Necronomicon? What do you think?

Hello fellow users, I wasn't really sure where to put this thread but I guess this is where it's at.
I've been wondering what people think about the Necronomicon and whether anyone here believes in its existence or not, either way I will be interested to know why. I personally am doubtful of it having a true physical body in reality, but it does have one in the realms of our imagination, so what do you think, if you believe in it, the book really is? I don't know, but, as a sad, gullible(spell check) individual, I wish it to be so.
Is it an account of the events in Abdul Alhazred's life, that was written by him, containing many a spell and incantation? Or what?

Ramadwarf on Necronomic Literature

Oh and I am sorry if someone else has posted a thread on this subject before

[edit on 3-8-2009 by Ramadwarf Philes]

The Necronomicon is a fictional book created by HP Lovecraft as a plot device in his Call of Cthulu novels.

Pretty straight forward, I thought. I am not sure why people insist it is anything other than fictional. I have a paperback copy of it at home. Oh, and make sure you read the section about all the hoaxes regarding people who claim the book is real.

reply to post by TLomon


Yeah, I know, it's fiction, but what I'm doing is asking why so many people think it's a real thing. Just curious. Or whether anyone thinks there's anything like it in existence.

Ramadwarf on a reply

For lack of a better explanation, here is mine....

People want to believe. Like the people who insist dust are spheres, or hair over a lense is a level 3 astral being, or what ever. People believe what they want to believe and you can't change their mind because then you are a debunker or naysayer or disinfo agent, etc.

It's fiction. It is well documentated as a work of fiction. People who claim otherwise are, for lack of a better word, fan boys.

These fall in the same category as people who believe samurai swords were folded millions of times (folded, not having that many folds), and simply make up facts that they dont' want to believe.

I could go on and on giving examples if you like.

The reason people think the book exists is because a lot of books under the name of the necronomicon have been released since the days of Lovecraft. Some of them are "magickal tomes" and others are like fake gothic bibles. And what TLomon said, people want to believe in something.

I've read my share of Lovecraft, I think the guy caught on to something personally, on some level. BUT the necronomicon doesn't exist, nor does the plateu of leng, nor do shoggoths.

Are you sure about shoggoths?

It was a terrible, indescribable thing vaster than any subway train – a shapeless congeries of dust bunnies, faintly self-luminous, and with myriads of M&Ms melted and un-melted as pustules of greenish candy hue all over the floor, covering the frantic penguins and slithering over the glistening floor that it and its kind had swept so evilly free of all litter.

Oh wait, that was me cleaning under my daughter's bed.

reply to post by Ramadwarf Philes


It's an invention of Mr. Lovecraft's for his Cthulu mythos that some people have decided is real.....

I know this, I'm hoping for someone to tell me why THEY believe it, if there is no one then that's it.
Ooh, by the way, has anyone actually tried any of the spells/incantations?

Ramadwarf on feeling ignorant

The mythology behind the Necronomicon has become far greater than the reality.

Add to this the fact that Occultists have a wicked sense of humor, this running joke has made the Necronomicon into perhaps one of the greatest perpetuated hoaxes of the 20th century.

First of all, as others have pointed out, the Necronomicon was a Literary Device that H.P. Lovecraft used along with other works mentioned in his stories such as De Vermis Mysteriis and the Book of Eibon, both of which are non-existent works. This is common, especially to the Horror genre. Edgar Allen Poe did this all the time (and was probably the inspiration for Lovecraft). You even see it in Biblical Literature (like references to the Book of Jasher being but one example).

The first published version of the Necronomicon looked like a strange Arabic text. In reality, it was the same 8 pages from an Arabic Cookbook reprinted in random sequences, upside down and mirrored, etc. Since not many people in the West read Arabic, it passed as authentic for quite some time, and got the myth of the Necronomicon rolling.

The Simon version of the Necronomicon is fake. It isn't even Sumerian. However, it is modeled after many typical Medieval Grimoires, but it is far more erroneous than even those were. The Necronomicon it certainly isn't. It isn't even a working Sumerian Grimoire. Not only do I know this from scrutinizing the text, but I know "Simon" who supposedly was delivered the text by a mysterious monk who knocked on his door.

At this point, every Occult writer had to make their own version of the Necronomicon, outdoing previous hoax attempts. The Hayes version of the Necronomicon was far more believable, having been co-written by some great Occult and Scholarly minds, such as Robert Turner. With an introduction by Colin Wilson and David Langford, they never thought that anyone would actually take it serious as something other than a work of fiction.

Geiger's Necronomicon is pretty...but it is clear that it is just a tribute of artwork inspired by the myth.

As for Donald Tyson's version...don't even get me started on Tyson and his other Occult writings...it's still a hack job, but it's a better hack job than he has personally ever done previously. It was inevitable that Tyson would jump on the Necronomicon train eventually and produce his own forgery of this mythological text.

As far as the supposedly "historical" references to the Necronomicon, they don't exist. They were all fabricated in recent years by fans to make it appear that it had existed in various places and times.

Magick might be real, but the Necronomicon isn't.

[edit on 3-8-2009 by fraterormus]

because people put so much energy and will into the necronomicon and it's beings, it is very real for some. after all, not much is needed to give life to a idea. a little focused energy, a lot of will power, and tons of TLC is all thats needed. well, that and the belief that the necronomicon is a valid system in that persons world view.

it makes no difference if someone else thinks it's "not real."

cheers,
AA

i LOVE when someone says something like my system is real, yours is not. there is no possible way to show how close minded a person is than a statement like that.
[edit on 3-8-2009 by anonamousantichrist]

[edit on 3-8-2009 by anonamousantichrist]

Originally posted by Ramadwarf Philes
I know this, I'm hoping for someone to tell me why THEY believe it, if there is no one then that's it.
Ooh, by the way, has anyone actually tried any of the spells/incantations?

Ramadwarf on feeling ignorant

some have said that they beings are quite substantial and easily summoned (no more or less than any other system). however, nothing else was used but the name and sigil of the beings.

that said, they could be "real" because they have many names depending on the culture. often, the beings name will change from system to system but the essence of the being remains the same.

meditation on a particular being and it's sigil could be one way to find hidden attributes that will point you in the right direction.

[edit on 3-8-2009 by anonamousantichrist]

Yeah, well, you have to remember that just because the Necronomicon may not exist (keeping open text), it doesn't mean that something like it doesn't right? I mean it's already been said that Magick(?) may exist, so why can't it be written in a form similar to that of the necronomicon?

I'm gonna confess, there is some teenyweeny part of me that says: It may exist in some form, under some name, somewhere, maybe not here, but somewhere. Now now, I'm not saying I'm right, in fact, in all honesty, I reckon I'm wrong misguided by my desperation for something more than what we know.

I own the Simon edition of the book, and the spellbook and gate of the necronomicon, all Simon editions. I have tried all the spells, even the ritual stuff from the spellbook, and I must tell you that one of them does work. Not, I know, because there is some mystical power within the words composed in a piece of fiction, but maybe because of desperation.

It's just looking for a way out I guess. A way into something that interests me and you so greatly in fiction, be it textual or visual.

Ramadwarf on admitting to a secret 'shame'

There are many genuine Magical Grimoires from history. The Picatrix of pseudo-Majriti is perhaps the most infamous and one of the inspirations for the Necronomicon. However all Magical Grimoires are incomplete (Grimoire is Latin for "Grammar Book") and assume a certain amount of practical occult knowledge on behalf of the reader.

If you are truly interested in Magic Grimoires, the Twilit Grotto - Esoteric Archives has perhaps the largest collection of Magic Grimoires available online. Joseph Peterson is a Scholar of the highest caliber and his life's work in the cataloging and referencing of Grimoires in Western Occultism has been invaluable to the esoteric community.

Grimoires: A History of Magic Books by Owen Davies published by Oxford Press is a good scholastic read into the history of these texts.

Unlocked Books: Manuscripts of Learned Magic in the Medieval Libraries of Central Europe by Benedek Lang published by Penn State University Press is another good one.

The Secret Lore of Magic by Idries Shah was an excellent survey of Magic Grimoires for it's time, but is outdated by modern standards (and it is Out of Print and hard to find any way).

I personally wouldn't recommend Arthur Edward Waite's The Book of Black Magic as not only is this book grossly outdated, scholastically inept, but Waite also had a definite Victorian Christian bias that is far too prominent in this book.

Thankyou, I'll look into that link in depth at some point soon. It is much appreciated. I am looking forward to finding out some stuff from this thing, so once again, thankyou!

Ramadwarf on the link