It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

Ron Paul: Cash for Clunkers hurts the poor

page: 2
3
<< 1   >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Aug, 5 2009 @ 12:09 PM
link   
Of course not everyone can get a loan! That's the way it should be!
First people gripe about unqualified people getting loans, the they gripe because they can't?
This program doesn't benefit me personally, but from the overwhelming response by the public, it obviously does for some buyers. How can you deny that?
As for "perfectly good engines" being destroyed, so freakin what? there are literally MILLIONS of replacements. Check VIN's why? What good comes from the added cost of doing so? Ever buy a classic car? VIN's are faked all the time.
If you went by VIN alone, Chrysler must have made at least 500,000 Hemi Road Runners and Cudas!




posted on Aug, 5 2009 @ 12:23 PM
link   
Has anyone here tried to borrow any of those billions of dollars Obama gave to banks?

If you want to accurate, say Obama AND GW Bush. And almost all of Congress. Or did you forget last fall?



posted on Aug, 5 2009 @ 12:42 PM
link   
reply to post by OldDragger
 



Originally posted by OldDragger
Uh, as I said, the same vehicle could be sold or traded for government cash multiple times.


Ever hear of a VIN? Very easy to prevent that which you purport.



Obama did not nationalize anything. Did he force GM and Chrysler to come begging for public subsidies? No. What he did was brilliant capitalism. Hey, you want billions from me, my first stipulation is controlling interest in your company.


The federal gov't has no business being in the auto business.

That is, unless you are a socialist or a communist.

And Obama undermined capitalism. Worst case, GM would have gone bankrupt without Barry interfering and blowing billions of our dollars.

So Barry gives them billions of our dollars, and what happens anyway?

GM went bankrupt.


But in the process, they suckered Obama for nearly a hundred billion dollars.



Ford did not come calling, Obama hasn't "nationalized" them.


And Ford is doing better that GM or Chrysler. Ford was smart enough to say "No thanks" to Obama.


If you are just going to oppose "Baracks" programs just because his administration thought of it, at least be honest about it.


I oppose him because he is a socialist. I hope he fails.

[edit on 5-8-2009 by jsobecky]



posted on Aug, 5 2009 @ 02:47 PM
link   
reply to post by OldDragger
 


A few posts ago you said something about you don't have to trade in your '82 Cutlass if you don't want too. Well, you wouldn't get money for it because it's too old. Too clunkerish for the program, or maybe it's deemed a "classic".

Anyway you keep saying that there isn't a shortage of used cars for sale... I hate to say it but there is a shortage of good, working, used cars! Have you ever tried to find a decent used car? It's really hard! First you have to find something you like, then it has to have everything right about it.

A couple years ago I was looking for a new car because the current one I had (1991 Audi 80, 170k miles) was falling apart. The first car I found was a 2004 Chevy Cavalier and my god that car was a dog! My current Corolla could run circles around that thing, plus the interior of the Chevy was all plastic and cheap. Then we came to a 2000 Chevy Camaro. Now that was better but still the interior was complete crap, things were cracked in the plastic, but it was overall a better car. Still it cost about 4k and we didn't have the money to shell out for it. Eventually we found my 1967 Mustang which needed some work but hey it's a classic, plus the parts are cheap and its easy to work on. It's so hard to find a decent used car with a decent price tag.



posted on Aug, 5 2009 @ 03:47 PM
link   

Originally posted by OldDragger
You also make the assumption that people are buying a car "they can't afford".You don't know that to be true.
You also site $9500 in debt. Thats really not much money. Maybe to very young people, but not to most over 30.
I'm really sick of the adoration of RP on this site. People treat every word he says as gold, but he's really just a crank super far right Republican.
Only in Texas!



Don't forget interest... How many people do you think are being fleeced with high interest rates as part of this? It's obvious a lot of our fellow citizens don't understand interest based on our previous experience with owning a home being a god given right.



posted on Aug, 5 2009 @ 03:55 PM
link   
Since when has "free money" from the gov't ever benefited the individual? Since tax revenue is in it's steepest decline since the great depression (finance.yahoo.com...) where are all of these billions of dollars coming from? The frist billion is already gone, they're talking about another 2 billion, and after that? Do we keep on printing more and more money in the guise of "helping the consumer"?



posted on Aug, 5 2009 @ 04:09 PM
link   
Most car loans are 0 % right now.
As with ANY loan, it's up to the buyer to determine what they can afford.
And who said anything about "free money"? Not me.
Not one of you will answer what I asked. Are people BUYING CARS? Is money moving again? ATS is always big on criticism and cynicism, low on any constructive ideas. If you have a great idea, let's hear it.
Spare me the free market corporate BS. Unfettered capitalism suffers from the same defect as communism. Human greed.
I tend to favor those who take action, not just complaining. I CARE about this Nation and it's citizens, I want people working, I want America to succeed.
Idealouges have gotten us into a lot of trouble the last few years, how about practical solutions?



posted on Aug, 5 2009 @ 04:09 PM
link   
Most car loans are 0 % right now.
As with ANY loan, it's up to the buyer to determine what they can afford.
And who said anything about "free money"? Not me.
Not one of you will answer what I asked. Are people BUYING CARS? Is money moving again? ATS is always big on criticism and cynicism, low on any constructive ideas. If you have a great idea, let's hear it.
Spare me the free market corporate BS. Unfettered capitalism suffers from the same defect as communism. Human greed.
I tend to favor those who take action, not just complaining. I CARE about this Nation and it's citizens, I want people working, I want America to succeed.
Idealouges have gotten us into a lot of trouble the last few years, how about practical solutions?



posted on Aug, 5 2009 @ 06:02 PM
link   

Originally posted by OldDragger
As for "perfectly good engines" being destroyed, so freakin what? there are literally MILLIONS of replacements. Check VIN's why? What good comes from the added cost of doing so?

Added cost? They have set up a website that already records all sorts of detailed information about the buyer, the dealer, and the car.

You know, you are right, seizing an engine is so much easier than simply checking the information you should already have on file.


Originally posted by OldDragger
Ever buy a classic car? VIN's are faked all the time.

Isn't an issue then since the Clunkers program only deals with cars built since they started using bar-coded (harder to fake) VIN labels.

Jon



posted on Aug, 5 2009 @ 06:25 PM
link   
reply to post by OldDragger
 



Not one of you will answer what I asked. Are people BUYING CARS? Is money moving again?


Gov't money. Money that isn't there. Money that puts us further into debt.

It's a further continuation of a Fool's Game, being played with Monopoly money.



posted on Aug, 5 2009 @ 06:39 PM
link   
reply to post by OldDragger
 


If the main motive behind this program is to stimulate sales increasing revenue for the auto industry, why would it be fraud if the dealerships were allowed to sell the clunkers for a profit?

Sorry, but destroying consumer goods that have a market value under the false guise of protecting the environment is a waste and counter productive to improving the economy.



posted on Aug, 5 2009 @ 06:47 PM
link   
I suggest all you concerned citizens call your Congresspeople and put Oldsmobiles, Pontiacs and Plymouths on the endangered species lists.
Your concern for the welfare of, not only the poor driving public, but the aging American car is........touching.
Or, you just despise Obama.



posted on Aug, 5 2009 @ 07:11 PM
link   

Originally posted by OldDragger
Not one of you will answer what I asked. Are people BUYING CARS? Is money moving again?


I am left wondering:
How many cars does it take to lower the price of food to pre-economic-disaster levels?

How many people have to buy cars before the default rate on mortgages declines greatly?

How many cars have to be sold before Sony starts making a profit off of the PlayStation 3?

Oh! You mean to tell me that people buying cars doesn't actually effect anything of any great importance to our economy, society, or planet? Who'd a thunk it?


Originally posted by OldDragger
ATS is always big on criticism and cynicism, low on any constructive ideas. If you have a great idea, let's hear it.


My great idea was so simple it would never have happened.

Let GM go bankrupt and none of this bull# would have been an issue.

You can save the US by rekindling her extinguished sense of discovery, creation, and invention. Let the existing frozen private capital in this country thaw. By providing low-cost manufacturing equipment, factories, and labor, the bankruptcy of GM would have triggered a massive investment into new manufacturing ventures.

From GM's ashes we would have had dozens of new vehicle, industrial equipment, and alternative energy manufacturing upstarts.

Jon



posted on Aug, 5 2009 @ 07:29 PM
link   
reply to post by TheWalkingFox
 


It's not that difficult really. Although it takes a bit of mental exercise on your part, IF you are willing to put forth the effort.


He was referring people who got ARMs and bought homes through legislation known as "Community Reinvestment Act". The "Community Reinvestment" act was a mandate which forced Banks to set aside a portion of capital and to provide it to those that do not meet normal lending standards. These people tended to be poor and usually of minority ethnicity and of course since this was a POLITICAL law enacted in order to correct perceived wrongs done to certain ethnic groups. Namely minorities, it would help them buy homes.

NOW....this law as it turns out, and as Ron Paul points-out in the video was counterproductive. These people that got the ARMs through programs such as the "Community Reinvestment Act" were the most hurt, as a result of the housing bubble being burst.

Guess who was mostly hurt...poor minorities THEY AS IT TURNS OUT LOST THE MOST. They have lost their homes and have ruined what little credit they once had, due to the government meddling in credit markets. And enticing these people with LOANS they couldn't possibly PAY.

He then gives the analogy that giving taxpayer dollars to buy cars will only be counter productive. Which it is. Decent cars which only poor people could normally afford will now be destroyed. Taking away the choices for poor people to purchase a decent used car to help them get around.

Hopefully you get it....let me know if you still need help, understanding.

[edit on 5-8-2009 by Gateway]



posted on Aug, 5 2009 @ 07:47 PM
link   
Disgusting video of the destruction of a perfectly good car

Watch this video. A perfectly good, usable Volvo engine is destroyed. Engine oil drained and replaced with liquid glass, then the engine is revved until it is destroyed.

This car is in fine shape. Many working stiffs and students would love to have it.

Where's the sanity in destroying it???

The only reason it was destroyed is to force the clown cars upon us as part of Obama's green agenda.





new topics

top topics



 
3
<< 1   >>

log in

join