Letter from the Whitehouse (so it begins), page 2
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ATS Members have flagged this thread 70 times


reply posted on 10-8-2009 @ 01:51 PM by Cito
hehe gmail is on the ball it dropped into my spam filter


reply posted on 10-8-2009 @ 01:59 PM by ProfEmeritus
reply to post by burntheships




When Arlen Spector urged the "fast" passage of legislation you know something terrible is being put on the American people!

True. I seem to remember another "bill" that had to be rushed through, or else -the Bailout bill! We all know how successful(not) that was.

On a practical note, the real reason they want it rushed through is that they know that in 2010, many Democratic representatives will be voted out of office, and they may lose their majority.

The really sick thing about all this, is that the healthcare bill, IF passed, doesn't take effect until 2013, AFTER the next presidential election.
All of those people who somehow think that if it passes, they will have healthcare right away, probably aren't even aware that it doesn't kick in for 4 years.


reply posted on 10-8-2009 @ 02:02 PM by gimme_some_truth
Originally posted by ManBehindTheMask
NEVER in recent history has an administration actively sent out emails to try and dissuade people from listening to an opposing side of an issue, this is unprecedented!



Hmm... trying to disuade people from listening to an opposing side of an issue.... Why does that sound so familiar....?

Oh yes....





This is just 1 of the multiple videos with similar content.

Now I ask, is what is happening in these videos OK with you? I ask because this is why politicians who actually want to get info out there with out being shouted down by people unwilling to listen, has to resort to. I actually think it would be smart for local politicians around the country, to get on TV and discuss the health care issue WITHOUT an audience so we can actually discuss it!

Now do not get me wrong. I am not pointing fingers at anybody here. I think a democrat who behaves this way is just as bad as a republican who acts this way. ANYONE who is unable to discuss/debate a topic with out intelligence or civility resorts to shouting, name calling and even in one case sending death threats.

I think it is a shame that both sides seem to be incapable of sitting down and discussing the issue like adults. Instead we get into arguments, resort to violence and threats there of, we shout and scream and wave our arms, and behave like a bunch of animals.

Nothing will ever be accomplished like this... but the way we all behave, sometimes I wonder if that is what we actually want as a species...

I can understand being upset, and disagreeing, but I cannot understand being so unwilling to even listen to the opposing side, that you will do anything to silence them... that is frightening to me. Now we have the white house resorting to mass emails, just to be heard...

I guess the days of civility and decorum ( in real life anyway) are over... That makes me sad. That makes me sad because when civility and decorum are taken out of the picture, anything goes. And if anything goes.... well ANYTHING goes... Now that is the real shame here.



[edit on 10-8-2009 by gimme_some_truth]


reply posted on 10-8-2009 @ 02:04 PM by burntheships
reply to post by ProfEmeritus


Yes, great illumination there. In addition...there is way more to this whole issue that meets the eye.

22 Jul 2009 // Washington, D.C. – While Citizens for Responsibility and Ethics in Washington (CREW) is pleased the White House has taken a step towards delivering the transparency promised in the first days of the administration, the letter sent by White House Counsel Greg Craig in no way satisfies CREW’s June 22nd Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) request for the Secret Service visitor records of 18 health care executives. First, the FOIA requires the administration to release the records themselves, not merely a summary of some information included in the records. The actual visitor records likely would indicate with whom each official met, the administration official who requested clearance for the visitor, the time of the meeting, the duration of the meeting and, in some cases, the purpose of the meeting. In addition, no information was provided regarding any visits to the vice president’s residence. Mr. Craig’s summary is not an adequate substitution for the records themselves.
citizensforethics.org...

What is the White house hiding?


reply posted on 10-8-2009 @ 02:04 PM by Wyn Hawks
Originally posted by ManBehindTheMask
reply to post by Wyn Hawks

You have to see the broader scope of things rather then just look at it as "just an email with links"


...this "oh so skeery" email was not mass mailed to every citizen (as you have alleged)... you subscribed to the newsletter and you can unsubscribe via the link at the bottom of the second page... shocking, huh?...




reply posted on 10-8-2009 @ 02:04 PM by TheTruthShallFreeYou
reply to post by ManBehindTheMask


I find that the rather interesting part of this entire "debate", has been the lack of "debating" that actually exists therein.

For example, the liberal wing of our government has proposed rather sweeping changes to our healthcare system. They have altered the name of this campaign multiple times, from "healthcare reform", to the darker and more recent, "health insurance reform".

The main thing to note, I believe, is not the lack of desire to see said reform, but the desire to see a certain type of healthcare reform.

However, as there is no "debate" actually occuring, all you are seeing is a push/counter-push by the parties involved.

Many Americans, (by far the majority) enjoy their healthcare, their doctors, their respective coverage and so on. They cannot see what this healthcare reform does for them, other than add another layer of faceless beurocracy, and give more monetary control to our government.
Remember, our "government" does not refer just to our elected officials, as much as it does to those who are hired to fill the many positions that are required to further government mandates and departments.
Although our "elected" government, the one that cares about votes and Polls, would never make a decision to limit coverage for the infirmed. But a faceless, unelected beurocrat? How do those people differ from the "faceless" people who deny private insurance claims?

Answer; They don't

The truth is, the only real difference is that you won't be able to hold the government beurocrats accontable, seeing as you can't sue the U.S. Government.

Fannie May, Freddie Mac, the VA healthcare system; All precedents that prove the inevitable collapse and failure of any government healthcare system.

I mean, why can't we just cut the $200 BILLION dollar a year waste and fraud from medicare and medicaid? Wouldn't that pay for this new program twice over?

All of this is mere proof that a true, lengthy debate over reform is needed, with all interested parties equally represented.

The American people are not "against" healthcare reform.

They are against the government making decisions on bills they didn't read, impacting people who have no problem with their current coverage.


reply posted on 10-8-2009 @ 02:07 PM by ManBehindTheMask
reply to post by Wyn Hawks


once again NO i did NOT subscribe to this, and have never subscribed to ANYTHING coming out of the whitehouse, so why would i need to unsubscribe on the link provided?

Another person on this board got one too, might ask him if he subscribed to this as well


reply posted on 10-8-2009 @ 02:08 PM by SpartanKingLeonidas
reply to post by ManBehindTheMask


I have to say, either you're trying to just bash Obama, or you're obfuscating the issues at hand.

I receive the same exact e-mail letters as you, and I had to sign up to receive it.

If you want the White House to tell the truth, try running for office yourself.

It has a certain way of stating things, just like George W Bush's former Presidency, to make itself and the President to appear benevolent, not malevolent.

Oh, before you state I support Obama, I do not, and I did not support the last idiot to stand behind the same podium either.

I just hate paid liars and lawyers, because they are of the same ilk to me.

Vote Garfield for President 2012

To me, there is no "lesser of two evils" when it comes to politics, it's who's closest to actually telling the truth.

Can you guess who I voted for this last election?
I will give you a few clues.

He's orange, cartoon, feline, loves lasagna, kicks Odie, tortures Nermal, irritates Jon Arbuckle just because it's fun, and rarely gets out of the recliner.



You see, to me, if a politician is not going to do anything for anyone else, is going to abuse and torture the people watching him, as well as the people he or she is responsible for, and does it all for cheap laughs, well, I want that to be someone who at least is more real than 99% of the politicians on Capitol Hill.

Read about my fight against stalkers here, since I was six years old.

Left-Wing, Right-Wing, This Turkey, Knows How To Soar Like An Eagle

Become a member of the Bully Pulpit, so you can debate me politically, if you do not choose membership in the Bully Pulpit, you can only read, and not post replies.



reply posted on 10-8-2009 @ 02:09 PM by ManBehindTheMask
reply to post by TheTruthShallFreeYou


I absolutely agree with you on your post. A lot of people dont understand this concept, and the government doesnt want to hear it.

They just want to push their crud through as fast as they can in hopes people just swallow the pill


reply posted on 10-8-2009 @ 02:11 PM by ManBehindTheMask
reply to post by SpartanKingLeonidas


Im not bashing anyone, im pointing out the obvious. Im also bringing to light the fact that they are being very public about how they are going to go about trying to push propaganda about this bill and either try to silence, or discredit anyone who opposes it!


once again, i didnt sign up for this email, and i never use that email to sign up on websites, I use a different one, that one is a personal email address I use for business only

Edit to add, I think Garfield is a wayyyyyy safer bet!

[edit on 10-8-2009 by ManBehindTheMask]


reply posted on 10-8-2009 @ 02:15 PM by ManBehindTheMask
reply to post by gimme_some_truth


No dont mistake me, I agree with you that lashing out is no way to discuss the issues..


However, what do you think starts to happen when the government wont listen to the people? They dont read these bills, they try to shove em through, and then private citizens decide to make it their mission to look through this stuff and see what its all about?

So what happens? They go through the bills, they find stuff in them that their representatives either dont or WONT address, but still try to press their agenda..

You start getting the average american out there paying attention and noticing whats going on , and the elected officials wont listen to them, or dismiss them outright, and keep spewing their rhetoric and people are going to start getting pissed........

If these elected representatives would have been listening in the first place and addressing the issues, instead of trying to dismiss them , then the people wouldnt be getting as angry as they are now



reply posted on 10-8-2009 @ 02:31 PM by SpartanKingLeonidas
reply to post by ManBehindTheMask


Sounds like someone signed you up for it then.

It's the same exact one I get, and I signed up for it of my own volition.

You should ask your friends and family if they signed you up.

And, yes, the irony of a 'Open Government' never escaped me.

Careful not to have to open a government, just like having too open a mind...

Yes, Garfield, at least is a safer bet, I know he will only steal my lasagna, recliner, and T.V. remote.

Transparency and "Open Government" indeed.

Ever since learning about J.F.K.'s assassination, I have never trusted the Government less.

[edit on 10-8-2009 by SpartanKingLeonidas]


reply posted on 10-8-2009 @ 02:39 PM by TheOneElectric
Someone confirm this for me. The argument goes a little something like this:

This morning I was awoken by my alarm clock powered by electricity generated by the public power monopoly regulated by the US department of energy.
I then took a shower in the clean water provided by the municipal water utility.

After that, I turned on the TV to one of the FCC regulated channels to see what the national weather service of the national oceanographic and atmospheric administration determined the weather was going to be like using satellites designed, built, and launched by the national aeronautics and space administration. I watched this while eating my breakfast of US department of agriculture inspected food and taking the drugs which have been determined as safe by the food and drug administration.

At the appropriate time as regulated by the US congress and kept accurate by the national institute of standards and technology and the US naval observatory, I get into my national highway traffic safety administration approved automobile and set out to work on the roads built by the local, state, and federal departments of transportation, possibly stopping to purchase additional fuel of a quality level determined by the environmental protection agency, using legal tender issued by the federal reserve bank. On the way out the door I deposit any mail I have to be sent out via the US postal service and drop the kids off at the public school.

Then, after spending another day not being maimed or killed at work thanks to the workplace regulations imposed by the department of labor and the occupational safety and health administration, enjoying another two meals which again do not kill me because of the USDA, I drive my NHTSA car back home on the DOT roads, to my house which has not burned down in my absence because of the state and local building codes and the fire marchal's inspection, and which has not been plundered of all its valuables thanks to the local police department.

I then log onto the internet which was developed by the defense advanced research projects administration and post on freerepublic and fox news forums about how SOCIALISM in medicine is BAD because the government can't do anything right.


reply posted on 10-8-2009 @ 02:47 PM by Hazelnut
reply to post by gimme_some_truth


Is it so hard to believe that agent provocateurs are at work? That infiltrators are infiltrating, causing uproar and irreparable splits from both ends of the cloth? I see it. Real people who are paying attention are marginalized by these clandestine efforts from the shadows. The results we are witnessing were carefully crafted well in advance. Predictive behavior and all of that. Connect the dots.
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