reply to post by mrmonsoon
Just because Russia has naval vessels looking for does not of itself indicate "something more than timber," so to speak. You have the alleged cargo
worth over a million dollars, the ship itself worth significantly more than that, you have the crew of 15 people. All those factors alone are
motivation enough for Russia to flex some military might to thwart future pirate and find their hardware and people.
Remember, it wasn't too long ago that US navy snipers operating from a destroyer killed a few pirates just to save one hostage's life...
Missing ship may have secret cargo, page 4
privacy
reply posted on 13-8-2009 @ 02:14 PM by detachedindividual
reply to post by sanchoearlyjones
When I first read about this story I was dumbfounded.
I am always suspicious, but this is just bizarre.
As I understand it, they were boarded by what they believed were anti-drug police. They stated this after it had happened, and then shortly after they vanished. Officials suspect that the person they spoke to on the radio to explain that they had been boarded may have been coerced by a pirate into stating that everything was okay.
My problems with this are as follows.
1. Why would pirates who had taken control of a vessel like this advertise the fact that the vessel had been boarded? If the person on the radio communication had not said anything no one would have know about it.
This is just asking for trouble.
If the pirates forced him to state that they had been boarded, tied up for 24 hours, and then they just left, wouldn't they have expected massive military involvement to deter the almost unprecedented threat of Pirates in the channel?
2. Why would a team of "Pirates" have the appearance of Drug Police? If the person on the radio stated that they were boarded by such and were tied up for twelve hours, they were obviously not in regular clothing. This suggests that whoever boarded that vessel were in a uniform, were a tight unit, had facilities and weapons suited to their role as drug police. You or I could tell the difference between a unified professional force and a rag-tag bunch of desperate pirates, why wouldn't experience men on such a vessel be able to tell the difference?
Traditionally, pirates don't pretend to be anything else, search a ship and then leave. They circle, attack, threaten and coerce the ship, and then take everything they can.
3. These "pirates" supposedly found nothing of value, at all. What, no jewellery, watches, phones? There were what, fifteen men on that ship? And none of them had anything worth taking?
I find that hard to fathom.
If a group of pirates attack a ship hoping for a big pay off and find nothing but wood, they would then attack the occupants and take everything of theirs of value.
And there would have been money on board, because after such a trip the guys on that ship would have wanted a break at their destination, a few nights in bars, in a proper bed, with a friendly lady...
4. The involvement of several vessels in the locating of this ship is also suspicious. Russia has been blasted internationally in the past for not doing more to rescue members of their own military in marine accidents. What makes fifteen civilians, and a cargo of wood, more valuable than a multi-million dollar nuclear sub and the lives of at least double that of this vessel in military crew?
There's a lot about this that doesn't make sense. But I do not for one second believe that they were boarded by pirates and then held captive and coerced into telling this story before vanishing.
I don't know exactly what I think really happened, but I am almost certain that the boarding team were not drug police or pirates, they were an elite team sent in on the basis of intelligence, or with the intention to hijack that ship for military purposes.
If it was an intelligence-led interception, Russia has something on that ship worth retrieving.
In which case, something important has been stolen from Russia and is on its way to god only knows where and for unknown purpose.
The other alternative is that Russia has staged all of this to get a foot in the door and justify a presence in certain waters, ready for something.
A little far-fetched, perhaps. But we are always suspicious of having Russian military hardware anywhere near us.
It's just occurred to me that several days ago it was reported that a Russian vessel was mysteriously patrolling an area of the US coast.
You can guarantee that wherever this vessel is, it's not in a US or UK operated location. Because Russia would have taken a peek at those first.
Hang on, how long would it take to paint that ship a different colour and install a new identity?
When I first read about this story I was dumbfounded.
I am always suspicious, but this is just bizarre.
As I understand it, they were boarded by what they believed were anti-drug police. They stated this after it had happened, and then shortly after they vanished. Officials suspect that the person they spoke to on the radio to explain that they had been boarded may have been coerced by a pirate into stating that everything was okay.
My problems with this are as follows.
1. Why would pirates who had taken control of a vessel like this advertise the fact that the vessel had been boarded? If the person on the radio communication had not said anything no one would have know about it.
This is just asking for trouble.
If the pirates forced him to state that they had been boarded, tied up for 24 hours, and then they just left, wouldn't they have expected massive military involvement to deter the almost unprecedented threat of Pirates in the channel?
2. Why would a team of "Pirates" have the appearance of Drug Police? If the person on the radio stated that they were boarded by such and were tied up for twelve hours, they were obviously not in regular clothing. This suggests that whoever boarded that vessel were in a uniform, were a tight unit, had facilities and weapons suited to their role as drug police. You or I could tell the difference between a unified professional force and a rag-tag bunch of desperate pirates, why wouldn't experience men on such a vessel be able to tell the difference?
Traditionally, pirates don't pretend to be anything else, search a ship and then leave. They circle, attack, threaten and coerce the ship, and then take everything they can.
3. These "pirates" supposedly found nothing of value, at all. What, no jewellery, watches, phones? There were what, fifteen men on that ship? And none of them had anything worth taking?
I find that hard to fathom.
If a group of pirates attack a ship hoping for a big pay off and find nothing but wood, they would then attack the occupants and take everything of theirs of value.
And there would have been money on board, because after such a trip the guys on that ship would have wanted a break at their destination, a few nights in bars, in a proper bed, with a friendly lady...
4. The involvement of several vessels in the locating of this ship is also suspicious. Russia has been blasted internationally in the past for not doing more to rescue members of their own military in marine accidents. What makes fifteen civilians, and a cargo of wood, more valuable than a multi-million dollar nuclear sub and the lives of at least double that of this vessel in military crew?
There's a lot about this that doesn't make sense. But I do not for one second believe that they were boarded by pirates and then held captive and coerced into telling this story before vanishing.
I don't know exactly what I think really happened, but I am almost certain that the boarding team were not drug police or pirates, they were an elite team sent in on the basis of intelligence, or with the intention to hijack that ship for military purposes.
If it was an intelligence-led interception, Russia has something on that ship worth retrieving.
In which case, something important has been stolen from Russia and is on its way to god only knows where and for unknown purpose.
The other alternative is that Russia has staged all of this to get a foot in the door and justify a presence in certain waters, ready for something.
A little far-fetched, perhaps. But we are always suspicious of having Russian military hardware anywhere near us.
It's just occurred to me that several days ago it was reported that a Russian vessel was mysteriously patrolling an area of the US coast.
You can guarantee that wherever this vessel is, it's not in a US or UK operated location. Because Russia would have taken a peek at those first.
Hang on, how long would it take to paint that ship a different colour and install a new identity?
reply posted on 13-8-2009 @ 02:16 PM by Rockstar1102
reply to post by Threadfall
I honestly can't see Russia caring about 2 million worth of lumber and a ship that doesn't belong to them. Not to mention why does it take 5 vessels including 2 Akula class nuclear submarines to find them?
I honestly can't see Russia caring about 2 million worth of lumber and a ship that doesn't belong to them. Not to mention why does it take 5 vessels including 2 Akula class nuclear submarines to find them?
reply posted on 13-8-2009 @ 02:17 PM by sanchoearlyjones
reply to post by TheSam
Excellent find for sure. So, were looking at a very likely nuclear load.
reply to post by mrmonsoon
I think it is really possible that a ship could hide a radioactive signature; it definitely has the room.........Lumber is a good insulator, or large cover for say a crate lined with lead.
Also, excellent points on communications. Where's the GPS as you mentioned.
reply to post by deltaboy
No, it doesn't. Why any communications??? ***WHO***** knew they left, and how was that communicated.
Excellent find for sure. So, were looking at a very likely nuclear load.
reply to post by mrmonsoon
I think it is really possible that a ship could hide a radioactive signature; it definitely has the room.........Lumber is a good insulator, or large cover for say a crate lined with lead.
Also, excellent points on communications. Where's the GPS as you mentioned.
reply to post by deltaboy
No, it doesn't. Why any communications??? ***WHO***** knew they left, and how was that communicated.
reply posted on 13-8-2009 @ 02:20 PM by Helmkat
reply to post by pavil
Searching for the ship is a matter of math. Heck if I was more motivated I could come up with a chart.
1: What were the performance characteristics of the target vessel, loaded and unloaded.
2:What was the last -confirmed- position of the vessel.
From that point you can plot where the ship could be. Each day beyond the last confirmed position that goes without contact increases the volume of space that needs to be searched, thus increases the difficulty of finding the vessel.
Right now with the known level of responce and the size of the search area I would -guess- that the search is more for show then to actually find the vessel. I would escalate my concern if higher then usual activity was seen at NATO/US airbases or naval stations. Heck I'm pretty sure there is a US battlegroup in the Med. right now and believe me if the US was concerned there would be a huge net of ships and planes looking for this ship.
Searching for the ship is a matter of math. Heck if I was more motivated I could come up with a chart.
1: What were the performance characteristics of the target vessel, loaded and unloaded.
2:What was the last -confirmed- position of the vessel.
From that point you can plot where the ship could be. Each day beyond the last confirmed position that goes without contact increases the volume of space that needs to be searched, thus increases the difficulty of finding the vessel.
Right now with the known level of responce and the size of the search area I would -guess- that the search is more for show then to actually find the vessel. I would escalate my concern if higher then usual activity was seen at NATO/US airbases or naval stations. Heck I'm pretty sure there is a US battlegroup in the Med. right now and believe me if the US was concerned there would be a huge net of ships and planes looking for this ship.
reply posted on 13-8-2009 @ 02:20 PM by sanchoearlyjones
reply to post by TheSam
BINGO, no comm. So who, what, where, how, and *******why*****.
I think we are being fed information so that when something happens sooner, or later we'll have been desensitized enough to buy the lie.
It might not even be with this ship, but I 'feel' there is something really odd here, and the MSM is being fed lies for a reason.
BINGO, no comm. So who, what, where, how, and *******why*****.
I think we are being fed information so that when something happens sooner, or later we'll have been desensitized enough to buy the lie.
It might not even be with this ship, but I 'feel' there is something really odd here, and the MSM is being fed lies for a reason.
reply posted on 13-8-2009 @ 02:29 PM by Rockstar1102
reply to post by sanchoearlyjones
Yeah, I agree. It seems as if different MSM networks are feeding different pieces of information at us in an attempt to confuse us. We should really lay out a timeline in order to give everyone an exact idea of what took place, when and by who...
Any takers (I would, but I'm getting inundated here at work)....
Yeah, I agree. It seems as if different MSM networks are feeding different pieces of information at us in an attempt to confuse us. We should really lay out a timeline in order to give everyone an exact idea of what took place, when and by who...
Any takers (I would, but I'm getting inundated here at work)....
reply posted on 13-8-2009 @ 02:31 PM by MischeviousElf
I really dont like this situation, in any way.
Very strange, worrying with all the hall marks of a set up or shadow agency involvement.
Russian Nukes?
Everyone remeber wo Barkendale missing Nukes?
Abducted? lol
I bet most people did not know 8 Tonnes of Olives did once from a farm with no trace at night, no sign of any disturbance, Just gone!!
8 Tonnes of Olives Abducted!
Thats a lot of olives, but nowhere near as big as this ship,
Also a Whole Town once just dissapeared mary Celeste like, BUMP for any Canadian or USA members who can dig a bit below
Whole Town Abducted?
Its destination the North African coast to a lot of radical Muslim extremist groups, easy transit to the Mid East for any "Cargo", especially using lready in place and highly organised smugglers who alreday move ton's of drugs and weapons daily to and from europe etc...
However it may have been found BREAKING
Well I would find that HIGHLY unlikely as ANYTHING going past gibralter is listened to, watched, tracked etc by the huge British Military Naval bases and would have been picked up by them first rather than a lone ship....
ABC Australia
Got to link this here to Many many strange things just dissapear!
The Great Vanishing Mystery
Kind Regards,
Elf
[edit on 13-8-2009 by MischeviousElf]
Very strange, worrying with all the hall marks of a set up or shadow agency involvement.
Russian Nukes?
Everyone remeber wo Barkendale missing Nukes?
Abducted? lol
I bet most people did not know 8 Tonnes of Olives did once from a farm with no trace at night, no sign of any disturbance, Just gone!!
8 Tonnes of Olives Abducted!
Thats a lot of olives, but nowhere near as big as this ship,
Also a Whole Town once just dissapeared mary Celeste like, BUMP for any Canadian or USA members who can dig a bit below
Whole Town Abducted?
Its destination the North African coast to a lot of radical Muslim extremist groups, easy transit to the Mid East for any "Cargo", especially using lready in place and highly organised smugglers who alreday move ton's of drugs and weapons daily to and from europe etc...
However it may have been found BREAKING
Russian media is reporting that a ship that went missing off the coast of France last month may have been found.
The editor of Russian maritime bulletin Sovfrakht has told local media he has learnt from a Defence Ministry source that a frigate has been following a ship similar to the Arctic Sea in the Atlantic Ocean near Gibraltar.
Well I would find that HIGHLY unlikely as ANYTHING going past gibralter is listened to, watched, tracked etc by the huge British Military Naval bases and would have been picked up by them first rather than a lone ship....
But according to the ITAR TASS news agency, the Russian navy has denied the report, saying its ships are continuing to search for the Arctic Sea.
ABC Australia
Got to link this here to
Many many strange things just dissapear! The Great Vanishing Mystery
Kind Regards,
Elf
[edit on 13-8-2009 by MischeviousElf]
reply posted on 13-8-2009 @ 02:34 PM by sanchoearlyjones
reply to post by burntheships
I've heard that different professional syndicates, or rivaling factions operate o with military tactical precision. As you pointed out, 12 hours is long enough to go in, disrupt everything.
Your mentioning that with some of the other reports points toward a very highly organized attack.
One in which 'Lead in' had to be performed. This would in turn point toward an Intelligence Agency of some sort being involved.
reply to post by joe82
It's not about fear. It's about being aware, and vigilant.
reply to post by SLAYER69
You know perspective is one of the most important things to pay attention to. Everyone's is different.
I'll clarify right now, for all. When I say US/Israeli false flag, I'm not attacking the people; I am attacking the private sector military industrial complex that feeds off of OUR wounded veterans, and preys upon IED's to cause more amputee business.....25k arms, and legs..... Also, for eveyone to go back, and read Albert Pyke, and realize who he was. He formulated the 3 World wars for domination, and to conquer the Earth.
We are looking at his lineage, or spawn trying to bring that into fruition. No one wins in that game, but them.
Sorry, I'm still getting caught up in the conversation. So far it seems most everyone is thinking something is definitely not right.
I've heard that different professional syndicates, or rivaling factions operate o with military tactical precision. As you pointed out, 12 hours is long enough to go in, disrupt everything.
Your mentioning that with some of the other reports points toward a very highly organized attack.
One in which 'Lead in' had to be performed. This would in turn point toward an Intelligence Agency of some sort being involved.
reply to post by joe82
It's not about fear. It's about being aware, and vigilant.
reply to post by SLAYER69
You know perspective is one of the most important things to pay attention to. Everyone's is different.
I'll clarify right now, for all. When I say US/Israeli false flag, I'm not attacking the people; I am attacking the private sector military industrial complex that feeds off of OUR wounded veterans, and preys upon IED's to cause more amputee business.....25k arms, and legs..... Also, for eveyone to go back, and read Albert Pyke, and realize who he was. He formulated the 3 World wars for domination, and to conquer the Earth.
We are looking at his lineage, or spawn trying to bring that into fruition. No one wins in that game, but them.
Sorry, I'm still getting caught up in the conversation. So far it seems most everyone is thinking something is definitely not right.
reply posted on 13-8-2009 @ 02:45 PM by Eye of Horus
reply to post by sanchoearlyjones
Interresting theroy. Heres another one you might not be thinking about. Since the Reptilians now control china, and the vulturites now control the US, iraq, syria, and surrounding countries. Who's to say they were in the process of secretly moving there mobile stargates which used to be located in a ancient temple on the outskirts of bagdad. And it was intercepted by opposing forces.
or..
It was targeted by one of the new space based laser weapons and vaporized as a show of force.
or..
It was taken out by a rogue killer wave and vanished with all hands.
or..
It could be what your theroy was, the beginning of a false flag black op that went wrong.
or..
It was sucked into the burmuda triangle, and is in a different time space now.
or..
Its one of those freaky mysteries will never know about..
Interresting theroy. Heres another one you might not be thinking about. Since the Reptilians now control china, and the vulturites now control the US, iraq, syria, and surrounding countries. Who's to say they were in the process of secretly moving there mobile stargates which used to be located in a ancient temple on the outskirts of bagdad. And it was intercepted by opposing forces.
or..
It was targeted by one of the new space based laser weapons and vaporized as a show of force.
or..
It was taken out by a rogue killer wave and vanished with all hands.
or..
It could be what your theroy was, the beginning of a false flag black op that went wrong.
or..
It was sucked into the burmuda triangle, and is in a different time space now.
or..
Its one of those freaky mysteries will never know about..
reply posted on 13-8-2009 @ 02:47 PM by sanchoearlyjones
reply to post by ElectricUniverse
Okay, I see your point, and it is very clear. The result should this end in a bomb, or false flag would be war!!! It would be WW 3; with all hands on deck ...... The same more, or less countries as we've all been expecting.
Your question of why not the Russian?
I think as in many old keep the cold war going movies; it's the same Private Military Industrial Complex. I do feel these people who are descended followers of Albert Pike(IMO) are *******mainly staged***** in the US/Israel/UK/France......However, I think they have tentacles all over the world.
They aren't patriotic to any country, or any common man. They are Power Elites, who transcend known borders as we perceive them. These are people of great, and deviant intelligence; able to speak multiple multiple languages, and carry multiple nationalities.
They have all the money in the world, their drug is POWER.
Okay, I see your point, and it is very clear. The result should this end in a bomb, or false flag would be war!!! It would be WW 3; with all hands on deck ...... The same more, or less countries as we've all been expecting.
Your question of why not the Russian?
I think as in many old keep the cold war going movies; it's the same Private Military Industrial Complex. I do feel these people who are descended followers of Albert Pike(IMO) are *******mainly staged***** in the US/Israel/UK/France......However, I think they have tentacles all over the world.
They aren't patriotic to any country, or any common man. They are Power Elites, who transcend known borders as we perceive them. These are people of great, and deviant intelligence; able to speak multiple multiple languages, and carry multiple nationalities.
They have all the money in the world, their drug is POWER.
reply posted on 13-8-2009 @ 02:54 PM by LyricusMagna
reply to post by sanchoearlyjones
They were carrying something else. Not drugs or bombs. IMO anyway.
They were carrying something else. Not drugs or bombs. IMO anyway.
reply posted on 13-8-2009 @ 03:08 PM by jammer2012
reply to post by sanchoearlyjones
I can remember when the US Navy,Special Froces and the CIA stole a Russia nuclear sub from right under there noises.I can assure you they have never forgotting about that.Then you have Putin hes a master chess player and one savvy individual.For the past two years he has been moving his peices and who knows what he is up to,But you can be sure hes up to something.This is going to be interesting to follow....nice find sanchoearlyjones SnF for you brother
I can remember when the US Navy,Special Froces and the CIA stole a Russia nuclear sub from right under there noises.I can assure you they have never forgotting about that.Then you have Putin hes a master chess player and one savvy individual.For the past two years he has been moving his peices and who knows what he is up to,But you can be sure hes up to something.This is going to be interesting to follow....nice find sanchoearlyjones SnF for you brother
reply posted on 13-8-2009 @ 03:13 PM by rmiller196
reply to post by sanchoearlyjones
Can you explain your theory in one or two sentences? I'm not sure I understand what you are implying.
It makes no sense for the US to fight Russia. That is just silly. A little bit of stage drama is good for both sides but an actual war would benefit neither.
The US and Iran? Now that makes some sense but you are mistaken if you think it would take some drastic action by someone to provoke the American peopleinto supporting such an action. The psychology of the American public is very simple when it comes to supporting a war. They will suport it as long as we are winning and will not support it once Americans start dying. No act of provocation to justify it matters.
Now, would terrorists or a hostile government try to do such a thing, maybe. But do you honestly think that a ship can get close enough toAmerican ports right now to do serious damage? No ship that has not been documented and tracked from its origin will get past port security.
As for Isreal, well they clearly have reason to want to protect themselves from Iran. (What would you do if the guy down the street told everyone his goal was to kill you and then started arming himself?) But they don't need any excuses so I don't see what any of that has to do with the missing ship.
I'm not saying your ideas are wrong, I would just like to understand them better. I love a good conspiracy theory and this situation clearly seems to have more to it than is apparent right now. But wild speculation without a sensible and connected theory to explain everything that is happeneing is just crazy. Can you explain your theory and connect the dots?
Can you explain your theory in one or two sentences? I'm not sure I understand what you are implying.
It makes no sense for the US to fight Russia. That is just silly. A little bit of stage drama is good for both sides but an actual war would benefit neither.
The US and Iran? Now that makes some sense but you are mistaken if you think it would take some drastic action by someone to provoke the American peopleinto supporting such an action. The psychology of the American public is very simple when it comes to supporting a war. They will suport it as long as we are winning and will not support it once Americans start dying. No act of provocation to justify it matters.
Now, would terrorists or a hostile government try to do such a thing, maybe. But do you honestly think that a ship can get close enough toAmerican ports right now to do serious damage? No ship that has not been documented and tracked from its origin will get past port security.
As for Isreal, well they clearly have reason to want to protect themselves from Iran. (What would you do if the guy down the street told everyone his goal was to kill you and then started arming himself?) But they don't need any excuses so I don't see what any of that has to do with the missing ship.
I'm not saying your ideas are wrong, I would just like to understand them better. I love a good conspiracy theory and this situation clearly seems to have more to it than is apparent right now. But wild speculation without a sensible and connected theory to explain everything that is happeneing is just crazy. Can you explain your theory and connect the dots?
reply posted on 13-8-2009 @ 03:15 PM by sanchoearlyjones
reply to post by jammer2012
I've written on the great game elsewhere, and Slayer69 writes on the topic here in much greater detail.
Your correct, Putin is a great chess player, and we are all privy to watch the game; that is if you know what to look for, and at some point we'll have a decided role in it..... The role may not be by our choosing, but a role none the less....
HATE NO ONE, BUT THE ELITE MINORITY PARASITES.
I've written on the great game elsewhere, and Slayer69 writes on the topic here in much greater detail.
Your correct, Putin is a great chess player, and we are all privy to watch the game; that is if you know what to look for, and at some point we'll have a decided role in it..... The role may not be by our choosing, but a role none the less....
HATE NO ONE, BUT THE ELITE MINORITY PARASITES.
reply posted on 13-8-2009 @ 03:17 PM by rmiller196
reply to post by jammer2012
Stealing a Russian sub is useful. What interest would there be in stealing an old freighter?
Someone might want to steal the secret cargo but not the whole ship.
And why would they call attention to themselves in so many ways?
I certainly think something is going on here but most of the simple conspiracy theories don't fit with the facts.
Stealing a Russian sub is useful. What interest would there be in stealing an old freighter?
Someone might want to steal the secret cargo but not the whole ship.
And why would they call attention to themselves in so many ways?
I certainly think something is going on here but most of the simple conspiracy theories don't fit with the facts.
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