Phoenix: Dozens of armed citizens attend todays Obama Speech

reply to post by grover


Indeed it is your opinion and thankfully your opinion does not represent law.

I think the US is headed down a very dark road. You have to be aware that demonstrations are often attended by provocateurs who get their kicks from inciting violence. People bringing guns to demonstrations is just a plain bad idea - unless its the police and yes, I do think the police over-react many times.

If you right or left wing wackos really are spoiling for a civil war because that will "fix" your broken system, well I guess you will do what you want to do.

Looking at all of this from a Canadian perspective, I have no problem if people need to purchase arms to protect their security. I don't thiink it is healthy to have so many guns in the hands of gangs and with the police powerless to stop crime. But it looks like a lot of Americans are been incited on the most trivial of excuses. A war to stop government funded health insurance? Are you guys all crazy down there?

reply to post by truthquest

I think you made a lot of good points except the suggestion that those outside the US not voice their insistence that they disagree with an (almost) unrestricted right to bear arms. If they strongly object and believe the right to bear arms is a bad idea, I think its good that they stand up and say so.

Ok if they "strongly object" we should give them kudos. Yes in an online argument, fine and dandy. Here is the problem, they are not US citizens, of course if they can sneak in, than they can vote.

We the people have something called the US Constitution, and to amend that constitution it takes an act of Congress with a 2/3 vote of both houses than an approval by the states with the same margin. Why so hard, so that the sheeple cannot be tricked into backing legislation that will destroy the very fabric of our nation.

Why we are getting angry, yes Bush passed UNCONSTITUTIONAL decrees. But Obama, directly ran on the stipulation he was going to CHANGE this sh*t.
LO and BEHOLD nothing but more restrictions and now a RULE OF LAW cr*p about a new judiciary with no constitutional authority to imprison whomever they want.

The sleeper has now awoken. (movie reference)

If they have an idea about how we should be running our country I think they should be very welcome to chime in about how we run it.

Fine and dandy, they can cus and discuss all they want. But I tell you one thing, if any fracking country or the UN try to start telling the American people that we need to start following any International law, that road TPTB do not want to go down.

reply to post by grover


And your point being, Damn Libertarians, think they can actually have an opinion after we won. Grover you are becoming transparent. This is my first response to you. Wow, Ron Paul supporters speaking their minds and showing what God honest patriots can do when they put their minds together.

Not quite foe yet but getting closer.

And to quote the HUFFINGTON POST, my God, that is like a conservative quoting FAUX NEWS.

reply to post by nixie_nox


No offense taken. I was born here in phoenix a little over 30 years ago. There are alot of people from the east coast here, and you all brought your lame trees with you, lol. This place used to be the place to come if you had allergies or asthma, but now it's just as bad as anywhere back east. Thanks alot, j/k (kinda). I do like the outdoors, and off roading here is some of the best, gotta get some new radiator hoses for my 89 dodge raider tomorrow, and i'll be out on the trails this weekend for sure.

About the racism , it's ironic you say that coming from the east coast. All my friends from back east talk of their cities, and how many neighborhoods they couldn't walk in being white, since it would assuredly bring harrassment and even assault. Here, there are no such neighborhoods, and i've navigated comfortably in every part of the city, by car or on foot.

reply to post by truthquest


I was not implying that those outside the US are not entitled to an opinion on our policies or are not entitled to suggest that they have ideas that are better. I thought I was perfectly clear that those who do not live in the US should not insist or demand that we do things the way it is done in their country. I am always open to someone offering suggestions that may be helpful. If I lived in another country where the US was trying to force its policies on my country I would resent it just as I resent people from other countries telling me I have to adopt laws that conform to their standards. Open exchange of ideas is liberty, forced adoption of policy is tyranny.

Originally posted by Tentickles

Originally posted by Rockpuck
I always wonder why more people don't bring firearms to rallies and protest... if the people were holding AR15's I think the police would think twice before they bash peoples skulls in with clubs and shields.

Take the London protest. How far would the police have gotten when they faced several thousand armed, angry people?

Protect your freedoms, or the fascist take it by force...

Well the London protesters would have been arrested... it's illegal to own guns in the Isles.

No it's not illegal.

You can own carbines, bolt-action rifles (including 50 calibre) and shotguns, plus black powder pistols etc.

Displaying it in a public place like london would probably lead to the ptb thinking an insurrection was going on...

Originally posted by john124

Originally posted by ElectricUniverse
reply to post by grover

 

I know exactly what you said.

Do tell us grover...when is a good time to have a legally owned firearm with you? After you were robbed? After you were killed for $20? After your wife, daughter, son is killed?... Hope none of the above ever happens to you.



[edit on 18-8-2009 by ElectricUniverse]

A gun culture increases the overall risk of armed robberies, and usage of weapons such as knives. Same with youths in Britain who carry knives, by carrying the weapon and showing it, you are provoking somebody who may not actually be a killer. Just give them the money etc and walk away. That's the best thing to do, not cowboy law and citizen arrest!

I understand that with everybody potentially having guns at the moment in the US, then you may feel safer carrying one. But if guns were banned, then from what I've said you cannot logically give a good reason to carry one.

You're a coward and a complete idiot if you believe that imo.
Typical of the socialist mind-set infesting the UK at the moment.

Banning guns (semi-auto handguns) in the UK has not prevented gun crime going down. Criminals get theirs illegally and crazies just go to Eastern Europe and smuggle them in.
In short there is no justification short of making a population even more reliant and enslaved to a government.

To the fools playing the race card: no body was speaking out against this administration or demonstrating their rights 6 months ago. Did people suddenly realize he's (a small part) black?

reply to post by jam321



Probably quite a few, but what is so wrong with that? Any sane gunowner knows that if he or she makes a move that the SS would interpret as attempting to fire on the President, they will shoot, which is totally reasonable.

I'm an independant. If I show up and protest wearing a t-shirt with a picture of a gun, am I going to be clubbed to death?

Considering that Presidents ....

A. Lincoln

J. Garfield

W. McKinley

J F. Kennedy

were assassinated

and Presidents .....

A. Jackson

T. Roosevelt

F. Roosevelt

H.Truman

G .Ford (twice)

R. Reagan

Had assassination attempts made on their lives ........


At the very least, it a distraction to those charged with keeping Barack Obama`s name, off that substantial pair of lists.

Heck , what do i know ......

Originally posted by ELNC3
reply to post by jam321

 

Probably quite a few, but what is so wrong with that? Any sane gunowner knows that if he or she makes a move that the SS would interpret as attempting to fire on the President, they will shoot, which is totally reasonable.

You are exactly right. I have not read all the posts here but most. Didn't anyone give ANY thought to the idea that these gun owners were "allowed" to be at the rally or event as a precursor to the assassination that will most likely take place very soon?

I remember when Oyawna was elected and the QVC and other stations were selling plates that had Lincoln AND Obama on them, I thought, why in the hell would they be selling collector "plates" with these two guys together on them? I knew about Obama's crap with Illinois legislature and all but it seemed really weird to offer a plate with both of them on it, unless you were conditioning people to accept the fact that the fate of the pres is going to be the SAME?

Or maybe they were trying to give someone the idea that Obama should get what Booth gave Lincoln? Anyone?

Seems awfully weird to me to allow someone to walk around with an AR15 on his shoulder and others with sidearms, don't get me wrong, I am an avid gun owner and hunter, just seems to be too obvious and weird.

Just thought I would throw this out too; SWITZERLAND ISSUES EVERY HOUSEHOLD A GUN! SWITZERLAND 'S GOVERNMENT TRAINS EVERY ADULT THEY ISSUE A RIFLE. SWITZERLAND HAS THE LOWEST GUN RELATED CRIME RATE OF ANY CIVILIZED COUNTRY IN THE WORLD!!!


[edit on 19-8-2009 by daddio]

Originally posted by UmbraSumus
Considering that Presidents ....

A. Lincoln

J. Garfield

W. McKinley

J F. Kennedy

were assassinated

and Presidents .....

A. Jackson

T. Roosevelt

F. Roosevelt

H.Truman

G .Ford (twice)

R. Reagan

Had assassination attempts made on their lives ........


At the very least, it a distraction to those charged with keeping Barack Obama`s name, off that substantial pair of lists.

Heck , what do i know ......

And who were the killers?

Lincoln's killer:
Democrat. Upset the blacks were freed. Upset Union won the war

Garfield's killer:
Nutcase who was upset he didn't get appointed to a post. So basically a lazy do-nothing looking for a hand-out and upset it wasn't just given to him.

McKinley's killer
He was upset that evil America was expoilting the poor, so yet another Leftist nutcase.

Kennedy's killer
Defector to the CCCP. Communist.


Obama better watch his back when he's with his buddies. they're the ones who kill.

The people who show up at these rallies with guns are a lot like a bunch of drag queens flaunting it in the middle of the street.

Everyone agrees that they have the right to do it but that still doesn't mean its wise or prudent.

reply to post by grover


Why do you have to make insulting, divisive statements like that? Are you five? Is it your goal to stir up hatred? Can't you make valid points, you've got to compare people to drag queens and insult their intelligence based solely on their political beliefs?

Grow up. There's a whole world of adults out here that would love to meet you someday.

reply to post by mattifikation


I was drawing a parallel to the absurdities of both stances.

No one is threatening their second amendment rights so why do they have to make a show of it?

In fact the drag queens probably have firmer grounds to stand on when they take that in your face stance.

All it was was showmanship...a veiled threat and a crock...

It deserves to be mocked.

reply to post by grover


Every time you talk, are you making a show of your right to free speech because somebody is threatening it, or are you simply talking?

reply to post by grover


There is no valid reason to take a gun to a political rally.

AND for your information I know some drag queens who would be equally offended by my analogy.

Originally posted by jafo1984
reply to post by truthquest

 

I was not implying that those outside the US are not entitled to an opinion on our policies or are not entitled to suggest that they have ideas that are better. I thought I was perfectly clear that those who do not live in the US should not insist or demand that we do things the way it is done in their country. I am always open to someone offering suggestions that may be helpful. If I lived in another country where the US was trying to force its policies on my country I would resent it just as I resent people from other countries telling me I have to adopt laws that conform to their standards. Open exchange of ideas is liberty, forced adoption of policy is tyranny.

I suppose it was just a misunderstanding then. I've always thought of "insisting" on things being to be a verbal cue that the person is very certain and firm in their position rather than something physically forced.