Get a clue America

First of all, the U.S. is not primarily a republic. We have publicly elected president as opposed to a Prime minister, and a republic has, to lead our nation. We are a democratic republic, a mix between the two concepts.

Nationalized health care would be general welfare, available to all, as opposed to the military industrial complex which is specialized welfare for those well connected to the government. We pay all these taxes to support the rich here in the U.S., and the average person is getting nothing back. At least with nationalized health care the people would start getting something back for their tax dollar.

Clearly most Europeans see their health care systems as better than the U.S..

With our privatized health system we have a bunch of pill popping fools killing themselves because they are told to take a pill for everything that bothers them. You feel sad, start taking drugs. WOW, you people think this is good? Keep listening to that pill popping fool Rush.

These for profit insurance companies who prey upon people when they run into problems are the worst problem. Our banking systems and insurance system are the ones who are morally bankrupt.

Wake up and smell the coffee people.

Our huge debt was created by republican admins who claimed they were for smaller government while all along they built ever an ever larger government which primarily provides welfare for the rich, while turning their backs on the poor, all the while building a police state. The ideas of Reagan are completely and totally contrary to the ideals of our nations founding fathers. Reagan advocated policies completely in reverse of the Monroe doctrine, using our military to support the interests of private corporations by creating huge debts for the U.S. government.

We need to start enacting policies more like the Dutch, get rid of the war on drugs and start tending again to the General Welfare of the people, and reduce the military to a proper size to defend our nation, and stop meddling in places around the world.

the common mistake that Americans say to foreigners is "Why do you care so much about our government?"
honestly, what America does, effects the whole world. they have no choice but to care.
100percent agreed with the Canadian.

Originally posted by Debsturrs
the common mistake that Americans say to foreigners is "Why do you care so much about our government?"
honestly, what America does, effects the whole world. they have no choice but to care.
100percent agreed with the Canadian.

And what happens in the world affects us.

or did you think we actively wanted to be a part of World War I and World War II and the Korean War?

Vietnam was cleaning up after France's incompetence.

Most Americans want nationalized health care. They are sick and tired of the corrupt, abusive, dirty sneaky tactics of our private health care system. The polls show this to be, aside from all the dirty underhanded lobbying by insurance companies and lawyers living fat off of other peoples misery.

reply to post by Debsturrs
What will you gain when young Americans and old Americans are denide life saving treatments? I for one will not be a voluntary sacrifice nor will I encourage those who want to sacrifice other people.

Originally posted by VinceP1974

Originally posted by Mintwithahole.
reply to post by VinceP1974

 

Of course they're for it. When you are about to made obselete you either adapt or die, much like the poor in America. You cannot deny that the American news networks have acted disgracefully over this, scare mongering and even hunting through British Conservative MPs for someone to spout off about how bad our national health care is. . . Something which has badly damaged the Tory party.

If you don't know this perhaps it's time to invest in a television!!?

are you on drugs.. you're going all over the place and then say stupid things like "if you dont know this". What is the basis for that?

You are an angry little chap aren't you? No wonder you have two warnings.. . I asked you a question about whether or not you agreed that the American news stations have acted appallingly in reporting this, misleading the people and in some cases openly lieing. Your reply was to ask me if I was on drugs. . . Pathetic.

The poster who made the point about having publicly paid for firefighting forces and police forces who don't charge people when there is fire, or a murder, is right, we shouldn't make people pay when they have a serious accident or get a serious illness. That is plain cruel. We aren't talking about people getting lazy here. We are talking about people who work all their lives, only to run into misfortune. It is a tradition of all decent societies to help those down on their luck, and not to rob them when misfortune strikes, as our insurance companies and banking institutions currently do.

It is only decent, fair, right, and moral to help someone who has suffered from a terrible accident or caught a terrible disease.

reply to post by poet1b
We can pay for medical care for poor people without giving the lunatics in the government so much control. The governmnt should not have databases enabling rich connected farts to shop for new livers among the sheeple. The Obama mites can assure that this will not happen ,but they are wearing rose tinted frames.





[edit on 19-8-2009 by eradown]

reply to post by eradown


You have a point there, the state should only be allowed to collect so much information on people, but HECK, do you really think the insurance companies don't already do this. While I don't trust government, I trust insurance companies even less.

Originally posted by poet1b
reply to post by eradown

 

You have a point there, the state should only be allowed to collect so much information on people, but HECK, do you really think the insurance companies don't already do this. While I don't trust government, I trust insurance companies even less.

You can't sue the government and expect to win. Insurance companies have lost in court many times.

[edit on 19-8-2009 by eradown]

Originally posted by eradown

Originally posted by poet1b
reply to post by eradown

 

You have a point there, the state should only be allowed to collect so much information on people, but HECK, do you really think the insurance companies don't already do this. While I don't trust government, I trust insurance companies even less.

You can't sue the government and expect to win. Insurance companies have lost in court many times.

[edit on 19-8-2009 by eradown]

If the Govt thinks it's going to get my information, it will have to pursue a court warrant from a judge.

Thank you Constitution.

reply to post by eradown


How ya gonna prove that you information was stolen? Unless you have a lawsuit that can bring enough money to pay for the lawyers, you can't sue, unless you want to take on the corporate lawyers yourself, in a judicial system rigged to greatly favor lawyers.

The whole sue mythology is greatly over exaggerated. I have known plenty of people with very legitimate law suits who got nothing. I think they allow some lopsided lawsuit to go through every great now and then to fool the sheople.

Here is another thing people aren't looking at. When extremely expensive health care is tied to employment, it makes U.S. workers far more costly, and less competitive on the world market. If our taxes were used to pay our healthcare instead of overthrowing banana republic dictators who refuse to toe the corporate line, it would make U.S. labor cheaper and more competitive on the worlds labor market.

This is what I do not like about Obama's health care plan. Health care costs should be completely removed from employment costs.

reply to post by poet1b


The solution is to move to a car insurance model.

Individuals buying their own insurance. Instead of every health care transaction being handled by a 3rd party.

Socialism and communism are not the same thing, if you people care so much about these forms of government why not learn something about them?
And why do you keep drawing a distinction between a socialist government and a democratic one???? You might want to have a look over at europe sometime.
Deny ignorance....... by not logging on here!

Originally posted by Ebaneeza
Socialism and communism are not the same thing, if you people care so much about these forms of government why not learn something about them?
And why do you keep drawing a distinction between a socialist government and a democratic one???? You might want to have a look over at europe sometime.
Deny ignorance....... by not logging on here!

Communism is not a form of Socialism? Please no lectures about ignorance from you.

Originally posted by VinceP1974

Originally posted by eradown

Originally posted by poet1b
reply to post by eradown

 

You have a point there, the state should only be allowed to collect so much information on people, but HECK, do you really think the insurance companies don't already do this. While I don't trust government, I trust insurance companies even less.

You can't sue the government and expect to win. Insurance companies have lost in court many times.

[edit on 19-8-2009 by eradown]

If the Govt thinks it's going to get my information, it will have to pursue a court warrant from a judge.

Thank you Constitution.

Like they don't have it already



[edit on 20-8-2009 by mental modulator]

Originally posted by eradown

Originally posted by cranberrydork

Originally posted by eradown
He wants access to all our health records. He wants access to our bank accounts.

Huge, giant, glaring...

Wrong!!!

Please stop spreading stupid information.

Yes, the government will have access to everyone's records and they will be able to deny care. They will garnish wages. The system proposed will be as compassionate as the IRS.

Interesting.
Where does it say that in the plan?
Could you post the specific area's that describe this?
Thanks.

Originally posted by VinceP1974
(1) are that such standards shall-‘(D) enable the real-time (or near real-time) determination of an individual’s financial responsibility at the point of service and, to the extent possible, prior to service, including whether the individual is eligible for a specific service with a specific physician at a specific facility, which may include utilization of a machine-readable health plan beneficiary identification card

Read that very carefully......take your time. Don't be embarrassed.....on the Internet, no one can see you move your lips.

an individual's financial responsibility

Not an individual's ability, or their checking account balance....just as simply as it states....how much is the insured responsible for.....ie, the copay or deductible.

It may be that you don't have insurance, you don't use it, or your Mom takes care of all of that for you.....but so you know, this is the system that is currently in place. I hand the front desk my health insurance card, they look up the policy and member number information, and then tell me what my copay is.

Then, if I really want to get all crazy, whacko socialist.....I give them my debit card.....granting them *gasp* real-time access to my checking account.

And with the provision for "machine readable cards", it appears as if the intent is to make the process more efficient.

Get your panties in a twist if they start talking about changing HIPAA. Go look it up.

[edit on 20-8-2009 by cranberrydork]

Originally posted by jfj123
Where does it say that in the plan?
Could you post the specific area's that describe this?

It's always great fun when they try to do just that......inevitably, the content they offer as "proof" is laughably misread, misconstrued, or misinterpreted.