Why is Christianity so hated?

reply to post by Agree2Disagree


Yes, I agree. There are always exceptions to every rule, and people who dont fit the generalizations.

Personally I do believe there is some kind of higher purpose of us being here, but I dont follow a religion because any rules that prohibits me from changing my view would be very frustrating for me. I dont want a set of rules saying "this is what you are to believe". I would much rather learn about the world myself and make my own decisions on how to be a good person.

Because for me, thats what life is about. Learning, exploring new ways of thinking or doing things. And that includes making mistakes and experiencing the consequences. You can really see the life experience in some of the old people. You can tell they have experienced a long life of trial and error, and are wiser because of it. I like that. I like that a lot. They have grown as human beings because they were and are free thinkers.



[edit on 18-8-2009 by Copernicus]

Reply to post by JJay55

Why such harsh words towards Islam? Out of curiosity, of what faith are you?

Aren't the islamists just doing what their scripture tells them?


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Originally posted by TruthParadox
reply to post by calstorm

 

Honestly, I'm a bit surprised how *little* Christianity is hated.
I say this in light of the fact that the Bible is prejudice towards so many people.

Just to give some examples, according to the Bible:
1) Gays are to be killed & homosexuality is a sin
2) Women are under the authority of men
3) Different belief systems are not to be tolerated

And the most prejudice one of them all:

4) Anyone who does not hold Christian views will be tortured for eternity

This goes against the grain of what we believe in modern society - equality regardless of gender, belief, or sexual orientation.
Which is why I'm somewhat shocked that there isn't more hatred towards Christianity.
Not saying there should be any hatred, but I'm still a bit surprised...

The difference in the 4 items you mentioned is that in Christian countries these laws are not civil law.
In Islam these actions are punished by whipping, stoning, and death by beheading.
Yes, today in 57 OIC countries it is illegal to be a homosexual, and the penalty is hanging.
Yes, today in 57 OIC countries it is illegal to convert to Christianity. The penalty in Saudi is beheading.
Yes, today in 57 OIC it is immoral for women to go out of the house without a headscarf. Women are beaten by the fashion police, yes a government force that patrols the streets and carries out punishment.
Yes, today in 57 OIC countries Islam dictates that it is the only path and all non-muslims are inferior. If a non-muslim lives in this territory they are required to pay a jizya, protection tax just because of religion.
These countries have violent governments who enforce these rules and chop off hands, ears, whip women in public, bury and stone women and men, allow honor killing as part of their government action.

OIC- Organization of Islamic Countries where Sharia Law, religious law, is a way of life 24/7 that is breeding hate for non-muslims.

Originally posted by Agree2Disagree
Reply to post by JJay55

 

Why such harsh words towards Islam? Out of curiosity, of what faith are you?

Aren't the islamists just doing what their scripture tells them?

 

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I've practiced Islam and studied it for over 40 years. That makes me an apostate, which the penalty is death. By exposing Islam there are those who will threaten me and wish me dead... hmmmm... there's some hate for ya.

Muslims pray 5 times a day and live by Sharia religious law. That's quite different from majority Christian countries who live by civil law based on modern society. There's one thing to follow scriptures in the language they were written as metaphor and there's another thing to enforce scriptures through government as 57 OIC countries do.
Now when a muslim moves out of the 57 countries to a Christian country he still takes the law he is grown to know with him... in many cases muslims demand SHaria law be followed in countries without Islamic governments.
For instance, the muslim cabbies in Minneapolis airport refuse to carry passengers who have liquor in their possession. This is based on Sharia law and affects American law because people who want a cab can't get a ride. After a long fight the cabbies are required to go to the back of the line if they refuse a fare but this shouldn't have to be settled in a religious manner, we have laws in the US and that is the law. More and more muslims are seeping into Christian areas and bringing the hate with them, the perfect example is 911 which was a call to join Islam and bow down.

Reply to post by Copernicus

So, do you think I am limited by my personal beliefs then? Am I not a free thinker? Am I not allowed to change my views because of my religion?


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Reply to post by JJay55

Who is to say whether muslims are right or wrong for interpreting their scriptures literally or metaphorically?

Again I ask, aren't muslims just practicing their faith and executing the words of their scripture?


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Originally posted by Agree2Disagree
Reply to post by Copernicus

 

So, do you think I am limited by my personal beliefs then? Am I not a free thinker? Am I not allowed to change my views because of my religion?

It depends on if you think being a Christian means following the Bible 100% or if you can pick and choose what you want to accept as truth. You said earlier you dont agree with some things in the Bible, so in a way you are already a free thinker. But then you cannot, by definition, also be a Christian unless the definition of Christian is to take and pick what you like from the Bible and leave the rest.

I dont know... you seem like a mix of free thinker and religious follower to me.

Reply to post by Copernicus

Well, IMHO, a christian is one that bears fruits similar to the christs. With all the time that has passed, the church(men) have undoubtedly done what men do(exploited biblical texts for their own gain).

I practice what christ practiced...love and understanding.


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Originally posted by Agree2Disagree
Reply to post by JJay55

 

Who is to say whether muslims are right or wrong for interpreting their scriptures literally or metaphorically?

Again I ask, aren't muslims just practicing their faith and executing the words of their scripture?

 

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There is a big difference between faith and law.
Islam is demanding that everyone follow their law. So you think I should be killed because I denounce Islam? That's hate, that's the topic of this thread.

Here's an article that might help. It is about an 11 year old girl who is in US state custody in Florida because her Islamic parents in Ohio are enforcing Sharia law on her. :
"Other Islamic spokesmen in the U.S. have been even more flagrantly deceptive. M. Cherif Bassiouni, a professor of Law at DePaul University and President of the International Human Rights Law Institute, asserted about the notorious Abdul Rahman apostasy case in Afghanistan in 2006 that “a Muslim’s conversion to Christianity is not a crime punishable by death under Islamic law.” This is simply false. Islam’s death penalty for apostates is only a dead letter if no one cares or is able to enforce it in a particular case, but it is deeply rooted within Islam. Some argue that it derives from Qur’an 4:89, which speaks of those who have embraced the Islamic faith and then turned “renegade,” directing Muslims to “seize them and slay them wherever ye find them.” Muhammad, the prophet of Islam, said, “Whoever changed his Islamic religion, then kill him” (Bukhari, vol. 9, bk. 84, no. 57). This is a universal principle in Islamic law. The Islamic scholar and ex-Muslim Ibn Warraq explains that all the schools of Islamic jurisprudence teach this: “Under Muslim law, the male apostate must be put to death, as long as he is an adult, and in full possession of his faculties….According to Hanafis and Shia, a woman is imprisoned until she repents and adopts Islam once more, but according to the influential Ibn Hanbal, and the Malikis and Shafiites, she is also put to death.”

A Shafi’i manual of Islamic law directs that “when a person who has reached puberty and is sane voluntarily apostatizes from Islam, he deserves to be killed. In such a case, it is obligatory for the caliph (A: or his representative) to ask him to repent and return to Islam. If he does, it is accepted from him, but if he refuses, he is immediately killed.” ('Umdat al-Salik o8.1-2).

The internationally renowned Sheikh Yusuf Al-Qaradawi, whom Saudi-funded Islamic apologist/scholar John Esposito of Georgetown University famously called “a reformist,” is likewise adamant: “Muslim jurists are unanimous that apostates must be punished, yet they differ as to determining the kind of punishment to be inflicted upon them. The majority of them, including the four main schools of jurisprudence (Hanafi, Maliki, Shafi`i, and Hanbali) as well as the other four schools of jurisprudence (the four Shiite schools of Az-Zaidiyyah, Al-Ithna-`ashriyyah, Al-Ja`fariyyah, and Az-Zaheriyyah) agree that apostates must be executed.”
frontpagemagazine.com...

I've waited to do this.

Bear with me, this is only my second attempt at a thread. If there is already one like this i didn't find it.

We all have our first threads, see mine to see me get a new one ripped.

There is more opposition to Christianity than any other religion

Watch t.v. for Islam, and ATS for the Jews. Ultimately the only "religion" some may say, are atheists, the ultimately discriminated group oppose to all others.

Wouldn't he try to sow discord amongst the people, dived and conquer?

All religions seem askewed, and separated. So all religions must be done away with by one (satan) or by reason.

Leaving apart agnostics, that 'just don't know'. Apart from religious folk.

Wouldn't he use people claiming to belong to this religion to do horrible acts in the name of such religion to discredit it?

He, equal to lucifer, of christianity, I suppose he would, serpent and all. Although, i'd think he'd side really upon atheism if none other, and disprove instead of, argue against. Savvy?

No I figured not. He would rather prove religion wrong, then to use it's falsehoods to use as why not to believe. Seeing as the bible states such things, and he, must be literate.

I am also open to constructive criticism to help me improve on future threads.

Great!

Criticism for christianity, is not only allowed upon christians. When done on allahists, from a small newspaper, grew from hatred of it, to where everyone knew about it, aka the drawings that pissed EVERY muslim off!.

Also, some of the muslims burned christians in tires to prove their point in the outrage of the cartoons.

Now I suppose only, you are american, and that being burned in a tire for belief (from a secular constitution) is outrageous, and not realistic here. Although it is elsewhere.

Christianity, has a certain lack of extremists this day, so those who oppose, aren't immediately stoned to death or burned or killed in anyway. So it's free to criticize.

Also, those who poke fun at it, may in fact be christians although poke fun at themselves. See comedians poke fun at their own race (except those which we all know won't, and others that do will be sued).

Christianity, would be wise to go back to it's extremists roots.

reply to post by Dean Goldberry

Jesus did say that his death was necessary for the remission of sins. I suggest you read the the four gospels. Read them slowly, stop and think about what you read, and you will see that Jesus clearly states that he came to die for humanity. He was/is the ultimate sacrifice.

reply to post by alien
Thank you, sir, (I'm assuming here!) for a voice of reason. It doesn't hurt that you agree with me, that true Christianity is a more than a belief system, it is a lifestyle that dictates that one must consider and perform right actions.
This means charity to the poor, compassion to sick, mercy to the "sinner." And before I get flamed, here in America, our laws and our government, despite arguements to the countrary, are based on the Judaeo-Christian ethic. Christ said we should forgive our transgressors "seventy times seven," but forgiveness does not mean one escapes punishment, and capital punishment is perfectly acceptable.

We are also commanded to be good stewards of the earth, but that is a matter for another thread.

In answer to the OP ..hypocrisy.

Originally posted by kettlebellysmith
And before I get flamed, here in America, our laws and our government, despite arguements to the countrary, are based on the Judaeo-Christian ethic.

But we don't stone people to death in the US for adultry. We don't behead people for changing their personal religion, hell, we even allow them to have a personal religion.
Whereas in Islam... this is not true. So if laws are based on ethic what right does Islam have to preach hate against Christians and Jews?

Yes adulters are stoned to death in Islam by government order. Not some tribal ritual that is remote and uncommon. Stoning happens often as part of Islamic governmental law, enforced and carried out by the government.
What's the difference between this and a Christian US?

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic


I believe you're right. Most Christians don't practice what their own scriptures tell them. The new testament is a 'guide by example', so to speak. Did Jesus thump a Bible on street corners and annoy everyone? No. They came to him, and he spoke to them. He taught them to love, not hate. 'Revenge is mine, sayeth the Lord'. OK, then Christians need to LET God have his revenge instead of trying to get it for themselves. If they will recall, every 'vessel' used to take revenge was also despised.

The part about 'judge not, lest you be judged'? Well, apparently that one hasn't sunk in, yet. It goes along with the 'attitude' and condemnation that you were feeling when you 'tried' Christianity. Its not our job to do that. Only a perfect God can do that. So, why, then, are they playing the part of God? Another strike that turns people away. I won't go into the Church's 'conversion' of the pagans in Europe and the British Isles.

Also, the evangelists, Paul and Peter and such: When someone rejects your gospel, leave. Don't be pushy. They shook the dust from their clothes and moved on. They also need to let God do the work. Instead of being an annoyance to society, they tend to not let whatever God does for them just 'show up' in their lives. Wouldn't it be a lot more impressive to just see a difference in someone rather than they have to explain it to you until you're BOTH blue in the face? The idea of the WWJD probably had good intentions, but well, they screwed that one up, too.

I grew up in a Baptist church. I still have my belief, but I've distanced myself from the organized religion for some of these very reasons. Sure, I have my ups and downs, but I don't politicize them for the sake of my religion, nor do I get the urge to tell you what I know, have experienced, or believe. Why? Because even the Bible talks of the still, small voice that tugs at a man toward Christianity. If you don't hear it, you're not going to notice it, and you're not going to be interested. If my life can be used as an example of how you would like to be able to tolerate the world around you, then, viola! There's my 'witness'. I only sweat it the small stuff until I realize, I don't need to.

That, in my nutshell, is what I find wrong with the current state of Christianity, and why it is, among other religions, one that is trashed constantly. If you aren't throwing out trash to the people to begin with, I guess they wouldn't be tossing it back to you.

Paz

Originally posted by ldyserenity
reply to post by calstorm

 

I think a lot of it has to do with the way the Christians themselves show hatred toward anybody different from them. IMHO, I mean did they not burn so called "witches" at the stake just because they would not convert or drive them off their land if they would not convert? They are a hateful and hypocritical religion, they hate gays, they think women should be submissive, Granted not to the degree the Muslims do, but to a degree they do devalue women, they hate anybody who's had an abortion regardless of the circumstances, they hate anybody who beleives in freedom without restraint(I'm talkin sexual freedom, yes), There really isn't too much they are tolerant of. As a matter of fact they will sit and say "Love thy neighbor" and in the same breath pray for that neighbor to lose his home, if he is gay, or a single mother, or a person whos had an abortion...that's hipocracy. At least other religions will just come right out and say we hate you but we'll tolerate you, because you have the right to what you think is living right.

You realize YOU are the epitome of ignorance, right?
I consider myself a Christian and I don't subscribe to 90% of what you posted.

You should really engage your brain before your mouth. You just displayed more hatred than any Christians within my circle of friends and family.

Congratulations on demonstrating the definition of "close-minded"!

reply to post by GroundZero

People who are sympathetic to Islam through condemning Christianity are apologists. Jimmy Carter is a prime example. They cast aside the brutal reality that Islam is killing in the name of religion in our day and time and apologize for all the wrongs that Christianity did to make them kill... or something. When in fact it is Islam that is doing all the killing all by themselves without any kind of influence except their own theology.
As demonstrated by the post you commented on... another apologist it seems. Good catch.

PS. Most importantly to understand: Chritianity is plural and accepts other people with other religions as equal humans.
Islam does not.

reply to post by Republican08

Also, some of the muslims burned christians in tires to prove their point in the outrage of the cartoons.

In TIRES? What are these muslims thinking? Tires create a great deal of pollutants, and dont do an effective job. Bury the SOBs alive- at least there will be fertilizer for the plants.

reply to post by GroundZero


Can you be offended any more? Wow. That's why people like me quit- You people are so 'holier than thou' you dont think your crap stinks. Guess what- IT DO.

reply to post by JJay55

But we don't stone people to death in the US for adultry. We don't behead people for changing their personal religion

Nope- we have Christians for mental abuse and use of their muscle to make sure anyone who doesn't end up in their little club (and has all the 'right' attributes) ends up as close to a social outcast as you can get. Remember, their little behinds will be going to 'heaven'. How interesting a lot of those behinds are evil, rich, hypocritical, cruel, mean, and inhumane.