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Guard troops may be needed in troubled Ala. county

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posted on Aug, 4 2009 @ 02:53 PM
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Guard troops may be needed in troubled Ala. county


www.miamiherald.com

By JAY REEVES
Associated Press Writer
BIRMINGHAM, Ala. -- The sheriff in Alabama's most populous county may call for the National Guard to help maintain order, a spokesman said Tuesday, after a judge cleared the way for cuts in the sheriff's budget and hopes dimmed for a quick end to a budget crisis.

Circuit Judge Joseph L. Boohaker ruled that leaders in Jefferson County - now trying to head off a municipal bankruptcy filing of historic proportions - could go ahead with plans to slash $4.1 million from the budget of Sheriff Mike Hale, who had filed a lawsuit that temporarily blocked spe
(visit the link for the full news article)




posted on Aug, 4 2009 @ 02:53 PM
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Well this is a novel way to introduce the National Guard and Military to a Law Enforcement role without having to declare Marshall Law on a wide scale level. The County or Municipality, or State just needs to not be able to pay traditional Law Enforcement personnel because of budgetary short falls and to withdraw them from the street and create a vacuum.

It’s also a great way to keep Civilian Local Law Enforcement from standing up too or rebelling against State or Federal Military Law Enforcement being imposed one a domestic local level. They just need to be sent home without their badges, guns or pay and that takes care of that!

What a world.


www.miamiherald.com
(visit the link for the full news article)



posted on Aug, 4 2009 @ 02:56 PM
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About 1,000 county workers already are on unpaid leave because courts threw out a key county tax, and Hale has warned that reductions to his budget would mean fewer patrols by deputies and decreased courthouse security.

A spokesman for Hale, Randy Christian, said the sheriff told Gov. Bob Riley after the ruling that state assistance may be needed to perform basic law enforcement tasks once the department's current funding is exhausted in early September.

"We will certainly be looking at calling in the National Guard," said Christian.


Certainly sounds convenient too? One call does it all, and you too can have automatic weapons toting military personnel patrolling your quiet streets!

Your tax dollars hard at work! The military for the people, bailouts for the bankers!



posted on Aug, 4 2009 @ 03:22 PM
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Jefferson County in Alabama has been facing some tough Economic times. About 16 months ago, the county was devalued by S&P and Moody's to Junk bond status. 15 months ago the County defaulted on it's bonds and missed their opportunity to file a Chapter 9 Bankruptcy.

If you think Detroit Michigan is facing some tough Economic hardships, you haven't seen Birmingham Alabama and the rest of Jefferson County.

Having to lay off 2,000 County Employees immediately after putting 1,000 County Employees on Administrative Leave without pay. When you are financially broke and can't file for Bankruptcy protection from your creditors, there isn't much else you can do.

The biggest problem, however, is that Birmingham has always been a city built on injustice. You used to have "Dynamite Hill" in Birmingham, but since the Civil Rights Movement, the entire city has become a Powder Keg waiting to go off.

And this won't be the first time the National Guard has had to be used in Birmingham (just as it often has to be called out in Atlanta Georgia just as many times for similar reasons). However, National Guard is different from Federal Troops. The National Guard is made up of local people who are from and live in that area. It isn't quite the same as using Federal Troops, but it is bad enough to spark the racial tensions that exist in Birmingham into something far more explosive.

However, you do bring up a very valuable point...What do the States do when the Municipalities are financially unable to pay their Police to Maintain the Peace? What can they do other than call out the National Guard? And what happens when the States are unable to financially pay to Maintain the Peace? I've said it before on other threads and I'll say it here again...there is a big difference between a Local Civilian Agency that is accountable to a Local Body of Elected Representatives and a National Military that is is accountable to only their Chain of Command. Hope this isn't a sign of the times.

S&F for you, OP!



posted on Aug, 4 2009 @ 03:23 PM
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reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler
 


This is what the national guard does though.

It's part of their mission.

We used to have them around during really bad winters supporting the police efforts as well as helping to direct traffic and get folks supplies.


What's really concerning is that many places no longer have a national guard because they are in Iraq or Afghanistan.

Those which do, have war scarred PTSD infected soldiers...

I don't think they can ever go back to being national guardsmen after having been in that kind of fog of war...


[edit on 4-8-2009 by HunkaHunka]



posted on Aug, 4 2009 @ 03:27 PM
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"About 1,000 county workers already are on unpaid leave because courts threw out a key county tax"

Well, good! Fewer taxes, less government! surely jefferson County is set to become a utopia!

..Wait... You mean the right is wrong? Nooooo!



posted on Aug, 4 2009 @ 03:29 PM
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reply to post by TheWalkingFox
 


Small gov is great until there is no one to enforce the law!





posted on Aug, 4 2009 @ 03:30 PM
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I am really getting sick and tired of hearing about these abuses of power and the sheer willingness by government to have soldiers patrolling our streets and neighborhood. There has to be a line that should never be crossed and this is one of them. Only in extreme circumstances should these actions be permitted. I don't want to describe what an extreme circumstance is because I think our leaders should be able to figure that out with educations from Princeton, Harvard, and Yale.

This is crap, and that sheriff should be removed from office by whom ever has the authority to do so. If they don't have the money why aren't the citizens deputized; they used to do that in the west back in the 1800s. Lets call it a public service or collateral duty. Let the people police their own streets if they are strapped for cash. I am pretty sure since it's Alabama the people are trained in small arms. So I don't see any problem with this approach as a temporary fix. If the police need money, it's simple, raise taxes again! However, using armed military units to do policing should be the last alternative.



posted on Aug, 4 2009 @ 03:40 PM
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WOW, this is Birmingham!! This is not some small town, we are talking about 1 million plus living in this county!!

maps.google.com... &resnum=1



posted on Aug, 4 2009 @ 03:40 PM
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Everyone needs to take a deep breath here.

As hunka pointed out, this is what we have a National Guard for. It may be disquieting to some to see armed troops patrolling the streets, but it's a heck of a lot better that having armed thugs roaming the streets.

Right now there's a financial crisis that is affecting public safety. It should fill every American's heart with pride to have true citizen soldiers looking after them.

From my own experience in New Orleans (not Katrina), the NG is far less likely to abuse power than the police are.

This is a temporary problem and the NG is the way to go.


[edit on 2009/8/4 by GradyPhilpott]



posted on Aug, 4 2009 @ 03:48 PM
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Originally posted by fraterormus
Jefferson County in Alabama has been facing some tough Economic times. About 16 months ago, the county was devalued by S&P and Moody's to Junk bond status. 15 months ago the County defaulted on it's bonds and missed their opportunity to file a Chapter 9 Bankruptcy.

If you think Detroit Michigan is facing some tough Economic hardships, you haven't seen Birmingham Alabama and the rest of Jefferson County.

Having to lay off 2,000 County Employees immediately after putting 1,000 County Employees on Administrative Leave without pay. When you are financially broke and can't file for Bankruptcy protection from your creditors, there isn't much else you can do.

The biggest problem, however, is that Birmingham has always been a city built on injustice. You used to have "Dynamite Hill" in Birmingham, but since the Civil Rights Movement, the entire city has become a Powder Keg waiting to go off.

And this won't be the first time the National Guard has had to be used in Birmingham (just as it often has to be called out in Atlanta Georgia just as many times for similar reasons). However, National Guard is different from Federal Troops. The National Guard is made up of local people who are from and live in that area. It isn't quite the same as using Federal Troops, but it is bad enough to spark the racial tensions that exist in Birmingham into something far more explosive.

However, you do bring up a very valuable point...What do the States do when the Municipalities are financially unable to pay their Police to Maintain the Peace? What can they do other than call out the National Guard? And what happens when the States are unable to financially pay to Maintain the Peace? I've said it before on other threads and I'll say it here again...there is a big difference between a Local Civilian Agency that is accountable to a Local Body of Elected Representatives and a National Military that is is accountable to only their Chain of Command. Hope this isn't a sign of the times.

S&F for you, OP!



lucky for us, the people, the 2nd amendment allows us to maintain law ourselves if need be..



posted on Aug, 4 2009 @ 03:49 PM
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[edit on 4-8-2009 by hotrodturbo7]



posted on Aug, 4 2009 @ 03:50 PM
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Armed thugs already roam the streets, for the last 2+ decades! The police avoid those streets also.

Go to any ghetto in this nation, or inner city project, and tell me I am wrong. I dare you.

The police and national guard will not change that. Only education can change it. And guess what, no one has a clue how to pull that off.



posted on Aug, 4 2009 @ 03:52 PM
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The tax that the judge declared illegal was what the city of Birmingham called an occupational tax. Basically, if you worked within the city limits of Birmingham, you had to pay this tax. If I recall, I was taxed about $28 every paycheck. It was illegal and several judges before this had deemed it illegal and the city still collected it. It's about damn time someone finally put an end to it.

Now as far as the NG patrolling the streets, I don't see that happening. Birmingham is a big city and if anything, if there are any uprisings, the NG would respond to distinguish the situation. I highly doubt we will see full geared NG's with M-16's on the street corners.



posted on Aug, 4 2009 @ 03:53 PM
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Doesn't FEMA fly black helicopters?

I live north of Birmingham and at all times of the day I can pretty much look out and see a black FEMA helicopter flying over head, even at night to, but not much luck seeing them at night just hearing them. And this happens atleast 5-7 times a day. Maybe the national guard is a precursor to using something more. I know it's their job but this just doesn't seem right at the same time.



posted on Aug, 4 2009 @ 03:54 PM
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[edit on 4-8-2009 by hotrodturbo7]



posted on Aug, 4 2009 @ 03:58 PM
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reply to post by muzzleflash
 


I visited "Murder Row" before Katrina!! I had a friend that grew up in the housing projects there, but I ended up there by accident! Left pretty quickly once I realized where I was!

Two rival gangs running Two projects right across the street from one another and the deadliest real estate in America was a city road seperating them!! Visible from I-10, but nobody seemed to care.

Yes Armed gangs are nothing new, they are apparent all over the country. The NG did a pretty good job in NO though! I am just surprised that AL has any NG left in the country?!? I thought they were all in Iraq!

Maybe Blackwater can fill in. They got kicked out of Iraq, the armed gangs will surely notice that!



posted on Aug, 4 2009 @ 03:58 PM
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reply to post by hotrodturbo7
 


Lol, it would be impossible to take every gun from every person in Alabama, or Birmingham, Just about everyone I know down here owns atleast 3 guns. In my house alone we have 7 guns. And their is no way Alabamians would put up with that, we love our guns too much and would probably bust a cap in anyones ass who tried to take them.



posted on Aug, 4 2009 @ 03:58 PM
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reply to post by GradyPhilpott
 


I don't know, this feels like a stepping stone on the road to martial law.

I hope it isn't but this is how it would begin. What happens if more cities start going under. Will the NG be able to police them all ?

I'm not saying this will lead to ML just that this is how it would start.



posted on Aug, 4 2009 @ 03:58 PM
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[edit on 4-8-2009 by hotrodturbo7]



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