I am 23, an American Citizen with government run health care.

reply to post by contemplator


You don't seriously believe that?

I mean..

That's like believing Bush when he said we would all get tax reductions for the middle class... which we didn't get much of one, but the rich got a huge one.

Same for dems. "We will tax the rich a lot, the middle class a little" which turns into "We taxed the rich a little and the middle class a lot!"

Because quite frankly there is more of a middle class than there is a wealthy class .. and in economics, that's all that matters. It will be funded by the Middle Class, or it simply won't be funded at all.

reply to post by Rockpuck


Thanks Rockpuck! Glad I finally signed up, I just can't sit back anymore and not comment. I really just don't get it. I am all for my fellow man and women to be healthy and live a good life. But at the same time, let's not take from the middle class. People like myself and the millions of other middle class earners really are the ones struggling to keep our credit and name good, live up to "socities standards," and keep our lives going in this crazy world....Don't mean to sound like a whiner but it's reality, life is hard for us. I want people to be healthy regardless of income, but it should not burden other people that work hard to make ends meat and provide. I am still single as in not married and I don't have kids. I feel strongly for the guys and gals making $50+ like me that have kids to support. I can barely support myself don't take money out of their pocket!

Figure out another way. How about the government stop all the pork projects, bonuses, corruption, etc. Then I am all for government healthcare!

[edit on 15-8-2009 by Tom192]

reply to post by contemplator



The problem is that those that make more than $250K are our bosses and biz owners. You raise their taxes, you or I may lose our jobs. It's called the trickle down theory.

reply to post by Rockpuck


Next time state that your putting words in my mouth Mr.BS, I never said that last quote It would be nice of you to make that clear. I'm not proud to be on it if your trying to paint that picture. Too much Rush in the morning I guess?

reply to post by ladyinwaiting


If the story was true then it was a simple case of stupidity. Who am I? Someone that had to study in depth the laws of insurance.. I know how the system works, and the system works as I described. The fella who gets laid off would have still had insurance, thus your story is likely made up drivel.

I find you're response both illuminating and humorous.

reply to post by contemplator

wrong wrong wrong. Your argument is about those making over 250k which is not 'the middle class'.

Common mate, you can't just say what Obama told you in a press conference and presume I accept that as fact. Dig a little deeper then that.. to assume only one class (the smallest class in the nation I may add) will afford full health benefits for the entire nation is economically retarded.

reply to post by TheWake


My apologies I am usually good at getting the appropriate "reply to" tags.

And no, I don't listen to Rush. I don't even own a radio.. and I am Libertarian.. not a Republican.

Originally posted by Rockpuck
reply to post by contemplator

 

You don't seriously believe that?

I mean..

That's like believing Bush when he said we would all get tax reductions for the middle class... which we didn't get much of one, but the rich got a huge one.

Same for dems. "We will tax the rich a lot, the middle class a little" which turns into "We taxed the rich a little and the middle class a lot!"

Because quite frankly there is more of a middle class than there is a wealthy class .. and in economics, that's all that matters. It will be funded by the Middle Class, or it simply won't be funded at all.

You can't back that up with any kind of proof. The administration has gone into extreme detail about how they plan to pay for this. I didn't see you complaining over Bush's prescription drug bill which he didn't even attempt to pay for. You are reading out Limbaugh talking points that have been debunked months ago. Anyway, ignorance is bliss.

Originally posted by Rockpuck
reply to post by ladyinwaiting

 

Lies.

Or ignorance.

Or both?

If you have employer sponsored healthcare, and you get cancer, then loose your job, through COBRA the corporations are legally obligated to "grandfather you in" .. You can apply for new insurance without being "screened" for preexisting conditions.. the corporations MUST pay for the health costs of the condition you had at the time of loosing your job.

Next time you make up a BS story at least get the facts right.

No, Mr. know-it-all. they do not. Furthemore I resent your consdecending attitude, and you are out of line.

reply to post by Tom192


And you of all people have much to say about paying taxes! I know from experience when you're in the 50-60k a year without a single dependent no one pays a higher percentage of taxes than you! .. That places you in the near top tax brackets

What's taking an extra 10% of peoples money? Well in an economy based on consumerism and seeing we are in the middle of an economic depression, I think it's safe to say our hard working middle class would fold under the pressure of further taxation.

Originally posted by iamjesusphish
Alright I am very fed up with rich people that have great health care being enraged with the notion that they will not pay for another persons health care because it is socialist... I am 23 years old and have been on Medicaid since I was 18 and taking off my parents insurance. This is not because I don't work or pay taxes but simply because I can not afford private insurance.

Now first off I am a recovering addict and without medicaid I would have died when I overdosed in 2004. Without Medicaid I would have been pushed off to a hospital that could not treat my Pulmonary Edema. My life was saved because of government run health care.

I for one believe that every American citizens deserves to be insured. To any of you that think our country will be ruined because of this needs to be human for one second and think about their fellows humans. We are not enemies. We are the same as you except we are not as well off. I work just like you do I pay taxes just like you and I would want the same health insurance for you....


[edit on 15-8-2009 by iamjesusphish]

Who exactly are 'the rich'? Is this just anyone who makes more than you and can afford insurance? Why does anyone owe it to you to pay your health care just because they might make more?

I'm sorry you OD'd and are a recovering addict, but with or without medicaid the ER is still available for your use. They are required by law to treat you.

Now with all that said, I am not rich, although I may be doing better off than some. We own our own business and work our asses off so that we can succeed. I work so that I can provide for me and my family, not so that I can pay for other people's health care. I agree the health care system needs overhauled, but that doesn't automatically make govt run health care a good idea. The new health care plan will fine any company who doesn't buy into the program. Your required to buy it for yourself and your employees. So what happens when I can't afford to pay my employees health care? Yup, you guessed it.. someone has to go or at least go from full time down to part time. People are going to lose jobs. We have talked about hiring someone new, but are waiting it out until we know what happens with this health care plan. If it goes through then we won't hire. hmmm already there goes one possible job down the drain.

Making money isn't a crime and there is nothing wrong with those who do the right things and become rich. So why penalize people who make more solely because you don't? You seem to have a very entitled attitude, but I hope I'm just reading it wrong. It's so hard to read tone online.

reply to post by contemplator


WTF are you talking about, I pointed out a flaw of Bush in the first sentence? Pull your head out of your arse will you?

Bush's prescription drug plan, over time, will be the death blow to Medicare. Simple as that.

He didn't fund it.. it's "future obligations" .. like the entire Social Security program.. like many of the State Pensions .. lets just add health care on top of it!

"Limbaugh" points indeed talk about ignorance.

reply to post by Rockpuck


I don't see how its so hard to believe ladyinwaiting. I had a relative deal with similar issues before.

Here's you 2 year wait.



www.medicalnewstoday.com...

reply to post by Rockpuck


You are so full of yourself you don't even recognize the truth when you see it. You are so far into your self you can't accept that someone has experienced something, or knows something you do not?


I have sent you a u2u. I have no desire to continue this here.

reply to post by ladyinwaiting

No, Mr. know-it-all. they do not. Furthemore I resent your consdecending attitude, and you are out of line.

Um yes miss knows nothing about insurance (see I can do that too) .. do a little research on what COBRA is and the laws regarding it per your state.

reply to post by TheWake


It's not. It's just hard to believe someone with cancer who looses their job wouldn't opt for COBRA insurance to move into a plan that covers their expenses to save their life. It's the insurance aspect that makes no sense.

Originally posted by VonDoom
Have you ever been a drug addict? Do you know what its like? Im going to guess no by your previous replies. Have you ever see what some addicts are willing to do to get their "medicine" ? Not that im calling the OP a straight up drug addict, like he said, he got hurt, and was prescribed his medicine legally. However, I think its worth paying a little extra upfront if it will reduce the chances of another crazy drug addict robbing my grandmother. This is just one small minute example.

Yes in fact, in my late teens and early 20's I got caught up in coc aine and crack addiction. I quit, never taking a handout from the government to do it. And even through the addiction I attended college & held a full time job. I never resorted to stealing to support my habit. That was over 20 yrs ago.

Quitting was hard, but it was really just a choice I had to make. I made it.

And either way, you'll still have another burden on society. why should I have to subsidize YOUR retirement with my SS "donation" every other week, when I WONT BE GETTING IT WHEN ITS MY TIME? Maybe If didnt have to pay for that, i might be able to finagle some form of private health insurance.

Every generation since SS began has said it probably wouldn't be around for them to collect when it was their time, yet it still is paying.

I've been forced to pay into SS since I began working at 15. When I do collect it, I will only get a payout determined by my income for the 10 yrs preceding the date of eligibility.

I think that's BS, If I payed into it for 50 yrs, I should rightfully get every penny I paid in back, but I won't, neither will anyone else.

I wish they WOULD abolish SS. I have my own savings for retirement, I put a little in every payday, because I do not intend to try and figure out how to live on the pittance that SS will pay me when the time comes.

If I could have been putting the $$ that is taken from me for SS into a savings account since I began working, there would probably be over a million dollars in the fund by the time I became eligible to retire.

I am a firm believer that I will manage my money better than someone else will manage it for me.

Third, all of you "rich and well to do people" need to learn to share the wealth around a little bit. Once someone has lost everything, they dont care.

Is that your personal experience? You have no idea what losing EVERYTHING is. I do. I lost everything in Katrina and have worked even harder to get back what I've lost since. Before that I've been knocked way down in a divorce, but I worked hard to get back up, bought a house just to lose it in Katrina.

You have choices in life, you either choose to be a success or you choose to give up or you choose to be a leech. Anyway you look at it, it's all a matter of choice.

You can use catastrophes as a crutch, you can become a professional victim, or you can take what life throws at you & become stronger from it, again, all a choice.

As to sharing the wealth, who says those of us who have worked hard to be successful DON'T help others?

I do, but that is my business, and my CHOICE to do so, I am not FORCED by my government to support people who may or may not appreciate it.

Fourth, more than likely, over say the next 20 years, the cost of socialized healthcare would decrease, as more and more people would be able to take preventative measures and screenings, thus reducing the number of serious cases which do cost a lot of money.

REALLY??? And what government run program are you using as an example to base this on? Please point out to me ONE PROGRAM that the government runs that has become LESS COSTLY to run as time passed

reply to post by redhatty

I've been forced to pay into SS since I began working at 15. When I do collect it, I will only get a payout determined by my income for the 10 yrs preceding the date of eligibility.

And Core Inflation. Which we both know is fixed. If Inflation levels were accurate SS would go bankrupt over night.

Regardless of your opinions about the current Health Care Reform Bill being proposed by the Obama administration, one must agree that the system is inadequate and needs some serious reform. It is of my opinion that the PTB are taking advantage of the public's need for more and better health care. Using it as a catalyst for employing new levels of social control. The Reform Bill's pushers are winning the fight with the general public through media control and counter-information blackout. By counter-information blackout, I mean that there isn't any healthy public debate or alternative proposals in the public forum. This is because we are conditioned to let our legislative representatives make the decisions for us and just except it; rather, we should act as a jury and decide for our representatives in government.

We can call each other names all day long, but that won't change opinions. Realize that those here who are in support of the Obama reform plan are right in that they believe that reform is necessary. They haven't been offered any alternatives or variations and so those who are in favor of health care reform appear to be in support of the bill, because in the public forum this is all there is. Those who oppose the Obama plan have many valid arguments and objections to the bill. To dismiss their input would be foolish. Both sides of this argument are right in their beliefs as the bill reaches and effects issues reaching well past just health care. It no doubt changes the definition of what is an American Republic.

I am for the advancement of mankind and believe we are at a very important place in history where we can evolve to a higher level of humanity if we choose or we can take another step back and continue to let others rule our lives. It's possible for the masses to speak up and change the way we are ruled over, but we better know what the hell we are demanding.


[edit on

Originally posted by redhatty
reply to post by iamjesusphish

 

I have plenty of compassion for my fellow man, I have no compassion for people who play the "poor, poor, pitiful me" routine.

And I have no stomach for leeches who fight to defend their leech activity.

It IS a cruel world, sounds like you need to tough up.

So, you are saying that someone becomes ill or is injured, and you would like to get the care you need, but can't afford private insurance, they are playing a "poor, poor, pitiful me" routine, or being a leech?

Anyone who has had some bad finiancial luck, made poor and self destructive choices in life, or even a child born into a poor family... Any of these disgusting leeches needs to just die like they are supposed to and stop whining about health care.

This would make more room on the planet for highly evolved and noble human being such as yourself redhatty.

You truley are your brothers keeper....

ok plain and simple i am on straight government health care being part of the military and you think its great lmfao... ya don't listen to that guy listen to redhatty i've been sifting around for a year and a half trying to find out what is wrong with my knee thanks to government health care and come to find out that i had a torn acl miniscus and medial colateral ligament yeah i think its safe to say that government health care is garbage and please avoid it and to the original post thanks for taking my HARD EARNED MONEY