200 mpg carburator waiting to be rediscovered, page 1

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Topic started on 11-8-2009 @ 06:03 PM by Studenofhistory

Charles N. Progue apparently invented a carburator that got over 200 miles to the gallon in the 1930's. His patent has expired long ago. See below for patent number.

Charles N. Pogue: High Mileage Carburetor In Jan. 3, 1935 Charles N. Pogue was issued a Canadian patent – 353538 – for a High Mileage Carburetor. In Apr. 9, 1935 Charles N. Pogue was issued a US patent – 1997497 – for a High Mileage Carburetor. In Jan. 7, 1936 Charles N. Pogue was issued a US Patent – 2026798 – for his newer High Mileage Carburetor.

Pogue used the carburetor for about ten years on his car and produced about 200 carburetors thru the Economy Carburetor Co. In early 1936 Breen Motor Company, Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada tested the Pogue carburetor on a Ford V-8 Coupe and got 26.2 miles on one pint of gasoline. The performance of the car was 100% in every way. Under 10 mph the operation was much smoother than a standard carburetor. T.G. Green, President of the Breen Motor Company did the tests. In April 30,1936 Ford Motor Company, Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada tested the Pogue carburetor and is at "a loss to understand" how the carburetor got "25.7 miles on one pint of gasoline"! (That's approximately 205 mpg). Mr. W.J. Holmes and Mr. Purdy conducted the test for Ford Motor Company. In Aug. 10,1936 S. Stockhammer tested the Pogue carburetor on a 1934 Ford V-8 Coupe and got 28 miles per pint of gas. "I can say the performance was all anyone could desire in every shape of form." In Dec. 12, 1936 Canadian Automotive Magazine states that the standard carburetor gets about 25 mpg at only 9% efficiency. Therefore the Pogue carburetor is 72% efficient overall at 200 mpg. In 1953 CARS magazine stated that in the opening months of 1936, Pogue panicked the Toronto stock exchange and threw fright into the major oil companies. Stock exchange offices and brokers were swamped with orders to dump all oil stock immediately. This same article states that Winnipeg's largest automobile dealers tested the Pogue carburetor and got results of up to 216.8 mpg! In 1945, according to an unnamed source, carburetors marked "POGUE CARBURETOR, DO NOT OPEN" were used on American Army tanks throughout WWII but were removed from circulation after the war ended. In 1980 Arthur C. Sgrignoli, after 45 years, has built a legendary Pogue carburetor by hand and is said to have achieved an efficiency of 86%. Contact was made through his brother, William J. Sgrignoli. In 1981 Ultra-Lean Carburetors of Northridge, CA, was selling a set of plans for the Pogue carburetor for $50. (This price is too high). (I remember gasoline was a little cheaper then. Gary Vesperman) As of January 1981, Charles N. Pogue was still alive at age 81 and was living in a rest home in Winnipeg, Canada. He refuses to talk to anyone or to receive visitors from outside his own family.

The US patents can be viewed at:
www.pat2pdf.org...

A quick glance at his patent shows that his carburator pumps air up thru the gasoline in order to generate fuel vapor that is then burned in the engine. It seems reasonable to me. I propose that ATS members should email a copy of the patents to ALL of the world's car companies and to members of Congress (ESPECIALLY RON PAUL). If even one car company tests and incorporates this technology in their cars, the others will be forced to follow.

reply posted on 11-8-2009 @ 06:20 PM by Ex_MislTech

reply to post by Studenofhistory

It would be nice, but there is literally only so much energy
in a gallon of gas.

The best and easiest way to get better gas mileage is to
have a lower aerodynamic profile, and less weight.

So Volkswagen went that route.

Regenerative braking helps a bit as well.

The only car built by a major automotive group to break 200 mpg
was the 1 litre proto type made by VW as a inline 2 seater.

VW 1 litre concept car gets 282 mpg

The fuel systems already are near there maximums.

Our best bet is to make a car powered off heavy water if they can get
the kinks worked out.

Cold Fusion experimentally confirmed

The US navy SPAWAR facility has duplicated it as well with a liquid
vs. solid active element.

reply posted on 11-8-2009 @ 06:35 PM by son of total newbie

reply to post by Studenofhistory

The boys at GM announced today that the new Volt could get upwards of 230 MPG in the city. Due in late 2010. The story was in Yahoo news.

Hold two fingers closely together. They're that close to getting or "digging"
Magnetic Zero Point Energy. I thought that Toyota would would get there first..........

reply posted on 11-8-2009 @ 06:56 PM by Ex_MislTech

Originally posted by son of total newbie
reply to post by Studenofhistory

The boys at GM announced today that the new Volt could get upwards of 230 MPG in the city. Due in late 2010. The story was in Yahoo news.

Hold two fingers closely together. They're that close to getting or "digging"
Magnetic Zero Point Energy. I thought that Toyota would would get there first..........

It is a manipulation, it only gets 230 mpg if you drive under 40 mph, and
drive in the battery range which is not real far, much less than 100 miles even.

reply posted on 11-8-2009 @ 07:30 PM by Gregarious

Originally posted by Ex_MislTech

Originally posted by son of total newbie
reply to post by Studenofhistory

The boys at GM announced today that the new Volt could get upwards of 230 MPG in the city. Due in late 2010. The story was in Yahoo news.

Hold two fingers closely together. They're that close to getting or "digging"
Magnetic Zero Point Energy. I thought that Toyota would would get there first..........

It is a manipulation, it only gets 230 mpg if you drive under 40 mph, and
drive in the battery range which is not real far, much less than 100 miles even.

If I can get over 200 mpg, I can drive at 30 mph! Time is money, sure, but at gas over $40 a tank, I can afford a little more time.

reply posted on 11-8-2009 @ 07:39 PM by son of total newbie

Originally posted by Ex_MislTech

Originally posted by son of total newbie
reply to post by Studenofhistory

The boys at GM announced today that the new Volt could get upwards of 230 MPG in the city. Due in late 2010. The story was in Yahoo news.

Hold two fingers closely together. They're that close to getting or "digging"
Magnetic Zero Point Energy. I thought that Toyota would would get there first..........

It is a manipulation, it only gets 230 mpg if you drive under 40 mph, and
drive in the battery range which is not real far, much less than 100 miles even.

I'm disappointed. Oh, well I guess they're heading in the right direction anyway. Maybe we'll have to get the Magnetic Zero Point Energy from ET after all.

After the ET characters finish up in GB they may be coming back to the states. I'd like to see another big showing like in 2007. Maybe the rise of the "stick figure" ETs. The US, however seems to be going through some very disturbing times.

The reactor at Bushehr is tentatively scheduled for an initial start by the end of September. Putin has stationed two Akula class subs off the eastern seaboard. Hmmm.............

[edit on 11-8-2009 by son of total newbie]

reply posted on 11-8-2009 @ 07:42 PM by HaTaX

Before too many people start getting on the bandwagon of there only being so much we can do with fuel in an engine consider this:

www.fueleconomy.gov...

Engines are not NEARLY as efficient as they should be, why do you think they still have coolant systems to keep them from overheating? All that extra energy that is not being converted into kinetic energy is lost as thermal energy. And there's enough heat in there to kill a motor quickly without a way to remove it quickly enough.

Check your laptop power brick, if it was 100% efficient at converting power it wouldn't even be warm.

reply posted on 11-8-2009 @ 08:03 PM by rebel9

The Volt will go approx. 50 miles on 1 charge (?). Half of all cars on the road travel 40 miles per day, so this means that half of all trips wouldn't use any gas. Once you get on the highway, you get 50 miles per gallon, which is still better than the Prius. Unfortunately, it doesn't look any better than the Prius.

This is according to someone that was on Fox News this morning.

reply posted on 11-8-2009 @ 08:12 PM by j2000

I had an uncle try this in the 70's with a truck.
It works, but his truck burned to the ground.
On the smaller older engines that did not have the same valve train and low compression, it would be safe. But if you want to do it on todays car, you would have to go back to the drawing board with a containment system for the vapors and direct cylinder injection of it.
The problem with that, is that in order to force it into the cylinder, it take pressure. Which in turn make it back into a solid fuel again and no different than fuel injection.

If someone figures out how to enter it on the low pressure side of the intake valve with out the danger, you would have a winner.

Yes, I am an engineer............

reply posted on 11-8-2009 @ 10:54 PM by TeslaandLyne

That name sounds familiar.
Was that put in the Sherman tank during WWII.
And classified a national defense restricted item.

One way the government takes away technology from us.
It might not work now with the watered down gas of today.

reply posted on 11-8-2009 @ 11:54 PM by MBF

I came up with an idea like this 20+ years ago, but never built anything. The biggest problem with this system is that a backfire or a spark will ignite the mixture prematurely. There are a couple of ways to prevent the problem though. It's sad that the car companies are not doing more to increase fuel mileage in automobiles. There is so much waste of energy in the cooling system and exhaust.

reply posted on 12-8-2009 @ 05:49 PM by Studenofhistory

reply to post by j2000

Interesting post. Thanks for the info. I'm NOT an engineer but I know a little bit about a lot of things. If I remember correctly, a liquid, which is heated past the boiling point, will still remain a liquid if under enough pressure. If that's correct, then how about this. Gasoline is heated past it's boiling point using the engine's waste heat, but is not allowed to become a gas until it's injected in the cylinder where the drop in pressure will allow the gasoline to turn into a vapour. So if tiny amount of liquid gasoline expands into a larger volume of vapour, that might get the same result as Progue's carburator. Can someone who knows about the properties of matter tell me if I'm way off base or if my idea is possible?

reply posted on 12-8-2009 @ 11:34 PM by Maj35t1cI2

Well I thought this was interesting but I think it was all just wishful thinking. I don't really care about fuel economy I got money and I love my blazer Zr2 so I think I'll be sticking with my average 15mpg truck. lol I'd rather have a vehicle I can be proud of and go offroading in then some gay hybrid. No offense to gay hybrid owners lol.

reply posted on 13-8-2009 @ 12:43 PM by DaMod

I've heard of this, except I heard when he finally went to GM to sell them his design they bought it and then ripped it in half. Might take a while but I'll find a source for this.

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