How many people on ATS say they think they know the exact dates and times and signs leading up?
If I was to present to you this verse from the Bible, Luke 21 or Mathew 24 like many people do on here and else where then we without further explanation make the Bible sound vague and open to criticism.

Example in Luke 21 people use this quote a lot.

Signs of the End of the Age

10Then he said to them: "Nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. 11There will be great earthquakes, famines and pestilences in various places, and fearful events and great signs from heaven

25"There will be signs in the sun, moon and stars. On the earth, nations will be in anguish and perplexity at the roaring and tossing of the sea. 26Men will faint from terror, apprehensive of what is coming on the world, for the heavenly bodies will be shaken. 27At that time they will see the Son of Man coming in a cloud with power and great glory. 28When these things begin to take place, stand up and lift up your heads, because your redemption is drawing near."
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People may use this to speak about what is happenning in the world around them, and by doing so will not convince people and many people on the internet will go to their Bibles if they have one these days to look it up further. Other events that involve Israel must also take place. This is a future Israel after the 2nd temple as predicted in the same verse was destroyed by the Romans as described in the previous verse in 70 AD.

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Luke 21
Signs of the End of the Age

5Some of his disciples were remarking about how the temple was adorned with beautiful stones and with gifts dedicated to God. But Jesus said, 6"As for what you see here, the time will come when not one stone will be left on another; every one of them will be thrown down."

7"Teacher," they asked, "when will these things happen? And what will be the sign that they are about to take place?"

8He replied: "Watch out that you are not deceived. For many will come in my name, claiming, 'I am he,' and, 'The time is near.' Do not follow them. 9When you hear of wars and revolutions, do not be frightened. These things must happen first, but the end will not come right away."

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There was World War 2 in recent history and many small wars and disasters but the end is not yet come, apart from Israel being back on the map after nearly 2000 years and everyone has gone back to hating that nation and people.

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Matthew 24
Signs of the End of the Age

4Jesus answered: "Watch out that no one deceives you. 5For many will come in my name, claiming, 'I am the Christ,[a]' and will deceive many. 6You will hear of wars and rumors of wars, but see to it that you are not alarmed. Such things must happen, but the end is still to come. 7Nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. There will be famines and earthquakes in various places. 8All these are the beginning of birth pains.

The Day and Hour Unknown
36"No one knows about that day or hour, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son,[f] but only the Father. 37As it was in the days of Noah, so it will be at the coming of the Son of Man. 38For in the days before the flood, people were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, up to the day Noah entered the ark; 39and they knew nothing about what would happen until the flood came and took them all away. That is how it will be at the coming of the Son of Man. 40Two men will be in the field; one will be taken and the other left. 41Two women will be grinding with a hand mill; one will be taken and the other left.

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You see not even Jesus knows nor the Angels when the day will come, it will happen unexpectedly but people are so sure they know or can guess even when they are practicing good Christians, some even use such a theme to become cult religion like which is wrong and it should not be followed in such a manner. They gather people into their groups and form cults, we have seen this happen before, if it is amateur non religious people predicting the dates we have seen by their amount who have that they were always wrong, ATS has enough of them on its own.

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The most important argument is this verse below, this is a 2000 year old warning of such behaviour, we see it all the time now on the internet, sometimes its the conspiracy theorists who try and predict dates and times, the 2012 theory is no different it seems, look at youtube, its full of it. For such events the mesage in
2 Thessalonians 2 is saying that the events are synchronised, one major event in human history is not the sign yet, no matter how big it was, not even world war 2 puts it on scale. The events of the end will involve just about everything war and disaster but with religious elements and of course Israel being in the centre of such events. Any way read below because if there are any Christians alike who feel like its the end every turn of the year then you really have to tick more boxes to convince people.

For the Athiest doomsday lovers who are also very wrong everytime, you just make the Bible sound even more accurate and 2012 is no different.
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2 Thessalonians 2

The Man of Lawlessness

1Concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our being gathered to him, we ask you, brothers, 2not to become easily unsettled or alarmed by some prophecy, report or letter supposed to have come from us, saying that the day of the Lord has already come. 3Don't let anyone deceive you in any way, for (that day will not come) until the rebellion occurs and the man of lawlessness[a] is revealed, the man doomed to destruction. 4He will oppose and will exalt himself over everything that is called God or is worshiped, so that he sets himself up in God's temple, proclaiming himself to be God.
5Don't you remember that when I was with you I used to tell you these things? 6And now you know what is holding him back, so that he may be revealed at the proper time. 7For the secret power of lawlessness is already at work; but the one who now holds it back will continue to do so till he is taken out of the way. 8And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord Jesus will overthrow with the breath of his mouth and destroy by the splendor of his coming. 9The coming of the lawless one will be in accordance with the work of Satan displayed in all kinds of counterfeit miracles, signs and wonders, 10and in every sort of evil that deceives those who are perishing. They perish because they refused to love the truth and so be saved. 11For this reason God sends them a powerful delusion so that they will believe the lie 12and so that all will be condemned who have not believed the truth but have delighted in wickedness.
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Just added - off shoot thought;
2012 divided by 3
= 6.70667

[edit on 14-8-2009 by The time lord]

I posted this thread at the wrong time of night, so hope tonight people may see it and have an opinion.

What I am trying to say is that people will say the Bible is vague and when its speaking about end times and quotes are used for modern events and disasters of today, people who listen to it will be put off. The Bible does mention that we should not guess times and dates anyway and its only shown once all prophecised events occur.

But there are those who say keep saying its this year or that, then even that makes the whole believability come to a negative response as we see with people's reactions. Remember first are the Birth pangs and revolutions as such but it takes time for it reach its peek.

[edit on 15-8-2009 by The time lord]

I respect your viewpoint on the bible; however, you will not get to the truth unless you expand your perception. I know you intend well.

When Jesus stated that not one stone would remain stacked on another, I think he was referring to all structures in society will crumble not in a physical sense but that the institutions that perpetuate false beliefs will crumble.

In Matthew, he states that before the coming of Jesus people will be living life normally. That is when Jesus returns, and scares everyone in a sense. So the whole destruction of the earth prior to his coming doesn't sound possibly, if everyone is living life normally.

Nation has risen against nation in the past few years. Raise your head and be in joy, as it is almost time. All those things have happened when viewed from a spiritual perspective.

Don't forget what how the bible described how to make it through the end times:

How to make it through the last days; very similar to new age and hopi prophecy teachings:

Timothy 2:21-26

21Therefore, if anyone cleanses himself from these things, he will be a vessel for honor, sanctified, useful to the Master, prepared for every good work.

22Now flee from youthful lusts and pursue righteousness, faith, love and peace, with those who call on the Lord from a pure heart.

23But refuse foolish and ignorant speculations, knowing that they produce quarrels.

24The Lord's bond-servant must not be quarrelsome, but be kind to all, able to teach, patient when wronged,

25with gentleness correcting those who are in opposition, if perhaps God may grant them repentance leading to the knowledge of the truth,

26and they may come to their senses and escape from the snare of the devil, having been held captive by him to do his will.

Read up on the Parable of the Ten Virgins.

Also do a search on no one knows the day or hour and the correlation to one of the Jewish feast day.

I would go into more detail, but I am pressed for time. I have pointed you in the direction you need to go, and I will follow up later tonight, if you do your research!

Before we get to the Parable of the Ten Virgins - The Day and Hour Unknown in Matthew 24 looks more important in comparison, there is also the Rapture as some see it as describing. Again the principle is the same, we have to be ready dailey when ever we can.

Okay so what do people think? First all like the Bible says don't be hysterical with the end is near untill other events come into place along with it because we all be jumping at shadows and people will profit from such predictions for their own cause. You heard about BSE, you heard about Bird Flu, Swine Flu and terrorism as such but there will always be some type of hysteria going on, they are not even the tip of the iceberg yet.

No doubt there are signs leading up like, Global economy, ID Cards, RFID chips and the Israel conflicts but that is just small steps that maybe the timing is being set. But even so it could happen anytime in ways we do not know.

So any thoughts, have I scared you off or something? I prefer people to be accurate with them selves that is all. I could be saying all this and for all I know the end of days has started already. But many times even with the Bible code people said there would be a nuclear war in 2006, it never happened and of course John Titor who is well mentioned here.

Again more threads that say the world will come to some end with all this hysteria and built up inner fears. But you have to do one thing and that is stay calm and don't freak out, we all in some way felt freaked out since 9/11, there has been wars and international tention and a new arms race.

But don't set a date and feel like you some how know, I know for sure Jesus said even he does not know, that is good because if he did know the devil would end this world along with him.

A Bible prophecy in Revelation might be fulfilled in the next 10-12 days.

2012 will not be the end of the world

It will be when the U.S. will be brought down from its pedistal of thinking it is on top

What happens to a bully ,, they are brought down a peg or two when everyone else rebels

The world is getting tired of the U.S. being the bully

Originally posted by rtcctr
2012 will not be the end of the world

It will be when the U.S. will be brought down from its pedistal of thinking it is on top

What happens to a bully ,, they are brought down a peg or two when everyone else rebels

The world is getting tired of the U.S. being the bully

2012 will be the end of the world as we know it. Human consciousness on a wide scale basis will realize it by mid-2010 to 2011 that we are in that time. The world/Earth will still be around in the solar system and probably along its same orbital path, but things will be a whole lot different for sure. Look up what likely happened 13,000 years ago to Earth. It was still around, but completely changed. Precession is 26,000 years roughly, 13,000 years ago something happened to Earth. Look it up. We are at that time again in the cycle.

This is why noone NOT EVEN THE CHRIST KNOWS WHEN ITS TIME INTENTIONALLY. Keeping the secret safe from those who may of attempted to MINIPULATE his return (AS THEY ARE DOING NOW ANYWAY) THE FALLEN 1/3 AND THE BRIGHTEST LIGHT LUCIFER. But GOD did not leave all you in the DARK HE SET A SIGN PATTERN FOR CHRIST FOLLOWERS TO RECOGNIZE WHEN THE MESSIA IS ABOUT TO AWAKEN, so eveyone would be ready.

So in some ways 1 cannot discredit the many predictions for they may be reading the SIGN PATTERN and are possibly 60% correct in their visions.

Are you willing to bet you soul on it PLUCKY THAT THIS IS AN ACCURATE PREDECTION.......

Imagin how many predictions there would be if something heavy was put on the line before predicting like in the ancient days 1 may have been called a DEVIL OR DEMON FOR RUFFELING THE FEATHERS OF THE MANY TRIBES. just asking PLUCKY NO MEAN STUFF.


[edit on 10/1/09 by Ophiuchus 13]