamed US military commanders and the captain of the Vincennes for reckless and aggressive behavior in a tense and dangerous environment.[3][4]

After completing their tour, the crew of the Vincennes was awarded Combat Action Ribbons for having actively participated in ground or surface combat, and the captain received the Legion of Merit. (The Combat Action Ribbon was also given to crews from other U.S. naval vessels who served in Persian Gulf Operations from 1987–88.)[5]

In 1996, the United States and Iran reached "an agreement in full and final settlement of all disputes, differences, claims, counterclaims" relating to the incident at the International Court of Justice.[6] As part of the settlement, the United States agreed to pay US$61.8 million in compensation for the Iranians killed. The United States did not admit responsibility or apologize to the Iranian government.


Medals awarded for service in combat in shooting down a civilian airliner...now that is the definition of "disturbing"

[edit on 21-8-2009 by Taikonaut]


Incredible!! I didn't even know about medals being rewarded. Absolutely despicable. What about the families of those killed from Iran? Are American's going to be just as angry and upset for them too? Or does the $61.8 million (which is peanuts to the US) compensate them enough?



posted on Aug, 21 2009 @ 07:21 PM
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Al-Megrahi is dying of cancer, that is all the revenge anybody needs.

To those who here who still thinks more revenge is needed, then just get it into your thick skulls that he is GOING TO DIE SOON FROM CANCER!!!

[edit on 21-8-2009 by john124]



posted on Aug, 21 2009 @ 07:41 PM
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Does anyone consider it ironic that they let this guy onto a PLAINE back to Libya?

I couldn't disagree with this release more. Why would you let a convicted mass murderer go free back home just because of rectal cancer? To me it would be just fitting for him to rot in prison where he was.



posted on Aug, 21 2009 @ 10:31 PM
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Originally posted by Wimbly
reply to post by john124
 


Basically, the terrorist won and will now motivate new terrorists. Instead of dying in prison, he got out and as far as those crowds are concerned he won a great victory. Think of all the people who now might take action, because they have been motivated by the weakness of their enemies.

It was a stupid, misguided move and people will more than likely die because of it.


I'm wondering if there isn't more to this than meets the eye.

Maybe this was disapproved of by London and it's a way of Scotland 'throwing the head up' so to speak. Scotland now refer to their own 'Government' which was a no-no till recently, so perhaps it's a way of separating themselves from London and ergo the US?

'Wimbly',
I can only speak from experience, can you? Here in Northern Ireland for every 'martyr' that died plenty took their place, look at Margaret Thatcher's decision regarding the hunger strikers, it was one ofthe biggest recruiting drives the 'Ra ever had and a nightmare for all concerned which still reverberates to this very day.

How? Well the Omagh bomb was planted by the Real IRA who have a member called Michael McKevitt..his wife is the important thing here though..

Her name? Bernadette SANDS McKevitt.

She was hunger strike martyr Bobby Sand's sister. Now, that has got to be one bitter lady. Whatever your political stance.

See what I mean? A ripple effect in action to this very day- from the dead. Your gov needs to learn from history or repeat it's mistakes. Don't fuss over this, and more importantly don't be seen to fuss. Do business quietly. Walk softly..big stick.

No. no, never a dead martyr, especially one who dies in prision. Keeping him in prison may have made you feel justice was done ( it would not have been, his victims remain dead ) but many more may have been killed had they left him in prison.

Dead = Martyr = Very Bad Thing



posted on Aug, 22 2009 @ 01:39 AM
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Originally posted by john124

It's ridiculous to trash relations with Libya to save face over what is a very small matter that he will actually get to see his family before he dies.


The people he killed in the bombing didn't get a chance to see their families before they died... why should he?



posted on Aug, 22 2009 @ 02:59 AM
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For a conspiracy theory website, there is only argument as to compasson given or the hero's welcome, what about whether guilty or not.

I don't claim to know who was really responsible or why, just something smells fishy in this whole case.

www.scamtypes.com...

DRUGS, BOMBS AND THE CIA
One of the many conspiracy theories suggests that that the U.S. Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) had set up a protected drug route from Europe to the United States.
Some people allege that this route was known as ‘Operation Corea’ and suggest that Syrian drug dealers, led by Monzer al-Kassar (who was involved with Oliver North in the Iran-Contra scandal) used it to ship heroin to the U.S.
These conspiracy theorists say that the American intelligence community then received intel on Palestinian groups based in Syria in exchange.
It is alleged that the CIA protected the suitcases containing the drugs and ensured they were not searched.
The theory suggests that on the day of the bombing a suitcase containing drugs was switched for the one that contained the bomb.
WHITE POWDER AND $547,000
After the explosion debris fell on Lockerbie.
In the aftermath of the disaster two teenagers claim to have found over half a million dollars in travellers cheques.
A reporter, David Johnstone, reported on white powder being found in polythene bags.
Furthermore, Wikipedia reports that a mountain rescuer wash ushered away from a field containing a large tarpaulin.
Conspiracy theorists believe that the tarpaulin covered a container which they believe may have belonged to Major Charles McKee, belived to have been a special forces operative.
This particular theory continues by suggesting that the CIA allowed the alleged drugs and bomb to be switched because the protected drugs route was a rogue operation, and Maj. Charles McKee had found out about it, and was on his way to Washington to tell his superiors.

www.conspiracyplanet.com...

Conspiracy: CIA Planted Fake Lockerbie Evidence
by MARCELLO MEGA
(EDITOR'S NOTE: How long will this police chief stay alive? Lester Coleman's book "The Trail of the Octopus" describes the CIA drug trafficking operation which ended as the Lockerbie disaster.
A former Scottish police chief has given lawyers a signed statement claiming that key evidence in the Lockerbie bombing trial was fabricated.
The retired officer - of assistant chief constable rank or higher - has testified that the CIA planted the tiny fragment of circuit board crucial in convicting a Libyan for the 1989 mass murder of 270 people.
The police chief, whose identity has not yet been revealed, gave the statement to lawyers representing Abdelbaset Ali Mohmed Al Megrahi, currently serving a life sentence in Greenock Prison.


Also other Lockerbie conspiracy theories.
en.wikipedia.org...
Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine - General Command
Iran
CIA drug smuggling
Alleged framing of Libya
Iran and the London angle
Radio detonation
South-West Africa (Namibia)






[edit on 22-8-2009 by acrux]



posted on Aug, 22 2009 @ 04:44 AM
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reply to post by Ulala
 


Well said - the level of outrage and double standards is quite something to behold.

Here is one example that happens to be in todays news I'm sure there are similar situations in history, too many to quote if you were to take the time to do so..

news.bbc.co.uk...

Here is a an American man who was involved in the massacre of 500 people including women and children, he was convicted on 22 counts of murder but ended up serving a 3 year house arrest term... he now says he's sorry for the first time in nearly 40 years.. should he rot in hell? Was he only obeying orders? Is this an example of double standards?

Let me say this - I love America, I've been several times, all over the US. I've never met a bad American yet, they have been decent, warm hearted, courteous, helpful, funny and damn fine human beings so this isn't meant to be a swipe at the people, this is to draw attention to the double standards that are being displayed.

There is much more to this than is being presented in the news, the reaction by the Libyans is regrettable but not surprising, imagine the situation from the other side. If a US citizen had been imprisoned in Libya and and no American truly believed him to be guilty and they were then returned to US soil a few weeks before they were to die how do you think this would be presented in the news?

Without being in the know of what is truly going on here all that is happening is that people are getting their chains yanked by the media which creates ill feeling among decent citizens on both sides of the Atlantic, which is a great shame.

B



posted on Aug, 22 2009 @ 06:39 AM
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Originally posted by craig732

Originally posted by john124

It's ridiculous to trash relations with Libya to save face over what is a very small matter that he will actually get to see his family before he dies.


The people he killed in the bombing didn't get a chance to see their families before they died... why should he?


Neither did the families of those on the Iranian flight shot down by the US.

Maybe in a civilised society we feel it more appropriate to treat people the way we wish to be treated.

Or does your brain shout "revenge revenge revenge" when the US govt. could not even be bothered to apologise for killing 290 Iranian's.

[edit on 22-8-2009 by john124]



posted on Aug, 22 2009 @ 09:41 AM
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reply to post by john124
 


You continually have used the term "revenge". Revenge has nothing to do with it. Ask the Russian mafia. It's deterrence. Of course prison is no real deterrence either. The entire idea of putting terrorists on trial is bizarre and self-defeating. Okay, Lefties - let the squealing begin!



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