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Ask an Atheist.

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posted on Aug, 10 2009 @ 05:09 AM
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Originally posted by Voiceoftreason
reply to post by badmedia
 


Of course people at the four corners will view the statue differently.
Of course you postulate a real statue.
The "statue" we are debating here is a bit of an imaginary one. (With due respect to the theists, I'm only presenting my view).
I have not been shown the actual statue, therefore I will not believe in its' existence, until I see it. When we all see it, then we can have debates about what it looks like.



So we deny the perspective of the ones who never saw the statue as being possible, and thus label the statue not seen as imaginary?

I see no difference in theists and atheists. Both are based only on belief and not knowledge. They are like democrats and republicans to me.

Agnostics and gnostic. Well I find either of those to be honest and that I think is respectable. Nothing wrong with saying I don't know when it comes to god. Perfectly honest and reasonable. Just wish atheists would realize this, and go from atheist to agnostic. Many agnostics call themselves atheist and such already, but there is a big difference IMO between the 2, and it causes a bit of confusion.




posted on Aug, 10 2009 @ 05:13 AM
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Do you have any beliefs in things beyond this world, souls? afterlife in any sense or are you of the full belief that this physical world is the only form of existance?

or are you an agnostic?



posted on Aug, 10 2009 @ 05:31 AM
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reply to post by Agree2Disagree
 





Why do atheists and theists not get along so well together when in all actuality, we're all searching for the same thing - the truth?

I think you may be mistaken and generalizing, something that xtians accuse atheists of being experts at.

Some of my closest friends are xtians and we all get along fine, I just happen to be the one that's not deluded.

Of course, they make the same claim lol.



posted on Aug, 10 2009 @ 05:36 AM
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Originally posted by Irishwolf
Do you have any beliefs in things beyond this world, souls? afterlife in any sense or are you of the full belief that this physical world is the only form of existance?

or are you an agnostic?


Not agnostic, what's here is here and what we speculate, is purely speculation and shouldn't be regarded as truth nor something we should give our whole lives over entirely to this speculation.

Physical is here, non physical isn't.

Souls aren't real, just a want from the mind to comfort itself. No afterlife is included in that.

This is the only form of existance, unless of course multiple dimensions, but nonetheless you and I will never see that, so this is it. IMO

[edit on 10-8-2009 by Republican08]



posted on Aug, 10 2009 @ 05:38 AM
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reply to post by badmedia
 


Sorry, in my opinion the statue is not there just because you say it is. Prove it. I'm not taking away peoples' right to believe it's there based on hearsay. I'm just saying hearsay isn't enough for me personally.



posted on Aug, 10 2009 @ 05:46 AM
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reply to post by Republican08
 


Glad you are definite in your beliefs, at the moment I haven't got a clue what I believe in, the science part of my brain tells me this is it, nothing more, nothing less, yet the spiritual side of me still tugs at my brain saying there is something more, not heaven or hell, or "God", but something.

I was raised catholic but quickly realised that it was all a load of #. When people ask me what religion I am or what are my beliefs I answer "I dont know", because its the truth and the only day I will know for myself what is the answer will be the day I die, and then it wont matter, unless it will.



posted on Aug, 10 2009 @ 06:01 AM
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Originally posted by Irishwolf
reply to post by Republican08
 


Glad you are definite in your beliefs, at the moment I haven't got a clue what I believe in, the science part of my brain tells me this is it, nothing more, nothing less, yet the spiritual side of me still tugs at my brain saying there is something more, not heaven or hell, or "God", but something.

I was raised catholic but quickly realised that it was all a load of #. When people ask me what religion I am or what are my beliefs I answer "I dont know", because its the truth and the only day I will know for myself what is the answer will be the day I die, and then it wont matter, unless it will.


Words of a wise man for sure. Sagacious.

The spiritual side may be no more then the side that Indoctrinated you, the side that hijacked your childhood, stole you from your first love, molested you, the side that got you into the football team so you'd be accepted, the side that offered oppurtunity and no answers. That's what it did to me, all the oppurtunities and no answers.

As you must know, I'm sht out of luck, and full of the answers and questions yet, my new signature explains it quite well. Or i'd be dead.

When you die, if religion is right, you will know, whether muhammed allah, yahweh, shiva, krishna, zeus, or whomever is right, your chances of burning in hell is very great


I'd rather live my whole life helping those around me, then living my whole life helping those because a deity told me to, it is my choice not its to do what I want, it is my free will.

And if by the hole in one on the first swing, Yahweh is right, then screw him, he was a lousy god, who did nothing, disregard this post as it's late and intoxicated, but he didn't help me or my brothers or sisters, and the rapists and tortures that ruined our lives, and only the pride which made the few who lived come out on the other side to have wisdom. We've overcome the need, and adapted the need to save ourselves.

If your family is dying you do not pray for their help when you yourself can help, you jump into action, you do what is right, you don't call on imaginary friends to help.

Bit of a rant here, back on topic.

Think of this, have you buried your father like I have, did you sign the papers to damn him to death, or your mother brother sister daughter son.

Did you damn them to death to help them knowing they'd be a vegetable of pain forever.

If you have you understand how easy it would be to say they are in Gods hands, and how hard it'd be to accept they are dead.

They are no longer, and I accept that with my heart, I pulled that plug knowing they'd be no more, their life is over and short lived, gone forever, no afterlife, they are gone.

And I don't regret it, but cry for it every night, and obviously from the time I post, don't sleep ever. lol, haven't slept in weeks. months, not a sleep but night terrors when I do.

November 6th 2008. A day i'll never forget or let down.

I'm glad there's no pain nor suffering, and I won't let theist win, by saying he's in eternal happiness, he was atheist for reasoning, so he'd be in hell.

Nor the islamist say They prayed for him, because Allah wouldn't let him in either, by any texts, I knew him best. He was the best man on earth I ever met.

Jesus christ, krishna, i'm rambling like a fool, i'm so sorry.




posted on Aug, 10 2009 @ 06:04 AM
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reply to post by phi1618
 





What do atheists believe lies beyond the grave ( nothing?) and as an atheist how do you account for near death experiences?


How to put this into words ?

If we die and rot there you go, if my view or personality is not of this body and is separate from it then coll exiting times a. perhaps.

I can't see any reason why my mind should not be existing here and elsewhere/when.

Near death experiences sound pretty cool, on the whole they tend to be shaped by the deep rooted beliefs of the individual.

So,if there is more, brilliant and if there is, then there is still no good reason that one should make some imaginary being accountable for it.





Why do most atheist look to science for answers when most scientists are religious?



Of all the Nobel prizes that have been awarded in in the last 30 years only a very small insignificant minority of recipients actually claim to believing in a god let alone being religious.


Interestingly enough the same question can be more or less asked a believer (mainly xtian) why is it when claims of prayer are made to xtians choose go to an atheist or muslim/pagan doctor ?






and do you personally believe in evolution (even with all the evidence for it being fabricated, such as mismatched bones)


This is prompting for a long debate on the validity of the "theory" of evolution which I don't have time for.

When I learned to drive it was by necessity , I needed to get to work to earn the coin to survive. My need to survive prompted me to increase my knowledge, no different to a chimp learning to use a stick to get at some ants.

Surely this is evolution in action, small changes over long periods, trial and error, if I did not get my driving license then I may well have not passed on my genes survived.



posted on Aug, 10 2009 @ 06:05 AM
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*May I also add ON Topic*

This thread is to halt many threads, as Will be looked after accordingly.

This thread hopefully will harbor a Mirror Thread

Ask A Theist.

Hopefully.

Mods, please be kind this one time for me



posted on Aug, 10 2009 @ 06:06 AM
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Originally posted by Voiceoftreason
reply to post by badmedia
 


Sorry, in my opinion the statue is not there just because you say it is. Prove it. I'm not taking away peoples' right to believe it's there based on hearsay. I'm just saying hearsay isn't enough for me personally.


You simply believe reality is objective, and I see it as being subjective. My reality allows for your reality and think is valid, but for some reason you reality is not allowed to see anything beyond the objective.

I understand why you believe what you do, and when it comes to life on a daily basis I basically live by the rules of the objective reality. But I realize in the end, it is completely subjective in itself and but 1 reality among many.

Subjective Reality Simplified



posted on Aug, 10 2009 @ 06:14 AM
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reply to post by Republican08
 


I'd take it down, but that's showing that i'm shameful, and I'd pose the same answers to theists, so if you feel an attack pose worthy on it so be it.

I will not take offense, don't worry, unless you mean just to be offensive, as long as it's OT.



posted on Aug, 10 2009 @ 06:15 AM
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reply to post by Irishwolf
 





Do you have any beliefs in things beyond this world, souls? afterlife in any sense or are you of the full belief that this physical world is the only form of existance? or are you an agnostic?

I ask why should there not be? if there is then the evidence will present itself, it would appear that particle physics is moving in this direction and some results of experiments may well have been considered supernatural not long back.


When and if evidence presents itself, then the atheist can evolve by incorporation this new evidence into his paradigm. This can't happen with a religion the belief is set there cannot be anything new or added to the belief. Many religious people don't just refuse to believe that evolution is happening but are actually not evolving themselves.



posted on Aug, 10 2009 @ 06:22 AM
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reply to post by badmedia
 





On the other hand though, one might say - if we are all god, isn't it about time we started acting like it? That kind of stuff isn't really divine is it? In fact, I think it's a pretty strong argument it's rather ignorant of us.

If we are all expressions of god. then are we not god experiencing what god is not, in order to know what it is ?

How can god know what it is without experiencing what it is not ? But it cannot experience what it is not, so perhaps we are an illusion it created for itself in order to experience what it is not ?



posted on Aug, 10 2009 @ 06:23 AM
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reply to post by badmedia
 


I really have no problem with subjective realities. In fact I think that most of our interpersonal relationships, for example, dwell in a sort of subjective reality. Subjective reality is very close to the concept of "circles of perception" which is applied in many different flavors of magical practice. I have had experiences which would not fit into "objective reality" by any stretch and I do not deny them. They are part of my subjective reality, God with a capital G isn't. If I saw a God in my subjective reality, say in a state of trance, The first thing I would do, is question whether this entity is really who they say/appear to be.
I guess what I'm trying to say is I will allow things that exist in my personal reality, but that doesn't mean I will believe in them unconditionally. For the very reason that, for example, the other people that were in the same room at the same time didn't see them.

And I most certainly won't try to persuade other people of their existence. That's the sort of stuff that gets you committed.
Unless, of course you happen to be peddling a "recognised" major religion.

[edit on 10/8/2009 by Voiceoftreason]

[edit on 10/8/2009 by Voiceoftreason]



posted on Aug, 10 2009 @ 06:40 AM
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Now I have a question for the theists among us:

How do you know that "your" religion is the correct one? Out of all the religions in the world, how do you know? Or is believing enough. If so, how so?



posted on Aug, 10 2009 @ 06:44 AM
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reply to post by Voiceoftreason
 


I once asked a fundamentalist Christian a similar question, I asked

"Why do you only follow the bible, Mohammed in the cave had a vision of god's angel in similar ways to those in the bible, and then what of Joseph Smith also received messages in similar ways, why do you not follow their word? Maybe God has been sending updates to his divine law as the world changes?"

Her answer was honestly this "Those people were probably making it up".

you just cant argue with them



posted on Aug, 10 2009 @ 06:49 AM
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reply to post by Irishwolf
 


Oh you can argue to your heart's content. Sometimes you just can't reason



posted on Aug, 10 2009 @ 06:55 AM
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reply to post by Republican08
 


Just one question.

What if you are wrong?



posted on Aug, 10 2009 @ 07:00 AM
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reply to post by Udontknowme
 


What if he's right?

And this is your one chance to do something meaningful, something that will benefit the world, or just a handful of people. Would you really want to gamble the only chance you'd ever have at life thinking it would continue and waste most of your valuable worshipping some deity that may or may not exist and not doing things for the good of the world because you think "He" will help them out so you dont have to do anything?

Some religious people can do a lot of good work, but most simply go to church and pray for the things they want instead of going out and getting them.



posted on Aug, 10 2009 @ 07:07 AM
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reply to post by Irishwolf
 


You didn't answer my question.

I don't believe any religion has it right. What religion are you in? That's just as exclusive as asking what cult do you belong to? Religion is exclusive.

But, atheism is a religion in its own right. A deep hatred for a supreme being they don't believe in. What an oxymoron.

Respect God, and you will love Him.

Treat your neighbors well, and they will treat you well.

That's all I've got to say in this thread.




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