It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

'I wouldn't be here if not for the NHS': Stephen Hawking defends UK's 'Orwellian' healthcare a

page: 5
30
<< 2  3  4    6  7  8 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Aug, 12 2009 @ 04:03 PM
link   

Originally posted by moocowmanThe depths people will stoop to for fear of losing some money, I don't know why the bastards don't try for a policy of euthanasia poor people when they get sick


Be my guest, pay for national healthcare.

I want nothing to do with it though. You and all your like-minded cohorts can get together and pool your resources to get "FREE NATIONAL HEALTHCARE FOR ALL!!!!!!!!!!"

However, I, and my like-minded cohorts, don't want to pay a dime. So, if you can get some kind of plan together where people like you are the only ones paying for it, have at it.

[edit on 12-8-2009 by Double Eights]




posted on Aug, 12 2009 @ 04:06 PM
link   
I'll keep saying it til i'm blue in the face.

The NHS, whilst far from perfect, is Britain's finest achievement. It has been nothing but good to me and my family, along with literally millions of people since its inception in the 30s.

Labour and the Conservatives both know that to publically announce a dismantling of the NHS is political suicide. For all its faults, people generally are very proud, and even more protective of it.



posted on Aug, 12 2009 @ 04:10 PM
link   
Something tells me that when Stephen Hawking goes to a hospital in Britain, he's getting.... slightly... better care than your average NHS patient.



posted on Aug, 12 2009 @ 04:14 PM
link   

Originally posted by Rockpuck
Something tells me that when Stephen Hawking goes to a hospital in Britain, he's getting.... slightly... better care than your average NHS patient.


I imagine he is getting the very best care. the same quality of amazing care I received as an NHS patient.



posted on Aug, 12 2009 @ 04:15 PM
link   
reply to post by System
 


It's Orwellian because Americans are the fellas that believe in the "pull yourself up by your bootstraps" mantra, even if you're poor and sick and a doctor wants you to come up with $5,000 just so you can get the necessary procedure(s) to survive.

I think it is possible for Americans to have public healthcare. Here's an idea: Pull out all the troops we have around the world, slash the defense budget (with improved technology, we can defend ourselves with less manpower) and put that money into education and public healthcare.

But noooooo, that is too logical and all of the gun nuts will go to rallies with their guns to oppose it.



posted on Aug, 12 2009 @ 04:29 PM
link   
reply to post by Janitor From Mars
 


Quite frankly.. the Middle Class doesn't want to pay for all the poor leachers out there, and Mexicans.. God knows the Mexicans will celebrate the creation of a National Health care System in America.. Proportionally, American taxes are not equal at all.. my taxes will go up, while Betty-Sue living in the next town over with 13 kids with 7 different last names gets a check from the Government for all her breeding all the while now not only getting her food, rent and cable TV paid for, but also her health care.

I could imagine an infinite better ways to have Uncle Sam spend my money...

Americans .. most (I hope) are not in the business of taking care of people like they are babies .. I notice the vast majority supporting the new health care plan don't have health insurance.. but they have no problem paying $150 a month for Cable/Internet/Digital Phone and a new car. It's about priorities. They also tend to be poor... the poor in this country EXPECT entitlements.. they expect someone to give them their food stamps, their welfare, their medicare and medicaid and social security and now their health care.

To hell with them.



posted on Aug, 12 2009 @ 05:02 PM
link   
reply to post by muzzleflash
 


Well. thats a way to stroke your own ego and try and sound clever whilst belittling a handicapped man who knows considerably more about his condition, his wellbeing and how he has been treated than you do.

You don't agree with his physics so - in your world - his lifetimes experiences mean nothing.

If thats the state of critical thinking in America at the moment, then god help you all.

[edit on 12/8/09 by neformore]



posted on Aug, 12 2009 @ 05:18 PM
link   
I cannot speak for Dr. Hawkings, but I can speak for the millions receiving VA healthcare; It sucks, it stinks, and you are a piece of meat.
Is it the same for retired generals? I seriously doubt it.
I was diagnosed with a liver tumor in November of last year.
Biopsy date? August 20th.
My brother? Same scenario. My uncles? Same. (although they have private, better care, so...)

Doesn't anyone get that we want better healthcare, just not UNIVERSAL healthcare provided by the same people who write off $200 billion a year on medicare and medicaid waste?

Good for Dr. Hawkings.
Now why does his word trump the thousands of people from Canada and the U.K. who have shared their horror stories about their care?



posted on Aug, 12 2009 @ 05:19 PM
link   
I'll do this one blind without reading all the posts except for your OP.

I think they need to slow down in DC.

I think someone has an agenda they are filling.

I think they are gaining too much power, the Govt and the Fed. that is.

I think there needs to be a simple answer to have a Govt system that we as citizens can understand as it goes along.

I propose something simple and effective, that would alow the Govt to still move at a good pace.

ONE BILL

ONE ITEM

No more, no less.

You want to fix health care? Split it up, make it simple, and go on to the next item.
Now, some items might still take 100 pages to get it worked out in detail.
But what we have been shoving thru the last year or more is insane.
This would also slow down spending because that would get rid of earmarks as well.

For two years - if it's not worth the time and effort to be on a Bill of it's own, it just is not going on one at all.

What is the difference if they pass 10 a week or more. As long as they can read it, understand it, and represent like they should.






[edit on 12-8-2009 by j2000]



posted on Aug, 12 2009 @ 05:30 PM
link   

Originally posted by Rockpuck
reply to post by Janitor From Mars
 

I notice the vast majority supporting the new health care plan don't have health insurance.. but they have no problem paying $150 a month for Cable/Internet/Digital Phone and a new car. It's about priorities. They also tend to be poor... the poor in this country EXPECT entitlements.. they expect someone to give them their food stamps, their welfare, their medicare and medicaid and social security and now their health care.

To hell with them.


Amen to that brother. People need to reap what they sow.

The only entitlements that should be guaranteed by the government is one that entitles an individual to make their own decision, and accept the consequences.



posted on Aug, 12 2009 @ 05:48 PM
link   
I think we take the NHS for granted really. We are lucky in that we get sick, we go to the doctor, If we need further treatment we can get it, operations that would otherwise cost thousands, without paying a penny.
(apart from taxes obv!)

But yeh its not perfect. They are overstretched, the nurse and midwives are overworked and cannot give the care they would like to. There is lots of beuroucrecy (sorry cannot spell it lol) and paperwork involved, they sometimes miss things, and the waiting lists are long.

But saying all that, I cannot imagine having to pay for it when I got sick, even in insurance, surely your rates go through the roof if you get a significant health problem? and I hate the idea of rich people getting richer from other people getting sick and dying, its just so wrong!

I think its good we in the UK get to have a choice. Example- earlier this year my mother-in-law was diagnosed with breast cancer following her free mammagram that the NHS gives to all women over 50 every 5 years. She was told she would have to have the lump removed then 5 weeks of radiotherapy. on the NHS she would have had to wait 4WEEKS to have the op, but luckily her and her husband had a private health care plan from their employment and so she had the lump removed within the week. Obviously the lump wasn't life threatening at that time or they would have had her in sooner but even so, 4 weeks waiting and worrying?

The worrying thing to me is that private healthcare is first and foremost a business, so there will always be the guys at the top looking to make money. This then heightens the risk of cutting corners to save money (as what happens in most private sectors) therefore getting more money in the fat cats pockets. At least with NHS no-ones looking to make money from it (except the drugs companies naturally) but corners will still be cut to save money as theres not enough to go round, but at least the GREED factors taken out of it. So really no systems perfect is it?

I just think well at least we are not in some places in the world where there is 0% healthcare. We are lucky really.



posted on Aug, 12 2009 @ 05:53 PM
link   
Need to edit

[edit on 8/12/2009 by WhatTheory]



posted on Aug, 12 2009 @ 05:53 PM
link   
Personally, doctors here in the US hasn't treated even 1 of my medical problems.

I'm still getting frequent nose bleeds, phlegm in my throat, vertigo,,,,

All they do is suggest me some expensive prescription.

My dad got a surgery on his hand and he can no longer move his index finger, and you know what? the hospital didn't care, they wanted to offer for surgeries.

Our family insurance is around $4k per year.



As much as I admire Hawkings, I don't think his life can justify the suffering of others.

[edit on 8/12/2009 by die_another_day]



posted on Aug, 12 2009 @ 05:53 PM
link   
The NHS was once Britain’s finest achievement, which doesn’t mean it still is. It really cannot be denied that wards were and in some cases still are totally unfit for anyone to be in let alone a sick person. MRSA and C Difficile were and are rampant and people die purely from that. There are many cases of people who go into hospital with minor ailments and die. There is no excuse for that, except that the service is governed by money, above any concern for the humanity of a patient.

Treatment is allotted according to age and the finances of that particular hospital in that particular trust whilst also attempting to reach stupid government targets. It is a complete lottery as to whether anyone gets decent care. Many patients die or suffer terribly through incompetence, indifference, and even lazy nursing staff not feeding patients who cannot feed themselves. For many years it was a great health service but it is no more. It has got worse as a reflection of the entire world being driven by greed, self obsession, inhumanity and selfishness.

It also cannot be denied that depending what postcode you are in will decide whether you will get the life saving drugs that you need. Hardly a great service when you will die because a trust or NICE decide it is not financially viable and your life is worthless, while in the next county the patient is prescribed it and lives. And the drug companies are just beyond disgusting. NICE is every bit into the heartless judging of the worth and viability of a person in monetary terms just as the American bill is, it is just that people don’t see this.

People react in defence of the NHS because they themselves had decent treatment or Auntie did, and they really do not want to see the world as bad. But many people are denied treatment and drugs based on the idea that if the patient may only get 6 months to a years life from it then it is not worth giving it to them. Or if it is a slow degenerative illness then they will have to rely on a painkiller rather than a drug that might increase drastically the quality of life. There is a set price put upon every patient’s life and if the drug treatment costs more than that in a year it is refused. Wow, how civilised is that?

Billions are wasted on war and killing people. How about using that money to save people and have some damn respect for life. The only way it would ever work well is if all politicians were forced to use ONLY the services they prescribe for others, along with all the rich, the corporate rats , the bankers. Then and only then would the service suddenly improve. Bunch of smug, criminal, hypocritical, barbaric morons running the world.



posted on Aug, 12 2009 @ 05:56 PM
link   
reply to post by getreadyalready
 


Don't forget Chuck Norris and his expert views on parent education and child deveopment...



posted on Aug, 12 2009 @ 06:00 PM
link   

Originally posted by TheTruthShallFreeYou
Good for Dr. Hawkings.
Now why does his word trump the thousands of people from Canada and the U.K. who have shared their horror stories about their care?


He's just responding to this:


In an editorial commenting on the healthcare debate that has gripped America this summer, the newspaper claimed: ' People such as scientist Stephen Hawking wouldn't have a chance in the UK, where the National Health Service would say the life of this brilliant man, because of his physical handicaps, is essentially worthless.'


You can find anecdotal evidence to support either side of the debate, it's essentially worthless. Based on actual data and surveys the health services in the UK and Canada don't come out too badly.

Link 1

Link 2



posted on Aug, 12 2009 @ 06:06 PM
link   
reply to post by Chris McGee
 


Lol, Context....

I found it funny that my quote, taken as is, seems like I am anti-Hawking...

VERY relevent on this website...



posted on Aug, 12 2009 @ 06:06 PM
link   
Stephen Hawking is living proof that Socialism saves lives, not destroys them!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

No so called, "Death Camps" in the UK, unlike the Private Healthcare "Death Camps" we DO have in the USA that lets you die by cutting off your coverage!!!!

WAKE UP CONS.



posted on Aug, 12 2009 @ 06:14 PM
link   
IF it wernt for the NHS i wouldnt be here nor would my sister

or let me rephase that .. we would be here but paying the Medical bills off for the rest of our lives

We pay our National Insurance Tax to pay for the NHS ..its Extremley Over Streached Under funded and Over worked... the Nurse's and Doctors Ever one in the NHS are heros in My eyes! cause they dont get Paid # loads either!



posted on Aug, 12 2009 @ 06:21 PM
link   

Originally posted by Janitor From Mars
....
...Here's an idea: Pull out all the troops we have around the world, slash the defense budget (with improved technology, we can defend ourselves with less manpower) and put that money into education and public healthcare.

But noooooo, that is too logical and all of the gun nuts will go to rallies with their guns to oppose it.


First of all cutting the military budget would put a strain on a gigantic don´t-ask-don´t-tell government-run subsidy and job system that is in place so´s the common man on the street can still claim to live in the only free makret economy.



new topics

top topics



 
30
<< 2  3  4    6  7  8 >>

log in

join