Phoenix: Dozens of armed citizens attend todays Obama Speech

And stop talking out your @ss about gun laws making things safer for everyone. Stats don't lie, only those against owning guns do. Keep believing that laws protect you and that the government is going to keep you safe, tuck you into bed.... Let me guess, you bought into the whole "hope, change, yes we can" BS too...

Originally posted by DraconianKing
It's only a matter of time before one of these people takes a shot at Obama. That's what happens when republicans lie to their delusional supporters. These people want to murder the president, they don't care about their rights they just don't want a black president. If this isn't about race then why didn't you gun lovers bring all your guns when Bush was in town?

Bush wasn't known for talking about taking away guns. But you already knew that and were JUST LOOKING FOR ANY EXCUSE TO PLAY THAT OLD, TIRED, AND IRRELEVANT RACE CARD. When intelligent argument fails miserably, out comes the race card.

Bringing guns to a town hall meeting is stupid.
Even if no civilian tries to shoot the president or some other politician, how long before this is used as an opportunity by the shadowy powers. I can easily see some rogue element of the government or military using the firearms carried by civilians as comoflage to pull off an assasination to gain political power or push an agenda and blaming the civilians.
Did we learn nothing about the shadow PTB from JFK?
I predict that if people continue to bring firearms to what are presently peaceful protests there will be an incident.

I'm an avid 2nd amendment supporter and gun owner. I think I understand the point these people are trying to make but it's a double-edged sword. All it would take is an assassination or assassination attempt during one of these armed gatherings and we'll see our second amendment rights ripped to shreds. There is always some half-baked nutter floating around out there looking for their Hinkley-moment.

reply to post by john124


I can see that your testicles have been removed. Was that done under public health care? When some punk wants to sex up your wife or children you will just hand them over and walk away because you do not want a confrontation. Somebody might get hurt. And it would probably be you. Guns cannot help you. You would only give it away the minute somebody tried to scare you.

Originally posted by ElectricUniverse
reply to post by john124

 

BTW, guess you didn't get to see what was the main reason your Brittish patriots decided to do the largest "PEACEFUL" demonstration in the history of England.

Here it is in case you missed it, and watch it to the end to see what cops have to say and what happens when law abiding citizens now in the UK DARE to try to defend themselves in their own homes...

www.youtube.com...

Erm.... LMAO!!!!!!!!

Guns for hunting are not handguns that you can carry around with you on the street!!!! To be honest the foxes don't deserve to be shot, the snobs who want to shoot them deserve that fate!!

Knowing full well how the kids and even their parents behave around where I live, I would not wish it on anybody for guns to be legal in the UK, especially when irresponsible parents would probably leave guns lying around. A disaster would be almost guaranteed if the kids got hold of the guns.

Maybe there are parts of the US where almost everybody is responsible enough to own guns. But there are also parts where there aren't. Crimes will always be committed with illegal guns, just as crimes will be committed by some of those irresponsible folks who obtained a gun legally.

The UK may be a bad example because we have too many youths with the wrong attitudes towards life and treating other people, and the risk would be exponentially worse with legal guns over here than anywhere else in the west. That bad attitude will also significantly contribute towards the high levels of crime involving illegal guns, because of disaffected youths who often trash things just for fun. But it's mainly London, Birmingham, Nottingham, Edinburgh and a few other large cities where they are used to intentionally murder, but armed burglaries are common in most areas of the UK.

So actually, I just realised it may not be a good comparison to compare the US and UK, both in terms of illegal guns or legal gun culture and its effects. Both of our countries don't always see guns in the same way.

[edit on 18-8-2009 by john124]

GOOD FOR HIM! People need to make points because the president and his followers obviously doesn't get it.

Originally posted by Hastobemoretolife

The WH snitch e-mail got taken down today, I think the reality is starting to hit home for some people on our government, maybe just maybe they are getting the message.

I bet it was taken down because too many people where sending in trash to clog it up.

Originally posted by ugliefrog
reply to post by warrenb

 

Wow...I understand ppl wanting to make a statement but toting an assault rifle is a little extreme and scary at this type of venue will probably send the wrong message...but its a freedom message in his eyes

As well as a profound statement in my eyes, too. This man is black, so he probably won't be smeared as a prejudiced terrorist. And Alan Keyes is one of over a dozen lawsuits contesting the presidential status of the kenyan. EVERY SINGLE LAW that illegal alien signs is in court as being not signed by a president. Contested. I am getting concerned that I will not be able to clear out of NAmerica before the bloodbath begins.

Originally posted by john124
A gun culture increases the overall risk of armed robberies, and usage of weapons such as knives. Same with youths in Britain who carry knives, by carrying the weapon and showing it, you are provoking somebody who may not actually be a killer. Just give them the money etc and walk away. That's the best thing to do, not cowboy law and citizen arrest!

I understand that with everybody potentially having guns at the moment in the US, then you may feel safer carrying one. But if guns were banned, then from what I've said you cannot logically give a good reason to carry one.

You do realize that the vast majority of illegal arms that are in Mexico are cheap guns made in China and Russia. It's been known for years that those countries sell containers of guns to criminals because it helps disrupt western countries.

Oh look.

12 pages of unproductive, partisan bickering.

Now come on folks. Surely we can all at least agree on the concept that anyone who can attain the rank of President of the United States of America - in this political climate - is a rotten apple. Demoblican, Replicrat, Blight race, Whack race. It doesn't matter to the banks and lobbyists pulling the strings. They're all the same at the high levels: Sell outs and traitors!

The Democratic agenda is to disarm the citizens. The Republican agenda is to establish an unstoppable population-quelling force. Neither side makes a real attempt beyond "harsh words" to stop the other's agenda, because they are, in fact, part of the same agenda: Shift more power away from people and towards the government. Each side takes on half the task.

Freedom of Speech? Same thing. Freedom of Religion? Same thing. Freedom of the Press? Same thing. Neither side ever actually restores their constituents' rights when they get elected, they just put on a good show to make it look like they're "trying."

Do you squabbling, mindless sheep know why they keep getting away with such atrocities? Here's the big secret that you're all too blind to catch:

Each side has you so AFRAID of the "agenda" of the other, that you'll offer supporting votes and mouthpiece-servitude for your chosen "lesser of two evils" no matter what horrible garbage they get up to!

Why don't you people wake up? All of you! On both sides! Forget about whether or not this or that is a violation of that and this. Most of you people are nothing more than half the country trying to control the other half of the country with rhetorical talking points and manipulated facts. Why don't you fricking people pull together as the ENTIRE country trying to take back ALL of your rights, as opposed to half going for half?

Oh, that's right. Because it's "Us Vs. Them" and you're all too pig headed and stubborn to risk being the first side to give in. Blah.

What happened to this country?

Originally posted by john124

Originally posted by ElectricUniverse
reply to post by grover

 

I know exactly what you said.

Do tell us grover...when is a good time to have a legally owned firearm with you? After you were robbed? After you were killed for $20? After your wife, daughter, son is killed?... Hope none of the above ever happens to you.



[edit on 18-8-2009 by ElectricUniverse]

A gun culture increases the overall risk of armed robberies, and usage of weapons such as knives. Same with youths in Britain who carry knives, by carrying the weapon and showing it, you are provoking somebody who may not actually be a killer. Just give them the money etc and walk away. That's the best thing to do, not cowboy law and citizen arrest!

I understand that with everybody potentially having guns at the moment in the US, then you may feel safer carrying one. But if guns were banned, then from what I've said you cannot logically give a good reason to carry one.

You are mistaken, in Vermont is example of this contradiction.
In Vermont anyone can carry concealed, no permit required, just non-felon, legal weapon.
In Vermont there is no crime to speak of.

In UK when they banned guns, the criminals, laughed their aces off.

And you say, just give them you money and walk away, the sick B###### going to take your money, screw your wife, and shoot your whimpering Ace.

Originally posted by gotrox
One could assume that, as the first demonstrator acted alone, the next was a group of a dozen, and the next will be 50 or a hundred.
It can't be long until an event is manipulated, or a nutter shows up to prove the opposing view.
All it would take is 1 joker with a firecracker and a secret service sniper with an itchy finger to get a bunch of citizens shot.
A better method, IMHO, to get media attention while proving no harm is intended would be to organize the protest with the local police.

Although you just made a very profound point, I'm sure it will be missed so I thought I'd reiterate something you just said. "All it would take is 1 joker with a firecracker..."

I can picture a few bored teens with nothing better to do in the heat of their summer vacation coming up with just that idea. "Hey Tim, lets blow off a string of Black Cats at that next protest, that would be a riot !!"

A riot indeed. That my friends, scares the crap out of me.

Guns at a public hearing are a display of intimidation that prevents free speech and open discussion without fear. Just because nothing bad happened is just plain naivete and bad policy. Any professional knows that gun policy should aim at preventive action...in order to preserve the right to bear arms (by the current interpretation). What happens if one of those cowboy mentality, gun-totin idiots loses control and fast-draws and shoots up the place. Bingo, there goes the Second Amendment. Catch a clue! This notion of guns being necessary to hold back the evil government is just stupidity. The possession of guns is in itself not bad- just keep them at home except when going hunting, with a license. Otherwise, guns shouldn't be casually carried around when mall shopping, or attending a public town meeting. We are not 1870 Dodge City, Kansas.

[edit on 18-8-2009 by havanaja]

Maybe speech should be left at home, and not taken out of your mouth except when puking?

Maybe religion should be kept in the church? After all, if you can't exercise one right while walking around in your day to day life, why should you be allowed to exercise any?

Stop looking at your rights as individual things that you can pick and choose from. The day you let them take ONE of your rights is the day you teach them how to take ALL of your rights.

"Well, these few nuts used their guns for violence. Since the Right to Bear Arms can be abused by bad people, it's time to eliminate this archaic and outdated "right" for the sake of the Greater Good. So now, you can't have guns."

Then another generation of politicians takes office, and...

"These people formed a protest without proper licensing and approval, and we had to arrest some people. So clearly, the right to assembly is dangerous as it can be abused. We must do away with the archaic notions of protests, and eliminate the right to assemble."

Then another generation of politicians takes office, and...

"Well, these few nuts said bad things about the government. So now, you can only voice government-approved opinions."

Then another generation of politicians takes office, and...

"Well, these few nuts used their religion to start a cult. So now, you can only join a state sanctioned religion."

Then another generation of politicians takes office, and...

"These folks voted for a Third Party candidate who wanted to restore psychotic, anti-society notions such as gun rights, free speech, and religious freedom. So now, we've officially licensed two political parties with federally-sanctioned agendas to operate in the United States and people will have to decide which one suits them best."

Is that the path you want to take?

WAKE THE LIVING FRAGGLESTICKS UP, PEOPLE!

Originally posted by fleabit
It's all fun and games until someone puts an eye out.

I just hope someone doesn't think it's their duty to show their rights by opening fire on a rally.

Wow. What kind of ignorant statement is that? I am speechless. You are exactly the pudding-brained citizen the gun control loonies love. You eat up every word of their made up statistics and scaremongering. You clearly know nothing about gun owners or ownership.

Let's say that there is one person who goes off the deep end and tries something stupid. How far would he actually get if there were a lot of other people legally carrying guns? Not too far, and I'd even bet the the Secret Service wouldn't even be involved until after the fact.

Wow.

reply to post by AwakeinNM


AwakeinNM, I think you are asleep. You have just called half of your country "pudding brained." Half of the country you live in. Half of your friends, half of your co-workers, half of your neighbors, and of your family... "Pudding Brained."

Whether you agree with another's stance on gun rights or not, when you throw around such labels you only seek to further the divide.

Your gun can stop the intruder who wants to rape you, the thief who wants to rob you, the tyrant who wants to enslave you, and the bear who wants to eat you. For these reasons, you should always keep your gun.

However, your gun cannot fight against division and hatred. You cannot shoot political tension. You cannot take out political conditioning with a head shot. A bullet is no match for the power of hatred. You can only fight these beasts with an open mind, a fair hand, and an accepting heart.

You have a right to arms....But you don't have the right Not to be offended.

I carry a fire arm for the same reason I have a fire extinguisher in my kitchen. I pray to God I never have to use it, but it is there in case I need it.

It's really as simple as that.

-Al



[edit on 18-8-2009 by AlBeMet]

Well it might be legal, but I'd have to question the intelligence of folks carrying assualt rifles to a speech by the POTUS.

I wonder if the NRA membership championing these gun-toting folks out front of a Presidential appearance would equally chamion... I don't know...Lets say 10 or 20 American gentleman of Middle Eastern descent wearing traditional garb and head-dress gathered on a corner of downtown Phoenix with assault rifles to protest US policy in the Middle East?

Legal?..yes. Bright?...not in my opinion....and dumb people with guns make me nervous.

Just my opinion.

[edit on 18-8-2009 by maybereal11]

Originally posted by mattifikation
reply to post by AwakeinNM

 

AwakeinNM, I think you are asleep. You have just called half of your country "pudding brained." Half of the country you live in. Half of your friends, half of your co-workers, half of your neighbors, and of your family... "Pudding Brained."

Whether you agree with another's stance on gun rights or not, when you throw around such labels you only seek to further the divide.

Your gun can stop the intruder who wants to rape you, the thief who wants to rob you, the tyrant who wants to enslave you, and the bear who wants to eat you. For these reasons, you should always keep your gun.

However, your gun cannot fight against division and hatred. You cannot shoot political tension. You cannot take out political conditioning with a head shot. A bullet is no match for the power of hatred. You can only fight these beasts with an open mind, a fair hand, and an accepting heart.

Matt, I do think I might have knee-jerked on that guy, and I agree with your assessment of the division we have in this country. One side makes decisions and reaches conclusions based on facts, data, experience and logic. The other side makes decisions and reaches conclusions based on what-ifs, hopes, dreams and ideas. That is assuming that people subscribe wholly to one side or the other. I think the bell curve straddles the two more often than not.

How many times do you go out in public in your normal routine and make snap judgments about people you interact with? Judgments like "Oh, she's hispanic so he must be a democrat." That white guy is old, he must be a republican." "That lesbian is surely liberal." While you may be right more than half the time, you are not right all of the time. It's only when people are holding signs and wearing shirts and displaying bumper stickers that the divide really manifests itself.

So yeah, which half of your neighbors and friends? You don't really know, do you?

Apologies to all the pudding brains.