Time for 'Don't Ask' Policy to Go?

reply to post by jd140


Why would they need these things? They don't currently have separate showers for gays do they? If not, where are they showering? Because they are already serving.

Gay people have as much ability to control their sexual urges as the next person. What a stupid, fear driven comment.

THE GAYS ARE ALREADY IN THE MILITARY. If there were going to be any issues with allowing them to serve we would already be seeing them.

Originally posted by getreadyalready
Back on topic:
Why is it different for your girl to see you naked compared to a gay man seeing you naked?

Well my girl is MY GIRL
and a gay man is a man
I think the answer should be self-evident
I cannot fathom how it is not

Originally posted by getreadyalready
Or knowing some straight guy is playing with himself, compared to a gay guy just peacefully sleeping?

Well, I'm hoping that you are speaking of different beds here.
I guess it wouldn't make a difference to me either way
I just wouldn't want to have anything to do with either.

Originally posted by getreadyalready
Isn't a battle situation similar to having your clothes on fire? Nakedness would be the least of your worries.

Ya but you said would I take my clothes off if my clothes were on fire.
I'm not going to strip in the line of fire, no matter how much tactical sense I might make.

Originally posted by getreadyalready
What about a gay doctor cutting off your clothes after an accident? (This has happened to me twice!!) Would you prefer they wait to get a straight doctor?

Neither, I'd wait for a woman to do it
If they say no then I escape to another hospital

reply to post by ModernAcademia

I'm not going to strip in the line of fire, no matter how much tactical sense I might make.

OK, I cannot imagine a tactical scenario where this would make sense, but if it did come up, I bet you would run right out of your clothes without a second thought!

reply to post by ModernAcademia

Or.... Surely not!

You are a bisexual so you have a COMPLETELY different perspective than me.

I am a conservative

Actually, as I explained, this is the rationale of my straight friends.

"I'm a conservative." LOL.

Originally posted by ModernAcademia

Originally posted by detachedindividual

But where does that discomfort come from?
And why would another's sexual persuasion even matter?
What do you think will happen?

But as i've mentioned in this thread, nothing NEEDS to happen
wandering eyes are sufficient!
Even if they don't wander, I KNOW that if i was in a shower full of women my eyes would wander.

But this is something that I don't understand, why does what may or may not be going through another persons head concern you?

And I'm sorry to break it to you, but the eyes of self-identified heterosexual men in such scenarios also wonder. Whether that is through curiosity, competition or a desire they don't understand, it is a fact.

Regardless of that, you do realise people can see you right? You're not invisible. People check other people out all the time and for various reasons, nudity or no.

You could be walking down the street and a guy is checking you out.

WHY DOES IT MATTER?

You cannot control what other people think, so why even be conscious of it?

I'm sorry, I'm just not buying that this is the reason.

And no, I honestly don't think that 99% of men would feel the same. This is a distinct paranoia that most men don't actually feel in my opinion.

[edit on 18-8-2009 by detachedindividual]

reply to post by ModernAcademia



OK MA, now go ask your wife/girlfriend if she would mind showering in a room full of women. Because that is the reality of the situation. Men, with penises, showering with other penised men. Women with the breasts and vaginas showering with other equally naked women.

What does this have to do with mixed sexes? So what if it makes you uncomfortable. Many people feel discomfort in a vast array of situations. Should we write up policies to deal with them all? If showering with black men makes a few soldiers uncomfortable should we maybe force them to wear white latex paint before showering or perhaps just forgo the shower all together?

reply to post by detachedindividual


Straight guys eyes might wonder out of curiosity or competition, but we dont get turned on when our eyes wander... so there is the difference. Do you really want to be in a shower with a guy that is getting aroused by looking at you?

The old, "foot in the door" strategy? Like so many other "great" social movements of the progressives. We dont know whats best for us but we can count on your inexperience and good intentions to destroy everything we've built.

Homosexual behavior is a perversion. It doesnt matter how "normal" you've been trained it is. The battlefield is no place for your social experiments.

And dont think for a moment we didnt see this coming....

Originally posted by ALLis0NE
I think the law should stay as it is...

There is absolutely no reason for anyone's sexual preference to be advertised in the military. There is no place in the military for it.

Gay's can join the military, nobody is stopping them. However, there is NO REASON for ANYONE to know they are gay.

Don't ask, don't tell, because nobody needs to know.

So then there is equally no reason for the straight military personell to go around announcing that they are heterosexual. Yet they do. Not in so many words, but you can't deny that an extreme amount of soldiers do infact disclose their orientation through either talking about their spouses, their significant others or their sexual conquests. We are constantly bombarded with hetero inuendo, but thats fine.

Just a bunch of people who doesn't have any stock in the issue running their mouths.

I really hope you guys don't get your way. Not because you are ignorant about what you are talking about, but because there will be a mass exodus of people leaving the military.

Keep running your mouths fellas, I will continue reading for the entertainment.

Originally posted by HotDogNoBun
reply to post by detachedindividual

 

Straight guys eyes might wonder out of curiosity or competition, but we dont get turned on when our eyes wander... so there is the difference. Do you really want to be in a shower with a guy that is getting aroused by looking at you?

Now there is a legitimate concern, but it would be handled swiftly and severely! If some guy gets aroused by looking at me in the shower, he will get his azz beat instantly! There is no need for a special law or congressional act in this case! If I am leering at women and playing with myself, I will get the appropriate repercussions!

Again, there is no difference between straight or gay in this case; there is only right vs wrong!

reply to post by getreadyalready


Sorry bro makes no sense

If i'm in the shower I got shampoo in my eyes and i'm busy cleaning myself

I can barely see the bar of soap how am I going to notice someone looking at me in that manner.

It is just wrong!

At the end of the day, we could cut this entire debate short by FIRST discussing a unisex shower room.

reply to post by ModernAcademia

At the end of the day, we could cut this entire debate short by FIRST discussing a unisex shower room.

I totally agree!

And, for now, I am a fan of it, but I see some problems during the first week until I get desensitized to it! I may have to grow a beard to cushion the first few slaps!

Seriously, I think you are right on the money! If there is no problem with gays, there should be no problem with unisex facilities, and no problem with nudity in general??

I am a fan of all the above, but I think many people that are pro-gay in the military will draw the line somewhere before public nudity!!

I think it should go and homosexual men and women should be accepted into the armed forces just like any heterosexual man or woman. They are no less capable of performing their militant duties just because they don't have the same sexual preferences as you.

Who knows, maybe they will do better as infantry. I sure would want a gay man to have my back out there when the going gets tough. Hell, I would hope he loved me. That way he would protect me better than a homophobe would.

The policy should go. Bottom-line.

Time to keep religious beliefs out of the military. They have already failed doing that in the government. Might as well attempt to redeem yourself.

reply to post by ModernAcademia


That does not make any sense to me. Another nude man is just that; a nude man. You have the same equipment and body parts so why freak out if someone is looking at you.
It is the mind set like this that does not make sense.
I am gay and women don't freak out on me if see them naked. Just because you are gay does not mean you are always turned on by a nude body of the same sex.
Do you get excited at every nude women you see?

reply to post by dreamseeker

Do you get excited at every nude women you see?

You have to ask? I am a man, and if I want to be turned on by a woman, I can find one square inch of smooth skin, or suppleness somewhere on any woman's body!

If she has more good than bad, then I am turned on without effort!

That's just me, but the lesbians that I know are even more hounddogs than I am! They can embarrass me at times!

I still don't think it affects people in battle anymore than a close friendship would. We really don't want an entire force of robots out there. Some things require emotion to overcome and innovate wins!

reply to post by weedwhacker


well not every straight male finds every female attractive, and not every straight female finds every male attractive either. So since we're all grown ups, I guess we might as well have males and females showering together too. Why not the same washrooms as well? It's the same argument, we're adults so see it my way.

reply to post by KSPigpen


We don't need a "don't ask, don't tell" policy if we STOP going to war with every country that does not conform to US standards of living, etc.

Keep it. Get rid of it. Who cares?

STOP THE INSANITY OF WAR!!!!!!!

reply to post by Nivcharah


Going to war has nothing to do with this thread. Similarly, it has nothing to do with the policy of 'Don't Ask, Don't Tell.'

The policy is still the policy whether we are at war or not; whether you believe in the war(s) or not is irrelevant. We will have a standing army even if we are not at war, and this policy is meant for the armed forces; therefore, the whole war thing you are throwing out there has no place in this thread.

reply to post by heyo


heyo, I'm with you, there. Co-ed toilets are common in many places, it's a hang-up within certain cultures, the USA's included.

BUT, as has been pointed out, so many Gays and Lesbians already are enlisted, and serving, and in the majority of cases their comrades have no idea.

Not all Gay men are flamers, and not all Lesbians are butch. Judging on appearances is just plain bigotry. IN FACT, this entire argument is bigoted.