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Where is your God?!

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posted on Aug, 20 2009 @ 10:58 AM
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Originally posted by Republican08 Why do we 'all' go to heaven. Why do we need a judging process. They should already know, and I for damn sure know what I've done good and bad in my life. Even the little things in life.

We all do not go to heaven. Logic behind God's version of freewill is based upon humility. Even though someone confesses a sin, they can do it without being honest with themselves. God can see into the truth of things, so you cannot bluff by hiding emotions. Its all about how honest you are to God and yourself. Do not confess unless you are truthfully seeking redemption. He can tell the difference.

Hitler in heaven? Not a chance. God had warned against false prophets and demons. Some of these demons appear to be Christian in nature, but they are only here to promote damnation.

Touchy subject :: Obama can go both ways. Since he proclaimed to be a Christian, he should have straightened out those people who called him their messiah. Humility would have been to confront these people, and to tell them that there is only one God and messiah. Instead of being humble to God, he used their illusion of him to win an election. That is not being a Christian. Obama still has a chance to obtain redemption, but he is the only one in control of his own freewill.

Confession = Humility.
Humility = Redemption.

[edit on 20-8-2009 by Pathos]




posted on Aug, 20 2009 @ 11:00 AM
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reply to post by makinho21
 


Yet again another rubbish argument.

If nobody lives near a volcano and it errupts...then is the volcano erupting "evil" / "terrible" / "disatrous" ...no.

As soon as humans are present it is terrible, evil, suffering, disatrous, flawed by design.

Comon now...



posted on Aug, 20 2009 @ 11:14 AM
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Originally posted by makinho21reply to post by Wookiep
 


So our free-will resulted in a tsunami around Christmas that killed 10,000+ people?
Or are natural laws above god's influence. Surely he created everything in this world, so he must have created the mechanisms in nature that allowed for such a thing to occur.

God can control all the elements, but he will not interfere with the natural course of life. One of the greatest flaws about religious sects is translating the Bible. Almost every Christian and Islam miss one important 'fact'.

"Is the Earth alive?" Is the Earth a living and breathing entity, which requires certain conditions to survive? Yes. If it does not have certain elements to sustain it, the Earth will be dead like Mars. When God makes choices over when and how to interfere, he also has to consider Earth as a living entity.

If you consider the Earth as a living vessel, mankind is similar to a flu virus. We multiply, damage our environment, live for short periods of time, and then die.

[edit on 20-8-2009 by Pathos]



posted on Aug, 20 2009 @ 11:39 AM
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easy answer for a hard question .

god is perfect order ... god made people perfect ....

each person is perfectly made for one thing and one thing only ... and they sux at everything else ...

5% of the people on earth are angels to you.
5% of the people on earth are demons to you.
90% of the people on earth are good , hard working , honest and not very bright to you.

never assume malviolance ... when ignorance will explain it .
the guy is not a demon... he is just stupid , brainless , sleep walking thru life .

there is true evil in the world ... and goodness in the world ... but that is rare and very very hard to find .

and your demon's are some one elses angel's

your the bad guy to some one else on earth .

its an easy answer to a hard question , 90% of the time its a good answer .

you need a hug or a gun the rest of the time (about 5% of the time) unless your numb and and apathic .



posted on Aug, 20 2009 @ 11:45 AM
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reply to post by readerone
 


Quote of the day



you need a hug or a gun the rest of the time (about 5% of the time) unless your numb and and apathic .



Best thing i've heard all day!



posted on Aug, 20 2009 @ 12:07 PM
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reply to post by Republican08
 


Well god is you and me.
You let that happen to that guy in the picture as much as i did.
God if you speak of the all powerful creator of everything...
He need's not interfere..Or else it would be Fact He exists and people would follow him regardless.
Because they know for a Fact he exists he is standing right there.

I use to claim i was a atheist.
But i am really more of undecided.
Do we have it right now? No
God in those book's is man made.

But there is a creator of all life as we know it.
It's called ENERGY...
Can never die or be created...


And it is in everyone of us.
Thus God is in everyone of us.
We are made in god's image....

But Stuff like war..Torture ect...
Is not god's fault even if there is one.
It's man's.



posted on Aug, 20 2009 @ 01:00 PM
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reply to post by Republican08
 


Republican08

there are no tests.

religion was created by our slave race in attempt to feel a sense of purpose. religion is the worship of something outside of yourself. it is the worship of something more powerful than our meager minds.

what more would you expect from slaves?

a race genetically created and manipulated to not think, but to SERVE.

a few of us rise up out of the muck and cry FOUL........and are stoned and ridiculed for thinking outside of our genetic programming.

my friend.........the answer is very simple. but everyone wants to make it so complicated with their gods, and devils, and hell, and heaven.

they want to believe that their life matters and that they have purpose. this is because of the ego genetically mapped in their brain matter. it comes from their creators.

the only problem is they don't have the genetic power that their creators do. we have the high octane fuel (ego), but not the 500 horsepower engine.

we were created to work. that is all. now we have all this free time on our hands because our creators left a long time ago. the strongest of our species rise up and attempt to mimic our creators. they rule the rest because they are the strongest minds.

does my babble answer any of your questions?

[edit on 20-8-2009 by dimensionaljumper]

[edit on 20-8-2009 by dimensionaljumper]



posted on Aug, 20 2009 @ 01:24 PM
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Originally posted by Toughiv
reply to post by makinho21
 


Yet again another rubbish argument.

If nobody lives near a volcano and it errupts...then is the volcano erupting "evil" / "terrible" / "disatrous" ...no.

As soon as humans are present it is terrible, evil, suffering, disatrous, flawed by design.

Comon now...


That's exactly what I'm saying, maybe I didn't get my point across very well.

If this world is made and centered around us - heck the universe is too, if we take the scriptures and OT as true - I'm just asking why nature would provide such a disastrous thing in the first place. If our existence is so divine, why is it so easily squashed? The fact our galaxy is heading towards imminent destruction in millions and millions of years doesn't really help the posit of "creation for god's people" or any of that.


Obviously if a meteor collides with our moon, or mars, it's not really a catastrophe. No harm has been done.

I see these "disasters" as natural occurrences that simply arise. However, if you believe in a personal god, you have to think hard as to how to reconcile these events with the idea god is protecting you and watching over you.

That is all I am attempting to point out.

No doubt people do find ways to get around this obstacle, and keep their delusions live and healthy, but it means one has to make personal interpretations of something that is supposed to be perfect and un-needing of change or analysis.
(I am ofcourse referring specifically to big 3 monotheistic religions)


Calling my point rubbish doesn't make it not relevant.
If god created anything and everything according to his will, then he created the avenues for natural disasters to take place.
What kind of personal, all-loving god would build a house for us, only to let that house collapse in on us?
What's your next reply to this - "your too dumb to understand" or something akin to that...


[edit on 20-8-2009 by makinho21]

[edit on 20-8-2009 by makinho21]



posted on Aug, 20 2009 @ 01:46 PM
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reply to post by Toughiv
 





Your argument is ridiculous. You are also arguing that suffering causes the god of classical theism to be illogical.



So where is the logic exactly, in creating something then instructing that something how to behave through a third party. Then kill that which has been created for not complying to third party instruction ?




Who are you to say what all loving means for an all powerful being?


Then equally, who are you or anyone else that would make such claims ?

I only observe the claims that have been made I make no claims myself as there is no evidence (and none reacquired by those professing to have faith) of said being to begin with.



posted on Aug, 20 2009 @ 01:51 PM
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reply to post by Pathos
 





God can control all the elements, but he will not interfere with the natural course of life.


Course he will, he said so he's a vengeful angry god to be feared, who will kill indiscriminately those who would not comply to what he told someone else to tell them to do or not to do.

God destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah by interfering with nature in order to kill the non compliant did he not?

We are talking about the same yahwhe eloi ,jesus , el shaddai,addonai god here aren't we ?



posted on Aug, 20 2009 @ 01:54 PM
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He does not hide from us...reply to post by moocowman
 



posted on Aug, 20 2009 @ 01:54 PM
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reply to post by Pathos
 





Hitler in heaven? Not a chance.

How the hell do you know this ? All hitler had to do was confess his sins the same as the rest of you, job done .



posted on Aug, 20 2009 @ 02:36 PM
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reply to post by moocowman
 


haha I've never even thought of that one to be honest. Makes you wonder though doesn't it. 1000's of people on their deathbeds have been frightened into confessing there "sins" in order to not be punished in the after life.

As if that would really make a difference. Talk about a cop out.

Similar to Pascal's wager, it is completely narrow-minded and goes against the very principles it pretends to argue for.

If a divine creator did exist, I doubt hedging your bets simply in order to go to "paradise" would go unnoticed.



posted on Aug, 20 2009 @ 03:08 PM
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reply to post by makinho21
 


i think the principle behind the concept is something like this:

(this is a silly metaphor i made up)

God is a big computer. He created a Guardian program who's job it was to verify the safety and purity of incoming programs trying to access the God mainframe. The Guardian started to modify his own programming till no one could access the big God computer. He's like a corrupt prosecuting attorney on steroids. The concept is very simple.

If there is even one thing wrong in your program's software you can't access the big God computer because the Guardian is off his rocker and has blocked all access. In addition, he further decreases your odds by inserting faulty code into your program that he knows he has safety procedures to block, thus showing the record that your program was denied access cause it's screwed up.

Realizing the Guardian is malfunctioning, the big God computer designs another piece of software known as the Random Number Generator (Yeshua), who covers every possible safety measure the Guardian could throw as an exception to refuse access, acting as a bridge, a hack program allowing programs access to the big God computer again. All they have to do is get and use the Random Number Generator software.



I see life as a series of difficult, preconceived malfunctional situations that occassionally are quite wonderful but also quite horrid. These circumstances can lead to scenarios literally no one could rise above and even has a tendency to drive some people right over the edge. This is not their fault, the deck was stacked against them from the outset. In essence, if you agree with the Guardian, that some shouldnt have access, you're cutting off your nose to spite your face, as he can generate a list a mile long on just about anybody.




and that concludes my silly metaphor



posted on Aug, 20 2009 @ 03:27 PM
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Reply to post by moocowman
 


Jesus was part of the deity I refer to as the Creator. Just as we are part of that same deity.


 
Posted Via ATS Mobile: m.abovetopsecret.com
 



posted on Aug, 20 2009 @ 03:37 PM
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reply to post by undo
 


Are you referring to Pascal's Wager? The main problem with it, is you have already assumed "Christianity" is correct.
What about the countless other religions that claim the same divinity and truth.
Are they wrong?



posted on Aug, 20 2009 @ 03:51 PM
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reply to post by Republican08
 


I have one question for any believer to consider when asking, "Where is your God?"

How did God become perfect?

Here is an etymology of the word perfect, so that you may know what it actually means.

perfect (adj.) Look up perfect at Dictionary.com
c.1225 (implied in perfectiun), from O.Fr. parfit (11c.), from L. perfectus "completed," pp. of perficere "accomplish, finish, complete," from per- "completely" + facere "to perform" (see factitious). Often used in Eng. as an intensive (perfect stranger, etc.). The verb meaning "to bring to full development" is recorded from 1398. Perfectionist is 1657, originally theological, "one who believes moral perfection may be attained in earthly existence;" sense of "one only satisfied with the highest standards" is from 1934.


LISTEN TO ME


1 Samuel 2:8
He raiseth from the dust the poor, From a dunghill He lifteth up the needy, To cause [them] to sit with nobles, Yea, a throne of honour He doth cause them to inherit, For to Jehovah [are] the fixtures of earth, And He setteth on them the habitable world.

Give me your perverts, give me your molesters, give me your demented of mind, your sick and needy...your spotted sheep and I will raise Kings from them.

Talking Heads
"Same as it ever was, same as it ever was...Letting the days Go by, water flowing underground..."


Till death do us part...



posted on Aug, 20 2009 @ 03:51 PM
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reply to post by Republican08
 


Hows it going? Hope your doing alright, ive not read all the replies in this thread.

Simply wanted to say that god has very little to do with this world unless you want it to personally but ultimately it is the reason for our existence.

This reality is all about choice, mankind chose this life through the path of knowledge so what you say is quite irrelevant.

If you believe in god or whatever you believe, why does death matter?

Death no matter how bad is relief, not punishment because this is the punishment, life is the punishment or a better word would be lesson actually. Fear is something entirely different of course which is nothing more than instinct.

Hope that makes sense.



[edit on 20-8-2009 by XXXN3O]



posted on Aug, 20 2009 @ 03:52 PM
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reply to post by makinho21
 


don't they have access to the same random number generator? i have no clue how it works, only how it functions on this side of the physical dimension. the other side, not in my purview.

let me ask you this:
in order to sit in judgement of another person's activities, do you not have to assume you are capable of such judgement by virtue of your own moral fiber? where'd you get that idea? yet you haven't walked in their shoes, and even if you had, you might not have had the same genetic proclivities. even in the presence of identical environmental circumstances (poverty, wealth, neighborhood, education, parenting, etc), there's still the variables of emotional make up, malfunctional hormones and so on. life experience is a good teacher but is also fraught with randomness or unknowns that you can't forecast without the added ability of omniscience.

i think this is what is meant by "don't judge" cause we have no clue what the reasons were for that person's behavior nor their final destination. so the answer to your question is:
i dunno



posted on Aug, 20 2009 @ 04:14 PM
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Originally posted by makinho21
reply to post by undo
 


Are you referring to Pascal's Wager? The main problem with it, is you have already assumed "Christianity" is correct.
What about the countless other religions that claim the same divinity and truth.
Are they wrong?



Love is correct. Any religion or individual not practicing this (love), is wrong.

"Wisdom is justified BY HER CHILDREN"...Jesus

"Do my dirty work scapegoat"....Metallica

Children are called "Kids" for a reason. (see above line)

All religions seek utopia, but is this really what they want?

utopia Look up utopia at Dictionary.com
1551, from Mod.L. Utopia, lit. "nowhere," coined by Thomas More (and used as title of his book, 1516, about an imaginary island enjoying perfect legal, social, and political systems), from Gk. ou "not" + topos "place." Extended to "any perfect place," 1613. Utopian originally meant "having no known location" (1609); sense of "impossibly visionary, ideal" is from 1621; as a noun meaning "visionary idealist" it is first recorded c.1873 (earlier in this sense was utopiast, 1854).

"He's a real no where man, sitting in his no where land, making all his no where plans for nobody"....the beatles on Utopia from the song "No Where Man"



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