Is there an ARCHAEOLOGICAL COVERUP going on in New Zealand?

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posted on Aug, 7 2009 @ 11:25 PM
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Have the skeletons of a caucasian Tall (giant) race and short (fairy) race been uncovered in New Zealand? Did the Maoris know about them and live together with them at one time, and do many of their legends talk about them? Is the evidence (in the form of skeletons, dwellings etc) being deliberately destroyed and kept from you by the New Zealand government, who has deemed it 'sensitive'?

(charges of racism are often levelled at anyone who mentions this stuff, but that would mean that the maori elders themselves are racist too, becuz this stuff is in their legends, and i am sure that the elders believe it is true. I think its racist to say the elders and nz legends are wrong, when it looks like there is evidence to back it up, personally.)

QUOTE BELOW:

In 2004, Member of Parliament, the Hon. Chris Carter, was asked, under an “official information” request, how many archaeological “embargoes” were presently in place. He forwarded a written response that there were 105 current embargoes, mostly concerning burial sites. It was stated that “DOC administers the New Zealand Archaeological Associations Central file ...of which, 105 ... were classified as sensitive records”. The response stated: “File keepers may create sensitive files ....if this is requested by the site recorder...”

One of these embargos of recent years included a 75-year suppression of information related to a cache of large stature skeletons at Waikaretu, 12-miles SSE of Port Waikato. The very tall people (measured to be 7-feet or more) were laid out on cut shelves in a cavern, which was exposed during road widening excavations. Anthropologists from Auckland and Waikato Universities were called in and, to the dismay and disgust of the roading contractors, they slapped a moratorium over the find, requiring that it be kept secret from the New Zealand public. Maurice Tyson of Tuakau, a contractor in the area for 50 years, recalls how this upset the men who had discovered the cave. They could not understand why such a valuable, history-changing, archaeological site should be kept secret. In 1988, archaeologist, Michael Taylor slapped an embargo on any release of information concerning the ancient, stacked stone structures in the Waipoua Forest, but that embargo was partially broken by a private citizen’s legal challenge after 8-years.

What this means is that the “powers that be” assume the authority to veto any mention or release of information they consider not suitable for the public. The reality is, however, that all skeletal remains of the pre-Maori people, when located in caves, rock shelters, sand dunes, etc., by hunters or others and reported to the authorities, are inevitably buried, removed or destroyed by concealment teams associated with the local iwi or Department of Conservation. Since the beginning of New Zealand’s colonial era, innumerable anomalous skeletons have been seen in dry burial caves and some of these were in coffins or more-often laid out on stone shelves, etc. On rare occasions, some bodies have been seen to be encased within solidified tree gum. Many skeletons have been observed to have the blond, red or brown hair hues, typical of Europeans, and are often accompanied by carved greenstone or other kinds of funerary objects. In coastal sand dunes, as elsewhere, the skeletons are mostly found to be buried in a foetal or sitting position, with the knees drawn up to the chest and trussed (tied). This is similar to Beaker-People burials of ancient Britain or the innumerable mummy-bag burials of Peru.

For about 12-years during the mid 1860’s-70’s Robertson’s Mill in Onehunga, Auckland ground up tens of thousands of Patu-paiarehe skeletons from the Auckland and Northland burial caves to make fertiliser. Maori leaders had told Governor Bowen at Te Kopuru in 1869, ‘Do with them what you wish for these are not our people’ (Source: Noel Hilliam, former Curator of the Dargaville Maritime Museum).

This statement to Governor Bowen parallels what historian/ anthropologist Edward Tregear heard and wrote:

“The Maoris used to pay great respect to the bones of their dead, yet here and there may be found among sandhills, etc., human remains uncovered by the wind, and of these no tradition remains, as there would certainly be if the relics were those of ancestors. The natives say, “These are the bones of strangers.” So also mortuary-caves are found concerning the contents of which the Maoris make the same remark, and regard them with indifference” (See: The Maori Race, pp. 562-563).

SOURCE: LINK


[edit on 7-8-2009 by rapunzel222]

[edit on 7-8-2009 by rapunzel222]

[edit on 7-8-2009 by rapunzel222]

[edit on 7-8-2009 by rapunzel222]



+14 more 
posted on Aug, 7 2009 @ 11:32 PM
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there is an archealogical coverup going on throughout the whole world.

frankly i'm sick and tired of it. i am ready for the veil to be removed from our faces.

one can only hope that on december 21st, 2012 is when the veil will be lifted.



posted on Aug, 7 2009 @ 11:39 PM
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I know there is, but this stuff about New Zealand is interesting i think, cuz you can see the govt has a process it uses 'for sensitive sites' called an 'embargo'... how often are they using these things?

How much of our true history has been obliterated and destroyed?

How ironic that they're called the "department of conservation" when they're DESTROYING ancient skeletons and irreplaceable parts of the archaeological record, of importance to all humans.

However confronting the truth is, we have to face it and not hide it. For example, if 7 ft plus skeletons have been found all over the world -like in north america, where the indigenous americans have legends of them defeating tribes of red haired giants (tons of skeletons and mummies have been found over the years, then given to the smithsonian, who has since, 'lost' them/or they have conveniently 'disappeared'). If giants existed, big deal. I want to know. i think its cool. i dont want archaeologists dumping bones in the ocean cuz they can't face up to the truth. (story this allegedly occurred: Childress's book: Lost cities of north and central america: from amazon.com. ) There is a story in his book about a girl who worked at smithsonian and was fired becuz she wouldn't participate in the 'cover up'. Of course, im sure MOST archaeologists are totally ignorant of any of this, even if they do work for the smithsonian. its probably select groups or teams who do this sort of work, like the above quote says.



posted on Aug, 7 2009 @ 11:56 PM
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I don't think any of us would appreciate someone digging up our deceased ancestors in the name of "science", no matter how interesting those ancestors might be. Why should the Maori be any different? It's just a desecration to dig up their ancestors.

I'm not seeing any serious conspiracy here, other than a belated sensitivity to the customs and sensibilities of the Maori. If they revere their dead, who are we to dig them up?

As for the unusual sizes of these alleged bones - easy to say, when there's nothing to prove it wrong. You can say they had three heads and tentacles, or anything else you want. But, is it true? Or is it just an embellishment to a story of not allowing people to dig up other people's ancestors?



posted on Aug, 8 2009 @ 12:06 AM
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It's very difficult to say what really existed before the Maori people arrived in NZ around 1,000 years ago. While living in that beautiful country some time back I heard and read that the Maori ATE the previous inhabitants. So there you go, anything prior to then would be an interesting find to be sure. I too find annoyance at the covering up of important finds relating to the genesis and nature of humanity.



posted on Aug, 8 2009 @ 12:15 AM
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Originally posted by chiron613
I don't think any of us would appreciate someone digging up our deceased ancestors in the name of "science", no matter how interesting those ancestors might be. Why should the Maori be any different? It's just a desecration to dig up their ancestors.

I'm not seeing any serious conspiracy here, other than a belated sensitivity to the customs and sensibilities of the Maori. If they revere their dead, who are we to dig them up?

As for the unusual sizes of these alleged bones - easy to say, when there's nothing to prove it wrong. You can say they had three heads and tentacles, or anything else you want. But, is it true? Or is it just an embellishment to a story of not allowing people to dig up other people's ancestors?



If you had read the quote to the end, you would have seen that the Maoris do NOT consider this race to be their ancestors at all. This race was in NZ before the maoris arrived. You would also have noticed that the Maori's were apparantly at one point consulted about the digging up of the caucasian skeletons, and said they didn't CARE what happened to them, since they WERENT THEIR ANCESTORS AT ALL. If you follow the link theres photos of the skeletons and coffins as well. theres also pictures of red haired caucasian mummies in nz in anothe rlink i posted.



[edit on 8-8-2009 by rapunzel222]



posted on Aug, 8 2009 @ 12:16 AM
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reply to post by rapunzel222
 


[sarcasm]But that would throw the population into anarchy!!!! If they concede giants existed then the population would take it to mean that dragons existed and leprachauns and perhaps even gods!!! It'd be ANARCHY!!! AHHH!!! [/sarcasm]

But, I wouldn't be suprised if that was somewhat close to the view. Not to mention how the current paradigm would have to be re-examined.



[edit on 8-8-2009 by Watcher-In-The-Shadows]



posted on Aug, 8 2009 @ 12:17 AM
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Originally posted by Tayesin
It's very difficult to say what really existed before the Maori people arrived in NZ around 1,000 years ago. While living in that beautiful country some time back I heard and read that the Maori ATE the previous inhabitants. So there you go, anything prior to then would be an interesting find to be sure. I too find annoyance at the covering up of important finds relating to the genesis and nature of humanity.


Well if there's skeletons and dwellings and oral history, then its not difficult to say who was there early on, its very easy to say. If people care enough to stop their governments from destroying the evidence and covering it up. The above article i linked to also says that the maoris did kill off and eat/ enslave the previous inhabitants, or many of them.



posted on Aug, 8 2009 @ 12:31 AM
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Originally posted by Watcher-In-The-Shadows
reply to post by rapunzel222
 


[sarcasm]But that would throw the population into anarchy!!!! If they concede giants existed then the population would take it to mean that dragons existed and leprachauns and perhaps even gods!!! It'd be ANARCHY!!! AHHH!!! [/sarcasm]

But, I wouldn't be surprised if that was somewhat close to the view.

[edit on 8-8-2009 by Watcher-In-The-Shadows]


There were giants but its not what most people think. according to many philosophers such a Josephus Goliath was considered a giant at 6ft 9 in by today standard thats not that tall compared to them average height of 4ft 5 in id be a giant at 6 ft 3 in. Where there groups considerable taller than the norm of course there were. good example average height of male in china 5 ft 4 in average in Netherlands 6 ft so in china they can say there be giants!


Ps admitting there were tall pwople doesnt open up a pandoras box and automatically prove every legend either!



[edit on 8/8/09 by dragonridr]



posted on Aug, 8 2009 @ 12:43 AM
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Originally posted by rapunzel222
In 1988, archaeologist, Michael Taylor slapped an embargo on any release of information concerning the ancient, stacked stone structures in the Waipoua Forest, but that embargo was partially broken by a private citizen’s legal challenge after 8-years.


[edit on 7-8-2009 by rapunzel222]


I requested and recieved the initial Archaeological survey of the area from the Northland DOC constituency. They also gave me the contact details of Michael Taylor for further information but I have yet to hear back from him.
The report mention 'stone structures,' 'stone walls' etc but is remarkably devoid of any in depth information about them.


I hope to hear from him soon.



posted on Aug, 8 2009 @ 12:43 AM
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Yes, the Aboriginals of NZ and Australia have oral tradition that states that there was another race there, and that they supplanted them. They also say that these people were lighter skinned.

That may not mean Caucasian. Lighter skinned than an Aboriginal without any mixed Ancestry would be just about anybody but Africans and Negritos - and some of them are still lighter in complexion.

And it wasn't a thousand years ago. The last dating of that I saw of evidence shows that they have been in the area for about 40,000 years. Which would also seem to be supported by oral tradition.

Further, some of their haplogroups split about 60,000 years ago.

[edit on 2009/8/8 by Aeons]

[edit on 2009/8/8 by Aeons]



posted on Aug, 8 2009 @ 12:50 AM
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Originally posted by Aeons


And it wasn't a thousand years ago. The last dating of that I saw of evidence shows that they have been in the area for about 40,000 years. Which would also seem to be supported by oral tradition.

[edit on 2009/8/8 by Aeons]


Do you have a link for this,or some supporting evidence as this is the first I've heard of this, as well as there being no record of it in the geological record (vegetation changes/specific plants etc).



posted on Aug, 8 2009 @ 12:59 AM
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Originally posted by aorAki

Originally posted by Aeons


And it wasn't a thousand years ago. The last dating of that I saw of evidence shows that they have been in the area for about 40,000 years. Which would also seem to be supported by oral tradition.

[edit on 2009/8/8 by Aeons]


Do you have a link for this,or some supporting evidence as this is the first I've heard of this, as well as there being no record of it in the geological record (vegetation changes/specific plants etc).


Sure I just added one up there. The fact that all of their mutational changes from their main haplogroup founders happened 50,000 to 60,000 years ago is pretty solid. Go to the genographicproject.org and you can see for yourself.


How about this one?
www.oneworldmagazine.org...

There are some finds that are going back as far as 70,000 years potentially.
wapedia.mobi...


I'd have to see what the Maori have, but I woudn't be surprised in the next couple of years to find that there was polynesian influence in that area and that they supplanted some of the culture with their culture. The same way that the Vikings did for a while with some of the Innu. The succeding generations identify as "Maori" or "Viking" even though genetically they are mostly indigenious with some mixed ancestry. Particularly since these groups only sent out men - the women had to come from somewhere.

[edit on 2009/8/8 by Aeons]



posted on Aug, 8 2009 @ 01:07 AM
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Here's another link to a page with LOTS of info on the destruction and cover up of the archaeological record going on in new zealand:

LINK

and here's a link to info on the waiopo (or whatever) forest structures in new zealand, with photos: link



posted on Aug, 8 2009 @ 01:22 AM
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There does seem to be an ongoing issue with DNA testing for ancient remains in places that are "out of place" and Caucasoid (not caucasian note) or merely "out of place" in general but political inconvenient.

There is political pressure to not test or publish. That's pretty apparent. No one can see what is happening in Eygpt and deny that.

How long did China try to cover up the remains of obvious Europeans with settlements in the heart of China? Only until it became apparent that in doing so they would be making it seem as if China was a "backwater" of history and not some thriving trade empire.....only when covering it up started to impact the new dynasty's ego.

I wish I understood what the problem is. Because I want to believe that there are no cover ups and no political wrangling about human history that is causing places to be bulldozed or ignored. But I can't deny it, because I've seen this process in action myself and been utterly astounded by it.

Something so incomprehensible is either abject stupidity or some conspiracy. I'm torn as to which it might be, so I'm open to the idea of it being conspiratorial in nature.



posted on Aug, 8 2009 @ 01:38 AM
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Originally posted by Aeons


There is political pressure to not test or publish.



I have neither experienced this nor know of people who have experienced this, regarding New Zealand/Aotearoa prehistory.

I'm not denying that there could well be something going on and that there appear to be curious occurences, but to be honest, the majority of it seems to be hearsay dressed up as fact....often by people who seem tohave another agenda, usually regarding the Treaty of Waitangi and some sort of 'Pakeha greivance'.

[edit on 8-8-2009 by aorAki]



posted on Aug, 8 2009 @ 01:41 AM
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Hard to have facts when no one is allowed to go look or things are bulldozed, now isn't it?

It is simple to insist that those without fact are wearing the tinfoil, when in fact that side simply wants facts and can't get at them.



posted on Aug, 8 2009 @ 01:42 AM
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im afraid i dont think its stupidity. I also don't think its really a white people/racism problem. (theres plenty of evidence the chinese traded with mexico (olmecs) in ancient times and were plenty advanced, so they shud have enough self esteem from that, and from inventing just about everything too)... the indigenous nth americans were also advanced as anyone else, with canal infrastructure, irrigation, agriculture, pueblo buildings, pyramids etc. It cant be that. I think, there's another component to all this, that governments believe HAS to be covered up. And im afraid i think it has something to do wiht eric von daniken's theories; and also wiht the worldwide practice of skull binding, and the skeletons with extremely elongated skulls that have been found all over the world (malta, egypt (nefertit, akhenaton - a living god), nazca, paracas, lapita people (batuku the skull) in the pacific islands, in russia as well etc). and also with the giant sized skeletons appearing on youtube, that are said to be hoaxes.. perhaps...



posted on Aug, 8 2009 @ 01:45 AM
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Originally posted by Aeons
Hard to have facts when no one is allowed to go look or things are bulldozed, now isn't it?

It is simple to insist that those without fact are wearing the tinfoil, when in fact that side simply wants facts and can't get at them.


I know, and work with, some pretty major researchers (arguably THE major researchers) in New Zealand prehistory (mostly geology - including Quaternary studies) but also Biological investigations, Archaeology and Radiocarbon dating (as well as being involved in the collection and processing of samples) and have never ever heard or seen anything about having their research obstructed/denied access and we have very in-depth discussions about all manner of things including much of what has been mentioned here.

[edit on 8-8-2009 by aorAki]

[edit on 8-8-2009 by aorAki]



posted on Aug, 8 2009 @ 01:47 AM
link   

Originally posted by Aeons
There does seem to be an ongoing issue with DNA testing for ancient remains in places that are "out of place" and Caucasoid (not caucasian note) or merely "out of place" in general but political inconvenient.

There is political pressure to not test or publish. That's pretty apparent. No one can see what is happening in Eygpt and deny that.

How long did China try to cover up the remains of obvious Europeans with settlements in the heart of China? Only until it became apparent that in doing so they would be making it seem as if China was a "backwater" of history and not some thriving trade empire.....only when covering it up started to impact the new dynasty's ego.

I wish I understood what the problem is. Because I want to believe that there are no cover ups and no political wrangling about human history that is causing places to be bulldozed or ignored. But I can't deny it, because I've seen this process in action myself and been utterly astounded by it.

Something so incomprehensible is either abject stupidity or some conspiracy. I'm torn as to which it might be, so I'm open to the idea of it being conspiratorial in nature.


can you elaborate on what you saw when you saw the process in action yourself? Id be really interested to know. Particularly as im studying to be an archaeologist at the moment.. altho i already have a different profession (thinking of changing careers, altho when i read stuff like this, i think, whats the point. if no one is actually interested in the truth, and the truth is impossible to get at.). From all the stuff ive read, i SENSE theres something going on, ,,, perhaps its just they dont think people could 'handle the truth'? or is it more sinister than that?




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