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Miracles: Can you help me understand?

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posted on Aug, 17 2009 @ 12:08 PM
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reply to post by Majestic23
 


Reply to the longer post.

Right, if i flip and coin **and it lands the probability of it being heads is 1/2. What you are doing when talking of seagulls or disappearing acts is just adding in external factors, to a somewhat simplified probability.


there are patterns and repetitions all throughout the universe but these are part of the world of duality and so are like an illusion that helps us make sense of things and basically be translated to our conciousness


-I argue that duality does not exist. It is something our minds create to help us relate to the objective world. You are quite right wehn you say illusion.
-We are socialble creatures by evolution, by nature. So to add weight to my argument of how duality is imposed by us. If I am in a group of people and I hit one of them, I see that me hitting them causes discomfort and so causes them to dislike me. I do not want to be disliked, due to my nature (safety in numbers, hence the reason why you see all forms of life group together:prides, schools, herds and so on.), I would see that action of hitting as "wrong" or "bad" since it would produce a social affect I do not want. NOT BECAUSE it is INHERENTLY wrong to hit people.


Its from a human perspective, human rules, human preconceptions
And yours are what? :S


Duality exists at every level of existance until you reach the godhead source of all things as I can tell.
...As you can tell...How do you tell? How can you say that so matter-of-factly, especially since I have just challenged your preconception of "duality exists", rather strongly I might add. So please, enlighten me.

You also wish for me to challenege "we are all one". I wouldnt dare. We are all one, if you think of a big enough scale. We are human. A species that exists on the surface of a really hot rock that orbits a ball of gas that we call the Sun. So yes you are quite right, on a large scale, we are all one.


Subtle energy forces bind us and manipulation of these can effect miracles
I would hardly call Gravity subtle. And before you try and challenge the concept of Gravity, I am referring to the force that causes an object to accelerate toward earth. Manipulation of these forces effect miracles? They dont cause then...the effect them. So if they can be affected by forces, then what are miracles exactly?

We have already had one definition which has shown to be lacking, of which I shall remind you


a miracle is any happening or circumstance which is so highly unliely as to be incapable of being ascribed to simple chance without stretching the bounds of reasonable thinking


Care to change or add your own? Id love to hear it.

May I ask, where do miracles come from? Is it a divine intervention? If so, then can you define the character of this said being that is intervening? If we are going to argue about the God of Classical Theism, i.e. All-powerful, all-knowing, all-loving...then it leads me to wonder

What sort of all powerful, all knowing being would create something that has flaws, so that they can amuse themselves by running around fixing everything through miracles. They must have been making a cup of tea during world war 2.

Cheers,

Brad.




posted on Aug, 17 2009 @ 12:47 PM
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Originally posted by Majestic23
I just feel very sorry for people such as you. You are not like the sheeple because you are too inquisitive and smart but you are not like the enlightened because you are convinced you know enough.

Save your sympathy. If you were a tenth as aware and enlightened as you think you are, you would know you are being patronizing and therefore obnoxious.


If you really want to know why people like me believe in miracles its because we have useually experienced things that cannot be explained or even imagined by modern academics (not just one incident,usueally many). Things that measure 10 on the scale of mind bending terror. Its more real than anything else in this illusion of our waking reality.

What presumptuous, high-and-mighty poppycock. You have no idea what I have experienced. I spent most of my adult life - and I am fifty-one years old, by the way - in the middle of a civil war. I have driven through a burning neighbourhood and watched the inhabitants being slaughtered by a racist mob. I had to stop the car and change a tyre in the middle of that. I have seen bodies piled on tyres and set alight, bodies hanging from lamp-posts, bodies floating down rivers. Blood and guts littering a street in the aftermath of a suicide-bombing. A friend of mine was taken away in the middle of the night and shot dead by uniformed assassins. I carried his coffin at a funeral where the mourners were hemmed in threateningly by armed troops. And you have the gall to preach to me about terror?

I wrote you a courteous post. You responded with a blundering, mealymouthed, hypocritical sermon. Well, I'm not a member of your precious congregation, so enough with the prating. When I need enlightenment, I'll get it from a fortune cookie.



posted on Aug, 17 2009 @ 03:51 PM
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reply to post by Toughiv

Right, you would firstly have to say that the Big Bang is incapable of being ascribed to 'simple chance'...which I dont believe you can do...OTHERWISE i will simply say that GOD is a MIRACLE.

I feel certain that somehow the odds of a Big bang could be calculated should one understand the complete physics behind such an occurrence.


but who was anticipating divine intervention? How can one intervene with something that does not exist.

Er, isn't that the same point I just conceded to?

Look, you may not like how a term is used, but that does not change how it is used. English is an evolving language and it is far from rare for the connotation of a word to convey more meaning than its literal definition. 'Faggot', a flaming torch used for illumination, comes to mind. I as well as most others on this very forum would give it a different meaning in common usage.

Logic is a wonderful thing, but when taken out of the context of reality, it frequently delivers answers which do not reflect reality.

TheRedneck



posted on Aug, 17 2009 @ 03:52 PM
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reply to post by Toughiv
 


I force no one to believe in what I believe in. I also use hindsight to see the connections in events in the life of myself and others and the world in general.

I believe as science has proved everything is connected.

Everything has a purpose open your eyes and think back in your life to the little things that lead up to a learning event at some point later. Or look back at history and see the small events that lead up to big events. Or think back to the past mistakes you've made the ones where you think I knew I should of made the other choice or not did that.

Many people won't agree because they don't pay attention to details even the very small ones that don't seem like they should matter. Many people that will agree are ones that have learned to watch and remember the past. So when things start happening in their lives they know this is all happening for a purpose.

Even though we are all connected it doesn't mean we all walk the same path. Perhaps those that don't believe everything happens for a reason are on a path where no light is shed for them to see it does.

Do not feel as if I am imposing my beliefs on you or anyone else. As you can see from my avatar its one who is observing. Something I'm very good at. It lets me see things others tend not to see. Just as science uses observations to reach conculsion so do I. I believe everyone should reach their own conculsions using the same basic tools. They need to conduct an experiment to see if there is a purpose for things that happen. They should have all the data and have done all the research they need to do. Not just take samples of the big picture and think they will come up with an acurate conculsion.

Like miracles a purpose for everything don't have to be a big one. It might just lead someone into a different direction of thinking that leads to another purpose some where along the way. Then some where along the way all those little purposes make one big event happen. A shocking thought I know. Thats the way I see it can't help it if other don't. Each to their own path in life.

Anyone else reading this or any of my comments on any other threads. These are my opinions and beliefs. Which I have come to on my own accord. As with anyone elses opinions and beliefs even if they weigh you down with facts always do your own research both for and against the subject. Come to your own conculsions do not let anyone tell you how to think or feel.

I believe my conversation with you now is over I have made my position clear and explaned to you. I have also released those that you must of thought I was forcing my opinions on. So run free now people you are released from my evil clutches...hurry go before I change my mind lol.



posted on Aug, 17 2009 @ 04:26 PM
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Originally posted by Toughiv
Right, if i flip and coin **and it lands the probability of it being heads is 1/2. What you are doing when talking of seagulls or disappearing acts is just adding in external factors, to a somewhat simplified probability.


And you are trying to apply simple probability to all of the things that occour in the universe. When you yourself have shown that the probabilty of just one event occouring is near enough impossible to pass as miraculous.


Originally posted by ToughivWe are socialble creatures by evolution, by nature. So to add weight to my argument of how duality is imposed by us. If I am in a group of people and I hit one of them, I see that me hitting them causes discomfort and so causes them to dislike me. I do not want to be disliked, due to my nature (safety in numbers, hence the reason why you see all forms of life group together:prides, schools, herds and so on.), I would see that action of hitting as "wrong" or "bad" since it would produce a social affect I do not want. NOT BECAUSE it is INHERENTLY wrong to hit people.


Yes duality is an illusion but that does not mean that concepts like good and bad mean nothing. Non-religious people often come to the conclusion that people are good to each other because of empathy and desire to not rock the boat. We are here in the world of duality for a reason wheter we like it or not, its not like we can just jump off at will and not come back. You believe that balance is the goal to attain but does that mean balance is lack of duality or balance is the goal of being in a dualistic realm?

How is it so many enlightened people claim to transcend duality yet still clearly stand up for the side of good?


Originally posted by ToughivAnd yours are what? :S


Hmmm, let me put it another way. Its looking from the left brained "logical" perspective, the yang side. That goes to explain the physcially manifest world quite well. It falls apart when it has to explain anything spiritual that eminites from the unmanifest (in actuality everything comes from this). Thats why science and mathemiatics has such trouble and breaks down as soon as its out of its comfort zone. I would therefore say your point of view is made by man and mine is made by the oneness. Of course you will argue "but it still comes from the mind of humans" and I would say it comes from elsewhere.


Originally posted by Toughiv...As you can tell...How do you tell? How can you say that so matter-of-factly, especially since I have just challenged your preconception of "duality exists", rather strongly I might add. So please, enlighten me.


Have you been there? Its more real than our illusion reality "as far as I can tell". If you want more than that I cant help you, you have to see it for yourself. If you think I and many others are making it up then fine, you are missing out. I have no idea how you saying to me duality doesnt exist matters at all.


Originally posted by ToughivYou also wish for me to challenege "we are all one". I wouldnt dare. We are all one, if you think of a big enough scale. We are human. A species that exists on the surface of a really hot rock that orbits a ball of gas that we call the Sun. So yes you are quite right, on a large scale, we are all one.


This is what the Hermatic laws state. As above so below, patterns and repitions and opposing forces on every level.

I would hardly call Gravity subtle. And before you try and challenge the concept of Gravity, I am referring to the force that causes an object to accelerate toward earth. Manipulation of these forces effect miracles? They dont cause then...the effect them. So if they can be affected by forces, then what are miracles exactly?

Funny how you instantly start arguning against gravity (which might not even be a force as such, just manipulation of time space). I am talking more about qi/orgone energy tachyon based stuff. How do you think the universe manages to move constantly? Where is the enrgy source?

We are back to this definition problem (yet again) so lets just call mircales magic, the manipulation of the forces that makeup our reality. Everything is energy and energy can never be destroyed only changed or directed. From Moses parting the ocean to the miraculous survival of a young child in an earthquake its all manipulation of energy. This concept is integral to enlightenment.


Originally posted by ToughivWe have already had one definition which has shown to be lacking, of which I shall remind you



a miracle is any happening or circumstance which is so highly unliely as to be incapable of being ascribed to simple chance without stretching the bounds of reasonable thinking


We are used to energy acting in predictable ways. When it does not this is "paranormal" and miraculous. Again, manipulation of energy.


Originally posted by ToughivCare to change or add your own? Id love to hear it.


Again, everything is energy, a miracle is energy reacting in a way that is not usually observed, by intent and willpower (please god save my life!) or your beloved "chance" which is still directed by intent, only subconsciously or by higher beings that we do not useually percieve.

Sounds like a good description of the miraculous to me.



Originally posted by ToughivMay I ask, where do miracles come from? Is it a divine intervention? If so, then can you define the character of this said being that is intervening? If we are going to argue about the God of Classical Theism, i.e. All-powerful, all-knowing, all-loving...then it leads me to wonder


Again, we are all one, we are soul sparks of god and everything is interconnected. So in essance its our own intent that performs the energy manipulation. This is mind over matter. Making the unmanifest manifest. We (our incarnated souls here at this time) have higher selves which are like demi-gods, and they in turn answer to yet a higher power. This might go on indefinately or until the godhead is reached.


Originally posted by ToughivWhat sort of all powerful, all knowing being would create something that has flaws, so that they can amuse themselves by running around fixing everything through miracles. They must have been making a cup of tea during world war 2.


Its like a training camp. How will you become a god if you dont learn to fix thing?



posted on Aug, 17 2009 @ 04:36 PM
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reply to post by Astyanax
 


My hat is off to you. I can picture from your words your life but I can not even imagine what it would of been like to live through that.

Over here we like to think we have inner strength. I'm afraid many of us would not be able to find the strength it took for you to deal with all that was going on. Our soldiers over here would probably be the ones closest to experiencing what you have seen and been through.

Your post also has me doing some inner checking..would I have what it takes, could I find that strength you did? I really don't know. It seems there is a part of me I need to do some work on if I don't know.

Thank you
Napayshni



[edit on 17-8-2009 by napayshni57]



posted on Aug, 17 2009 @ 05:07 PM
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Originally posted by Astyanax
Save your sympathy. If you were a tenth as aware and enlightened as you think you are, you would know you are being patronizing and therefore obnoxious.


Everything is energy. Clearly the way you go about communicating your ideas illicits a reaction from me, its push and pull. I do like to think I am quite enlightened to be honest but I am not a zen master, Iam aware I have a lot to learn and am quite often wrong. Its very hard to not sound patronizing and (I dont know about obnoxious) when trying to explain such concepts.


Originally posted by AstyanaxWhat presumptuous, high-and-mighty poppycock. You have no idea what I have experienced. I spent most of my adult life - and I am fifty-one years old, by the way - in the middle of a civil war. I have driven through a burning neighbourhood and watched the inhabitants being slaughtered by a racist mob. I had to stop the car and change a tyre in the middle of that. I have seen bodies piled on tyres and set alight, bodies hanging from lamp-posts, bodies floating down rivers. Blood and guts littering a street in the aftermath of a suicide-bombing. A friend of mine was taken away in the middle of the night and shot dead by uniformed assassins. I carried his coffin at a funeral where the mourners were hemmed in threateningly by armed troops. And you have the gall to preach to me about terror?


It is a great shame you and others have to endure such horrid things, I have no experience on anything of the level you described and you have my respect for enduring it. Is this partly why you dont believe in miracles?
The terror I describe "mind bending" is more otherworldly.


Originally posted by AstyanaxI wrote you a courteous post. You responded with a blundering, mealymouthed, hypocritical sermon. Well, I'm not a member of your precious congregation, so enough with the prating. When I need enlightenment, I'll get it from a fortune cookie.


Astyanax, its an internet forum, you cant go about claiming catagorically miracles dont exist and expect nobody to counter. I dont think I have been very disrespectful, I was sort of trying to be humerous and keep it a little lighter than your posts seemed to me. I dont mean any personal disrespect I dont know you its a public forum.

So, if indeed we do still have something to say to each other and perhaps even learn from each other lets get back to a nice comfortable argument about religion. If not then lets not tanlge. Personally I quite enjoyed your posts.



posted on Aug, 18 2009 @ 05:04 AM
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reply to post by napayshni57
 

I thank you. People like me have it pretty easy, really.

The soldier at the front, surviving on stinking rations and equipped with faulty equipment because his superior officers are in cahoots with war-profiteering crooks, expecting at any moment to lose his foot to a landmine or his life to a 12-year-old girl with an AAK47; that twelve-year-old's mother and baby brother cowering in a shallow foxhole on a beach while the dive-bombers stoop and howl; the doctor who must treat the casualities without recourse to medicines, anaesthetics, food or sleep; the journalist who is taken from his family dinner table by masked thugs who torture him and threaten him with death for writing about all of that - they are the ones to whom we must all raise our hats.

There are circles of Hell no front-parlour mystic has seen in any vision, but which ordinary, unphilosophical men, women and children must inhabit all their lives.

[edit on 18/8/09 by Astyanax]



posted on Aug, 18 2009 @ 11:29 AM
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For someone who has apparently seen some bad things you rise to anger and personal insults with little or no provactation and appear to have a "victim mentality". You have certainly derailed this thread.

Where and when did you come across these things? Its not as though they are particularly uncommon or anything but seen as you see fit to bring your personal history into a debate that really doesant call for it why dont you at least give some history to your claim.



[edit on 18-8-2009 by Majestic23]



posted on Aug, 19 2009 @ 05:22 AM
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reply to post by Majestic23
 


Right sorry for the wait, but here is my response to your argument against me. Firstly though, i must say, do not use my signatures in this debate. I myself am a theist, however for sake of intellectual debate, rather than a one sided discussion, I am playing the role of a skeptic.

You say just because dualism is an illusion, but 'good' and 'bad' have meaning. Where do you draw this conclusion? I would argue that it is part of our nature to try and see reason and logic in everything around us. Therefore, you saying 'good' and 'bad' have meaning is simply the nature of our conciousness, to believe in something more. We cannot simply believe we are here, we werent put here, we dont have reason. We just happen to be here. Thats is. Get on with it.

When you say where is the energy source for the Universe to 'move' (which I am taking as expand) the big bang theory provides strong evidence as to why this is the case. More credible than "The Universe is moving because God is making it move".

Now YOUR definition of a miracle "Energy reacting in a way that is not usually seen" Here ladies and gentlemen, by this most wonderful definition, an atomic bomb is a miracle. Tell that to the descendants of the families vapourised in Hiroshima.

Thanks

Brad



posted on Aug, 19 2009 @ 11:33 AM
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Originally posted by Toughiv
You say just because dualism is an illusion, but 'good' and 'bad' have meaning. Where do you draw this conclusion?


Does your life on Earth mean nothing? Of course it means something, just because its an illusion does not mean it isnt important, it still has wide reaching effects.
Example, in WW2 the both armies used decoy tanks etc... they saved many lives and stretched the enemy resources. An illusion having an effect.


Originally posted by ToughivI would argue that it is part of our nature to try and see reason and logic in everything around us. Therefore, you saying 'good' and 'bad' have meaning is simply the nature of our conciousness, to believe in something more. We cannot simply believe we are here, we werent put here, we dont have reason. We just happen to be here. Thats is. Get on with it.


What exactly are you arguing here? Since when does anything exist without a reason? Nature doesnt like to waste energy if it can help it.


Originally posted by ToughivWhen you say where is the energy source for the Universe to 'move' (which I am taking as expand) the big bang theory provides strong evidence as to why this is the case. More credible than "The Universe is moving because God is making it move".


The big bang theory is constantly challenged by science and it is beginning to wane. When I say move I mean literally the opposite of staying still, the universe is not only infinately big and expanding but infinately small and getting smaller, when I say move what is really meant is that everything in our illusion reality and the layers immediately above and below it split and duplicate constantly all the time, that is the real opposite of inertia. What was the energy source for the big bang then? You can keep going until you get to the source of energy, that energy just happens to be god and by god I mean the interlinked energy and consciousness of all beings.


Originally posted by ToughivNow YOUR definition of a miracle "Energy reacting in a way that is not usually seen" Here ladies and gentlemen, by this most wonderful definition, an atomic bomb is a miracle. Tell that to the descendants of the families vapourised in Hiroshima.


Thats a pretty cheap shot and clearly you are taking liberties with what I said. In my opinion yes the splitting of the atom was almost miraculous (all miracles WILL be understood by science one day and are understood by those with an open mind right now). Such energy is not inherantly evil its only evil when you use it to destroy and kill. Iam sure "the descendants of the families vapourised in Hiroshima" would agree. And even so, if we are taking into account that duality is an illusion and we are all here to experience the full spectrum then it could be argued that its not evil.

Would you call Einstein evil?

Cheers Brad.



posted on Aug, 20 2009 @ 03:47 AM
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Originally posted by Majestic23
Does your life on Earth mean nothing? Of course it means something, just because its an illusion does not mean it isnt important, it still has wide reaching effects.

Example, in WW2 the both armies used decoy tanks etc... they saved many lives and stretched the enemy resources. An illusion having an effect.


You say that my life means something. Here is where we would differ. You are arguing FROM the point that we have a soul, something of inheritant value, that is more than this reality, that experiences through the duality of reality.

My argument is the only meaning in life is what we give it. There are no souls, we are a bunch of chemical reactions and so on. A product of evolution. (reductionist).

Good example of how illusions can have meaning behind them. However, what was the motive of that said illusion. It was to spread enemy resources.

But you cannot move from that point and apply it to "the illusion of duality is to make us learn from experience". **To what avail? **Who put the illusion there? **Does the illusion exist really? Or are we making an illusion out of it, rather have we been taught to understand things as good and bad? What would you think if you just lived on an island?


What exactly are you arguing here? Since when does anything exist without a reason? Nature doesnt like to waste energy if it can help it.


Firstly, *without a reason. Now that troubles me. Look at it this way, the food chain. Do plants exist so elephants (i know elephants, hooray!) can eat them? Or is it just the way it has come about to be?

If you start suggesting plants exist for a reason. You are arguing for design. Something you cannot move me with.

Secondly, nature doesnt like to wate energy. Yes you are quite right, in fact all systems dont like to waste energy.

Law of Thermodynamics


What was the energy source for the big bang then? You can keep going until you get to the source of energy, that energy just happens to be god and by god I mean the interlinked energy and consciousness of all beings.


THAT ENERGY JUST HAPPENS TO BE GOD. Ladies and gentlemen I would like to draw your attention to that statement. Now listen to the following. What is the source of God? WHY does the Universe need a source but God doesnt?


Such energy is not inherantly evil its only evil when you use it to destroy and kill. Iam sure "the descendants of the families vapourised in Hiroshima" would agree. And even so, if we are taking into account that duality is an illusion and we are all here to experience the full spectrum then it could be argued that its not evil.

Would you call Einstein evil?


You say such energy is only "evil" when you destroy and kill. Yet again, back to our duality point, its an illusion, get past "killing is wrong". If you can logically break down and provide support to what morals actually are, then i would be greatly intrigued.

No I wouldnt call Einstein evil. Just a clever human.

Cheers,

Brad.

[edit on 20-8-2009 by Toughiv]



posted on Sep, 6 2009 @ 06:49 PM
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When Jesus said that he pretty much meant that humans do not have enough faith and will probably never have enough faith to do those kind of things, also back in biblical times, there were other gods that "could do the same things as Jesus have done" so all the healing and all that was considered normal, God doesn't want to force us to believe, if we saw a mountain move on the 7th o clock news, no one could deny his existence, and therefore our freedom of will to believe in him would be taken away, but miracles happen its just that it it will be less spectacular then back in the biblical times

Im sorry if i didn't make any sense im really stoned



posted on Oct, 23 2011 @ 12:52 AM
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Star & Flag....
From the Opening Page...

According to the scriptures Jesus went about the land healing the sick,feeding thousands with only a few fishes and loaves, raising the dead, pulling money from the mouth of a fish, walking on water...etc.... now when His disciples looked and acted all amazed, He told them not to be surprised that if they had faith even as small as a mustard seed, they could do the same and greater, He said they could tell the mountains to jump into the sea and they would obey...

Perhaps Jesus was referring to "Faith" as having Trust in the Knowledge of how to do these things, rather than Blind belief ? (as in the word faith is often being used.)
First knowledge is required.
We can't do anything unless First we have the knowledge in how to do it.

"Posted by Greenize"

according to one of the lost books of the bible, when Jesus was a child he would make animals from mud/clay and animate them... How?

I presume you you are referring to "the Infancy Gospel of Thomas". Verse 2 Quote;


2. When This Boy Jesus was five years old
He was playing at the ford of a brook,
and He gathered into pools the water that flowed by,
and made it at one lean, and commanded it by His WORD alone.

He made soft clay and fashioned from it twelve sparrows. And it was the Sabbath when He did this.
And there were also many other children playing with Him.

Now when a certain Jew saw what Jesus was doing in His play on The Sabbath, he at once went and told His father Joseph:
"See, your child is at the brook, and He has taken clay and fashioned twelve birds
and has profaned The Sabbath."

And when Joseph came to the place and saw it, he cried out to Him, saying:
"Why do You do on The Sabbath what ought not to be done?"

But Jesus clapped His hands and cried to the sparrows:
"Off with you!" And the sparrows took flight and went away chirping.

The Jews were amazed when they saw this, and went away and told their elders what they had seen Jesus do.

And in verse 3 Quote;


3. But the son of Annas the scribe was standing there with Joseph;
and he took a branch of a willow and with it dispersed the water which Jesus had gathered together.

When Jesus saw what he had done He was enraged and said to him:
"You insolent, godless dunderhead, what harm did the pools and the water do to you?

See, now you also shall wither like a tree and shall bear neither leaves nor root nor fruit."

And immediately that lad withered up completely;
and Jesus departed and went into Joseph's house.

But the parents of him that was withered took Him away, bewailing His youth, and brought him to Joseph and reproached him:

"What A Child you have, Who does such things."


And in Verse 4 Quote:

4. After this again He went through the village,
and a lad ran and knocked against His shoulder.
Jesus was exasperated and said to him:
"You shall not go further on your way,"
and the child immediately fell down and died.

But some, who saw what took place, said: From where does This Child spring,
since His every Word is an accomplished deed?"
And the parents of the dead child came to Joseph and blamed him and said:
"Since you have such a Child, you cannot dwell with us in the village;
or else teach Him to bless and not to curse. For He is slaying our children."


And in Verse 5 Quote:

5. And Joseph called The Child aside and admonished Him saying:
"Why do You do such things that these people must Suffer and hate us and persecute us?"

But Jesus replied: "I know that these Words are not yours; nevertheless for Your sake I will be silent.
But they shall bear their punishment."

And immediately those who had accused Him became blind.
And those who saw it were greatly afraid and perplexed, and said concerning Him:
"Every Word He speaks, whether good or evil, was a dead and became a marvel."

And when Joseph saw that Jesus had so done, he arose and took Him by the ear and pulled it hard.
And The Child was angry and said to him:
"It is sufficient for you to seek and not to find
and most unwisely have you acted.
Do you not know that I am yours? Do not vex Me."


"Posted by Greenize"

Surely someone on this earth has had the tiniest bit of faith...why hasn't anyone else been able to do miracles?

Perhaps it is because they Lack the Knowledge.
Faith without Knowledge is fruitless.

"Posted by Greenize"

Did Jesus have access to secret knowledge?

It appears He did.

"Posted by Greenize"

If so what knowledge and whose?


Perhaps to do with the "Processing System" of the Soul.
Here is a 100% Accurate Drawing of the base "Partition Map" used in The Souls "Processing System".



"The True Mind" uses this "Partition Map" in the "Processing System" of The Soul Construct, to generate our Experiences i.e. the Holographic universe etc. which appears to be reality to the human species, but instead is generated Inside each Soul experiencing the Program.

"Posted by Greenize"

Like in the old testament, the magicians mimicked nearly everything that God had Moses do? Is this maybe part of the same knowlege?

Possibly, as magicians often display Geometric Images such as 5 and 6 Pointed Stars etc.

"Posted by Greenize"

Or was it all just trickery?

LOL. The universe (Material World so called) could be seen as such... produced by The True Mind through the Soul. But what awesome Trickery then.

"Posted by Greenize"

Why would He say we could do the same and more if only we believed?

Perhaps we can but who will believe what I am showing with regard to the Souls Processing System.
No one believed Him then so why would anyone believe me today?
Is it because my Geometric Drawings regarding the Processing System of The Soul are so alien to today's beliefs?

"Posted by Greenize"

Is faith the same as postive thinking?

I don't think so, not in the Context the word faith was used in then by the Scribe who reported these things...

"Posted by Greenize"

If secret knowlege, has it been lost over time?

Definitely, I believe this is in fact the case.
These Ancient writings are like a Parable and are intended for the Inner True Mind Not the human species whose title is A' DAM Not MAN.

The Descendants of A' DAM have Coveted the title, MAN.

It is only called a "Miracle", if it is Not known how it is done....



posted on Oct, 23 2011 @ 01:52 AM
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Originally posted by ProtoplasmicTraveler
People live in eternal conflict between the competing hemispheres of your brain.

The left side wants to ask the pretty girl at the end of the bar to dance, the right side says she will never agree don't embarass yourself.

Lack of faith.

The left side wants that new leather jacket, the right says what are you a biker and a Rockefeller that thing costs way to much money.

Lack of faith.

You see the special on the menu at the restaurant and the left side says try it, it sounds really good. The right side says, but you love the chicken here, it won't be as good as the chicken get the chicken. You get the chicken and the people at the next table got the special and the smell of it alone makes you hate yourself for not trying it.

Lack of faith.

The faith isn't in Christ, or G-d, the faith is in yourself to end your endless eternal debate.

As a Christian you likely really do believe in Christ and G-d, and feel you have absolute faith, but when you pray to Christ or G-d most people who do don't have absolute faith that their prayers will be answered...they love to say G-d's will. In other words I am going to ask G-d or Christ for this or that in the form of a prayer or commune with him, but I don't have absolute faith that I deserve what I am asking them for, just like I didn't have absolute faith the girl would dance with me, or to get that new jacket, or to try the special at the resturaunt.

Your belief in Jesus and G-d is real, but your belief in yourself isn't real.

When you can succesfully become one with yourself, where there is no more argument and you have absolute faith in yourself and what you believe and what you want and feel it intently and totally with all your soul, mind and heart, then you can become one with the infinate universe and you can become one with the power of the inifinite universe and you can tap into that power to use it to manifest what you want in the infinite universe.

Then after you have blown your mind, shattered your illusion of reality for ever, feel guilty and horrible about what you have done, you can go for therapy and try real hard to convince yourself it never happened and to never do it again because you really just want to be human.

You like most people really just want to be human, and humans (99.999999999% of them) lack faith in themselves.

It's not about faith in Christ or G-d, though people do use their faith in Christ and G-d and talismans and spells and rituals to convince themselves it is possible for things to manifest in miraculous ways and attribute the results to those things instead of themselves.

It's really about faith in yourself, absolute faith.

Word of caution, open some doors in the universe and there is no going back.

Igrnorance is bliss, that's why most humans choose it!


A star for you.


Akushla



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