America: Freedom to Fascism - Film by Aaron Russo, page 2
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ATS Members have flagged this thread 72 times


reply posted on 5-8-2009 @ 03:44 PM by Maxmars
reply to post by daddio


While I generally agree with you, I think it is more like 60 million dissenters. Sadly, I fear they won;t be free for much longer, once the social engineering aspect of this globalization and socialization effort takes root.

Also, not paying one's taxes is not possible when you are charged for them as an embedded cost within the goods and services you consume.

Income tax on the other hand is something everyone should resist. I still pay them, but I DO so under duress, under the threat of incarceration and financial ruin.

Like I said earlier, it is not against the law to try to change the system.... yet.


reply posted on 5-8-2009 @ 04:52 PM by daddio
reply to post by consciousdrum



There are forms you need to fill out, you REVOKE your social security number and file a "Certificate of Exemption from Withholding in Lieu of a Form W-4", you file this with your employer, the Treasury dept., State Dept. and the IRS.

There is a book called "Good-Bye April 15th" there are forms in the re you can copy and alter with the new tax code and file them. This gets you out.

Of course the IRS will send you letters and you respond. If you DO NOT respond, they will come after you. They have left me alone for 2 years now. I got out 5 years ago. You must know the law and I used:

www.law.cornell.edu...



You can find all the social security code there. The internal revenue code is there to, 26 USC.

You are still a Citizen but a UNION STATE Citizen and Sovereign. NOT a U.S. citizen or subject. Capital "C" is imperative.

There are many other websites to get an idea, but an idea only, do your own research before you get involved. But the book "Good-Bye April 15th" is the greatest!!

Others I have helped just claim maximum deductions and then do not file a tax return. You can do this but when the IRS sends you a letter asking why you did not file, you repsond that you ARE NOT A U.S. citizen but a SOVEREIGN union STATE Citizen. FILING a tax return is ADMITTING liability to the system.


reply posted on 5-8-2009 @ 05:06 PM by daddio
reply to post by Maxmars


There are DIRECT taxes and INDIRECT taxes. Direct taxes are on material items manufactured and on fuel and on other "extra's" out there. If you don't want to pay these "direct" taxes, you don't buy the goods. Simple.

The Government DOES NOT have the enumerated authority or power to directly tax your LABOR! It is your property as the Supreme Court has stated repeatedly. Irwin Schiff mentions one case in the documentary.

The States CAN NOT tax your personal property, your car, boat, motorcycle, lawn mower and so on. You paid tax on it when you purchased it. They can not tax it again, but they do, and we are stupid enough, well some of you, to continue to pay that tax.

I do not have "tabs" on my motorcycle or auto. I have been stopped 3 times, explained the law and State Constitution articles to the officer and stated I was filing suit against the state for "Constructive Fraud" for violating my property rights and my civil liberties. They seem amazed and do not want to deal with it, so they let me go. I am sure I will run into a rogue officer one day and that will change but we will see.

The FREE public way is just that, Free. Without purchase or restriction such as a license, which I do not have either. That is a free public way.

As for the amount of people not paying income tax, it is estimated to be well over 100 million, it was about 60 million back in 1998.

We all must do our part and stop giving in to these thugs and pyschopathic morons in government. If we all took our plates OFF our auto's what could they do? Tow everyone? And where would they put all those vehicles?

Same with the income tax, if we all claimed exempt what could they do, arrest all of us. Maybe, they have enough prisons now, or "internment camps", but that is a gamble we must take.


reply posted on 5-8-2009 @ 05:16 PM by RolandBrichter
reply to post by daddio


Yes, "Goodbye April 15th" is a good book....Also might want to check out Larkin Rose...larkinrose.com Larkin has a book called "Kicking the Dragon"....In it, he tells his story of how he tried the 861 argument and they put him in prison for it, but his research and conclusions are indisputable...

Yes, any way you slice it, NOWHERE in the tax code does it state that private US citizens are required to pay federal income tax....in fact, it CLEARLY states the opposite


[edit on 5-8-2009 by RolandBrichter]


reply posted on 5-8-2009 @ 05:17 PM by 1 4M 7H3 1
To whoever mentioned the figure of 100 million who do not pay taxes...is that a number you conjured up? I hope you realize that's a third of the country. It is impossible that a third of the country does not pay taxes. If there were 100 million people revolting against the system in that fashion, I'm pretty sure all of us would be aware of it. A more accurate figure would probably be to the tune of around 2 million. And IMO a large portion of those 2 million are simply selfish because they refuse to contribute their share to our constantly accumulating debt and don't care about ending income tax for the rest of the country. In order for real reform to be efficacious, the number of these revolutionary tea-party "activisits" would have to at least triple, then congregate and flood the streets of DC. I don't think that is a plausible option. Better yet, we could inundate our Congress representatives' voicemails/inboxes, urging them to consider legislation that would significantly reduce government spending. Other alternatives include terminating the mandatory social security program and creating a required personal finance/economics course for all high school seniors that provides students with a general background in personal financial responsibility to prepare for future tasks such as balancing budgets and investing in 401ks or other retirement programs. There are too many financially illiterate Americans in this country, and we are a nation of consumers that, like our govt, spend spend spend. If we could purge from ourselves the need to purchase, maybe many of our national economic woes would be resolved with much ease.


reply posted on 5-8-2009 @ 05:28 PM by die_another_day
reply to post by daddio


Hold on, you're saying that if I don't have American citizenship I don't have to follow those "laws?"


reply posted on 5-8-2009 @ 06:11 PM by js331975
Or we can hang a few politicians. Pull thier names out of a hat and hang them on the steps to the capital.

Originally posted by 1 4M 7H3 1
To whoever mentioned the figure of 100 million who do not pay taxes...is that a number you conjured up? I hope you realize that's a third of the country. It is impossible that a third of the country does not pay taxes. If there were 100 million people revolting against the system in that fashion, I'm pretty sure all of us would be aware of it. A more accurate figure would probably be to the tune of around 2 million. And IMO a large portion of those 2 million are simply selfish because they refuse to contribute their share to our constantly accumulating debt and don't care about ending income tax for the rest of the country. In order for real reform to be efficacious, the number of these revolutionary tea-party "activisits" would have to at least triple, then congregate and flood the streets of DC. I don't think that is a plausible option. Better yet, we could inundate our Congress representatives' voicemails/inboxes, urging them to consider legislation that would significantly reduce government spending. Other alternatives include terminating the mandatory social security program and creating a required personal finance/economics course for all high school seniors that provides students with a general background in personal financial responsibility to prepare for future tasks such as balancing budgets and investing in 401ks or other retirement programs. There are too many financially illiterate Americans in this country, and we are a nation of consumers that, like our govt, spend spend spend. If we could purge from ourselves the need to purchase, maybe many of our national economic woes would be resolved with much ease.



reply posted on 5-8-2009 @ 06:30 PM by baddmove
reply to post by breakingdradles
Even after watching this movie..most of us are scared to not file..i owe the IRS 2500$ for not having my unemployment taxed..but my family needed to eat..now what do i do?


reply posted on 5-8-2009 @ 06:51 PM by Xtinguish
reply to post by baddmove


They will probably offer you a payment plan.

DO NOT take any one's advice that tells you to attempt the income taxes are illegal card. Granted they very may well be, but convincing a judge he should let you off because of it is something else.

Your going to have to deal with them. Perhaps try some firms that specialize in income taxes. I hear some can get what is owed lowered significantly.


reply posted on 5-8-2009 @ 07:16 PM by Maxmars
Originally posted by baddmove
reply to post by breakingdradles
Even after watching this movie..most of us are scared to not file..i owe the IRS 2500$ for not having my unemployment taxed..but my family needed to eat..now what do i do?



You are in no position to express dissent on this issue. Sad though it may be, you must accept that they have the power to compel you to do something you would rather not (pay income tax).

There is no honor in folly. Pay it, settle with them, get a legal aid, but do not simply take it on 'internet faith' that you should not pay your taxes. If you are the least bit uncertain do not travel that path... it is not for the meek - all the more shameful that our government fosters this fiscal abuse.
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