Hitler was a Godsend for Israel...

Isn't this like saying, "the slave ships were a Godsend for African Ameicans," or, "Cesear was a Godsend for Gaul"?

Seems a little warped to me.

Originally posted by mattpryor
reply to post by Neo-V™

 

Palestine ceased to exist as a geographical region when it was split into Israel and Jordan 60 years ago. Palestine refers to the whole region, including modern day Israel and the west of Jordan.

The Arab representatives never referred to themselves or their people as Palestinian until the PLO emerged in the 60s. Before that they didn't consider themselves to be any particular nationality, the big thing then was Pan Arabism, which didn't really work out either.

Interesting fact about the PLO: Stands for Palestinian Liberation Organisation as I'm sure you're aware. But when it was formed in 1964, its aim was to "liberate" not the West Bank and Gaza (since they were in Arab hands already - remember this was before 1967) but ALL of the region. It was a resistance to any Jewish state on Arab land whatsoever. They've changed their game (and name) over the years, but their basic reason for existence remains the same: To overthrow the (democratically elected) Israeli government and, it could be argued, to rid the area of Jews.

They had the backing of Jordan to start with, but fell out of favour with King Hussein in the 70s when they started blowing stuff up in Jordan and were kicked out.

Another interesting fact: the Jerusalem Post used to be called the Palestine Post.

A third (and final, I promise) interesting fact: "West Bank" is a name given to the area west of the River Jordan, and its correct name is Judea and Samaria. The term "West Bank" is a post-1948 invention by King Hussein to re-assert the region's Jordanian rule.

Middle East history is fascinating, full of treachery, double dealings, heroics, tragedy. I wish more people would read up on it.

The reason why they are against the existence of Israel (I am not, but I am totally against the policies of the Israeli government) is because they understand that Israel is a base for domination in that part of the world.

Originally posted by ModernAcademia
Guys there is ZERO anti-semitism in this thread
now how about we get back on topic

With the exception of..

Well geez, let's start with a thread title that states that the man who engineered the holocaust was a "GODSEND".

Or for that matter the entire premise that "thanks to Hitler" the "jews" got Israel.

For the sake of, yes, anti-semite chatter the author blurs causality with what he contends "the Jews" always wanted.

The suggestion that the Jewish people desired the horrific murder of millions of their family members and friends...

That "the jews" wanted to be cast out from their homes and all of their possesions stolen from them...their life's work taken away...to be imprisoned and watch their wives, husbands and children die suffering...

all for the sake of being uprooted and moved thousands of miles away to a place that has known war ever since?...Really?

That is what the jews always wanted? How about to be left alone and not have madmen slaughter them by the millions? I think that would have been a first choice.

Yah...beyond that ..no anti-semitic chatter here what-so-ever..




[edit on 19-8-2009 by maybereal11]

Originally posted by neformore
As such, the premise of the opening post is completely and utterly flawed.

I was going to change the title to "Zionists Dream", but I assume the majority of people will take the time to view the original content so posted as is.

Originally posted by Donnie Darko
I'd like to see Zionism exposed for what it really is, that is Jewish supremacy, but killing them off would be horrible.

No one, at least not I, is talking about killing anyone, why do people assume that anti-Zionists want Jews "killed off". I want to see all religion abolished, literally "wiped of the Earth", starting with Islam, does that mean I want to see every last Muslim on this planet killed off, no.

Originally posted by maybereal11
That "the jews" wanted to be cast out from their homes and all of their possesions stolen from them...their life's work taken away...to be imprisoned and watch their wives, husbands and children die suffering...

Who's casting Palestinians out of their homes?
And thanks mattpryor for your enlightening posts, Middle East history is fascinating. What's your thought's of the treatment of the Palestinian Arabs who have been forced to flee their homeland?

Originally posted by Neo-V™

Originally posted by maybereal11
That "the jews" wanted to be cast out from their homes and all of their possesions stolen from them...their life's work taken away...to be imprisoned and watch their wives, husbands and children die suffering...

Who's casting Palestinians out of their homes?

A fine example of answeing my post with an unrelated answer/baiting...distraction.

The premise that the Jewish people wanted the holocaust or that Hitler was a Godsend to them is not affirmed or re-inforced by asking "who is casting the Palestinians out of their homes"

If you wanted draw some parralell then why not state "Israel is a Godsend to the Palestinians" and that the Palestinian people want to suffer and be displaced so that they might indulge their arabic "terrorist nature".

Now THAT would be in keeping with the offensiveness and ugly bigotry embedded in your OP premise...







[edit on 19-8-2009 by maybereal11]

Originally posted by maybereal11
A fine example of answeing my post with an unrelated answer/baiting...distraction.

Your post didn't ask any questions, and I had already stated I should have changed the title, and stated throughout the thread the reason for posting this thread is the opposite of what you and others keep claiming it to be.

Originally posted by maybereal11
The premise that the Jewish people wanted the holocaust or that Hitler was a Godsend to them is not affirmed or re-inforced by asking "who is casting the Palestinians out of their homes"

The premise is that Germany helped the Zionists, to say otherwise is to be ignorant.

Originally posted by maybereal11
If you wanted draw some parralell then why not state "Israel is a Godsend to the Palestinians" and that the Palestinian people want to suffer and be displaced so that they might indulge their arabic "terrorist nature".

Because I wanted to ask a question, that so far none of your post has answered.

Originally posted by mattpryor
Most of the green bits in the first map were uninhabited.

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/603bd13a4c65.jpg[/atsimg]
Looks like some one thought they were?

Originally posted by maybereal11
With the exception of..

Well geez, let's start with a thread title that states that the man who engineered the holocaust was a "GODSEND".

For **** Sake!!

Anything can be taken out of context and turned into an insult.

"A Godsend for Israel" does not imply that the holocaust was good for anything except the creation of Israel. That is a known fact. Israel was created as a homeland for the Jewish people because of the actions of various countries, mainly Germany, during WW2. HOW.. how is that anti semitic?

The word 'Godsend' is a bit controversial I must admit, but that is the link from the original article and not dreamed up by the OP.

Originally posted by TheAftermath
[SNIP]

And if the Jewish people never existed...who would be the subject of your bigoted, ignorant quips?

Done adding posts to this topic...I already gave it more attention than it deserves...which is none.

Mod Edit: Removed quoted trolling.

[edit on 20-8-2009 by Gemwolf]

Originally posted by TheAftermath
[SNIP]

A perfect example of why this thread is a travesty on ATS.

Just like the comment made recently on MSM that the word "socialist" was really a code word for the "n-word", we all know that "Zionist and Zionism" as used here are code words for many anti-semites that don't have the cojones to come out in a public forum and say they hate the Jews. Amazing that in this deny ignorance environment that those people would be allowed to hide behind that smiokescreen for at least 5 pages.

Mod Edit: Removed quoted trolling.

[edit on 20-8-2009 by Gemwolf]

It also seems that many people posting on this thread will automatically believe stories such as the following since it fits in so nicely with their current prejudices.

article

JERUSALEM (AP) - Israel and the Swedish Embassy responded furiously Wednesday to a Swedish newspaper article that suggested Israeli troops killed Palestinians and harvested their organs.

The article published Monday in Aftonbladet, Sweden's largest circulation daily, implies a link between those charges and the recent arrest in the U.S. of an American Jew for illicit organ trafficking. Later the reporter told Israel Radio he did not know if the allegations were true

Headlined "Our sons are plundered for their organs," the story made news in Israel, where some commentators compared it to medieval libels that Jews killed Christian children for their blood. Daniel Seaman, who heads Israel's government press office, said the article played on "vile anti-Semitic themes."

AS a mod said earlier, more absolute rubbish ...

Originally posted by Neo-V™
I was going to change the title to "Zionists Dream", but I assume the majority of people will take the time to view the original content so posted as is.

Frankly, it makes no difference what you call the opening post. You can try and couch it in whatever terms you want.

The premise of the thread is still completely flawed.

If, instead of trying to strawman debate the borders of British Palestein and Israel, you spend some time looking at the way jewish people were treated by the Nazi's in Hitlers Germany before the actual implementation of the final solution, then it becomes fairly obvious that Hitler simply wanted them out of the way, at all costs.

He considered them inferior, and the Nazi's treated them like animals.

As such, he was neither a "zionists dream, or a "godsend" - what he was was a psycopathic bigoted facist who died by his own hands in a cowardly action because he did not have the power of his own convictions to be captured by the Russians and face trial with the world looking on.

What he is, in the context of this thread, is a crassly devisive excuse to try and stick it to jewish people, for the sake of it.

Claiming that Hitler was a godsend for Israel is like claiming that Peter Sutcliffe (the Yorshire Ripper) was a godsend for vice squads globally.

reply to post by maybereal11


Nothing bigoted or ignorant about my post.

Feel free to prove me wrong. Anytime someone is critical of Israel or jews, the first words in retaliation are often NAZI!!!!!!! or ANTI- SEMITE!!!!!!!

reply to post by centurion1211

Don't blame the topic, blame the poster.


reply to post by centurion1211

And I bet you believe Ahmadinejad said he wants Israel wiped off the map and denys the Holocaust?

Originally posted by neformore
Claiming that Hitler was a godsend for Israel is like claiming that Peter Sutcliffe (the Yorshire Ripper) was a godsend for vice squads globally.

I think people are getting too hung up on the article title, rather than addressing the information in it.

Neo-V i didn't think you meant actual genocide, but I wanted to make sure.

I don't think the Jewish people wanted the Holocaust to happen. I DO think the Zionists did though, and they actually betrayed their own people to the Nazis.

I just wish the Jewish people would wake up and release the people that claim to represent them are actually little different from the people who killed their ancestors 65 years ago.

Guys, I think Neo-V means Israel as a state, and as a political entity, not the majority of the people who live there.

[edit on 19-8-2009 by Donnie Darko]

Originally posted by neformore


As such, he was neither a "zionists dream, or a "godsend" - what he was was a psycopathic bigoted facist who died by his own hands in a cowardly action because he did not have the power of his own convictions to be captured by the Russians and face trial with the world looking on.

Yes I agree, but it's not like Russia was any better.

That's another thing that does annoy me about the public view of World War 2 - the idea that Stalin and the Soviets were nicer than the Nazis and Hitler. They were just as bad (arguably even worse since the Nazis at least loved their country and own people, while the Communists only cared about #1), it's just they were our allies, that's all.

[edit on 19-8-2009 by Donnie Darko]

[edit on 19-8-2009 by Donnie Darko]

reply to post by mattpryor

Palestine ceased to exist as a geographical region when it was split into Israel and Jordan 60 years ago. Palestine refers to the whole region, including modern day Israel and the west of Jordan.

I guess that at least would be greatly comforting to anyone that is Not Palestinian.

[edit on 8/19/2009 by KRISKALI777]

Originally posted by TheAftermath
reply to post by maybereal11

 

Nothing bigoted or ignorant about my post.

Feel free to prove me wrong. Anytime someone is critical of Israel or jews, the first words in retaliation are often NAZI!!!!!!! or ANTI- SEMITE!!!!!!!

So when the left say Bush is Hitler and the right say Obama is Hitler... we think they are anti Semitic,, No see everyone compares anyone they do not agree with to Hitler, only the Jews have good reason to talk about it. most Jews loved living in Germany and Poland etc before all of that Ask Einstein.. but sure it was all just a farce.. to take back some uninhabited land from the Arabs..

Peoples hate just turns them into blind morons.. yes you

Why isn't Jordan under pressure to enact the Right of Return for the Palestinian people? They have enough territory and money, open up the land. Oh but noooo, then they would have no excuse to continue to wipe Israel off the map and move toward the reformation of the Caliphate.

Germany under Hitler may have started the catalyst of Israel's existance but their goal was not such. To credit Hitler for Israel isn't accurate.



[edit on 20-8-2009 by JJay55]