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Was American POTUS Chester Arthur born in Canada?

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posted on Aug, 18 2009 @ 07:42 PM
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We won't be able to prove or disprove the rumor but I thought you all might like to discuss it so I'm presenting it here.


Chester A. Arthur - Wiki Answers


Chester Alan Arthur was the son of Irish-born preacher William Arthur and Vermont-born Malvina Stone Arthur. Most official references list him as having been born in Fairfield in Franklin County, Vermont on October 5, 1829. But Arthur sometimes claimed to have born in 1830, the date that is on his grave inscription and occurs in some reference works. His father had initially migrated to Dunham, Québec, Canada, where he and his wife at one point owned a farm about 80 miles (129 km) north of the U.S. border. There has long been speculation that the future president was actually born in Canada and that the family moved to Fairfield later. If true, this would have meant that he was constitutionally ineligible to serve as vice president or president. Given a lack of official documentation and the seeming confusion about the year of Arthur's birth, historians have been unable to rule this possibility out. But though some of his opponents circulated the Canada rumor during the 1880 election, they could not prove it, and no proof has emerged since.


The Star


The Democrats challenged Arthur to produce proof of his citizenship and hired a lawyer named Arthur Hinman, who travelled to Vermont and Canada to research Arthur's past. Hinman alleged Arthur was born in Dunham, Que., in an effort to discredit the vice-presidential candidate, and published his findings in a book entitled How a British Subject Became the President of the United States.

Arthur never publicly responded to the charge.

Vermont officials hold fast to the claim Arthur was born in Vermont in 1829, but have little to back it up. The state of Vermont didn't record births until 1857. Curiously, Arthur burned all his personal papers before he died in 1886.


Real Clear Politics


Long before "birthers" began questioning the citizenship of President Barack Obama, similar questions were raised about the early years of Arthur, an accidental president who ascended to the job after President James Garfield was assassinated. ....

In 1998, the Ottawa (Ont.) Citizen newspaper published a story asserting Arthur was born in his grandparents' home in Dunham but "probably" appropriated the birth records of the dead brother.

"The great impostor, the ultimate spoilsman, has never been defrocked. Not bad for a Canadian, eh?" said the newspaper, which called Arthur "our man in Washington."


hmmmm .... The date on his stone would have placed his birth at a time when his family was in Canada. He refused to address the issue. He hid his personal papers - burning them - so no one could see them even after he was dead.

As to the claim by Vermont officials that Arthur was definately born there - they really have no proof and I'm sure they wouldn't want their native-born-son POTUS - to disapear.

Interesting speculation that has been going on for well over a hundred years.
Thought you all might find it interesting.




posted on Aug, 18 2009 @ 09:03 PM
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Vermont didn't have the records to back their claims up. Hawaii has those records Not very similar after all.

But keep trying.



posted on Aug, 18 2009 @ 09:52 PM
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I read this in the Toronto Star this morning as well.

A couple of other interesting things.....




Chester Arthur's Presidency was predicted by James Russel Webster, a Perry resident. A detailed account of this prediction is found in a self-written memorial for Webster.[4] An excerpt from Webster's memorial:


I believe the prediction was made when Arthur was a boy.



Chester Alan Arthur (October 5, 1829 – November 18, 1886)
Most official references list Arthur as having been born in Fairfield in Franklin County, Vermont on October 5, 1829. However, some time in the 1870s Arthur changed it to 1830 to make himself seem a year younger.


I wonder if this was done for other reasons..........




During the 1880 U.S. presidential election a New York attorney, Arthur P. Hinman, was hired to explore rumors of Arthur's foreign birth. Hinman alleged that Arthur was born in Ireland and did not come to the United States until he was fourteen years old. When that story failed to take root Hinman came forth with a new story that Arthur was born in Canada. This claim also fell on deaf ears.


Sounds familiar.... the deaf ears part




President Arthur took the oath of office twice. The first time was at his Lexington Avenue residence, when it was given just past midnight on September 20. The oath was given by New York Supreme Court justice John R. Brady. The second time was two days later after he returned to Washington. This time it was given in the Capitol by Chief Justice of the United States Morrison Waite. This was to avoid any dispute over whether the oath was valid if given by a state official. (A similar situation later occurred with Calvin Coolidge.)


He took the oath twice............ also sounds familiar




suspected birth place..... Dunham, Lower Canada,


Obama's mother Stanly Anne Dunham .......... lol just though that was funny.



Despite chiron613's opinion I do believe this is very similar to the current situation......... however Arthur was a republican, so i guess the birthers back then were democrats?



posted on Aug, 19 2009 @ 05:27 AM
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Originally posted by chiron613
Not very similar after all.

I didn't say the two cases were similar. Although on further review they have some similarities for sure. And the articles are very clear that records weren't officially kept well back then.

But keep trying.

Keep trying WHAT?


[edit on 8/19/2009 by FlyersFan]



posted on Aug, 19 2009 @ 05:42 AM
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- Question about foreign place of birth due to family moving, etc.
- Oath of office taken twice.
- POTUS refusing to address the issue.
- Hidden (or destroyed in Arthurs case) documentation.
- Two different years of birth for Arthur AND Obama (Obama's facebook)
- Books written exposing the foreign births are shouted down
- Vermont and Hawaii want to keep their native-born-son POTUS' and they don't take the allegations seriously.

It isn't at the same level of spooky as the Kennedy-Lincoln similarities ...
but still. The facts are very interesting.

How a British Subject Became President of the United States


A. P. Hinman was a lawyer hired by the Democratic party to investigate Republican vice-presidential candidate, Chester A. Arthur. Hinman traveled to Vermont (the accepted place of Arthur's birth) and to Canada. The instant work is a collection of correspondence and affidavits collected by Hinman in support of his theory that Arthur was born in Canada, and ineligible for presidential office


The investigative reporter was able to support his assertion that Arthur was born in Canada by gathering affidavits. Even with these legal documents, the politics of the time shut him out.

[edit on 8/19/2009 by FlyersFan]



posted on Aug, 19 2009 @ 05:49 AM
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reply to post by FlyersFan
 


Keep trying to flog a dead horse.



posted on Aug, 19 2009 @ 05:55 AM
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Originally posted by Ulala
Keep trying to flog a dead horse.

That's a one line response - against T&C rules.
And what, exactly, are you talking about?
No one has discussed Chester Arthur on this site before.



posted on Aug, 19 2009 @ 06:26 AM
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reply to post by FlyersFan
 


I'd never heard of Chester Arthur either.

To that extent I guess we owe you a huge debt of thanks. He sounds like a real character & in isolation it was an interesting read.

But your motives are entirely transparent. From feigning sweet innocence in your first contribution you've gone for the jugular in your second, by drawing a direct parallel between Chester Arthur's dubious nationality and the unsubstantiated claims made against President Obama.

And that's fair enough.

But at least drop the little orphan Annie routine, it's getting tiresome.



posted on Aug, 19 2009 @ 07:00 AM
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Originally posted by Ulala
But your motives are entirely transparent.

yeah .. discuss POTUS Chester Arthur who may not have been American born.
SO WHAT?


drawing a direct parallel between Chester Arthur's dubious nationality and the unsubstantiated claims made against President Obama.

There IS a similarity. That's one of the points raised by a poster.
The poster was correct. SO WHAT?


But at least drop the little orphan Annie routine, it's getting tiresome.

You CLEARLY haven't been here very long or you'd know that I NEVER play little orphan Annie.


Some people get on here and claim that Obama is being treated unfairly and that people are after him just because he's black. (or at least half black). That's simply not so. Chester Arthur is an example of a WHITE POTUS who was also questioned about his eligibility.

It's just life. Deal with it.



[edit on 8/19/2009 by FlyersFan]



posted on Aug, 19 2009 @ 09:27 AM
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So what if lines are drawn to find similarities between 2 presidents? The fact that one of the presidents in question is the current POTUS makes this thread all the more relevant today.

Finding similarities between presidents is not new nor is this threads subject matter malicious in any way. It is merely an interesting topic at least to me, just as the Lincoln/Kennedy deal is.

This thread hardly makes any point to suggest that because Arthur's birth place was brought into question then Obama must surely not be born in the US(ridiculous). This is what is suggested here as the point of the thread according to what I get from the comments

"flogging a dead horse" or "keep trying"

Get real..........

I find this particularly interesting because I am Canadian, and the implied birth place of Arthur in this case was Canada. And just to rile up some more rumours wasn't one of the first birth place accusations for Obama also Canada? Or at least a charge that he held a Canadian Citizenship...



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