Demonic Video Games

Outright banning of video games that are questionable to certain humans is filtering out freedom of expression. There are books which paint far more vivid acts of depravity than what is found in Postal 2.

Once we start monitoring and deciding what humans can *think* based on our personal set of morals (no matter how many others may also share them) we start sliding down the slippery slope of thought control.

If a person if playing a video game, reading a book, watching a movie or even day dreaming in their head. Whatever they are feeling is personal to them. Whether it is disgust, fear, anger, happiness; it is their feelings.

If the thoughts move into physical action then they will be held accountable as any and all other humans.

As a society we must stop judging other people's thoughts lest we move down the path of 1984 and declare all other people who don't think like 'us' (which ever group is in power) as criminals and social deviants.

Expression of thought comes in so many forms; but the problem only comes when the form chosen is a physical act against another creature; be it human or animal; until that point letting people express their idea's in programmed video games is just the evolution of writing books or poetry.

--Loqeth

Originally posted by loqeth
Outright banning of video games that are questionable to certain humans is filtering out freedom of expression. There are books which paint far more vivid acts of depravity than what is found in Postal 2.

Dont forget that crime does not fall under "freedom of expression". You have the freedom to express yourself as long as it is somewhat mindful of others. Im not calling for a ban on this particular game, but it borders closely on being criminal.

Once we start monitoring and deciding what humans can *think* based on our personal set of morals (no matter how many others may also share them) we start sliding down the slippery slope of thought control.

A slight amount of thought-control has uplifted us from barbarian savagery to at least some decency. In other words, the thought to go out and slay fellow humans has been brought under control of our more benign sides.

If the thoughts move into physical action then they will be held accountable as any and all other humans.

Some apologists of this stuff have already stated in this thread that they dont care about the law.

As a society we must stop judging other people's thoughts lest we move down the path of 1984 and declare all other people who don't think like 'us' (which ever group is in power) as criminals and social deviants.

Re-defining (Newspeak) the promotion of criminal behavior as fun entertainment is so much more Orwellian than questioning it.

Within this thread I merely questioned it and was ripped apart as a "tyrant".

The Orwellian hive-mind is in full effect.

Expression of thought comes in so many forms; but the problem only comes when the form chosen is a physical act against another creature;

Psychological Terror is not something to be brushed aside. It needs more studying.

I'm with sky floating on this one:

After much and deliberate thought, without violent video games we would NOT have had to endure both of the world wars (caused by a particularly over-weight Quake fan who ate Archduke Franz Ferdinand and was mistaken for an anarchist) and also Hitler who was a dedicated Counter-strike fan who just took things too far.

Jack the ripper was a notorious gamer, in between chopping up prostitutes (to cover up alleged homosexual claims within the british royalty and working for the free masons) he could often be found at the local internet cafe feverously devoting himself to a daily world of warcraft addiction.

The atrocities in Cambodia were not commited under the rule of Pol Pot (as is often mistakenly believed) but in actual fact was due to a game of grand theft auto getting out of control. This cost 1.7 million lives. Rockstar games have refused to comment.

The ancient Greek Peloppenisian war between Athens and Sparta was again blamed on video games, notably due to the Thebans being unable to seperate reality from the fantastical elements of Fall out III.

The Waterloo creek massacre in 1838 were nearly 300 aboriginal Australians were beaten and hacked to death by colonisers was almost certainly due to a grudge over a game of Tekken tag (as were the witch trials of europe AND the Taiping rebellion 1851-1864).

Mortal Kombat II was 100% responsible for the Dublaine massacre (and had very little to do with the fact that a notorious and seriously troubled paedophile was allowed to keep loaded hand guns).

Through out history, humans have always dodged the question as to what makes humans violent? Any true thinker (with half a brain) can tell you that before video games were invented we NEVER had violence in any way shape or form. Humans instead preferred to spend their time dancing and deep breathing in fields.

Yes dear people... Violent video games are wholly responsible for every degree of violence that has ever dared to present itself in the history of the human race.

Without somebody telling us what NOT to play and what NOT to watch, we can only wonder what is around the next corner...

So remember kids, unplug your xbox 360 before YOU commit genocide.

reply to post by mr-lizard


Do you see the contradiction in opposing those real-life-tyrants behavior but then later glorifying it in a game?

While Im against banning, it is important to educate the gullible about what it actually means to glorify killing-sprees.

In other words, people willingly pay for and crave ultra-violent behavior and then they are shocked when it actually happens...

How gullible can you get. Not a clue of the cause-effect relationship between thoughts and reality.

[edit on 22-8-2009 by Skyfloating]

Originally posted by Skyfloating
reply to post by mr-lizard

 

Do you see the contradiction in opposing those real-life-tyrants behavior but then later glorifying it in a game?

The biggest difference in a world war 2 game is the fact that most players would much prefer to pilot a fighter plane and engage in a dog fight against the luftwaffe or engage in a daring mission across occupied europe to take out Tanks.

I have NEVER seen a game were you gas jews and execute handicapped people or forcibly inject prisoners of war with a lethal coctail.


Whilst we're at it Skyfloating since we're on anti glorifying campaign, i think we should tear down Hollywood and burn our DVD collections just in case we accidently watch 'The eagle has landed' or 'the great escape' or 'Rambo IV' because obviously we don't want our children to be reminded of the horrors of our past.

And that Steven Spielberg should be ashamed of himself for his depiction of the fate of the jews in Schindlers list. (funnily enough i've yet to see a video game of that?)

Now if you'll excuse me, i'm going to go and self harm myself because i've been playing too much Grand theft auto.

reply to post by mr-lizard




That was brilliant man...

I have refrained from posting in this thread, been following it though, and your post is the best thing in it


Edit to add:

Yes the postal games are in bad taste and don't interest me at all.... but from what people have said about them, I have seen far worse in movies than this game could ever do.

And i don't want to go and decapitate anyone or piss on a dead body.

You have to be pretty messed up to want to copy a violent act you've witnessed in a game/movie/show..... to the point that you would probably commit said crime with or without the movie's "Guidance"

It's like when they banned Child's play 3 because of the Jamie Bulger case... Made no sense whatsoever?

You can't ban everything violent or extreme because someone with mental problems wants to copy it?

Where would you draw the line?

[edit on 22/8/09 by blupblup]

Originally posted by Skyfloating
In other words, people willingly pay for and crave ultra-violent behavior and then they are shocked when it actually happens...

How gullible can you get. Not a clue of the cause-effect relationship between thoughts and reality.

Is this not the biggest clue of all.

We are violent by nature not by exposure to a visual medium?

reply to post by mr-lizard


The animal-side within the human can be overcome by the cultivation of higher thought (benevolence)

[edit on 22-8-2009 by Skyfloating]

Originally posted by Skyfloating
reply to post by mr-lizard

 

The animal-side within the human can be overcome by the cultivation of higher thought (benevolence)

This animalistic behaviour can also be subdued by engaging in a post-coital woodbine.

Works for me.

reply to post by mr-lizard


I agree that games most likley do not make most people more violent.

My issue is with games or any media that scars the psyche. I'm concerned with unconscious effects or the impact it has on the human subconcious.

More research needs to be done to evaluate the affect of media in regards to various mental disorders.

From a military standpoint I already know that media can be traumatic if used in psychological operations. This can include simulated and actual media. If it can be effective in demoralizing the enemy, I am sure media can be effective in demoralizing average people.

I don't even have an issue for the most part with games like GTA, Saint's Row, or The Godfather. My issue is with games that could produce a traumatic effect, like the future Postal 3, Manhunt 2, and some of the Silent Hill games. More studies and research need to be done to determine the long term psychological impact of such games.



[edit on 22/8/09 by MikeboydUS]

Maybe i've been a 'little' sarcastic, but i do believe most true gamers would avoid trash like postal.

Much as in the same way a wine enthusiast would prefer to sip the fruits of a red bordeaux over Tesco value wine.

Gamers are not drones - we have souls, minds and hearts.

Peace

reply to post by Skyfloating


go cry to mothers of america. seriously reading your describition of the game makes me want to play it. They could have left out the crack pipes and the the cat silencers but still it is only a game and we all have a choice in our decisions. If a game causes someone to act the way the "hero" or main character does then that person has an issue. For the rest of the gaming industry to try this means that that is were the market is going because people might be having a hard time right now and need a release. If you have something to complain about then do it on something worth while that matters . Not some video game. Once again. If you dont like what you are looking at or seeing, then look the other way.

reply to post by mr-lizard


Actually about WW2 games I always wanted a game where you could play as a nazi and actually change the "past"... but oh well... at least they lifted that stupid swastika ban from games and the next wolfenstein will feature the swastika again...!!!!

How is this game borderline criminal? While being crude, immoral and tasteless, I fail to see how it's skirting breaking the law by playing it. I haven't played this game and do not plan on purchasing it for the record.

Ahh.. good old Doom..gosh haven’t played that in years. I do recall wasting hours of my life playing quake 1, 2 and 3 and playing in quake capture the flag leagues, even staying late in work to play on the T1 connections to frag all the dial ups.

This has been touched upon by others that yes the military use this technology for training and as mentioned before can improve the accuracy of shooting. This is disturbing when in the context of this article

The Psychological Effects of Violent Media on Children

As with Michael Carneal, from Kentucky, who in 1997 shot and killed three of his classmates. He too was also said to have been a video game fanatic. Michael Breen an attorney in the case against Michael Carneal stated in court; “Michael Carneal clipped off nine shots in a 10-second period. Eight of those shots were hits. Three were head and neck shots and were kills. That is way beyond the military standard for expert marksmanship. This was a kid who had never fired a pistol in his life, but because of his obsession with computer games he had turned himself into an expert marksman” (Ivory, 2003), (Hanson, 1999, p. 15).

The Doom engine for example has been revamped to Marine Doom replacing the monsters with enemies.

www.experiencefestival.com...

Although the Defense Advanced Projects Research Agency (DARPA) has had plans for using video games since the early 1980s, it was not until 1996, shortly after computer-based wargames were permitted on government computers for U.S. Marines, U.S. Marine simulation experts created Marine Doom, a modification of the commercial game Doom II as a tactical training tool.

Although these games are not intended for children they do of course filter down due to sloppy parenting and the use of media as some sort of electronic babysitter.

www.examiner.com...

“By the time a child is eighteen years old, he or she will witness on television (with average viewing time) 200,000 acts of violence including 40,000 murders,” states the National Institute on Media and the Family (NIMF).

I agree that studies are subjective at best and although brain scans can be obtained whilst an adult is playing a violent game, scans have not been obtained whilst an adult is taking part in a violent act.. yet.!!

Violent media numb viewers to the pain of others

The studies fill an important research gap in the literature on the impact of violent media. In earlier work, Bushman and Anderson demonstrated that exposure to violent media produces physiological desensitization—lowering heart rate and skin conductance—when viewing scenes of actual violence a short time later. But the current research demonstrates that violent media also affect someone's willingness to offer help to an injured person, in a field study as well as in a laboratory experiment.

In one of the studies, 320 college students played either a violent or a nonviolent video game for approximately 20 minutes. A few minutes later, they overheard a staged fight that ended with the "victim" sustaining a sprained ankle and groaning in pain.
People who had played a violent game took significantly longer to help the victim than those who played a nonviolent game—73 seconds compared to 16 seconds. People who had played a violent game were also less likely to notice and report the fight. And if they did report it, they judged it to be less serious than did those who had played a nonviolent game

What to do? Do we need censorship as the German Parliament is trying to push through?

No absolutely not, but I believe as humans we should preserve our integrity and safeguard our dignity

Germany considers ban on violent games

Violent games may soon be a thing of the past in Germany. GamePolitics reports that the country’s sixteen interior ministers have banded together to petition the Bundestag (Germany's equivalent of Parliament) for a ban on both the production and distribution of violent games. If approved, the ban could be fully enforced before the next German elections in September, forcing companies like Crytek to either relocate or outsource development work.

Do we really need scientific studies to show us that watching hours of violent actions is having an detrimental effect on our psyche?

Many are the times I have played Doom only to get up right after and wail on demons and Nazi's and people

Come on folks...if you turned evil or murderous because of a game then you were evil and murderous before the game

-Kyo

One thing i have noticed about games (well alot) that are violent to that extent,
and thats games trying to be more 'realistic'.

I actually didnt realise how important (and how freightning) the D-Day landings were until i played Medal of Honour.

Don't start this crap again. The christian and family groups in the eighties went after cartoons and also rock music. That's why anime is still fringe and hasn't entered the mainstream culture. How come no one in Japan is objecting to anime. How come no one in Europe is objecting to video games. Grow up and join the 21st Century.

Grow up. There's no tooth fairy, no santa claus, no Jesus,the world isn't black and white. Grow up.