An Example of Why We Must Destroy Muslim Extremists!

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posted on Jul, 30 2009 @ 08:16 PM
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Originally posted by grapesofraft
reply to post by miss_silver
 


I suggest to remove them from power by negotiation and if that doesnt work by making war with them until they either give in or die.

I agree it is not only the Taliban, but also the Afghan tribal leaders who also have an extreme view of the Koran and how it should influence society. Thus making them all EXTREME MUSLIMS.


WOAH! I agree with you on many things you say, but the one thing I will have to disagree with you is on the statement that "I suggest to remove them from power by negotiation and if that doesn't work by making war with them until they either give in or die."

Making war would be counterproductive to the goal of changing Islamic extremism. War, in fact, would further destabilize the region and would make the world hate the U.S. even more. War sends mixed messages- it would be like saying that I want peace, yet I start a fight with someone because they are being stubborn.
What needs to happen is a PEACEFUL movement within Afghanistan to make some of the rules of Islam somewhat more flexible. Persuasion by force never works, it only causes resentment and sets the stone for further conflict in the future.
Extremist need to be captured and contained by other muslims. They need to be told by their own populace that their extremism is not right and that it only deteriorates and taints Islam as a whole.
Creating war and conflict with them will not work. there is ALWAYS a way to change things peacefully. It is not idealist thinking, it's just that it is somewhat harder to do and most politicians seem to believe that war is the answer to all of the world's problems.




posted on Jul, 30 2009 @ 08:17 PM
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reply to post by argentus
 


Yeah you see how parts of Sharia law interpreted in an extreme way are very dangerous ideas that threaten any group of people that may fall under their control?



posted on Jul, 30 2009 @ 08:24 PM
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Originally posted by grapesofraft

Originally posted by bringthelight
"We don't agree with it so lets destroy it"

You are doing the very same thing they are.


I agree. I am doing the same thing that they are. This is how the world works. They have an ideology that I disagree with and they will refuse to change it. I have an ideology that they disagree with and I refuse to change it. Somebody has to come out on top, and I dont see how it would be good to live under the Law based on a strict understanding of the Koran. So if we want to let people live their lives without being beaten down by a bunch of lunatics then we should do whatever is necessary to remove them from power and to keep them from getting more power.

[edit on 7/30/2009 by grapesofraft]
Some people are hopeless. Maybe with the Taliban bayonets ( made in USA) on their underbellies they will finally start to understand their mistake.



posted on Jul, 30 2009 @ 08:25 PM
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Originally posted by grapesofraft
reply to post by TheAftermath
 


Well if you want to start gunning down Christians who burn books or picket TV stations then have at it. Just be ready to face the legal consequences.


I'm asking what would YOU do.

We all know you are for killing muslim extremists, whats your tolerance level for extremists of your own religion?



posted on Jul, 30 2009 @ 08:30 PM
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reply to post by TheAftermath
 


Right now they are not a threat to anyone but themselves. If they break the law they go to jail like the rest of us. If they want to burn books or bitch about some TV show let them knock themselves out as it is their right to do so up until they cross a line and break the law.

However, if they start taking over the country and decide to burn every book they dont like in the whole country then I say off with their heads.

Is that clear enough for you?



posted on Jul, 30 2009 @ 08:32 PM
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reply to post by grapesofraft
 


It's clear enough for me.



posted on Jul, 30 2009 @ 08:34 PM
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reply to post by grapesofraft
 


And supposing they don't like the way Americans live, is it ok for them to come and kill you until you submit to their culture? How would you like it if they were sending people in to your country to shoot because they don't like the immorality of your way of life, in their eyes? You should join the government...same mentality. There must be something seriously wrong with someone whose posts are always about killing people.
America should butt out of any other countries business...there has been enough pointless killing. Not that that is ever the reason they invade and murder people..it's oil, drugs, money..and money...and money.
What will you do when you have teenagers that defy you...try to reason and then beat them senseless?



posted on Jul, 30 2009 @ 08:35 PM
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reply to post by argentus
 


Glad someone could understand. This isnt anti-Muslim. It is anti any group of people who start destroying the lives of huge portions of society because of some extreme belief system. It is about freedom.

It is obvious that extreme Muslims are against the freedom of others and so they must either change or be replaced.



posted on Jul, 30 2009 @ 08:49 PM
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Originally posted by grapesofraft
reply to post by miss_silver
 


I suggest to remove them from power by negotiation and if that doesnt work by making war with them until they either give in or die.

I agree it is not only the Taliban, but also the Afghan tribal leaders who also have an extreme view of the Koran and how it should influence society. Thus making them all EXTREME MUSLIMS.



And whom exactly should be sent abroad to fight them "extremists" if negotiation fails?

Give in? That will never happen for we are talking about centuries of tribal laws. There are extremists in every religions and if not tied to religion, then it becomes ideology extremist which I am sadden to say my friend that you are borderline of the latter. Killing someone or individuals for what they believe in, either religiously or idealistically is what is wrong with this world of ours.

Do I like what is happening over there? Hell no I don't! It disgust the hell out of my every woman fiber that those women are still oppressed to the point of inciting a mob to throw rocks at someone who want things to change and is doing something about it. DO I want them dead or wish them ill will for they narrow mindedness toward women... NO.

There is such a thing as Karma. The Koran Give equal rights to both men and women before GOD and those tribal "extremists" will have to answer to GOD at the time of their death and will be judge accordingly in the eyes of the divine.



posted on Jul, 30 2009 @ 08:56 PM
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reply to post by miss_silver
 


Well what if there isnt a God and these people have to answer to nothing for their treatment of these little girls?



posted on Jul, 30 2009 @ 08:57 PM
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reply to post by grapesofraft
 



Glad someone could understand. This isnt anti-Muslim. It is anti any group of people who start destroying the lives of huge portions of society because of some extreme belief system. It is about freedom.

It is obvious that extreme Muslims are against the freedom of others and so they must either change or be replaced.


Yes. OUR sense of freedom, which we have a Constitutional right to endorse without our own borders.

If "they" are to be changed or replaced, it must be from within; otherwise how does anyone know the change was wanted? Again, any attempt to impose another system of law upon the U.S., for example, would be wrong in many ways. It would be equally wrong to attempt to impose our laws and beliefs upon others. I realize that sounds simplistic and idealistic....... put in on a local scale, and I think you'll see what I mean.

Suppose a group of folks who resonated to you as "extremists" moved into your neighborhood. If they broke U.S. laws, they would be prosecuted, regardless of there own mores. If you chose to move to an area where Sharia law was enforced, you'd damn well be ready to change radically, and leave your former self behind. It's just that simple. If someone is making death threats against me or mine, I will respond with excessive force on my own turf.



posted on Jul, 30 2009 @ 09:01 PM
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reply to post by grapesofraft
 


Perhaps we should try to educate and liberate them through diplomatic methods instead. The Iranians are a perfect example of an educated populace that are currently fighting to end oppression in their country.

Trying to liberate the people of that region via conflict has shown that it has only exacerbated the problem of extremist ideology.



posted on Jul, 30 2009 @ 09:03 PM
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reply to post by argentus
 


Ok I see your point, but lets look at Afghanistan. These people didnt choose to be led by the Taliban. The Taliban took power by force. So do these people deserve to live under this totalitarian regime?



posted on Jul, 30 2009 @ 09:19 PM
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Originally posted by grapesofraft

I suggest to remove them from power by negotiation and if that doesnt work by making war with them until they either give in or die.


Have you noticed that's not working so good...that this past month has been the highest number of deaths yet in A-stan, that even the Soviets couldn't take them, and they don't play near as nice as us.

Personal accountability is my answer...a few well-placed bullets. But we simply don't have a government trustworthy enough to allow that power.

Besides...the war is making some people very rich at the expense of the middle class and a bunch of poor ones, too.

It's the crude, Dude.

The fanatics are a sideshow...war without end.



posted on Jul, 30 2009 @ 09:27 PM
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reply to post by grapesofraft
 



Ok I see your point, but lets look at Afghanistan. These people didnt choose to be led by the Taliban. The Taliban took power by force. So do these people deserve to live under this totalitarian regime?


Like you, I can only view their experience as filtered by my own. I don't have a way to measure what they deserve any more than I can qualify what you or I deserve. I wish liberty and freedom upon anyone who wants it. If the people of Afghanistan want to kill the Taliban, then it is far more justifiable in my mind than an outside force doing so.

The problem, as I see it, is that military actions are not without covert motivations. If it were as simple as a majority of a country somehow calling for help with an opressive minority, it would be easier to gauge the validity of the action. There are so many peripheral issues sometimes, and not necessarily pure motives.

What will solve it? World police? EEEEEK! Nobody wants that, at least I hope not.



posted on Jul, 30 2009 @ 09:29 PM
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reply to post by grapesofraft
 


Okay, I'm down with getting rid of the muslims, but you must help me get rid of all the christians next .. them bastards threatened me with eternal damnation in hell if I didn't join their gang and worship their spook, which is no different than them muslims wanting to chop my head off for not joining their gang and kissing their spooks butt too. Heck, lets get rid of all these threat filled make-believers, and we can solve this over population problem at the same time.
Grown-ups that still believe in the boogieman or santa or whatever are dangerously deranged people. So, lets get busy and clean up the humon species gene pool, and maybe after all the make-believing superstitious ones are gone there will be peace on Earth.



posted on Jul, 30 2009 @ 09:32 PM
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reply to post by Divinorumus
 


Hey, that's practically a thread on it's own Divinorumus! You could use the first line for a title -- guaranteed to draw a crowd.

Now, the only thing you have to figure out is: Does the lack of a belief system constitute a belief system? doesn't sound like there will be anyone left after your plan.



posted on Jul, 30 2009 @ 09:37 PM
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Originally posted by grapesofraft


Ok I see your point, but lets look at Afghanistan. These people didnt choose to be led by the Taliban. The Taliban took power by force. So do these people deserve to live under this totalitarian regime?


And exactly who gave the Taliban all that power? Who armed them? None other than Uncle Sam so we wouldn't have to fight the soviets back then.

(Sarcasm ON) Ohhhh, the little girls, the little girls... Let me tell you what, let's all chip in a dollar to buy you a plane ticket so you can directly tell them tribal elders that what they are doing is wrong and if they do not stop, that you will wipe them out


Or better yet, enroll to serve your country, you might end up in Afghanistan and save us all a buck. (/Sarcasm OFF)

Seriously grape, if you feel that strongly about the Afghan populace, enroll and do something about it. It is not by staying at home, sitting and staring at the monitor that you will change things.

Oh and to answer your question as to "if there is no GOD" to judge them at the moment of their death, you can at least rest assured that in the end, they will still be dead.

People who Really want to help change things find way to get there at the cost of great sacrifices or even their own life. The question is, do you, grape, have what it takes to fit the profile of people such as Mother Theresa, Ghandi, Martin Luther King, Biko, Nelson Mandala who sacrificed greatly for the love of freedom or are you just a common crown agitator ready to throw the first tomato at something you do not like/approve of?



posted on Jul, 30 2009 @ 09:41 PM
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reply to post by grapesofraft
 


I agree in principle here. Any religion, culture that treats women that way is plain wrong. Sure, no one is perfect and for a point I'll use the United States. Plenty wrong with Americans and the American Government. The ideals and laws we have in place though for the most part are just, fair and stand for freedom and furthermore are about as perfect as we're going to get right now. In theory we're all equal in America, including women and every minority. Everyone deserves an education. This thread could easily be about Christians and certain beliefs there that women should serve their men. Muslims are much easier targets because of the extremity of these views. They aren't just subservient to men they are denied education or to show thier faces in public. It's disgraceful and embaressing to the human race. No wonder the aliens won't show themselves to us heathens.



posted on Jul, 30 2009 @ 09:45 PM
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reply to post by miss_silver
 


Thanks you have stirred my passion. I will find a group I can join and go help the people of Afghanistan. Thanks for the encouragement and the great idea.





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