I am 23, an American Citizen with government run health care.

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posted on Aug, 15 2009 @ 07:14 AM
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Originally posted by ohioriver
Can someone post a brief summary of the Kennedy bill? Post a link?


Wall Street Journals take:

online.wsj.com...




posted on Aug, 15 2009 @ 07:15 AM
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Originally posted by ohioriver
Can someone post a brief summary of the Kennedy bill? Post a link?


Sure although I am NOT sure if this is the final draft being incorporated into the current legislation on the table

keithhennessey.com...



posted on Aug, 15 2009 @ 07:20 AM
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reply to post by Rockpuck
 


Responsibility. Intelligence.

Option 1.Save $100 to pay for X.
Option 2.Use credit card to pay for X, pay up to 18% interest on $100

Which is the smarter option and save money?



posted on Aug, 15 2009 @ 07:22 AM
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Originally posted by redhatty

Originally posted by ohioriver
Can someone post a brief summary of the Kennedy bill? Post a link?


Sure although I am NOT sure if this is the final draft being incorporated into the current legislation on the table

keithhennessey.com...



Thank you. Be back after while I need to read this. Have a good day everyone.



posted on Aug, 15 2009 @ 07:25 AM
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Originally posted by KnoxMSP
reply to post by Rockpuck
 



That's the one thing that bothered me about that. How do they get around the costs of malpractice insurance? Is there no legal waiver a patient could sign acknowledging that they do not hold the doctor responsible? I know it could open you up to possibly getting bad treatment, but isn't it our responsibility to determine who we want working on our health?

[edit on 15-8-2009 by KnoxMSP]


Rarely is a primary care physician the one who gets sued for malpractice. That usually occurs with hospitals and surgeries. Most docs know this too, although it doesn't change what they have to pay, even as primary care physicians.

What is not widely known is that in the case of a malpractice claim, a person's - get this - INSURANCE COMPANY usually provides a lawyer in addition to the lawyer you may hire on your own to sue the defendant.

If malpractice insurance was not around, doctors who make bad mistakes would end up out of medicine, as after a suit or 2 they would be bankrupt & lose their license. With malpractice around those bad docs stay in business by having the malpractice ins. settle out of court. It's a bad feedback loop.

All this creates more increases in medical care costs to the patient.

A primary care physician who prescribes something that doesn't work or doesn't heal something the first time, will RARELY charge a patient who is self-pay twice to correct the situation. This is LESS cost to the patient.



posted on Aug, 15 2009 @ 07:36 AM
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Originally posted by ohioriver
reply to post by Rockpuck
 


Responsibility. Intelligence.

Option 1.Save $100 to pay for X.
Option 2.Use credit card to pay for X, pay up to 18% interest on $100

Which is the smarter option and save money?


You fail, or choose to fail, to see my meaning. Or you choose to be confrontational, I don't know..



posted on Aug, 15 2009 @ 07:38 AM
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reply to post by redhatty
 


And let us not forget the PHARMA companies .. oh good lord there is another can of worms. Those sick bastards.. they are probably the biggest single cause for rapid rises in health care costs.. but nothing, not one damn thing is being said about them in Obama's health care plan .. why is that?

I will give you a hint. It starts with "D" .. it's green.. it gets people elected..



posted on Aug, 15 2009 @ 08:19 AM
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reply to post by iamjesusphish
 


There really is no point in arguing with people like that. They feel that everyone should lead perfect lives, but most likely they lead the least perfect lives of all.



posted on Aug, 15 2009 @ 08:27 AM
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reply to post by nixie_nox
 


Not at all. Just don't want to pay for anyone else's mistakes, that's all. Your life is what you make of it, when you resort to relying on hand outs.. well it doesn't speak much of your self does it?



posted on Aug, 15 2009 @ 08:28 AM
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Originally posted by redhatty
reply to post by iamjesusphish
 


So, YOUR BAD CHOICES have been subsidized by my taxes.

You CHOSE to do drugs, and this caused health problems, but MY TAXES are paying for your rehab and your medical treatment.

Of course you want to keep your free health care going, Me and the rest of the american tax-payers are paying your bills!!!!!

America really has become a nation of leeches, your post is just another example of that.



So you think that this person should have died just because they made a mistake?? Everyone makes mistakes and they learn from them. This person pays taxes and works, but cant afford private health care so they get govt assistance. You think you are more deserving of living because you have private insurance and you chose a different path? Everyone has a right to be healthy no matter their financial situation. IMO there is nothing wrong with bettering your life and realizing your mistakes and moving on with your life on a better path. I commend this person for cleaning up their act and even coming on a forum and talking about it esp when people like you do nothing but attack them. I really hope nobody you love ever has to go through something like this because it is not pleasant to deal with.

OP glad you are doing well now. I myself do not have any insurance. I have applied for medicaid but I do not qualify. I am 30, single and have no kids and I cant afford private insurance. My job does not offer insurance so it's really hard for me to get any medical treatment esp when I have to pay up front. I do try to find doctors that work on a pay scale slide which has helped but not always. If I could have insurance right now that would be great. I think everyone should be able to go to the doctor when something is wrong no matter your status. I always hate how they look at me when I go to the doctor because I dont have insurance. Its like I am scum or something to them.



posted on Aug, 15 2009 @ 08:30 AM
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reply to post by redhatty
 


I come from Denmark - known for one of the best put together health care systems and overall systems in the world - we have a dedication in Denmark for not loosing people and let all be equal. All should be given help and this is the basics of the system. You need people to be functioning in a society before the society can run with success. This is why YOU should care for OTHER people and not be a egoistic being. You will soon realize that many things will stabilize because much of the people are equal and no one is left behind - only those who really want to be left behind.

Think a little about other people than about yourself. Why do you think you have so many problems with equality in your country? Can't you really see what problems this creates?

The people you mention, drug addicts etc., are the source to some of the destabilization of your country... helping these people will only do good for the most.

[edit on 15-8-2009 by DwaynetheSpecious]



posted on Aug, 15 2009 @ 08:31 AM
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reply to post by Rockpuck
 


Oh dear, Big Pharma, yes a HUGE increase in costs.

Esp for taxpayers who subsidize Medicare/Medicaid now. The .gov not only allows a 10 yr patent exclusion for meds, but then lets Med. patients get those name brand meds, while the drug stores take a huge loss, which they carry over to private ins & self pay patients, the .gov gives a $$ subsidy to Big Pharma for the "loss" of income due to Med. patient usage.

Giant circle jerk at the expense of the taxpayer yet again



posted on Aug, 15 2009 @ 08:35 AM
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reply to post by mblahnikluver
 


Public Law prohibits hospitals from refusing patients. If he/she OD's they go to the hospital and the tax payer picks up the tab. Few people would say life and death situations shouldn't be paid for. Having established programs like Medicaid (for the poor) promotes abuse.. ask anyone who's ever been a nurse/doctor in the ER of a hospital, how many poor patients on Medicaid come in seeking simple over the counter meds because they get it for free .. It's not that they don't have 5 bucks for a packet of aspirin, it's that the hospital gives it away if they go to the ER with a headache, it's what they expect. My favorite stories come from nurses in the ER of Childrens hospitals, parents bring their kids in to the ER demanding food, pop, tv and meds that, had they gone to Wal Mart they coulda got for $3.

Saving a life in the event of an emergency is fine. Paying for their rehab or any abuses to the system? No thanks.



posted on Aug, 15 2009 @ 08:39 AM
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Originally posted by mblahnikluver
So you think that this person should have died just because they made a mistake?? Everyone makes mistakes and they learn from them. This person pays taxes and works, but cant afford private health care so they get govt assistance.


Keep reading the thread & you will see that the OP not only got help for addiction through the us taxpayer, but even GOT THE ADDICTION through the US Taxpayer.

Now, let's suppose that the OP didn't have medicaid paying the bills for the presecription drugs they got addicted to. Do you think the addiction would have still happened of the OP had to PAY for the meds in the first place?

I don't.


I really hope nobody you love ever has to go through something like this because it is not pleasant to deal with.


Too late, been through that with loved ones. I still stand behind the belief that there is a lack of personal responsibility that is the major factor here, not the unavailability of medical care.


I always hate how they look at me when I go to the doctor because I dont have insurance. Its like I am scum or something to them.


You are a rarity. I have always been self-pay for regular care and have NEVER gotten degrading looks from staff at doctor's offices.

Then again, maybe it's because I have the same doctor for years & always pay my bill.



posted on Aug, 15 2009 @ 08:40 AM
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reply to post by DwaynetheSpecious
 


That's a wonderful Socialist way of looking at things.

Denmark pays for that in their taxes. Which is one thing for Denmark to do it.. a Nation the size of New Jersey.. it's another to have a massive, expansive system across the US. How many Denmarks fit inside California?


***********************

Most expenses pertaining to ..... anything..... the GOV does is directly related to Bureaucracy. The bigger the system, the bigger the Bureaucracy. If we switch to this GOV plan, tens of thousands will be hired into the system just to fill the new Bureaucratic jobs..

All the while our care suffers accordingly.

***********************



posted on Aug, 15 2009 @ 08:45 AM
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reply to post by redhatty
 




You are a rarity. I have always been self-pay for regular care and have NEVER gotten degrading looks from staff at doctor's offices.


Being descended from Irish/English blood I was cursed with weak teeth. But I have never had dental insurance.. because, quite frankly, private dental insurance is a joke. If I ever go in, I usually have specific directions as to what they need to do because that's all I am paying for. ALWAYS ask why I don't have dental insurance .. well .. if I got dental insurance I would have to pay premiums for 12-24 months at about $50 a month to even qualify for benefits.. well if you add all that up plus the copay anyways it's cheaper to pay out of pocket lol.

Just an example of how *** up the insurance business is.

Now.. I would never expect (nor would I accept) the Gov to pay for my care.



posted on Aug, 15 2009 @ 08:47 AM
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Originally posted by DwaynetheSpecious
reply to post by redhatty
 


I come from Denmark - known for one of the best put together health care systems and overall systems in the world - we have a dedication in Denmark for not loosing people and let all be equal. All should be given help and this is the basics of the system. You need people to be functioning in a society before the society can run with success.


I agree, you need people that produce in society for it to be a healthy society. Here in America we have people who literally live off the teat of government assistance & still think they should have more from the .gov

That is wrong.

Many of these people are also part of the reason that malpractice is so high for our health care providers. These same leeches will find any little reason to sue anyone for the hope of a financial windfall. Doctors who have done nothing wrong included.

Come over here & experience the leech filled society here before you condemn my words. No one who needs emergency care can be denied, it is against the law here. The problem is, there are too many people who will get care and never pay their bills.



Think a little about other people than about yourself. Why do you think you have so many problems with equality in your country? Can't you really see what problems this creates?

The people you mention, drug addicts etc., are the source to some of the destabilization of your country... helping these people will only do good for the most.


In most states there are already services in place for low income people to get help for addiction & mental health disorders, but the people WON'T use them, they want the .gov to pay for them to have 1st class treatment, regardless of their ability to pay for it.

I do care about other people, I care about the people who REALLY ARE supporting this country, not the ones who suck off the .gov teat even though they are fully capable of being productive members of society, they just choose not to, since the .gov pays for everything.



posted on Aug, 15 2009 @ 08:51 AM
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reply to post by Rockpuck
 


Oh don't worry, the current legislation only provides for Dental with the "Premium-Plus" level of coverage option.

Most people still won't get to see a dentist without paying for it out of pocket.

PS, shop around, I pay $85 every 6 months for my check up & cleaning as a self-pay patient. Haven't had a cavity in years so can't tell you about those costs under self pay.

[edit on 8/15/09 by redhatty]



posted on Aug, 15 2009 @ 08:53 AM
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reply to post by redhatty
 


Just a quick question.

Do you have your own security team or would you go to the police if you'd had your car stolen or house burgled?

If it's the latter, haven't you ever heard personal responsibility? Perhaps, you shouldn't have things that are worth stealing.

Using the tax dollars of people that can afford security teams? Shame on you.



posted on Aug, 15 2009 @ 08:56 AM
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reply to post by redhatty
 


You pretty much just took over this thread with your anger and arrogance, its oozing from you. Your "holier than thou" attitude sickens me.
Who are you to judge another human being because of a currency. Money does not make a man.
In a society where there ARE poorer people, someone has to help them, and that someone is YOU, and everyone else. Deal with it. If we lived in an Indian tribe, there wouldnt BE poor people, but you would still help them. Well, maybe not you. So you are judging the OP because he's poorer than you, well done..Karma is a bitch.





 
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