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Media on abuse in Iraq

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posted on May, 10 2004 @ 06:33 PM
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I'll start off by saying that I don't like the abuse that we've seen of our prisoners and now for the BUT. But why is it now that the general population jumps on the bandwagon and says how the hell can this happen? Most of you must know of the slaughters that have happened in previous wars that would make what the media have shown us in Iraq look like a minor infraction. I won't post about previous wars but they are on the net for you to find and read. What I'm getting at is that the media finds way to exploit the attention of viewers around the world into a frenzy to benefit themselves. The media is what runs the country. The media posts the pics and runs the story on the obtainees and what happens? Our gov't must respond. The media made our gov't move and take action. The gov't must now do what they believe the people of America would want to happen to our men and women who had to go to that terrible country to fight a war. We now have the capability to see what really happens around the world because of current technology and we see what's happening in Iraq. Imagine if you could have seen what we did in Vietnam and you would understand why this current ride on the bandwagon throws me a little. War does things to men and women in war. If you believe for a sec that these soldiers who were seen the pics are bad people then you are mistaken. You should try what they have done and tell me differently. Like I said at the beginning....I know it's not right for a person to be treated in that manner and I feel for all involved...the obtainees and the soldiers.




posted on May, 10 2004 @ 06:56 PM
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Thanks, for that I See YOu.
It frightens me to think that the media and the internet is as involved in this war as it is. I know it was inevitable.
But, I truly shudder to think what would have happened in WWII if everything was this P.C. and we had the internet.
Do ya thing we'd be speaking German or Japanese?

War is horrendous. The people who go to war are forever changed. I am not excusing these people. But, I will not judge them either.



posted on May, 10 2004 @ 07:30 PM
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It seems as though the more information we have....the worse it gets. How often does the media cycle good news? The course of the war could and may be changed by this and it will get worse...much worse before it gets better.



posted on May, 10 2004 @ 07:59 PM
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How the hell is it jumping on a bandwagon to ask why this is happening?!?!
In my opinion this type of revelation is exactly what the media was invented for in the first place.



By I See You
Our gov't must respond. The media made our gov't move and take action. The gov't must now do what they believe the people of America would want to happen to our men and women who had to go to that terrible country to fight a war. We now have the capability to see what really happens around the world because of current technology and we see what's happening in Iraq.


Exactly.

If this information had not come to light it is likely that very little if not anything would have been done about the situation, whereas now the abuse will cracked down upon and stopped. Youll say well what about the troops placed in danger by these revelations? Well I care about the victims of torture as well as the troops. The commanders of the troops are responsible for the actions of the soldiers. The higher reaches of the command structure have known about this abuse for two years and yet have done nothing until now, solely because it has been reported in the media. The troops with no part in the affair have only their commanders to blame for their increased danger, not the media. If the commanders had taken action when this first came to light then there wouldnt be the scandal there is now, and the victims of torture have the media to thank for putting an end to it.

Just think what could have been stopped from happening during Vietnam not to mention domestic improprieties if we had the technology we have now! With the internet especially all sorts of government lies are being blown open, and far more people know about them than ever would before. I really can't see how stopping atrocities and bringing people out of ignorance is a bad thing, and I find it hard to believe on a site like this people would rather government fallacies were covered up.



posted on May, 10 2004 @ 08:21 PM
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First of all I am almost afraid to post here, after threats via e-mail from another thread I started here at ATS... But I will not be silent!

Fine, lets say this is all the media's fault, and just look the other way... Does that make sense to anyone here?

Lets just sweep it under the rug before anyone finds out... Is that a rational way to think?

Sure it is, if you feel shame and wish to hide from the truth or worse hide the truth from others.

The media did not fake or create this story, they could not have made anything up like this in their wildest dreams.

I am happy we live in an age where truths like this can be exposed.. god only knows what would have happened if they had been able to hide this from the world and the media.

And really there still could be a great deal we do not know about this evolving shame on our nation.

I'd say the jury is still out.. but there is no jury seated yet.

The reason we seem to be jumping on the bandwagon is simple... it shows that most of the civil world is outraged by what they have seen... it is a pure human reaction to a shameful issue.

Ironic?

Maybe.. But the reality is we will have to deal with this for a long time to come.. and I guess you can look for ways it could have been covered up, but is that not kind of pathetic?

Hitler was able to hide his unspeakable acts from the world for quite a long time and look what he was able to do!

Do not blame the media.. Thank them.. and be proud we do live in an age where information and TRUTH can come to you from all over the world at the speed of light!

Had this happened 65 years ago what do you think the world would have ever known of it?... How far would it have gone?

I would like to thank the media for bringing me the truth.. and a big
to ATS and ATSNN for staying on top of this issue!

Gazz


PS, If I vanish from the boards for more than a few days you can assume the worst...lol



posted on May, 10 2004 @ 08:33 PM
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Originally posted by I See You
...The media is what runs the country.
Even though the media is in the government's hip pocket and they omit a butt-load of pertinent information, they are still part of a free market. Every media outlet's primary purpose is to make money. If they determine that a great many of the people are concerned about one thing at the same time, they are going to capitalize on it. Media is making a killing off this issue, make no mistake. This is actually the only thing that is keeping the media from being essentially government owned and operated. The people are always the thread from which the media hang.

I still think the government is controlling the advertising market on the news stations because you see so many financial and banking commercials. Seems to me ol' GW might be engaging in a last ditch effort to make the economy look a little better before the elections.



posted on May, 10 2004 @ 08:44 PM
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Gazz you are swimming in shame along with you compatriots and thats your choice as a free citizen, just don't tell me to feel that way because its my right to.

Your glorification of the media and internet fails to adress the position and possibly further lives lost because of the way this story was RE-BROKEN by who was it CBS, What 10,40,100 bad apples reported in a sensational manner all over the world accomplishes is to make 134,900 other soldiers face increased danger until this war is over - is that right? is fair to tell the family of a soldier killed by a maddend insurgent tough luck it was all the superiors fault? I can not accept that as a valid or logical point, I consider it a selfish point of someone with nothing to lose, by playing this up to the current frenzy that it has reached. Do you have any compassion at all for our troops that are doing the right thing over there?

There is a right time and a right place to deal with problems like this, I for one cannot justify endangering American soldiers just so the left can get their satisfaction - its as sickening as the original problem only this time the left can get American soldiers blood on their hands as well.



posted on May, 10 2004 @ 09:12 PM
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Phoenix, so it's 'leftist' now to report what's actually happening? I'm sure they'll take that as a compliment.

The story was 'rebroken' by the Red Cross and Amnesty International as they didn't want to let the U.S and U.K governments get away with pretending they only just found out about it, and neither do I. Wither you like it or not ultimately it is the commanders responsibility. Aren't superiors ultimately responsible for the actions of their troops? Isn't that what the whole command structure of the army is all about? The fact that they knew about it for two years and did nothing about when they could have stopped it happening very early on if not straight away should certainly give the troops families something to be angry about.

But of course you want to blame the messenger. I'm sure giving the families the world media to blame will give them a lot of comfort.


All I can see from those that are opposed to this coming out is that they are angry simply because the government they support has been exposed as lying. Sad really.



posted on May, 10 2004 @ 09:14 PM
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Originally posted by Phoenix

Your glorification of the media and internet fails to adress the position and possibly further lives lost because of the way this story was RE-BROKEN by who was it CBS, What 10,40,100 bad apples reported in a sensational manner all over the world accomplishes is to make 134,900 other soldiers face increased danger until this war is over - is that right?


First of all, if I sound bitter or angry it is not because of this topic or your post, it is something else all together.. I have been told to shut up or else.

But by now you should know me better than that.

Now the danger that US forces face in Iraq does not seem to have changed much, in fact it would seem that there has been less Americans killed in Iraq since this story broke... don't believe me?... look for yourself.

It does not matter if it was one bad apple, 2 10 0r 5,000.. There is no way to explain it away, no way to lessen the impact of their actions.. For they acted as US soldiers, on duty, in uniform and also exposed a breakdown in the chain of command that may have gone all the way to the top.

I am sick of hearing all of the "war is hell and this is war" crap... If that makes you feel better about this situation, then I have to wonder just what kind of person you or anyone else that thinks that way is.

Dammit... this is America and I am damned proud to be an American born and raised... I also voted republican in the last election, and I did vote for Bush... but this is far beyond a political issue here.

That being said, I have the right and freedom to feel shame at the actions of our US military for the wrong done in the eyes of the world... and even more so for the possible implication that they tried to cover it all up.. as you and many other would have like to have seen happen.

We are humans for god's sake... we cannot act like this and expect to win a war... and damned sure it will not help anyone win an election on either side.

One day parents will have to explain all of this to their children... I have already had to talk to mine about it... and I learned more from their reaction to this than anywhere else.

After all it is their future that will be F'd up as a result of all of this... We just get to grow old and debate the issue.. they will be the ones who will actually have to deal with it.. and I sure as hell hope they do a BETTER job than we have.

Gazz



posted on May, 11 2004 @ 08:18 PM
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One of the great things about discussion forums is being able to read the opinions of others on a specific topic like the one I created here. It is great because it made me re-evaluate my thinking on some of this matter. You have all made me think about things that I was not thinking about. All we can do now is wait and see what this will bring for all. Let's hope for the best. We must continue to support our troops even through this crisis.




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