It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

What will it take for you to Stop Believing!? (Deity)

page: 15
13
<< 12  13  14    16 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Aug, 4 2009 @ 07:08 AM
link   
reply to post by atlasastro
 






John 15:7, "If ye abide in me and my words abide in you, ye shall ask what ye will, and it shall be done unto you.
"

Well, I see no difference in this and the verses that I quoted earlier, quitge clear "whatever" you pray for. the "abide in me and my words" appears to be not different to "believing that you have received" earlier quoted.


The fact remains however, that if as you an Jon have tried to imply, certain criteria has to be met for these promises to be fulfilled. Clearly no one is meeting the criteria, at least there is no testable evidence of praying to jesus "in the right way" actually has any effect.

Bearing in mind - We've been brought to this point in response to a poster, who is clearly distraught at having jesus not responding to his prayers. By all account the dude had followed the rules met the (overly complicated) criteria but still no appearance from jesus.

I have but asked that xtian posters get together in prayer and help the brother out, I personally don't care how the praying is done or how the criteria is met, that is entirely up to those adepts doing the praying.

So far there seems to be nothing but excuses for the inability of xtians to ask jesus to fulfill his promises and appear to this man, who clearly expected him to appear or at the very least help him out.


The whole situation strikes me not unlike some of the threads that go like -

"I've had contact by an alien who has informed me about their plans to land en mass "

When asked about the posters experience, the inevitable response is always - "I'm not allowed to tell you at this stage, it is beyond your understanding"





Over a period of time I have been accustomed to regular abusive hateful and threatening posts and U2Us from xtians. I was initially shocked that people that claim to be like the character jesus, get so spiteful and aggressive when asked to justify their beliefs.

I have got somewhat accustomed now to the level of hatred that arises from some and can only put this down to "Fragile faith Syndrome", what I find very sad though is that these people demonstrate very little understanding of the example set for them.



So when you pray moocowoman that all christian die, remember this:
[/quot]

This particular remark I find emotionally wrenching and it saddens me inside, I know you are fully aware that I do not pray, and I also know that you know, I do not wish death to be brought on upon anyone.

I have no doubt that you will make excuses and perhaps claim that I demonstrate hate toward xtians so obviously want them to die.

I have sometimes been asked why I don't spend as much time questioning Muslim beliefs. I don't really need to, the level of hate they are claimed to have toward the "caffers" is often (but not always) demonstrated in many xtian defensive responses when questioned, Hateful and somewhat paranoid.

I have debated some very decent people here on ATS that just happen to be xtian, and it has been a pleasure to exchange views and argue with them.

However, these individuals are in a minority and I find this scary, in that people are going about claiming to be compassionate and kind hearted demonstrate the complete opposite, when their faith is brought into question.

This sends me one clear message, that the faith/belief of these individuals is but a front and a very fragile one at that.

I very rarely observe this emotional issue in atheist posters, they sometimes can be aggressive and some can be hateful but on the whole they are few.

On the face of it xtianity would seem to have much to learn from jesus himself, perhaps xtians would do well to ensure they are in complete accord with jesus before inflicting themselves upon the rest of us.

There again, if xtians were in complete accord with jesus, they would probably not find it necessary, to inflict themselves on others.




posted on Aug, 4 2009 @ 07:34 AM
link   

Originally posted by moocowman
reply to post by atlasastro
 





It is important to note that Jesus himself prayed and asked God: "if it be possible, let this cup pass from me" (Matt. 26:39).


Clearly then, the fact that jesus questions the possibility makes it quite clear that he is not omnipresent and not one and the same entity as Yahweh.



Have you ever seen "Groundhogs day" with Bill Murray? Basically it's about a man who wakes up and lives the same day over and over and over and over except he is the only one who knows that he is experiencing the exact same day over and over again. No one else who he interacts with remembers that they have been living the same day over and over again, they think each day is new, but to this one man, it is an eternal day that never ends. He knows everything that could happen having seen it everyday since he "woke up" like this. He knows what time it will start raining, who will step infront of a car, who will be missed by bat, who will die.

At first he uses this to the advantage of the people, saving people from death, even pulling them out of the way of cars, but regardless, as soon as he goes to sleep, saved or unsaved, the same exact thing happens the next day. The only thing that isn't the same is him. He remembers every day, no one else does.

This is the like cup he is drinking and mankinds nudity revealed. When you can't view a new day, do you really want to wake up again?



posted on Aug, 4 2009 @ 07:41 AM
link   
reply to post by letthereaderunderstand
 





This is the like cup he is drinking and mankinds nudity revealed. When you can't view a new day, do you really want to wake up again?


That was a great thought provoking response, yes I've seen Goundhog Day, I shall not respond now because the depth of your response requires equally deep thought when time allows.

Thank you.

"Where there is no vision ----" Hmm



posted on Aug, 4 2009 @ 08:00 AM
link   

Originally posted by moocowman
reply to post by letthereaderunderstand
 





This is the like cup he is drinking and mankinds nudity revealed. When you can't view a new day, do you really want to wake up again?


That was a great thought provoking response, yes I've seen Goundhog Day, I shall not respond now because the depth of your response requires equally deep thought when time allows.

Thank you.

"Where there is no vision ----" Hmm



No thanks please, that is why we are here, to help one another.

Moccowoman, I just want you to know, your children love you...they are what Jesus, the name means.

I only hope that you will know that the name of Jesus, is an Idol, but the meaning is not, but rather is truth beyond truth, because it means "self existent salvation" the only salvation we can know....his fathers name....
Self existent. All names in religion mean so much more then the images attached to them. That is what people fight about all day long, who's image is right, but we are the image, so we are to not make up false images.

I see you fight this daily. I see you get upset only because I know who truly is in you. I only want you to know that the name isn't a religion or a "get out of jail card". It's truth as in all truth is its action. It does or it doesn't. Jesus the name is an action. He is in the flesh because every mankind is existent of self, therefore salvation only comes from producing, not carving another image....one begotten, each and every one the only begotten.

Peace always



posted on Aug, 4 2009 @ 08:44 AM
link   

Originally posted by moocowman
reply to post by atlasastro
 





It is important to note that Jesus himself prayed and asked God: "if it be possible, let this cup pass from me" (Matt. 26:39).


Clearly then, the fact that jesus questions the possibility makes it quite clear that he is not omnipresent and not one and the same entity as Yahweh.


Clearly to you, yes. But in reality no.

Hebrews 1:5 - I shall be to Him a Father and He shall be to Me a Son.

Matthew 3:17 - This is My beloved Son.

Matthew 16:16,17 - Thou art…the Son of God…My Father in heaven revealed this.

Matthew 17:5 - This is My beloved Son (spoken by God the Father - 2 Pet. 1:16-18).

John 3:16 - God gave His only-begotten Son.

John 5:17 - My Father has been working, and I work.

Romans 15:6 - Glorify God, even the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ.

2 Corinthians 1:3 - Blessed be God, even the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ.

1 John 1:3 - Have fellowship with the Father and with His Son Jesus Christ.

2 John 3 - Grace from God the Father and from Jesus Christ the Son of the Father.

2 John 9 - Abide in the teaching and have both the Father and the Son.

There is a clear distinction between Jesus and Yahweh.

But you could also ponder that Jesus was a Man. He lived as a Man. Although he was much more in a spiritual sense.
I doubt you would ponder that though.
Jesus asked that the Cup be taken from him. That was a possibility that could have happened, or course, but he also stated that that was his will that it be passed from him, and the fact that the will of God prevailed and Jesus acted as God willed shows that he was infact seperate from God.
Omniprescence is a funny conundrum I agree, but I think your over simplification and poor logic regarding exactly what that is and how it relates to Jesus in this circumstance needs futher investigation.
Off course you probably have other things to hate with your time.

I encourage you to investigate the omnipotent and omnipresent paradoxes. They only relate to God.
Jesus was distinctly seperate.
Agian for you education.
When Jesus was on the cross, the Father forsook Him (Matt. 27:46). When He died, He commended His spirit into His Father's hands (Luke 23:46).



posted on Aug, 4 2009 @ 10:18 AM
link   

Originally posted by moocowman


Well, I see no difference in this and the verses that I quoted earlier, quitge clear "whatever" you pray for. the "abide in me and my words" appears to be not different to "believing that you have received" earlier quoted.
The reason why you see no difference is because you believe there is a "whatever you can pray for". If you where to actually look at "what abiding by me and my words" means in the context Jesus said it in it would be clear, It is to me and I don't pray or practice religion.



The fact remains however, that if as you an Jon have tried to imply, certain criteria has to be met for these promises to be fulfilled. Clearly no one is meeting the criteria, at least there is no testable evidence of praying to jesus "in the right way" actually has any effect.
I am not implying anything. The words are there. I am just reading them.
How do you know no one is meeting the criteria? There are millions of testimonies out there. People pray they can endure many things or can recieve things like hope, strength, love, the will to live, all in their spirit, in who they are.
People pray for many things, but the reward is spiritual, and often most the end result of abiding by Jesus' words and actions are not for any material or worldly gains. That is what the words say to me.
How do you measure a person praying they can endure hardship.
How do you measure a person finding spiritual hope from prayer as the viscera dies.
How do you measure a person that discovers via prayer the will to forgive horrible wrongs commited upon.
I means are these not considered prayers answered Moocowoman?


Bearing in mind - We've been brought to this point in response to a poster, who is clearly distraught at having jesus not responding to his prayers. By all account the dude had followed the rules met the (overly complicated) criteria but still no appearance from jesus.
Well, I feel for the "dude". I can't find any references to Jesus making Appearances on Demand. Of course if this is the standard that you think applies in general to prayer and its rate of success then I understand why you have the opinion you do.



So far there seems to be nothing but excuses for the inability of xtians to ask jesus to fulfill his promises and appear to this man, who clearly expected him to appear or at the very least help him out.
That is not a prayer to me, that seems like a demand. But anyway, whatever. But you can take the mickey all you want, I guess people pray in different ways.
If you can point out the promise of Jesus' "ask and I shall appear" I would appreciate it.



The whole situation strikes me not unlike some of the threads that go like -

"I've had contact by an alien who has informed me about their plans to land en mass "

When........ it is beyond your understanding"
I agree, in fact I have started threads on the religious nature of a belief in ET's. Abstract and ambigious testimonies have no value to me.


Over a period of time I have been accustomed to regular abusive hateful and threatening posts and U2Us from xtians. I was initially shocked that people that claim to be like the character jesus, get so spiteful and aggressive when asked to justify their beliefs.
Have you ever considered that they do not hate you, they just hate what you do. I mean that seems to be OK for some people around here.
Anyway, If you can point out where I said I am Just like Jesus you might even have a point. I can easily justify my beliefs. I just generally don't need to create a large number of posts and threads questioning another belief(no seriously I am not looking at you, really) and expecting people to take it.


I have got somewhat accustomed now to the level of hatred that arises from some and can only put this down to "Fragile faith Syndrome", what I find very sad though is that these people demonstrate very little understanding of the example set for them.
If you could point out where I express hatred for you then I guess you might start making some sense.




So when you pray moocowoman that all christian die, remember this:


I thought that was pretty funny because I have read your other threads and obviously your signature begs to be poked. So I poked. Bingo.


This particular remark I find emotionally wrenching and it saddens me inside, I know you are fully aware that I do not pray, and I also know that you know, I do not wish death to be brought on upon anyone.
Really, saddened and emotionally wrenching. But apparently you are this too...

by moocowoman
Over a period of time I have been accustomed to regular abusive hateful and threatening posts.....

I have got somewhat accustomed now to the level of hatred that arises from some and can only put this down......
Well I apologize for emotionally wrenching and saddening you beyond that which you claim you are accustomed.


I have no doubt that you will make excuses and perhaps claim that I demonstrate hate toward xtians so obviously want them to die.
Sure. No doubt. Perhaps if you Hate what christians do, which is be christians. Then no, I don't need to point it out because you already do it for me. Cheers.
It is as stupid as claiming, I don't hate haters I just hate what haters do, umm which is hate, and umm I hate hate but umm I don't hate haters, just that I hate haters who hate, and not just a hater, just that I hate what haters do, and umm they hate, and I hate that.....lol.


I have debated some very decent people here on ATS that just happen to be xtian, and it has been a pleasure to exchange views and argue with them.

However, these individuals are in a minority and I find this scary, in that people are going about claiming to be compassionate and kind hearted demonstrate the complete opposite, when their faith is brought into question.
I am sure your questioning is done with intelligence, respect and grace, compassion, and understanding at all times moocowoman.
Like this thread.
Christianity is Finished in the UK"Thank God for That"

And here is your compassion and grace and understanding shining through.

No ones forcing you to debate, but I've got loony people shoving invisible gods and demons down my children throats, so I will bloody well debate these people.
I would hazard a guess that alot of U2U you get a probably replies to posts like this. LOL.
post by moocowman

How about this great debate.

jesus versus yoda

As there is more evidence for the reality of the Jedi than the Jesus god, should christianity be relegated to the genre of science fiction and Yoda be made a God with OB1 as his main prophet.

As Darth Vader created himself satanists should not feel left out in this new paradigm.
www.belowtopsecret.com...

Yeah I can see how you would want an intelligent and civilised discussion relating to the existence of God, or Jesus, or Yahweh.


This sends me one clear message, that the faith/belief of these individuals is but a front and a very fragile one at that.
Could be, could be, I have no doubt that in some cases it may just be a habit. But what is yours, a deep seated insucurity that they are not fragile or just providing a front, but that you need them to be? I mean that might be possible from reading your posts. Perhaps it is an irrational fear that your children will become christians. Perhaps you are afraid that they will question you and you will lose your authority over your own children if they accept God or Jesus as the one true father? Perhaps that is the fragile shell you are hiding. I could conclude that from some of your posts and threads.
I guess its easy to profile anyone anonymously on a forum to get a rise out of them due to a prejuduce or different belief. Just as easy as it is to infer with ambiguity based on just some personal experiences.


I very rarely observe this emotional issue in atheist posters, they sometimes can be aggressive and some can be hateful but on the whole they are few.
Well there are so few atheists, and why would an atheist get emotional over not having a belief and being challenged about not having a belief. LOL. Assinine. Infact on Evolution discussions I have participated in( i accept evolution in most parts but like many people have a few questions), Atheist are just as emotional as IDers. How many threads have you started challenging Atheists. 0 that is how many.
How many threads have you started comparing Atheism with fantasy(star wars), Zero.
How many atheists have you insulted or labled lunatics? 0.
No wonder you get on with them._javascript:icon('')


On the face of it xtianity would seem to have much to learn from jesus himself, perhaps xtians would do well to ensure they are in complete accord with jesus before inflicting themselves upon the rest of us.
I think everyone needs to learn alot from Jesus, he seemd to have some great Ideas.
If you could introduce me to any one person who seems to be perfect and like Jesus, I would appreciate that.


There again, if xtians were in complete accord with jesus, they would probably not find it necessary, to inflict themselves on others.
I guess that must be a problem for you. Believing people are inflicting themselves on you. Kind of like some xtians get upset when others inflict their beliefs on them with "but I am only" challenging your belief.



posted on Aug, 4 2009 @ 11:51 AM
link   
reply to post by atlasastro
 





Off course you probably have other things to hate with your time. I encourage you to investigate the omnipotent and omnipresent paradoxes. They only relate to God. Jesus was distinctly seperate. Agian for you education. When Jesus was on the cross, the Father forsook Him (Matt. 27:46). When He died, He commended His spirit into His Father's hands (Luke 23:46).


Dude I fail to see where we are in disagreement here, you observe a distinct seperation between Yahwhe and Jesus.

I also observe this eg " Why hast thou forsaken me " etc , where did you get the idea that I think to the contrary ?

I got the feeling (correct me if I'm wrong) that you may well have misread my posts and confused them with replies from another ?

Perhaps indeed, your not actually responding to me but to another poster, your observation of paradoxes is not unlike my own but the hate thing I'm normally accustomed to from hard assed xtians.



posted on Aug, 4 2009 @ 12:09 PM
link   
reply to post by atlasastro
 





How do you measure a person praying they can endure hardship.


There are over 5 billion people that are not xtian, it would be fair to say that many of them endure hardship , many of them pray to allah many of them may pray to a shrimp and many may not pray at all.

We either endure hardship or we kill ourselves there are only 2 paths on that road, so the end result for all concerned is the same , they either get through it or they don't. No jesus required






How do you measure a person finding spiritual hope from prayer as the viscera dies. How do you measure a person that discovers via prayer the will to forgive horrible wrongs commited upon.



Again, billions go through this everyday no jesus required and certainly no evidence from those that do require.

I


means are these not considered prayers answered Moocowoman?


No it certainly does not, it simply means that the individual felt a little better while enduring something uncomfortable.

Here's a nice video in relation to this type of prayer illusion, I quite like it as it personally as it ask nice valid simple questions, that I simply don't have time to do now.






posted on Aug, 4 2009 @ 12:19 PM
link   
reply to post by atlasastro
 





There again, if xtians were in complete accord with jesus, they would probably not find it necessary, to inflict themselves on others. I guess that must be a problem for you. Believing people are inflicting themselves on you. Kind of like some xtians get upset when others inflict their beliefs on them with "but I am only" challenging your belief.


So who exactly is inflicting their beliefs on xtians ?

Do atheists go around knocking doors telling xtians they will be harmed in some way should they not become an atheist?

When was the last time a group of atheist or Buddhists organized a weekend game or fete in order to recruit little xtian children?

The majority of atheists that I have personally come into contact with, have a very level headed attitude toward religion (including xtianity) which is. Great believ what you wish just keep it to yourself and your church.



posted on Aug, 4 2009 @ 12:32 PM
link   
reply to post by atlasastro
 





That is not a prayer to me, that seems like a demand. But anyway, whatever. But you can take the mickey all you want, I guess people pray in different ways. If you can point out the promise of Jesus' "ask and I shall appear" I would appreciate it.



Matthew 18:19: Again I say to you, if two of you agree on earth about anything they ask, it will be done for them by my Father in heaven. For where two or three are gathered in my name, there am I in the midst of them.

Wait, don't tell me, he didn't mean that, or , you have to take it in context , you have to read an entire copy of one of the bibles to get the full meaning or some other excuse.

Whats the problem with 2 or more xtians getting together to help out the other poster ?

Why not at the very least try it ?

I'm sure xtians try alternative medicines as a last resort, why not try jesus as a first resort ?



posted on Aug, 4 2009 @ 08:52 PM
link   
reply to post by moocowman
 


Jesus represents the truth, the way and the light. It is when you ask for understanding on those things that it is done, or when you ask in the name of those things, rather than in the name of the idol "Jesus".

Hey Jesus - will you please kill my brother? Not going to be done.

But if you are asking for understanding and help in regards to the the truth, the way and the light, then in my experience it will be done. Although for me, it was the father, not Jesus that does it. And that isn't really odd, as Jesus says it is the father who did what Jesus did in the first place.



posted on Aug, 4 2009 @ 11:55 PM
link   
reply to post by moocowman
 


in reference to the jug of milk...

depressingly amusing is the sure bet that had someone actually received his thousand dollars from the milk, some religious fanatic would surely be explaining to him that it was god working through the milk.

on the other hand, had he went into debt after the milk incident, he would very likely be informed that this is god's way of punishing him for having doubt, or praying to a false idol.




posted on Aug, 5 2009 @ 08:34 AM
link   
reply to post by badmedia
 





But if you are asking for understanding and help in regards to the the truth, the way and the light, then in my experience it will be done.


I wasn't asking for anything for me, another poster who sis/was an xtian had done all the pastors, churches and studying etc. The poor sod appeared to be totally fed up with the "shills" as he put it of xtianity.

All I asked was, if ATS members who happened to be xtians would show a little compassion to one of their own. I didn't think it would be too much trouble for them to get together here online and ask jesus to go visit this guy.

As far as I was concerned, according to the scripture quoting jesus' actual words in relation to having him appear this would be no problem for them as they are forever quoting anecdotes of how jesus did this that or the other

This would be a magnificent opportunity to for xtians to validate their claims right here on ATS and would certainly be a move toward shutting up the likes of myself.

Clearly I was mistaken, the xtians that responded don't seem to want to help a brother out, apparently when jesus says things he doesn't actually mean what he says, and an individual reader has to find another context within the bibles to put his promises in.

Needless to say the sort of set up must be very very confusing to new xtian recruits, to read things like "Love the lord with all your heart and soul ------" then have someone tell them, it does not necessarily mean what he says, and that the context he says it in should be checked with the rest of the scriptures.

I am observing right here on ATS, by the example of posts from xtians, why xtianity is imploding and the churches are emptying.


From the types of recruiting that I have personally witnessed xtianity use, and the rhetoric employed during this and withing its' churches. There is a great deal of misleading and downright lying being done.



posted on Aug, 5 2009 @ 08:44 AM
link   

Originally posted by Nathan_Orin
reply to post by moocowman
 


in reference to the jug of milk...

depressingly amusing is the sure bet that had someone actually received his thousand dollars from the milk, some religious fanatic would surely be explaining to him that it was god working through the milk.

on the other hand, had he went into debt after the milk incident, he would very likely be informed that this is god's way of punishing him for having doubt, or praying to a false idol.



That was quite droll, I would have give you a star but there seems to be no star button, no idea why.

This type of ridiculous excuse --


some religious fanatic would surely be explaining to him that it was god working through the milk.


Is most often employed when challenging xtians on health, I personally have asked an xtian, who has just come from church and is ill. Why he/she would need to see the doctor in the morning about their illnes. Why I asked didn't he/she get healed while at church, not more than 30 minutes earlier.

The ridiculous reply was that jesus works through his/her GP, when I pointed out that his GP was a Muslim, and employed the same scientific method that proves the earth is more than 6000 years old which the xtian rejects, silliness ensued.



posted on Aug, 5 2009 @ 09:26 AM
link   

Originally posted by moocowman

So who exactly is inflicting their beliefs on xtians ?

Do atheists go around knocking doors telling xtians they will be harmed in some way should they not become an atheist?
Does every christian do that, all the time. No. Only some do some of the time. BTW Atheist have no belief so what are they going to go door to door for? Knock knock-Hi I don't believe anything. So I guess you are not keen on Political groups, charities and sales people. Apparently they go door to door in order to communicate a message too.
By inflicting I mean, when you asked your neighbour about the doctor and god and all that about healing etc, did they ask for your opinion or did you just give it. LOL. I bet you just gave it. I bet you couldn't wait to have your say. Inflicting your challenge. LOL.


When was the last time a group of atheist or Buddhists organized a weekend game or fete in order to recruit little xtian children?
Atheist recently advertised on Buses. Buddhists organise stuff like that all the Time. You think the Dalai Lama travels around the world and hangs out with famous people because he is just cool, he travels the world giving free talks, at these free talks there is food and workshops, books dvds, cd's etc etc. Take off your hate goggles. He is actually doing this in my country very soon, again.
You can interpret these events as "recruitment". As I know your paranoia and fear of these people seems high, but the vast majority of people actually call these community activities. No one is forced to go to these events. People go to them on their own. Voluntarily.
Have you ever been forced to go to a fete or a game?


The majority of atheists that I have personally come into contact with, have a very level headed attitude toward religion (including xtianity) which is. Great believ what you wish just keep it to yourself and your church.

The vast majority of people(regardless of belief) I come into contact with are level headed and usually don't really give a S$%^ about what other people believe because they are secure and confident enough in themselves that they tolerate others so whilst they may not share a belief or even understand it, they would never restrict ones right to express themselves.
In a free country, people are free to express themselves just as much as you are free to express the need to have these people reframe from expressing themselves.
LOL.
Believe what you want about religious people like christians, but keep your bigotry to yourself.
See how it works both ways.

I would hazard a guess that you get alot of crap from religious people because you talk alot of crap yourself. Your posts are evidence of that. But of course it is far easier to attribute any negative experience directly on the belief system you oppose rather than look at yourself. You are very religious like in that respect.


That is my take on it.
Thanks for your replies.



posted on Aug, 5 2009 @ 01:55 PM
link   
reply to post by atlasastro
 





Atheist recently advertised on Buses. Buddhists organise stuff like that all the Time. You think the Dalai Lama travels around the world and hangs out with famous people because he is just cool, he travels the world giving free talks, at these free talks there is food and workshops, books dvds, cd's etc etc. Take off your hate goggles. He is actually doing this in my country very soon, again. You can interpret these events as "recruitment". As I know your paranoia and fear of these people seems high, but the vast majority of people actually call these community activities.

Lol I had the atheist bus in mind when I posted, I guessed you'd counter with it, which gives me the opportunity to make my point.
The atheists in question responsible for the bus thing as far as I'm aware (Dawkins I'm positive about, although he was a contributor) mad a point of using the word "probably" IE they were not in any way implying certainty.

They have no intentions of taking their views into schools and indoctrinating children with their viewpoints as a certainty, any viewpoints (as I know you will comment on evolution) are discussed as best scientific "theory" in relation to evidence presented. I'm also fully aware that some use the phrase "scientific fact" but I presonally will go for the former.

However, Noah and his ark,Jona living in a fish etc are not scientific fact, and as there is zero evidence to support these (and other) ludicrous claims. It is unacceptable (to me at least) that many xtians given the opportunity would impose these (their own) evidences beliefs upon children in schools as "facts".

I have absolutely no objection at all to xtians "offering" their opportunity to others but absolutely not to children while presenting them as facts.

This does go on and is going on, "other peoples" children are being lied to at a very susceptible age.

Do as you wish in your own home, believe what you wish in your life but don't present your beliefs as facts, to other peoples children.

"Hey Preacher! leave those kids alone"



posted on Aug, 8 2009 @ 06:15 AM
link   
reply to post by Republican08
 


Well, here is why I will never stop believing in God.

Believing in God is my own personal choice. I can give one Cap'n Crunch oat about logical or scientific evidence. But wait, before you rule me out as extremely stupid, let me explain why.

I was never brought up into religion. My family is not religious. My father drinks and my mother is a very depressive woman who has a sailor's mouth. I didn't worship God because others did, and I didn't curse Him because others thought He was an evil "Jafar" like God.

I picked up the Bible and I prayed before my first read of Genesis. I prayed to Him, the God of Israel, to let me understand the message. I didn't go through the Bible pointing out illogical fallacies or goofy contradictions. I went through it understanding its true message. You may ask me what that message is, but I would like you to experience it first hand. You can do the work and be rewarded yourself. It's worth it.

Anyway, I found that there was a God. Now I dove into this scientific debate. Creation Vs. Evolution and what about other religions etc. All these questions. Not to mention the people that I conversed with that had my mother's sailor tongue. God refined me from an old rusted piece of lead to a beautiful vibrant gold in those conversations. I learned the love I had towards my fellow man. The respect I brought to myself and to my Creator. I learned that I wasn't perfect. But I knew I learned how to be the man I wanted myself to be just in my standards. No one else's. It doesn't matter what others think of you but what you think of you. Your opinion about the world shows a lot about your character. The Bible taught me how to be human.

Anyway, after all that, I dived into science, God, and the whole nine yards.
I learned about all the 100 billion galaxies and how the Andromeda galaxy races through our universe at 200,000 miles an hour. I learned that the Universe doesn't follow any laws. It does its own thing. I learned about our Newtonian understanding of the universe. I learned about Earth being tidally locked. I learned without Earth being tidally locked, we wouldn't be here. I learned about the gravitational pull of the moon. No moon, no life. I learned about Einstein's theory of relativity. When it comes to light, there is no A + B. Light does its own thing. I learned that light travels at 670 million miles an hour. I learned that our oceans are 3.4% salt. Exact same as in the human bloodstream. I learned that the human height is just perfect. The estimate is that our universe is 10 to the 27th power meters across. I learned that we will never know it all. I learned that humans will never explain how humans ever got here. Only theories will come and go. I learned that what Jesus said in John Chapter 16 made sense. I learned that throughout this journey I called life, I was desperately seeking for truth. But I learned that it's all about love. I don't care about the questions and the answers to those questions. I care about living. Learning to love. Learning to do right instead of wrong. Learning to follow God into my entirety and obey His laws. We have a short life. I want to spend mine loving everyone else instead of looking at a negative atmospheric world. My spirit was renewed. And anyway, no matter what anyone else thinks about how I spend my life, whether anyone believes in God or not, I will die a happy man. If I could live my life again, I would not change it. Nothing will stop me from believing because I know Jesus. I can't explain why I know Him but I do. I know God. Many may have a negative outlook on life because of diseases and wars and how everything may resort to pain. But I don't. And I will take pain because I love all of us. This is not all there is. Whatever you believe, I will not judge. But I will never stop believing. My answer. Have a great day!!



posted on Aug, 8 2009 @ 06:45 AM
link   
reply to post by Water-tastes-good
 





I picked up the Bible and I prayed before my first read of Genesis. I prayed to Him, the God of Israel


So what exactly prompted you to pick this mountain god to pray to as opposed to all the other gods available? Did you check out all the other gods as well and decide this one was better than the rest ?

Which type of bible did you read to come to the decision that you did, Hebrew, greek, aramaic other ?



posted on Aug, 8 2009 @ 08:02 AM
link   

Originally posted by moocowman
reply to post by Water-tastes-good
 


So what exactly prompted you to pick this mountain god to pray to as opposed to all the other gods available? Did you check out all the other gods as well and decide this one was better than the rest ?

Which type of bible did you read to come to the decision that you did, Hebrew, greek, aramaic other ?


Does there always have to be someone who questions me? I'm just having fun with you Moocowman.

What prompted me? Well I guess it would be safe to say, curious if there was a God or not. Why else? I was having a terrible year and I figured if there was a God, He could help me out. He sure did. Not by physical means of course but by reconstructing my heart and soul along with helping get my life on track.

Have I read the Qu'ran? Yeah. I got nothing from Allah. End of that. Tried getting into Buddhism fore that was my buddy's religion. I do enjoy the meditation but the religion itself did not help. Mythology and Norse. Those were entertaining but once you've figured out you can't be a God-Bull and have sex with a woman who then provides a Bull-man who, when is older, is sold to King Minos and later locked in a labrynth eating human sacrifices, then you come to the conclusion that they were just entertaining stories. I guess reproducing to your own kind ruled out mythology. Then the good ole' Egyptian Book of the Dead. Was reading that on course with the Bible. Exodus helped me understand that bit. Then of course, the Holy Bible. NIV version. Oh, and are you asking if I read it in the traditional Hebrew/Aramaic Old Testament and Greek New Testament? No, but I know a couple professors who specialize in those languages who have read the Bible in its origianl text. I read it in English. Then once I got to the false idols part in Exodus, I decided to see what God really had since He claimed He was the only one. Let me put it this way, He didn't dissapoint. My buddy then decided give God a try. A few prayer sessions and Book reads later, He was talking about giving up Buddhism. Short story, we're both hardcore believers now. Guess my testimony isn't the most exciting story to read but there it is. All leading to the point of my answer above. Anyway, forgive me if I misspelled anything or provided bad pronunciation. I've been awake for awhile and it's a bit late. Anyway, have a great day and may God Bless you and your family regardless you believe or not. Just want you to be safe.

[edit on 8-8-2009 by Water-tastes-good]

[edit on 8-8-2009 by Water-tastes-good]



posted on Aug, 8 2009 @ 02:50 PM
link   

Originally posted by Republican08
What will it take for you to Stop Believing!? (Deity)


Well, I would only stop believing if God came down and told me there was no God.



new topics

top topics



 
13
<< 12  13  14    16 >>

log in

join